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First RX100M3 full size image samples. A7s preorders list updated (but still no Eu pricing).

These are the first four RX100M3 full size image samples (Source: Sony.net). In the meantime I have been told by one source that Sony in very last minute withdraw the A7s pricing release for Europe. He doesn’t know the reason why this happened. Also the Sony European RX100M3 pages do not accept preorders yet (price is 849 Euro). On the other side of the world you can preorder both the A7s and RX100M3 in USA:

Preorders:
Sony A7s preorder in USA/CA at Amazon (Click here), Adorama (Click here), BHphoto (Click here), Sony (Click here), Sony Canada.
RX100M3 preorders in USA at Amazon (Click here), Adorama (Click here), BHphoto (Click here), Sony (Click here).
RX100M3 preorders in Eu at Sony DE, UK, ES, FR, IT, NL, BE, AT, CH, SE, NO, FI, PT.
RX100M3 in Asia at Amazon Japan.
Sony A7s EU pages (no preorder yet): Sony DE, UK, ES, FR, IT, NL, SE, FI, PL.

SonyAlphaRumors support note: If you use these store links to preorder the camera I will earn a small commission that will help me to cover the cots and if preorders are high also reward me a bit for the daily work I do on SAR. Thanks for your help guys!!!!

Still, not many are going to buy these new cameras according to SAR readers poll:

Poll:
[poll id=”184″]
[poll id=”185″]

 

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  1. I’m looking at the samples on my phone (so I could be wrong) but is anyone else seeing smearing on the cardigan in photo 3?

    1. No. There is CA on the edges (white shirt). What appears as a “smear” is a OOF areas. Really very high quality images!

      Sony definitely has a winner here! 🙂

  2. I have a simple reason- it is cheaper to fly from Europe to Japan to buy the 3 lenses (ignoring the 28-70 kit zoom) available for A7/7R than even think about buying the A7s. The prices here are nothing but atrocious. 2X the price of the Japanese prices for the lenses? Come on!

    For 4K the choice is very clear. Panasonic GH-4 is priced at 1499 Euros. It is a far better camera for 4K and its price looks a bargain.

    I hope Sony do not produce too many A7S bodies. They will struggle to dump the inventory in a few months time.

    1. Not sure what’s going on with Sony’s pricing in Europe – UK prices are a good 15% higher than US and Japanese prices, even allowing for 20% VAT.

      1. The EU warranty is also double the American warranty ( EU regulations). Electronics companies bill this back to the consumer.

        1. If you at any one of the Sony EU stores, you find out how much an extended warranty/service plan costs. It is about 40 Euros (less than that) for a camera like the A7/7R. Similar prices are also shown for the lenses that cost 2X of Japan prices. Someone is trying to make a load of cash.

          Other manufacturers do not have this much of a price parity. Sony loses.

    2. right.
      my assumption is that in a few years there will be more if not to say plenty of 4k video – enabled cameras available. and they will be much more sophisticated and of higher quality. which is OK.
      and the reason to buy the current 4k camera, which are far from maturity is mostly to be able to start shooting 4k video already, now. at some affordable price. and possibly upgrade to the right device some time later.
      The possible candidates now might be the Panasonic gh4, sony AX100.
      But not A7S, unfortunately: it is way too expensive alone, and it is not 4k video capable alone. So video amateurs will simply pass by.
      The photo sensitivity is just by 1/8 stops more then A7R, means no real sensitivity advantage compare to the A7R. and low resolution photos are not going to attract the photo amateurs. And it has no autofocus advantages of A7.
      simply
      in order to attract the photo amateurs, the price should be much less then A7.
      in order to attract the video amateurs, the price should be much less then Panasonic gh4 and Sony AX100.
      with the current price it will be another stupidly overpriced A99.

      1. I made a comparison to the adventurous initial pricing of the industry flop, the Sigma SD1, a while back. I predict the same here with the A7s.

    3. Not sure, I’ve got a lot of friends who are interested in the body for low light capability, for stills or 1080p video. The D4S which is maybe not as good is 6000€…

    4. The A7s will sell better than you think. This will make a beautiful camera for timelapses, run and gun docs, and commercial video productions. The GH4 starts to get noisy at 800, 1600 is usable and 3200 in a pinch. The ISO 80,000 footage I saw from the A7s looks cleaner than the GH4 at 6400. The A7s is a beast.

      Also, the GH4’s DR is nowhere near 15 stops, there’s *maybe* 10 usable stops after shooting 4k and downscaling to 1080p – and its still really easy to blow out highlights. With the A7s and S-Log there will be far more detail in the shadows. I pre-ordered and if the claims of 15 stops hold true, I’m selling my 5d3 and using the GH4/A7s for all my commercial productions.

      Now all I need is a EF to M43 speedbooster so I can use my Canon glass on my A7/A7s/GH4 trifecta.

  3. I can’t find an official price for the A7S in Australia either. Still only pre-order pricing with subject to change disclaimers.

  4. Waiting for real photos from real users 🙂 “official” one makes no real sense because of they know how to make them better 😀 I’m curious if it will take better photos then MK1. I have lot of great shots in here: http://www.snaphub.pl/galerie/sony-rx100. Sensor is almost same so it is all about lens. If they make good job it will be best compact in class for sure.

    1. Strange backward thinking in my opinion.

      Of course, if you want reference pictures, they should be taken with the best possible methods to really show how the camera performs. What you call “real photos” that is taken by people who does not know how to get the best out of the camera are meaningless as any means to evaluate the camera.

      If your photos are not comparable to the “official photos”, then you at least know that there is no use for you to buy a better camera, but to polish your own photographing skills instead.

      1. Not in this sense 🙂 “real photos” are in real conditions, home, garden, school… as normal users does it. Official photos are most often taken in perfect conditions. Even high iso have good enough conditions to looks better then in real world samples. If you use professional lights and scenery to take sample photos and then take same camera and try to take family photos it won’t look same even at same ISO settings. Do you understand now ? There are also situations like sun that is from your side that you must test yourself. It is all about money 🙂

  5. The a7s is despite all the hype still just a 12mp camera.
    Yes it has high iso…but noisy and shoots but does not record 4k.
    Soon most cameras will record 4k and at a more reasonable price.
    Sony listened to the SAR pixelphobics and finally gave them what they asked for. But they are a small but vocal minority and will not buy a large number of these cameras even if the price were right.
    The silent majority wants higher resolutikn and at this point are ready for the new higher resolution stacked sensor.
    Sony will have a difficult time generating sales for current low resolution bayer array sensors that will very soon be obsolete.
    Unless Sony wants to go on vacation for a year they should speed up production and introduce this new technology asap

      1. You miss the point
        A7r or a A mount version of it is the current state of the art of an obsolete or soon to be obsolete technolgy.
        Everything comming out currently is already obsolete before it is introduced.
        Some people will knowingly buy products that they know will soon be obsolete because they desperately want something now.
        Other people dont know or believe these products will soon be obsolete. They will be upset when they find out.
        Many people are smart enough and patient enough to wait.
        We will not see major sensor advances in bayer sensors because the technology is obsolete and money is better spent on the new technology.
        Sony may as well go on vacation and come back with the new technolgy.

      2. You miss the point.
        The a7r is state of the art for an obsolete technolgy.
        Some people will knowingly buy these now and dont want to wait.
        Some people do not know or believe that exmor and bayer array are already obsolete. They will be upset when they find out.
        Others are patient enough or smart enough to wait for the high res stacked sensors.
        Sony is the largest sensor maker and basically decides for the rest of the industry how fast new technology will be introduced. The slow pace of sensor improvement has been Sonys decision.
        You rarely see rougue sensor tech..sigma/ foveon tried it and didnt get to far.
        Sony may as well go on vacation and come back when they are ready to introduce the new technolgy.

        1. So just come back in few years when some new technology become mainstream if you don’t need new camera today.

          A7r is not state of the art for me – weak video, not usable resolution for me.

          12MP makes much more sense for me – ideal for hybrid still/video camera. We will have to wait for some reviews, but it looks like:
          – 12MP = UHD video almost all pixels readout without pixel binning (which would degrade image quality)
          – 12MP FF = better DR (little better than other FF like A7r and much better than for example m43), probably very good even in video.

          And don’t forget about other things (sensor is just a part of camera) like professional in-camera software/algorithms/features for video…

          1. A7s was not designed to replace (be better) than A7r. It was made to complete the Sony FF mirrorless line-up:
            A7 – cheapest
            A7r – better resolution
            A7s – video oriented and more sensitive, as a side effect of 12MP sensor (ideal for video)

            There will always be a better technology around a corner (graphene next?), but if you want to make pictures today, this is it…

          2. I won’t say “A7 – cheapest” (even if, indeed, it is). A7 : electronic curtain shutter, faster AF = probably best for street photography. A7R : no electronic curtain shutter, (slightly) slower AF, higher resolution = probably best for studio photography.

          3. I want something very simple – mirrorless FF, price below A7s, interchangeable lens system, 120fps –> what choice I have?

          4. A7 also has some advantages over the a7R like AF.

            So Sony’s new FE ‘system’ is if you carry enough (ironically compact) bodies around your neck you’ll be able to handle a reasonable number of photographic use cases. Sweet! Now only if Sony applied the same marketing strategy to FE lenses. ;^)

          5. beaning was an example (maybe not the best one). I mean that too high resolution forces some kind of pixel messing (skipping, binning..) which is a problem (slow down frame readout, loose information..).

          6. I’d leave binning out of this because it’s actually the next best thing to a foveon style sensor. Interpolation used for Bayer sensors itself is no less flawed than binning. Binning a 8K sensor to get a 4K frame will give far more resolution than a plain 4K sensor like what’s in the A7s. Moire can be reduced using an AA filter and it won’t affect the 4K image quality if done right.

        2. I think that you are the one who misses the point. You don’t buy anything because something better will come up in the future. You have heard the word “4K” and now you will not buy a camera because it doesn’t have 4K. You may also expand your horizon a bit and realize that a better 1080p is much more useful than a bandwidth-limited 4K. And you may also read how the HBO CEO said that 4K will never be useful in homes because 70% of the USA households do not have room for a TV large enough to make a difference between 1080p and 4K. And I suppose you don’t plan to use an A7s to shoot a cinema movie.

          1. I am not waiting just because something better will come in the future…I am wsiting because nothing better will come now.

    1. Nope. That’s your opinion, that’s all. A lot of people are interested in the low light capability of the A7S, and if it delivers…

      1. It may well deliver but I am not sure that the advantage will be that significant
        when they higher MP camera files are downsized .Extra detail of higher res
        files allow for adding NR when reducing will still keep an image of the same detail.I will be honestly surprised when we see honest controlled RAW tests if the A7s high ISO even manages to be 1 stop better , I expect less.

        For many of the applications that demand good high ISO the A7s is simply
        not suited. Astrophotography , too low in resolution, low light sports , not
        fast enough C-AF , no native fast telephotos , plus poor battery life and so
        on. As for video, high ISO in video is far less demanding than stills and
        though I fully expect the A7s to be the clear winner hear it is once again a
        very specific niche. For most of my video work the GH4 would be a better choice
        though if you are an ultra high ISO video shooter then the A7s wins.

        1. Yes Sony is trying to milk thier old obsolete exmor tech to squeeze more money out of us.
          In the meantime the new high resolution cameras I so desperately want may not be available until I am too old to use them.

          1. No one cares Barry. Learn to live in the moment and appreciate what you have.

    2. Well, the good news is looking at pictures using the Sigma SD1 Merrill on Flickr (at low ISOs like 100) it’s a very popular and very capable technology for photographing cats. My only problem is I don’t own a cat. ;^)

      https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7411/12601323825_9eab79eda0_b_d.jpg

      Sony patented a Foveon-like technology years ago. They released another patent more recently, I believe. My point is it’s clear they have some engineers working on this tech but its development is slowly evolving and if you suspended your camera purchases on the first rumor surrounding the patent you’d be sitting on an old Bayer-based camera for quite a long time. We have no idea when it will show up and 2015 is only a wild-a$$-guess. For example, SAR talked about the a77 (not a77II) possibly getting this tech:

      http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/?s=stacked+sensor

      How did that “speculation” work out for folks? ;^)

      You asked the question earlier if some knew the 54MP stacked sensor was coming out would you by some existing Bayer-based Sony body. Well, that begs the opposite question: How long are you willing to put camera body purchases on hold waiting for a 54MP Foveon-like sensor body from Sony?

        1. If you couldn’t find my point in what I wrote before (Barry easily did) then I’m not sure I could clue you in even if I drew a picture for you with Crayolas. ;^)

      1. How long to wait?
        As long as it takese.
        I will not waste my limited money on a barely improved obsolete camera only to find I have none left for a good camera when Sony finally sees fit to sell us one.
        We will be doing Sony a service by not buying these obsolete cameras because the sooner they stop selling the sooner Sony will have to release the real new cameras.

        1. I sympathize. For example, I’m sitting on a 10+ year old Honda S2000 waiting in the hopes the redesigned 2016 Camaro (SS?) convertible will be a fine replacement. The only difference here is a redesigned Camaro is a near certainty (even if the date slips a bit) and I just have to hope GM doesn’t botch the job (figure the odds! ;^) ). With Sony and Foveon-like tech we have to hope it ever comes to fruition and their first whack at it is compelling. New tech like that likely will need to mature a bit like Bayer tech which, on paper, looks like rubbish but engineers have been able to squeeze surprising amounts of quality from over the years.

          Like you, I hoped for better – a lot better in the a77II. I still naively hold out some small ray of hope. ;^)

          If you were here in town, I’d bet you lunch we’re looking at a transfer of sensor tech from the a7/a7R to any a88/a99II meaning 36MP Bayer tech at best. Based on current Sony trends I expect the FEs to get most of the cool new toys first.

          In the end, I hope you’re right, Barry, on 54MP tech and that Sony delivers it soon in a cheap, compelling a-mount bundle. But that’s asking a lot and, in the meantime, I’ll grab anything that ups my game.

          1. Sony WILL continue to sell us the same old 24mp c bayer and 36mp ff bayer until we stop buying them.
            Only then will they allow the stacked sensor tech …available since 2002…of the shelf.
            Obviosly this is what sony wants to keep selling us until we dont buy it anymore.
            Give sony one year of really bad sales and the stacked sensor will be available really quick.

          2. But that makes it sound like it’s a conspiracy on Sony’s part which, IMHO, is very far-fetched.

            If Sony had better Foveon-like sensor tech ready for market they wouldn’t sit on it. If it were as good as you expect it to be and affordable it would usher in a new era of upgrades. They’d sell a lot of sensors to folks like Pentax and Nikon plus earn a pile of cash pushing their own cameras. Sony risks a lot sitting on this tech because Canon is already rumored (it’s a weak CR1) to be working on their own stacked sensor tech. If Sony substantially beat Canon to market with this tech it’d be huge!

            Sony could have run into so many hurdles from sensitivity issues Sigma ran into (Sigma SD1 Merrill photos at 800ISO look like they were taken in a snow storm) to cost issues manufacturing acceptable yields. Given their near-bankrupt status the project could have been completely mothballed for now.

            It doesn’t look like Sony’s in a big hurry to take my money in 2014 so, like you, I’ll keep waiting. Maybe we’ll both get lucky in 2015. Cross your fingers! ;^)

          3. Camera manufacturers introduce similar technologies at around the same time to avoid extremely cutthroat competition that would hurt all of them.
            If we stop buying bayer sensor cameras the stacked sensors will be released sooner.
            If we buy bayer then stacked sensors will not be released as soon because they will no longer be able to sell bayer.
            We can either let sony sell us what they want or decide what we want to buy.

          4. OK, you start first, Barry. If you aren’t buying cameras you won’t need to stick around here, yes?

    3. You make several assumptions here. So “pixelphobics” as you put it, are a small but vocal minority, but those who what more pixels are a silent majority? This is purely conjecture on your part.

      I would also add that the 36mp A7r came long before the A7s. It seems the “silent majority” got their wishes first.

      No doubt you’ll say 36mp isn’t enough, and that what the “silent majority” want is a 54mp stacked sensor. Well, perhaps they do, but posting that on a regular basis on here won’t make it happen any sooner I’m afraid.

    4. 2500 is a piece of junk car, but it’s still the price of a car. What I mean is, I agree that the A7S is just a 12MP camera at the end of the day. 15.3EV is great, but when your looking for good light, scenes typically hover around 10. You can still bracket with any other camera and save yourself 2500 IMO as well. Not the same but still. You also get terrible AF with the A7S and 4K- as you mentioned- will be a expected add on in any mid to high end camera soon enough.
      I think the camera you are referring to as a real upgraded option would be an A99II with at least 36MP. Its still the waiting game and it’s not what Sony is satisfied with giving us at this time. Three niche cameras must make more money then one mainstream SLT full frame.

        1. I see what you mean, but I’m looking at this just in terms of stills. There’s a lot of people out their who I think plan on just using this for the high ISO and DR advantage regardless of video.

  6. Thanks for the links, just ordered the A7s. I like the claimed 15.3 stops of DR, I’d be happy if its really “just” 14, which would put it far ahead of anything under $25,000. Looking forward to this one more than any camera in recent memory, and I’m looking forward to comparing it to the GH4.

  7. Does anyone here have a thorough experience with XAVCs? If so, how does it look in 1080 when shooting in the higher ISOs (800+) and how does it grade? I am doing as much research as I can but I seem to get nowhere with regards to colour correcting or grading in post.

    1. It’s an efficient intraframe codec, comparable to the Panasonic 50Mbps IPB mode on the GH3. It should work well to help minimize compression artifacts.

      1. Thanks. So, motion artifacts are a non-issue? I am not talking about sports, more about documentary type of stuff in the run and gun style (following, walking)
        Whats the GOP?

  8. I’ll buy the RX100, but not at this priec, I’m waiting for availability on ebay, HK imports are the bests. 😛

  9. Three disappointments on the RX100III

    1) The view finder does not appear to tilt up.
    2) There is still no backward compatibility to interface with all of Sony’s big flashes.
    3) The hot shoe is gone.

    With my RX100II when I snap on my the optional view finder, I have the ability to tilt it straight up at 90 degrees from the camera. I found this very helpful when taking macros of small plants growing on the ground, because I could focus in bright sun light with the camera resting on the ground or on a tiny tripod.

    Sony missed an opportunity to make this camera compatible with all of their big flashes. This could have been done by letting the pop-up flash serve as the master flash to control N number of slave flashes. There must be technical problems in implementing this. Otherwise, surely, Sony would have done it!

    I have the option of attaching my small yet twice a powerful HVL-F20AM flash to my RX100II. This option is gone with the new model. 🙁

    Still, the RX100III a good camera. I will not be trading in my MK2 to get this one.

      1. LOL, No the price is great! If I did not already have the MK2 and the snap-on EVF, I would jump on the MK3!

    1. The hotshoe made more sense on the rx1 than the rx100 as buying the add on optical or evf cost as much as another camera. As for the external flash all they really have to do is make the internal flash have the ability to trigger external flashes then i can’t really see why one would want a hotshoe unless you do video and want to put a mic on it or a go pro then yes. But they’ll probably put it back in next years model along with the missing 30mm on the long end.

      1. But the RX100II’s flash does NOT have the ability to control other (slave) flashes. A hot shoe would give you the ability to mount a more powerful flash than the tiny one built into the camera.

    2. are we sure the on-board flash cannot act as a wireless controller? …
      that would be a total miss..

      1. Well, it’s not mentioned in the specifications; it was not on the the original RX100 nor is on he RX100II that I own. It’s like the Sony camera divisions don’t talk to each other! I suspect there are technical reasons, that we do not understand, that made it difficult/impossible to implement in RX100 line of cameras.

        Surly Sony would have included that feature if they could. I used the wireless controller on my A900 and six slave flashes to capture the hummingbird I use in my avatar to the left of this text. If and when they include it in an RX100 type camera I’ll buy one.

        Resolution in the EVF was also dumbed down on this new RX100III; it’s half the resolution (number of dots) that the “snap-on” EVF had!

  10. I have a big problem with Sony colors (and that’s why I sold my RX100) but the samples shown here actually look pretty good color-wise. Of course, they are shot by Sony. Could the Bionz X processor improve things so much in the color rendition area ? In this case, I would line up for preordering. But I guess I need to see some more (independent) samples.

    1. Sad that there are people around who buy large and expensive cameras, yet aren’t able to color profile the camera for LR or at least tweak their colors… How about buying a P&S?

      1. Sad that there are people around who think that anything color-related can be fixed with RAW and Lightroom. How about using your phone to take pictures ?

          1. Yes, but Sony’s skin tones are clearly far behind Canon, no matter how much you tweak them in post. Just how it is.

          2. lol cameras don’t see skin differently to other things. The same wavelengths reflecting off skin also reflect off other surfaces. The amount of adjustments that a raw converter does to colour is several magnitudes stronger than what any photographer does to make something look right. The only reason why a photographer’s adjustments don’t look right is because they didn’t understand how things work because the guy/gal who taught them that in photography school itself picked things up from here and there. For example, what did you try to get the colours right?

            Also, it’s ridiculous to say Canon colours don’t look right when they are dominating the pro DSLR market alongside Nikon.

    1. Nice link!
      1600 ISOs+ seem heavily post processed :/
      Not much details…
      Shame, dreamt about such a camera…

      1. JPEG processing is always OTT with NR though I think you are being a tad optimistic lol. With some judicious processing and selective NR you can
        certainly do better than shown this is a 3200ISO RAW sample from the RX100mk2 [same sensor] It would certainly do for small prints and any web application

  11. The euro price for the rx100 was too high. 850 as opposed to 580 euro in the US. Here’s hoping for our European friends on this forum that they are still fiddling with this price.

  12. I just have this feeling that next year’s model (the m4) will really perfect some of the things introduced on this year’s model (m3).

  13. Something is fishy about these sample images. The f2.8 images have incredibly shallow DOF (say the one of the woman standing at about 5 feet distance with the very blurry mall in the background), and there are no f1.8 images except for one close up. Also, why don’t they provide the used focal length for any of these pictures?

    1. Very blurry? Clearly you’ve never shot a 85 1.2 L Canon on a full frame body. That looks about right @ F/2.8, or F/7.9 FF equivalent

      1. Look, chances are they didn’t screw with this and I’m hallucinating, but my default camera is FF and I don’t recall the DOF being that shallow for this subject distance at f7.9.

        1. The DOF isn’t THAT shallow.

          Take the same photo with a FF camera at 70/2.8 and you’d barely be able to make out the structure in the background.

        2. yosemite, the large, not shallow, dof you see is because the distance between the model and the building and, I guess to this photograph, the use of the lens in telephoto mode, to do that u don’t even need a full frame camera (although with “FF” I think you meant a Fujifilm compact), you could do it with a bridge camera with the smaller sensor size.

    2. The DOF on this camera at 70mm 2.8 is equivalent to FF at around 70mm f/8.

      Assuming that photo is taken at 70/2.8, then it doesn’t seem very fishy to me.

      1. Sony has very advanced firmware. I used a recent Sony camera which had firmware-bokeh – it was an art filter or scene type.

        We are rapidly approaching the day when shallow DOF will be a customizable button or just another gimmick shooting mode.

        So bokeh-schmoka. 😉

  14. the woman with the gray jacket shows huge moire pattern, visible in pinks zebras all over the jacket and blotchy internal rework patches. That was not the best subject to shoot. The photo with the glass roof shows the same excessive moire pattern in the light reflections of the plexiglass fences. It has some CA, but as I see it masters that part with brilliance.

  15. Shamael yes that shows up on my monitor as well, however if you zoom in to 100% the moire is gone but there is still some sort of distortion where the pattern is appearing – something strange about that image.

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