A source was that kind to explain me the different solution Sony engineers found to create the hybrid A an E mount camera. He didn’t unveil to me which one has been picked up by Sony. But here they are:
a) Singular mount that accepts all current lenses at differing distances from the sensor plane.
b) Sensor that moves the focal plane inward and outward dependent upon the mounting of all current lenses.
c) Singular mount that moves all current lenses at differing distances from the sensor plane.
d) 3 Interior (in-body) camera mounts that can be user switched dependent upon the mounting of all current lenses.
e) Redesign of all current production lenses to one physical mount.
[poll id=”143″]
That said I don’t know if it makes really sense to work on those kind of tech solution. I think it makes mroe sense to keep the E and A mount system separated.
254 Responses
A is just not possible people…you dont want option b, if its stuck you have a nasty problem, c is the best solution with.
And what’s exactly the difference between A and C?
Seem like roughly the same solution, only A is more like an adaptor that’s soldiered into a body, and C is more like collapsible adaptor?
I can only guess: a means it has the correct distance for E Mount, and the incorrect distance for A Mount, which means, neither lens nor sensor gets moved with A Mount (which has some clear disadvantages for the focus range and Image quality of course. c means that the Mount extends like a tube, like the RX100 or most compact cameras moves the lens into the camera to be flat while turned off or out in Operation.
If Sony chooses E, I will sell all my Sony gears ASAP!
OMG none of them at all – I’ll stay with E-Mount…
I agree with you. Any of these solutions could considerably alter the dimensions of the NEX camera because they somehow have to house A-mount lenses on it.
I fear Sony may find a disgraced path to please current A mount owners and thus alienating E mount users and new customers.
DONT DO IT!!! GO FOR THE CLEAN E MOUNT!!
I think C might not change the dimensions, if the A portion of the mount is collapsed inside the body and extends out when an A-mount lens is attached. It’s hard to tell from these one line descriptions, though.
Agreed. Make the E mount a straight shot. I own 3 NEX E mounts and could care less about A mount. Sony is really alienating it’s E mount owners… no more cam bodies! No more hybrids. E mounts is a great system,use it Sony! We need more super quality lenses (especially lenses for video) at decent prices instead of a new cam body every few months!! GEEZ!!
Exactly.
All these ideas are a dog’s breakfast – complicated, expensive and certain to cause trouble.
The only sensible solutions are the LEA-3 adaptor, and redesigning a few of the A mount lenses to fit E mount (in effect an adapter fixed on the lens).
After all, how many people are there who want to use A mount lenses on a NEX? I bet far fewer than want to use Canon or Nikon lenses.
I agree that this is not needed. Keep the E mount small and simple. For those that must use their A lenses, use a simple adapter.
a nex with a bulky lens? no way, you must redesign lens, or the compact&small factor go to hell
Cause that’s exactly what Sony needs – leading 4 lines of lenses. There’s not an option for that.
Why would the lenses have to be big? 35mm lenses are tiny if used in conjunction with the right flange distance. Think Contax G as the largest examples and the tiny Leica 35/1,4 as examples of the smallest lenses along with Voigtlander’s. The myth that 35mm lenses are huge is only recent and only because modern SLR designs put VR and AF and other electronics inside the lens.
Move back 20 years to AF-D lenses and they are suddenly much smaller and lighter. Move back further to Ai/S time and prior and you have even smaller lenses. But even then, they were much larger than similar focal length rangefinder lenses.
That’s an interesting, and perhaps a very important point. The micro-circuitry required for these functions is constantly shrinking in size. There is no reason that improvements in micro-servo size shouldn’t mirror this reduction in size. So, apart from the need for a constant flange-sensor distance, future generations of adapter could be smaller.
Back to the future?
Just keep the NEX as an APS-C sensor camera!! Sensor technology is advancing very fast, and in a very short time perhaps it will cover 90% of photographers and videographers needs ( including most Pro’s ). Sony needs to invest in designing new awesome HQ lenses for the E-mount, at least on par with what already exists for the A-mount. I see no sense in spending a lot of money into an FF NEX if there are no great lenses for it.
Amen to Lucas and every other voice of reason. Sony is hurting financially. Keeping things simple should be their motto to get out of this mire. In NEX cameras, they finally have a successful, popular product; BUT they are trying so hard to confuse the living daylights out of everyone.
There is already massive confusion with all the (non) options in the NEX line: built-in flash or nor; with WiFi or without; with touch-screen or not; built in EVF or not. How many hoops should the casual consumer jump through to buy a camera? And if they lose concentration, they might miss out on a feature that they actually need. This is not a choice; this is punishment.
Now Sony will be introducing different lines of lenses and different sensor sizes under the NEX brand. Awesome guys – job well done!
I agree, I have long felt that all the focus on so called full frame is going to prove a dead end. Advancing sensor technology will render it pointless except for a few fanatics. My guess is that in a few years, only a few pros will be using it.
So I think Sony should keep A and E separate and stop wasting time on a full frame Nex.
None. E-mount with adapter, otherwise why bother? You get a camera that is unnecessarily thick. Design the NEX-9 with an update LEA2/3 in mind and release grip at the same time. That should solve the handling issues with all but the biggest telephotos and while I’m sure some people will say it is ugly, some people will always complain. Creating this bastardized camera solves no problem except the ones the marketing people are having. Create what the customers want. Not the marketers.
Totally agree!
+1. What made the NEX series and the RX1 sell? The fact that they were small capable cameras with high IQ.
SONY can repeat the success and avoid complicated marketing and pissing off A-mount users by following the same basic strategy. Nothing more is required.
Use E-mount perhaps with a slightly wider throat, and ensure support for existing small fullframe lenses (Lieca, Voigt, Zeiss, Contax G) while releasing a handful of dedicated SONY/Zeiss primes.
“Use E-mount perhaps with a slightly wider throat,” – this probably mean new mount, not an E-mount anymore.
i wonder if the three-mount alternative would mean a basic FF e-mount with wider throat and even shorter flange distance than the current, upon which you can fit either the narrower and very thin “aps-c-e-mount” adapter or the bulkier a-mount adapter.
I imagine it’s something like a new mount on top of which you either put E mount or A mount – something I proposed long ago: a camera with no bayonet, where you actually pick the bayonet yourself.
I like this idea, modern mount(or pre-mount) that can accommodate both A and E mount. Also usable as digital back.
+1
Make that adapter have IS and its a perfect solution. You have all a lenses stabilized also…
I don’t think that there’s any chance for that. As far as I’m aware – currently there’s no adapter offering anything alike for any bayonet. On top of that – adapter like that would badly compromise image quality and would have a lot of performance issues while working with lenses of extreme focal lengths or brightness.
So A lenses will never be stabilized on Nex?
As far as I’m aware – that’s what Sony said between the words.
None of Nikon’s best lenses such as the $2000 Nikon 24mm f/1.4
AF-S G or $1700 Nikon 35mm f/1.4 G are stabilized. If you’re not shooting video, then the fullframe sensor and fast prime gives you everything you need.
That’s why some of us are shooting A-mount, not Nikon 🙂
Indeed, I rather like having stabilised f1.4 lenses. I just need one wider than 35mm to complete the set.
+1, i dont see why sony wouldn’t make a full frame E mount except for the fact that sony does not have any full frame E mount lenses and making them may take more time/money
and making a A to E mount adapter does make the camera/lens set very big, so personally i’d use 3rd party lenses; loss of money to sony
No manufacturer will jump out with FF body without lenses for it. That’d basically kill off notable part of their income and give it to the competition. I don’t see this happening any time soon. It’s just not worth it from corporate point of view, even if body would go to top-10 of best selling cameras.
That’s why they try to get some A-mount lenses on it. A-mount line-up is 2-3 times greater than micro 4/3 not to mention the NEX. Hence it makes perfect sense. Only issue being size obviously, but let’s face it: even with APS-C lenses Sony hardly has anything that’s actually portable (I suppose with new 20mm prime it’d be 3 lenses total). If someone thinks Sony will suddenly jump out with lenses like Leica M than he might be really disappointed by the outcome.
Joel, that’s the best solution. A new LA-EA adapter with improved handling/egonomics.
No stabilisation, or would it actually be possible to add it to the adapter somehow? A moving element maybe, but is that possible universally for all A-mount lenses?
How necessary is stabilisation? Each new sensor gives good quality at a higher ISO than the one before it. If you are getting good quality images at ISO 800 or even 1600 (speeds which were considered very high in film days), then you really do not need stabilisation.
Then the optical designers can concentrate on top quality images as Zeiss do.
You certainly make a good point about high ISO making stabilisation less essential, and I agree with you.
However, it is sometimes nice to know you can get the ISO as low as possible in order to maximise image quality.
I vote for you for Sony Product Manager Numero 1!!
Wow, now that would be a stupidly simple approach, and a good one at that (no sarcasm intended). I hope Sony reads this post as it would make the most sense to me, versus the other ideas expressed here in the thread. It would obviously save them a great deal of time and money by not having to engineer a new product and for us consumers, we’d be able to have a FF Nex sooner!
Also, by just coming out with a new adapter, people would have the option to expand their lens options and bulkify their tiny NEX body, but with proper FF lenses. Yet, the people that truly value the pocket ability and wish to keep the size and weight down can do so. With a 24mp or perhaps something higher (as we may see a higher mp count by the time it’s released), the camera could simply crop the resolution to accommodate the small e mount lenses. This would also leave space and relavence for the a mount FF since people could get that camera if they don’t want to mess with adapters and prefer the more solid handling and feel of a larger body. I love my NEX 5n but I have to say, Sony’s SLTs are a treasure to hold. Much more comfortable than any Canon or Nikon I’ve held.
Finally, to push this proposition further, instead of coming out with a new adapter and leaving it at that (since it’d feel like a cop out to me at least, Sony can bundle the camera with a new FF kit lens that is kept relatively small. Actually, the current a mount kit lens is small already in my mind for a dslr lens.
I’m most likely simplifying the challenges of a FF NEX mount solution but I’d personally prefer it to remain an e mount and supply the adapter in the box.
totaly agree on that !
Why is it so complicated for Sony to make a “simple” FF Nex-9 body close to the Nex-7 design ? That’s all people want…
We had a video camera with E-mount and FF sensor, now we’ll have a FF monster Nex body but with two mount !??
And of course it will be even more expensive just because of that !…
I Really hope other brands come also with a mirrorless FF body soon, because I’m more and more doubtfull about this Nex-9 and fed up with waiting for such a “thing”…
@Joel: exactly my words.. only better 🙂
Can’t really vote for one of the above option because they all sound horrible. They are either costly/bulky/fragile or lead to a third line of lenses. A one-mount-fits-all solution is outdated before it even hits the market.
@Sony: Keep it simple. (Please?)
Agree!
Make it a clean NEX design with the option of carrying a-mount lenses.
A cludge will most probably not appeal to anyone.
/E
“sensor that moves the focal plane” may allow also fast contrast AF with A-mount lens
Wow! A crazy idea!! Movable sensor can add autofocus to ANY lens (even to any manual lens)!!!
Not sure about manual lens – sensor would probably need to move too far. But fast AF with normal SLR AF lens should be possible.
Fascinating. Given the choice, I’d go with a solution that didn’t require an extension tube to achieve the focal flange distance.
Going the Contax AX route has a certain elegance to it, but is sure to drive the price up if we want a nice flat focal plain. On the flip side, if they’re adding actuators anyway, it’ll be psychologically easier from them to add IBIS while they’re at it.
I guess option e) would mean turn all A mount lenses to E mount and abandon A mount entirely. That way leads to blood.
The Contax AX route is the only route I would accept. I could live with a bulkier NEX if it also meant it would have support for both A and E mount, IBIS and last but not least, AF with all legacy glass.
Apart from that, I fully support Andrea’s opinion. A and E mount should be separated. We’ve got the LAEAs for that.
I think being compatible with both A & E mounts while maintaining relatively small camera size at the same time is Mission-Impossible. However, if they do achieve, then NEX-9 will be a big hit.
I think it will use the adapter approach to do the job … could be LA-EA4.
LA-EA3 is FF already
But AF is S-L-O-W. The “LA-EA4” would be the same as the LA-EA2 but for full frame.
I’d be fine with MF or LA-EA3 on a NEX-6 like body, for the price of 7. For half a year already.
A, B and C requires a thick body like DSLR. D and E are options for small body. I choose D.
Not necessarily. What if what they mean is collapsible / expandable mount?
But yea – D seems to make most sense for me too.
You could be right, I did not think of that.
collapsible = flimsy maybe?
Most likely. But any compromise solution will be flimsy. Just like adapters are. There’s nothing unexpected there.
Maybe it is a waste of development funds. If a high-end consumer can handle interchangeable lenses, he/she can also handle an adapter.
Besides, buying a NEX 9 shows that you can afford to buy a couple of extra lenses too.
Adapter A mount to E mount, maybe the adapter will be also a vertical grip?
Sony has the opportunity to unshackle itself from the legacy of the past—why would they want to burden the platform for the sake of such a small market?
Give the A-mount an adapter and move on.
You mean – forget that you have huge scope of lenses and accessories – use only a bayonet with… 13 lenses? (minus 3rd party). Really brilliant idea.
What about single mount with inner optics to fix differences?
A-mount isn’t designed for video on E-mount.
I’d like to see the NEX range kept as small as possible. If people want to use A-mount on it then use an adaptor.
Design new E-mount FF lenses please (that can be used on APS-C NEX as well).
Simples!
By “singular mount” they mean a new mount?
Not necessarily.
It’s a codeword for “kill A-mount”.
I don’t want any of these a-e solutions. Andrea, can’t you add your own suggestion as f too?
Me too would prefer to keep the A- and E-mount separated as it is, and adapters as now. I am not sure that it would be possible to design an attractive hybrid system mounts camera.
I understand that there is a big problem with a NEX FF. To get small sized lenses they need to introduce a third NEX F-mount (or something) with larger diameter than the current E-mount, or chose E-mount also for the FF NEX to keep compatibility. However, the latter choise would mean larger FF lenses, which would work against the main advantage of mirrorless cameras – small size and weight.
No easy solution here, what I can see.
.
Correct spelling for the word “chose” above is ‘choose’.
Andrea, can’t we get back the possibility to edit our posts for 10 minutes or so?
.
I am just wondering if the NEX9 will be A/Emount, if there will also be a solo E mount NEX FF.
My main worries about the hybrid mount are:
1) The tech to make a A/E mount will be rather expensive which will also increase the selling price. @Sony: What about those that just want an Emount (especially, that the only want to pay for an emount.
2) The A mount lenses do not have stabilization. IBIS will again increase the size of the boby.
3) How much will this hybrid A/Emount increase the body size. Will the NEX bet really a NEX from a size point of view.
For me my future is clear, so Sony please listen. I need a proper Standard zoom lnes for a NEX. If you make it for FF, my next camera will be a FF NEX. If it will be for APSC NEX than I will buy something like the NEX6. As long as lenses are too kit-like and slow I will stay with my A77. Sony please listen to your (still) loyal customers.
Cubic camera with mount per side and movable sensor inside 🙂
You mean Pentax K-01?
😉 😛
The pinnacle of success indeed :D.
Impossible to vote without more detail, otherwise it’s meaningless vote. I don’t see any point in mounting A-mount lenses on E-mount bodies at all. A-mount lenses are so large and heavy relative to NEX bodies, it totally negates the point of NEX system, you might as well just stick with your DSLR? We want great, compact, lightweight native FF E-mount glass to go with NEX-FF.
That means prime lenses with modest apertures such as f/2.8 or at most f/2.
Lenses like that can be made small and of good quality without costing too much. A 40mm f/2.8, for instance, would make a very useful compact general-purpose lens for FF.
A 20mm f/3.5 and an 80mm f/2 or 2.8 would complete the set.
Anything longer, and you can use A mount, Canon, etc lenses with adapters.
Is there really any need for a “kit zoom” at this end of the market? I doubt it.
The only this could work would be for the A and E lenses to share the same bayonet design and diameter. Is that even the case?
Still best to stick with the LA-EA3 and the FF E-Mount body
Hell….I leave Sony emount camp now.Very slow to bring up lenses…not a good investment..as lenses tend to be much much expensive.
Will use my Nex as a standby camera for travel or sell it. Never liked the A mount with mirror eating up the light.
I think best brand now will be Nikon…with cheap lenses options…and good range of camera,lenses and accesories to buy now…and not in future.
And lots and lost of oil to keep your sensor lubricated.
You are actually telling us that Nikon has lots of lenses available for the Nikon 1? You are simply incorrect. The number of lenses Sony releases a year is not really below Nikon or Canon or anything else. They are not slower. And: Quality is MUCH more important than quantity, I don’t understand, why you people all want 500 lenses out in few weeks, that are all crap.
I am not talking about 1 inch sensor, but full fledged APS-C D7100. It is not taht big compared to Nex system with big zooms.
After moving away from DSLR line and buying Sony Nex ..I did not gain anything.
I am still waiting to buy a 300mm lens ..if at all it will come. (200 mm is like no zoom at all). Whereas it is readily available at less than $200 in Canikon.
I tried using adoptor on Nex and then using my Nikon 75-300….but it was so unbalanced…had to give up the idea.
So Going in Sony Nex camp was a waste of time and money. Plus the promised 1 hardware and continous firmware update has stopped for older versions of Nex.
Greetings,
I cannot image myself how “a” could be physically solved. Maybe it is possible but it would look awfully. I believe that “b” and “c” would affect IQ too much. So I choose “d”. It could affect IQ when it get some fatigue but I still believe it is most reliable and real solution for this problem. I wish to vote to “adapter” solution but as I see, Sony don’t want to go this way again.
Best regards, WZ.
A/ is the cheaper and easier way to go.
Then the nex9 software will probably crop the no-full-frame picture.
And a manuel cropping mode will be welcome for the third party lenses with exotics adaptors.
Can we have the commenting system fixed, please? So we could actually post comments without them vaporising randomly, and never appearing? (ps. no: they don’t go to moderation, they just disappear)
Yes, some of my comments disappears too. Very annoying indeed. Hope Andrea is working on a fix for this.
+1 its been going on for AGES & is blinking ANNOYING.
I am a loyal old soul which is why I still frequent this site (& use Sony cameras lol) but that is being tested by the lousy commenting bugs that this site has at the moment…..
Admin – Please GET IT SORTED.
11.57
Hear hear. The fact that it always happens to my longest comments is especially annoying.
Option Z. Two sensors and two mounts: one on the front and one on the back with a viewfinder at the top that swivels round.
Lol, but side by side sensors will be cooler for stereopictures !
Two mounts, with tow different flange distances, with two different sonsors……. ah wait ……. in two different cameras!
Option C would be a hit if it worked as AF therefore needing no more AF on lens and simplifying adapters. However:
1) In option C the sensor has to move away from the lens for A-mounts needing bigger cameras
2) Movement could interfer with IS if it worked during video recording (for AF)
BTW, don’t really understand the difference between a) and c). For me one of them is the final choice.
The only half-meaningful “dual-mount” solution would be something like Ricohs GXR sliding adapters.
Even that makes very little sense. No need to create a solution for a non-existent problem. The current A-to-E adapters are enough.
Looks like it’s going to be one big mess.
Amazing list, that source is definitely not related to the next FF NEX.
It’s difficult to know what to vote for without seeing some kind of diagram or visual representation – can the sources provide anything, Andrea?
Some just of the options just don’t sound possible or feasible – others sound messy.
How is A even possible? How does A differ to C? It’s not particularly clear.
B sounds feasible, but there might be problems with design tolerances causing front/back focus issues.
D sounds weird – the mounts are inside the camera? So e-mount lenses will only be half exposed? I can’t visualise this at all.
E – This would alienate every single Sony owner – e-mount or A-mount
In my opinion, the last thing you want is anything that makes the NEX line thicker or over complicated. This rules out moving sensors (as it would have to be thicker to take the A mount). The helicoil lens mount that goes out is not desirable in my opinion as it will add extra bulk, weight and complexity (and probably some thickness due to the space occupied by the helicoil. To me the best is to have the E mount, possibly redesigned to allow a simple converter to be used for the A mount lenses. I think maintaining a converter to change the lens spacing makes the most sense.
Make ist plain E-Mount! Everything else would produce just unnecessary bulk and cost.
This!
and embraces a new lens line up.
None of these ideas really sound like they could be really done.
I mean, the distance to the sensor is highly important and the NEX would have to be the same Size as an Alpha to change the Sensor distance.
so either the Mount changes its distance from the Sensor (Zoom mount?!?) or its just not possible.
thats physics, i didnt created them!
Shoot! It erased most of my message.
Anyway, it concerns me that they are trying so hard to fit A-mount lenses into their mirrorless future. People who want them can use their current cameras or buy the new lenses.
The company who will win the mirrorless race is the one who lets go of the past and moves 100% in the direction of their new system. This is why Olympus and Fuji are on such a good track.
Make the E-mount everything it needs to be for the future and don’t saddle it with having to carry the A-mount forever.
Why is the grammar and or english on the most popular of Sony rumor websites always extremely challenged? Who’s writing these elegant posts [sarcasm]?
It’s written by a non-native English speaker[Obviously]. How many languages do you speak?
“If you call someone who knows two languages “bilingual” and someone who knows three languages “trilingual,” what do you call someone who knows only one language? – An American.”
😉
aliens like me, you redneck!
@jesture
English not english.
Oh the irony of your comment…
That was awesome…
Use e mount and make an a mount adaptor.
An optional a mount adapter can be available with an optical image stabilizing element if sony can design such a thing.
Once agaian i ask sony to scale up the new nex7 n sensor to full frame creating a 54mp full frame sensor with the same quality as the new nex7 n.
No one else has one. Everone else has 24mp.
There is currently no camera availably for those of us that need really high resolution in the field.
Those of you out there that want high resolution say something in hopes that sony might make one before they give us just another slightly better 24mp camera that wont sell.
Sony at least give us a 54mp camera version of this camera to choose from.
When has the highest resolution camera available not sold well?
MAKE IT 54 MEGAPIXELS PLEASE!!
“When has the highest resolution camera available not sold well?”
Sony A900.
That’s only because Sony to gave it to nikon first.
And it certainly did sell for nikon.
You mean to tell me that Sony didn’t sell many A900s because they already gave the sensor to Nikon to use in a professional FF camera costing 3x as much?
Absolutely
You are deluded. They are completely different target markets.
Put a Nikon badge on a dog turd and it will sell well.
Too bad for Sony that strategy isn’t working for them.
Thier dog turds don’t sell st all
Sony’s turds would sell very well if potential buyers were fed a continuing diet of Sony turd by magazines, web users and retail outlets, just like the CaNikon lot are.
The reason CaNikon sell well is not because they are better, not due to lenses, not the flash mount and certainly not the sensor.
They sell well because they are EVERYWHERE and in EVERY camera outlet and EVERY magazine and EVERY camera forum. It’s that simple.
Are you talking about the 1?
#IF(Alternative == E && Make a third mount)
DO Corporate suicide
#ENDIF
is it me or are these options ridiculous? release an FF-mirrorless…. give it an E-mount and start making a lot of lenses (not a new body ever 6 months… we get that sony is an electronics company…. hire some really lens people and capacity for gods sake!!!). Or release the FF mirrorless but give it a larger alpha mount, leave E-mount for APS-C NEX and have an adapter to make up the register distance for the current alpha lenses while you develope compact lenses. Don’t do these complicated mechanical monstrosities! They’ll just end up as oddballs on ebay. I appreciate innovation (a compact mirrorless camera system with big sensors) but at a certain point you have to realize that the imaging business is about cameras and lenses. Most people I know who have a NEX shoot adapted lenses. The decent lenses that are available for NEX now (10-18 zoom, 24/1.8, 35/1.8, 50/1.8) should have been available at the time of the first NEX release. We should have a nice 300mm compact option by now (that doesn’t cost the same as a bigger lens from canikon) and a set of premium primes (yes the zeiss are coming but once again, how many versions of the NEX with more or less the same 16mp sensor have you release?). I love my NEX-6 body and sensor. Yes I would love an FF sensor in it that plays well with RF lenses, but besides wanting the FF look, the reason I want that is b/c I have little faith in Sony acting as a serious company regarding lenses. I only own 1 sony lens (the 10-18… which while ok feels like a plastic toy for $850!!!!). Get it together Sony, release a single coherent FF mirror less, slow down on the body release (try firmware updates to re-build a following) and get real about lenses. Your capacity for developement and production needs to double if not quadruple and for lenses, please look at canikon for what they have in their line ups… they have much more experience in the photo business so on the types of lenses (focal length/speed combinations) don’t reinvent the wheel… just start releasing top-notch lenses on a reasonable time scale… build a real lens catalogue that you can be proud of (and that doesn’t have toy-looking silver lenses). I have a feel that i’m yelling into the wind but I know that there are a lot of photographers that feel the same way. Hopefully someone at sony reads this and gets the cotton out from in between their ears. They have a great thing here (potentially) and they are just killing it)
don’t re-invent the pixel!
Every solution that requires movement of parts is problematic. The greater the number of parts moving the greater chance for slight deviations that will screw up focusing. The VG-900 has the best solution it only lacks autofocus for the alpha lenses… fix that problem and use that system. Nothing wrong with a solid adapter.
I would do E mount and deliver the Adapter free of cost with the camera, just like the FS900(?) did. Easier, lower cost (since you can produce a large number that can be used for ANY FF E-Mount camera in the future, not just a single model). And for those wanting fast AF, develop an optional LA-EA4, that is like LA-EA2 but for FF.
Except, unlike the LA-EA2 use an AF module that’s actually good.
While there is nothing wrong per se with accepting both E and A mount, I would rather have it just be the E mount if it means smaller size and lower cost.
It kind of defeats the purpose of a small camera if you have a very large and heavy lens off of it anyway.
If accepting both E and A mount is part of what is driving the cost up to such high prices as was asked in that question by Sony on this site, then please, Sony, drop the A mount.
I’ll leave it to the engineer. The point of having a NEX is to have a smaller body. The trade off should follow that as a consequence.
I don’t understand what sense B does make? in case of B the maximum length between mount and sensor would be same as SLT’s so this E mount fullframe camera will be not thinner than DSLRs and then what’s the reason to be it nex series?
I vote for “f”: Make the camera of liquid metal like the T-1000, morphing into the mount that is necessary.
Seriously, the only acceptable solution for me is a pure E mount, and a new kind of E mount lenses which cover FF.
Nex = small camera
Dear Sony, keep the FF nex as small as possible.
eom.
Agree, keep it APS-C!!
Sony will have chosen to redesign A-mount lenses with an E-mount and optical stabilisation. It’s the obvious choice for them to make.
I very much doubt that they make much money, if any, from tiny A-mount lens sales. They don’t appear to care about swapping flash mounts and dropping their whole range of iISO flashes and accessories over night, so why should they care about the lens mount?
E-mount and nothing else in the camera, moving parts would just cause problems. Bring some new Full-Frame E-Lenses (3 Primes, 2 Zooms for the start) and that’s it. Old E-mount lenses in crop-mode and A-mount lenses with adapter as always.
Can’t vote. My answer is no to all.
As I have said before, if the E-mount is technical to big a problem
for a future FF NEX just make a new FF NEX mount.
If not the system will always be “bad design” and not a success for the future.
There is already a full frame NEX.
Wow! Did you see it? I wonder…
VG900
😉
Well, that’s a video camera. I (and several other photographers) couldn’t care less for video…!
A less charitable person would describe the A99 the same way.
IMHO the NEX should continue being an APS-C camera. Sony is greatly improving sensor technology and it’s almost at the point where an APS-C sensor will perfectly suit a Pro camera ( either NEX or DSLR/SLT ) and Pro’s photographers needs. The real problem is that there’s an obvious need for high quality lenses for the E mount! Sony must work in designing those or having Zeiss doing so ( and also others like Tamron, Sigma and Tokina )! The A mount bodies may eventually be exclusively for FF ( as all lenses developed for them ). Two new, state of the art E-to-A and A-to-E mount adapters ( light and compact, with AF and all other features ), should be designed, for obvious system flexibility reasons!
i would prefer a small size single E-mount camera with an optional or included adapter A-mount similar to LA-EA3 but autofocus one
Sony forget the useless bells and whistles that drive up the cost for no reason. Use an adapter.
All your competitors will probably be making 36mp cameras by the time this comes out.
Make yours 54mp and you will leave them in your dust.
Make yours 36mp and you will struggle to compete at best.
Make it 24mp and they will leave youin thier dust.
+100
Please, don’t start it again
Only very few people would need so many megapixels. It is same story as nex-7 and nex-6 and I think the last one is much more popular now.
Obviously from sony sales even fewer people want another 24mp camera.
The new 8k video standard has been aproved 24mp will not even match the resolution of your new tv.
+101
I guess we will just have to wait and see. If they made a rx1 then maybe they can work some kind of camera voodoo on the FF Nex. I personally don’t mind having a double mount. Alpha lenses on a nex will make it big but having the option to go small or big depending on what your doing is a good thing. I sometimes use my sony 135mm 1.8 on my nex-6 and actually used it on a c3. It was huge but for what I was doing at the time it worked out fine. You can’t make a big Dslr smaller so I like the option that the nex gives me.
Why not just make one specialized FF camera with m-mount? It will sell like hot cakes. Epson RD1s at 6MPs still sells for $1000+
It’s easy money in the bank Sony!!!!
I’m quite sure it wouldn’t sell at all if it’d be Sony-branded camera.
But if it’d be released as Zeiss Ikon D (digital) with the form-factor of manual focus Zeiss Ikon – it might work. Certainly it’ll scare hell lot from Leica if done right (which isn’t difficult – you take Ikon, throw out film interior, put digital, and you got potential high-end bestseller).
Sorry, but do ANY of you actually know what you are talking about?? didnt 99% of you say its not possible to have a FF e-mount. I love this site, but asking peoples opinions about something they know absolutely nothing about, amazes me.
FF E-mount lenses are possible as we have seen, but have you seen the sheer size of those lenses ?
Large aperture glass is going to be, well, large!
If it was a Sony badge then certainly. But I’d love something with a similar form factor to the Olympus OM 50/1.2. 49mm filter threads, Oh My.
Hever heard of Leica or Zeiss ZM glass? Fast and small with superb quality, an added AF system wouldn’t add much bulk.
They should do a new mount designed for maximum overall compactness of the camera + lens, not for backwards compatibility. So I vote the option “e”. That’s why RX1 is a success, because it is very compact.
Admin, why no option “regular E-mount” with optional adapter? I don’t want to pay for overcomplicated thing (and hybrid mount definitely is) that I won’t use in any mode different from regular E-mount.
Just give me an LA-EA2 cross-bred with a speed adapter. Suddenly, we would have cheap bodies and not enough improvement with a full frame sensor to be worth the cost. We don’t have any AF f/1.4 lenses, so I don’t see a point in going FF. Fuji is sounding better and better.
As for using A-mount lenses, it depends what you are using it for. On a paid shoot, cumbersome camera looks more “impressive” to the client, and by my experience, I’m actually able to hold it more steady. A-mount increases the lens possibilities beyond any other mirrorless system (larger aperture & niche lens options) and even allows a tiny NEX to serve as a legitimate back up body for some.
Ignore the A-mount.
Start anew with E-mount lenses that cover a FF sensor – though it will mean bigger lenses, current E-mount lenses will work in crop mode, like APS-c lenses on the A99 and A-mount can be used with the horrendously clunky LAEA adapters. The E-mount is Sony’s future, the A-mount is, sadly, dying a slow death.
I don’t like the idea of moving parts, either the sensor or especially the mount (with the exception of IBIS). ESPECIALLY the mount. It’s not a robust solution unless well-engineered and produced, which means prohibitively expensive for most people, as well as likely large and heavy, which defeats the purpose of the NEX platform.
The problem with having vulnerable assemblies in the camera body is that if the body goes down, photography goes down, necessitating a back-up body–the SAME back-up body for any real photographer, to avoid actual down-time. Moving parts in lenses, OK. I don’t trust Sony to make robust moving-parts solutions in-camera, unless it is IBIS, which I understand is not their invention.
I have a question for everybody: do you think that the NEX line is favored by women due to the smaller form factor, and due to there not being as many “serious” women photographers as men (a naked assumption on my part)?
Apparently there are more women in the world than men, and apparently they are gaining wealth and independence, and purchasing power, at an ever-expanding rate. In many countries their development has outstripped that of men.
Maybe they like NEX because it is actually more ergonomic for them, and just generally suits their needs better–better handling, better aesthetics, less gear-head’ish, less macho, easily portable in a handbag, and good enough in IQ.
Just a thought.
Generally men are more geeky, so I would say no.
Women (and men) who want to take “professional” photographs of their kids are far more likely to get a CaNikon dSLR.
Frank–The fraction of parents who want to take their own “professional quality” photos of their kids, and who purchase the required gear, is exceedingly low. They still have “real photographers” do that for them, along with the post-processing and large-format printing.
Also, I think that your observation about “geekiness” supports my suggestion, since the NEX is seen as far less “geeky” in a tech sense than is a dSLR. Check out the Nikon 1, I know more than one woman who bought it because it was “cute”, and it came in white with silver accents. I think the same would apply to NEX, except for the big black one.
One last thought: touring around Europe a lot(mostly art museums and national capitals), I check out what people are using. I see some NEX, being used almost invariably by women. In fact, essentially the only guys I have seen using it have been Japanese, mostly young, and mostly traveling with girls.
I have yet to see anybody using a NEX. I have yet to see anybody using a Sony dSLR/SLT at all either. Wall-to-wall CaNikon where I live.
Once guy with a 7D was amazed by my A77 and instantly loved the EVF! Another guy I know personally has a D7000 and regretted their purchase after I got the A77.
It’s just a pity that NONE of the dSLR people I meet have ever seen nor held a Sony camera and that is the biggest issue I have with Sony imaging. They are useless at promoting their fantastic cameras.
Frank–I have actually seen quite a few in my travels, especially in 2012, the vast majority with the kit lens but not the 16mm as I had anticipated.
Screw the hybrid mount. It will only add cost and problems
Make NEX9 normal E-mount + LA3 for a-mount.
When OS PDAF is up to Prime Time then come out with A-mount mirrorless.
Continue to develop the 2 lens mounts you already have
I agree Sony should just keep improving both their A and E systems, mainly by designing new great lenses for the E mount and investing in developing an on-sensor AF system ( either CDAF or PDAF or both added ) with on par performance with the current dedicated PDAF system.
Eventually the A mount body should only offer FF sensors ( either SLT or mirrorless ), with APS-C moving to E-mount only. The RX1 should be followed by at least two other models ( RX2, RX3)with fixed 50/1.2 and 85/1.4 lenses respectively.
A NEX FF should be a low priority project, considering the other more important ones mentioned, and the big success of the RX1.
Let nex be nex and alpha,alpha.Let’s make some good cameras and lenses instead of hybridmountgonnaworkforalllenses sh*t.
Whos gonna by this, not many, it’s gonna be big bucks$$$$$ for what!!!!!
Dont spend too much money on bodies, There are people like me who doesnt want to buy a body every year. BUT i buy almost 3 lens a year. Spend the development on stellar lenses. These are one of the reasons im not letting go of my MFT’s they have stellar lenses that doesnt cost an arm and a leg. E-MOUNTS doesnt need BODIES it needs LENS to compensate for the great sensor. FULLFRAME will never solve anything it just means more money-big lenses-great image quality which their is a market for it already. give the NEX line its own character – apart from the rest. my 2 cents worth.
You buy three lenses per year? Are you losing them??
Gotta collect them all.
Yes i buy 3 lenses a year because i have a job.
A, C or E are the ones that will not mess with the NEX body size and “Declasses” it back to SLT size camera’s
A means a bigger mount, where the E-mount sinks in and a mount stays on top. Meaning still pocketable with small e-mount lensens
C means a bigger mount, more or less an extentable extensiontube.
E means complete redesign.
So E is not going to happen. A and C are so so.
Where is the SPEED-like adapter? Still miss that option. by adding additional glass in an adapter it would be possible to cover FF with Amount..
Seems like most people commenting prefer the native E with A-mount adapter solution. I’m also in this boat since the main reason I bought an NEX was due to the total size and image quality.
If Sony tries to please everybody, they’re going to end up pleasing nobody. There’s a DSLR market and there’s a compact mirrorless market. They shouldn’t try to combine both of them into one. Canon and Nikon haven’t really pushed the compact mirrorless segment too hard purely because it’ll eat into their DSLR sales. Sony doesn’t have anywhere near the DSLR sales and this is their chance to take the mirrorless segment. Unfortunately, if it comes at the expense of pissing off some DSLR users, it’ll still make sense if they can attract new customers. Honestly, are there that many people who buy NEX cameras to use their A-mount lenses?
Any that involve moving either the mount or sensor will wear with time. Even if not moved they are a source of loose mounting. Which will make precise focus a serious problem.
And that does not even count a dual set of electrical contacts to keep working.
Only really practical solutions are to keep A and E bodies separate, or throw them both out and make an entirely new mount, which would be necessary to include FF. Cameras that are not mechanical nightmares are what’s desired.
A last solution, the only one that works well with all focal lengths is to center system development on A mount. E mount is a patchwork that’s really only proper with the wide angle end of lenses. It could be kept as the upper end of a premium Cybershot line and Sony could go on making duplicate wide angle lenses for it like they are now.
You were doing so well until the last paragraph.
Do you wake up in the morning and think to yourself, “What drivel shall I spout today on Sony forums?”.
There is nothing about e-mount that prevents the use of long lenses. The current range is far from just duplicate wide angles, unless you count 210mm as wide angle.
Simplest solution: Include an A adapter with the system or sell the AF A adapters for $50. Not even worth debating. Nobody is going to enjoy using a NEX FF with a mega A-mount lens.
voiting is not really correct
there must be ‘f’ option – none of them
I agree. I’d prefer just a pure E-Mount without A-Mount support. An adapter could be used for those that want to use A-Mount lenses. I have zero desire to mount overly bulky SLR lenses on a mirrorless body.
It sounds like this camera is designed to transition people from the A99 to the E-Mount. Then eventually doing away with the A-Mount. I think I’ll wait for a cheaper purely E-Mount full frame camera.
Weird poll options, half of the options sound like the same thing.
I have no idea what the difference is between a and c for example.
WHat’s weird isn’t that the options seem identical, but that they represent every possible option under the sun. You don’t need a Sony insider to tell you. You can just think of them yourself.
Add me to the ‘F’ none of the above.
Bigger, heavier, more complicated, no thanks, I’d rather keep my NEX 7 and buy 3 speed boosters.
Honest question: why would anyone want to buy a $3000-4000 FF mirrorless with a hybrid mount over an APS-C mirrorless with a “metabones speedbooster”-type adapter to mount FF lenses (e.g. SAL on NEX) for about $2000? You would get similar light-collection/speed and depth-of-field control this way, right? May keep the body smaller, too. Not trolling, I simply want to know what other advantages there may be to a FF-NEX that I don’t know of/understand.
That is an excellent question. I’m stating to wonder that myself. AF would presumably be better (at least with A-mount) lenses and it would be compatible with rangefinder lenses and possibly have a more compact system of full-frame lenses. I like my rangefinder glass so I’m still holding out for a genuine full-frame. A lot hinges on what sensor package they put in the NEX-9. If it is a warmed over version of the VG900 it won’t be worth it because it won’t play nice with rangefinder designs and so there’s no size advantage. I really hope that Sony doesn’t have some magic mechanical built-in mount. I’m sure that would be nice for some, but for me, with no current A-mount lenses it would be waste of money & space. I think there’s a far larger number of people in my camp.
That said, I might consider investing in some A-mount glass with the NEX-9 because after dropping that much cash I will certainly stay a while. I’ve almost pulled the trigger on an LA-E2 adapter and a beer can or tele-zoom a few times. I wouldn’t use it much but when you need it, you need it.
Any reviews yet on those metabones speedboosters? It’s an optical glass in the speedbooster adapter. But the question is what quality is the glass. will it make a sigma lens like a leica lens? Or will it make Zeiss and Leica lenses like low end sigma lenses?
Well, for one, M mount lenses won’t work with the speed booster, only DSLR Lenses (including Alpha lenses) would. The reason is that the speed booster adds pieces of glass in the adapter, and you need to have a lot of flange distance to work with in order to even fit the glass in (the speed booster also reduces the total flange distance). The flange distance on M mount and other legacy mounts just do not have the flange distance necessary for the speed booster.
I think that’s the reason why many people want a FF e-mount. Also we might be able to get native lenses that are smaller than their a-mount counterparts.
But what is the quality of these glass? Does it introduce heavy distortion, more ca, less sharpness, less contrast, screws up the colors, and a whole load of fall off and edge smears?
After all, metabones was never ever ever renowned for making quality glass.
Have they even been around long enough to earn a reputation? If they’ve had products before this recent Spood Beester thing, I’ve not heard of them.
exactly. they are nobodies. name one other piece of high quality “optics” that they rave reviews on. none.
How about Metabone produces SpeedBooster2 for the FF NEX + MF lenses? That would be something ain’t it?
I would guess, that option e would be the best thing.
The one physical mount should be the E-Mount and the A-lenses should be redesigned to fit the E-Mount… No more SLT technology, only OS-PDAF and CDAF, assuming the OS-PDAF will get fast enough to detach the SLT mirror and the future lenses for E-mount will also allow FF.
I guess a 10 years old kid sent in the list. Nice!
I didn’t read through all the comments so not sure it was suggested but would it be unreasonable to design the camera with an a mount or an e mount then let the consumer buy one or the other dependent on the lens system they already own?
if these are the options they are truly considering then the need to stop smoking whatever it is they’re smoking. Make and E-mount (or A-mount) FF mirror-less. Give the camera devision the resources it needs to make a world-class lens line up and start behaving like your in this game to win. Right now Sony is acting like a flake and a company who dabbles in the camera market which is frustrating as hell. It’s not rocket science. Look at established lens line ups and start making equivalents…. and lay off the damned tacky, slow silver zooms!!!
Hope you’re right… these sorts of rumors are getting people to really question what the hell Sony is doing on other web forums. Not really a good thing for building trust in the brands (which Sony hasn’t been helping themselves with some of their actions). They really need to get their #@$ together…
Why does Sony always seek to complicate things unnecessarily? As others have noted, what most people want is a camera that is approx the size of a NEX 7 but with FF sensor.
Don’t make it bigger or more expensive to add some sort of fancy tech to accept both E and A mount lenses. Make it E mount and offer an adaptor. Simple.
If you give us a FF NEX E mount for $2000 or less, with the type of great sensor we now expect from Sony, you will have a huge hit on your hands.
Its official! Sony is shutting down its lines of A and E mount cameras because the community complains no matter what they do and they’re tired of fighting their users.
Sony is damned if they do, damned if they dont.
If you want to see experienced whiners then have a look on CaNikon forums, they have got it down to a fine art.
I agree 100%!
Everyone just needs to relax a little. If what Sony (or Canikon) is doing REALLY bothers them, switch mounts! We’re all owe it to ourselves to find what works best for us, whether its in a professional capacity or a hobby. Unfortuantely the manufacturers dont see it as they “owe” us anything. I think the faster technology changes, the less stable an investment in any lens mount will be – that goes for Canon, Nikon, Sony, Pentax, etc. We’re living in a strange world these days…
Well said. I guess a lens mount is like life, its not promised to be there tomorrow.
Of course, if we’re forced to change mounts when we don’t want to….
The idea of an internally-moving camera is awfully Rube Goldbergian, but Sony’s compulsion to design such a thing comes right down to this. If they kill off A mount they’re in for a world of pain, the number of people who use A mount because their happen to like using DSLRs who’ll transition to NEX anyway is infinitesimal. At the same time, developing for two mounts is clearly an expense they’re rather do without. That they, apparently, have four different working solutions to the problem says at least that they’re thinking deeply about the problem, but I don’t think any of them is going to work well, at least not if we’re expected to shell out $4000 for something that is no better as a picture-taking device than something Nikon sells for $2000.
Another Canon JackA$$, I do have some respect for Nikon, but not at all for Canon. 🙂
No hard feeling then buddy, I shoot Nikon D4 and D800E. Canon? Psh… 😉 I used to shoot Canon, and have shot Minolta, Pentax too.
My name is just to anonymize me.
What about a back and forward shifting sensor as in example b) but with some micro shifting as well?
It could autofocus assist manual focus lenses! Any lens!!
How long have you been reading SARs ?
All of us that know Andrea really aprove his work in this site and the rumours that he posts are very well written with enough background information to show us the most he can without talking nonesense.
If you can read, there are more than 1 option precisely to mantain the source without compromizing him.
You are right. And I was so lucky to have posted 95% of the time reliable SR5 rumors. Damn was lucky when I was the first to tell you about the new SLT technology. And I was lucky when I told you about a new mirrorless NEX system. I am lucky having told you about the A58 and lucky about the A99 pictures I posted as first.
People easily forgets what I did in 4 years. I am used to be blamed for what I write…and I used to the fact that guys like you disappear the same day Sony announces what I “rumored” on SAR 🙂
Photonut, believe me, not me, but you will have to pay me a beer in one year exactly 😉
Horrible ideas.
Why this hybrid mount if it has to have moving parts??? More moving parts (either the mount or the sensor must move back and forth) = more points of failure. More dust more dirt more grit stuck inside. And will this be a mechanical or electronic motors to move them? If electronic than have to wait and wait for the motor delay each time changed a lens?
Should keep two separate mount bodies. A full size bulky heavy but rugged a-mount mirrorless. Hell it can even have a FAKE pentaprism like SLTs do. And the other is a compact e-mount with simple mount adapter.
PhotoNut just got spanked.
Absolutely!
PhotoNut is learning you should never doubt the seemingly far fetched ideas of R&D. Crazy ideas are the mother of invention, so long as development mirrors design.
The vast majority of crazy ideas fail. I’d say trying to stuff two mounts in is one of those ideas that will fail. Even if it did not it will add greatly to the cost of the camera bodies.
While I have my doubts on the technical possibility of option d) “3 Interior (in-body) camera mounts that can be user switched dependent upon the mounting of all current lenses,” it would be a good way for Sony to gravitate all of their ILS customers to one product line, the NEX. It would be a huge technical feat, however, if Sony was able to create a mirrorless system that accepted A-Mount, E-Mount and the older SR-Mount (MD/MC Rokkor) without the need for an adapter. Needless to say, I have a hard time imagining that the image quality could be optimized for each of these lens types using one camera – but, one can only dream.
I’d be very happy with an E-mount and the adapters I already own. I don’t want a new lens system…I’m very happy with my old lenses…both Minolta AF and manual glass adapted to either Alpha or E-Mount. Just give me a smaller camera with a bigger sensor.
Many people seem to be against a dual-mount body.
I agree with Sony though, and think it’s a good idea. Opening up the world of A-mount lenses (of which there are some beautiful ones!) to the NEX will make the NEX more competitive with CaNikon.
Allowing it ‘in-body’ may well be cheaper, and provide a smaller form factor, than using an A-mount – NEX adapter.
Lastly, it will allow A-mount user to more easily transition to the NEX system, should they choose to do so.
It’s a shame that IS will be lost – but maybe Sony has a trick up their sleeve for that.
Whatever the solution, I think the 3 most important considerations are:
1) SIZE – the impact on overall size of the NEX body (needs to remain small)
2) DURABILITY – an overly complex solution may be more prone to breaking-down over time
3) COST – the dual-mount is a “nice-to-have”, but I don’t care to pay a lot extra for the feature, especially with so many adapters available
Maybe Sony should partner with Metabones for the solution. 🙂
Admin, I’ve tried posting comments 4 times, and nothing ever gets through. Can you please work on this? It’s really frustrating.
But of course THAT gets through. WTF.
it also happens to me alot to
I happened to me earlier. The software is just broken.
The list was all of the options they thought of, not a list of choices we still have. They most certainly have already decided which method they will be using.
If we’re voting to guess which Sony did, I’m thinking it’s either A or D. B and C mean more moving parts in the camera, which would be riskier. Although the idea of a moving sensor means you might be able to add sensor stabilization as well 🙂
I would think if the engineers could do A, that would be the way to go. D would be next. B and C seem roughly equivalent, but it might mean a larger body with wasted space when using E-mount lenses (Especially for option B).
E makes no sense whatsoever. I guess it means make yet another mount, which means this isn’t a NEX camera, It’s just a mirrorless, Full-Frame camera. It was a last resort, if none of the other options turned out to be feasible.
Moving the sensor to adjust flange distance is not at all a motion used in sensor based stabilization. It’s straight fore-aft where stabilization is motions at 90 degrees to that across the lens axis. All the stabilization motions maintain the flange distance and thus do not interfere with precise focus. They are mechanically locked on the focus axis and precisely aligned to it with a set of alignment screws. Flange distance adjustment is in the same direction as focus movements. Which means additional potential for mechanical play in the system messing with focus as it would not be locked set screws.
What if the NEX-9 will have the Sony FZ mount and come bundled with an E & A mount adapter? That would “technically” fit with the wording of Adrea’s source and solve the size/distance conundrum?
I think the flange distance of the fz- and the e-mounts are the same (18mm) which should make it technically impossible to properly adopt the fz to to e. fz to a-mount should work though.
Question: shouldn’t the flange distance change between a APS-C and a FF sensor?
The flange distance is determined by the lens design, not the sensor size. Once you have the lens designed you have to make the sensor position work with that flange distance.
f – One mount on the front and the other on the back 😛
Admin
Could yoi ask sar readers if they would buy a 54 megapixel full frame camera of comparable image guality to the nex7n
Also ask about a 36 and 24mp version.
This way mayby Sony can know what we would buy before they build it.
It might also be usefull to tell sar readers about 8k video standard as it might influence thier opinions if they knew.
Andrea, is it possible to auto-delete any post with the words “54 megapixel” in it?
Why is it so important that just because you don’t want it no one should have it?
Exactly lets find out what people really want, not just who speaks the loudest (myself included)
Because you’re spamming this messageboard with the same post over and over and over again.
maybe we could ask for the poll just to end the discussion
pretty much a single E mount with an adapter for A mount just like it is today but
wit ha new adapter that probably wont have a mirror…
I think the solution will be like the adapter for Nikon V1 to F mount lenses for
hybrid autofocus…..;)
just make a good adapter for a-mount lenses (maybe one that you can secure with screws or something like that instead of just the bayonet) plus a self calibrating sensor.
or just ignore the a-mount I don’t care for that, just get an a99 or something if you have a lot of lenses. because I don’t think it is really important to have on board a-mount support, make it optional for those who want it.
Which they would do if they were going to continue development of the A-mount….
History tells us that Sony will abandon E and A for something new and useless… but will provide adapter that dumbs down the tech, and makes your lens fall off.
It will be hailed as revolutionary… And reviewers will praise the change claiming NOTHING fit E or A mount to begin with. And you guys will call me a whiner for complaining about it. I’ll be labeled as an old toothless tog stuck in the past, afraid of modernity.
Sure wish the flash shoe options were discussed before killing us with improvements.
Sony like a bad cheating girlfriend…
Hot as hell, totally unpredictable, expensive, self serving, and rarely keeps her word.
And we’ll have to wait a year, just for another 24mp Sony, which will be pricier than an a99 and NEX 7 combined.
Oh boy!
So if they want to use FF Alpha lenses on a slim mirrorless without an adapter mount How is the camera going to hold those heavy lenses without breaking the tripod mount?
Pure E-mount would be smarter and then alpha adapter with the tripod foot would be better.
The build had needs to better than the Nex7. Sure it’s metal on the outside but it’s still plastic fantastic inside and tripod mount is good for nothing other than native e-mount lenses. Forget putting any lenses heavier than the Tokina 11-16 on an adapter without a tripod mount on the adapter. I found it on another forum Sony wants $750 to replace the cracked tripod mount.
How many NEX owners own alpha cameras and lenses are there vs NEX owners that don’t own any Alpha camera’s or lenses? A few simple surveys would help Sony figure out if a hybrid E/A mount would be a smart idea.
“How is the camera going to hold those heavy lenses without breaking the tripod mount?”
Guess what – better tripod mount! Alpha bodies hold those lenses all the time you know, and their tripod mounts don’t break. it’s not like it’s impossible.
So then why isn’t “Keep A and E mounts separated” an option in the poll?
Sensor movement maybe the best option. OMD can do it pretty effectiely while maintaining a very small slim camera, of course sony can do it too. It could also double in as sensor stabilization for Nex finally.
That might be a good idea if it can do in camera stabilzation.
If it adds size to the camera I don’t mind.
Dual mount? yuk!!! That reaklly defeat the design purpose of a NEX system. I got a feeling that Sony is struggle to design a FF len that fit in a small compact NEX body.
Hybrid spells trouble! I know myself on this one 😉
If this leads to a frankenstein, bulky solution, then I’m out. So far, I’m pretty happy with APS-C NEX. FF NEX would be a reason to ditch my FF DSLR for something more compact, but if Sony produces something bulky just to appease A mount, they will lose me and other Canikon owners.
If this camera cost more than it should because Sony engineered a way for the 200 A mount lens owners to use their lens without an adapter, I am completely out. FF NEX should be dead simple. FF sensor in a NEX body with E-mount. If they have to deepen the distance between the sensor and lens a little, that’s fine. I do not want to see or pay for mechanical contraption that readjust the mount for DSLR-sized A mount lenses I will never buy.
my 2 cents.
NEX9 will cost $3500 or more than whatever RX1 is priced at.
So those thinking of getting a cheap NEX9, continue dreaming.
Sony is targeting rich amauters or rather rich techies to buy this.
And also those who have heavily invested in Sony lens who wants a smaller body.
These people will hail this new camera as a new saint.
NEX9 will come with hybrid mount that accepts both A & E.
In order for the above to happen.
Also for the benefit of all future Sony cameras.
Users will have access to more lens, from both mount, lens will fly off their shelves.
And they could choose either to have IBIS or OSS up to their liking.
e.g. A78 that could mount your E lens natively?
NEX9 will not have IBIS for E, but have IBIS for A.
A mount has no OSS but there are for E, this is the logical path they will approach.
NEX9 will have a bigger body, to accomodate the new mount.
Like i said, the target group of users for NEX9 is different.
If you do not fall in this group, whining will not help just stick with Sony’s plan for you using NEX3/5/6/7.
Or if compact is your key reason, just stick with Sony’s RX series.
Hybrid A+E mount will be hailed as revolutionary, as it will help Sony merge both lens into one family.
And from this, they could slowly concentrate on one mount in the next few roadmap.
This will most likely be the transition plan upcoming over the few years.
NEX9 will have 24MP sensor, no point going higher which cost more and take worse pictures and even worse raising the cost of the already expensive camera and R&D costs.
Remember they still have to make differences between NEX series and their Alpha series.
NEX9 will not have a viewfinder, ala RX series but might have big touchscreen.
This will help boost profits.
The simplest solution to the hybrid mount is make one mount that accepts both, focal flange distance by default is of the longer mount and make the sensor moves forward to get the shorter FL. Don’t have to make the body ticker, just the mount. It’s like a camera with an adapter attached to it permanently. Will look like this one: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-MngdlKHuxBg/UBAeO3XoRUI/AAAAAAAAFyw/xi20GPzBm3A/s1600/kipon_adapter2.jpg
Pros:
-Built-in screw AF is possible
-better lens alignment. adapter can decenter lens
-sturdier for large A-mount lens.
-can still use other-mount-to-NEX adapter because it still has NEX mount.
Cons:
-less compact, adapter is permanently attached.
“Don’t have to make the body ticker”
Thicker, not ticker.
Just sit back for a minute and really try to absorb how wack this ideas is…
I’m curious – how many nex shooters here regularly use a-mount lenses? Ive got a nex 3 kicking around struggle to see how most a-mount lenses would ever feel natural on a nex.
I wonder if part of the problem for sony is the cost of designing ff e-mount lenses for an as yet unproven camera. It could be that it will have a-mount compatibility for a wider range of ff lenses, allowing the to drip feed e-mount lenses if the demand is there.
If that’s the case, why not make the nex 9 native a-mount and release a-mount pancakes?
I have decided to keep my a850 and go for nex+la ea2 on the side instead of upgrading my alpha body. the lenses that I have and plan to use on both cameras are Minolta 35 f2, 50 f1.4 and planning to get the Minolta 20 f2.8 and the Sony 85 2.8. I’ll keep my old beercan for special occasions. this has become the perfect solution for me to get portability without entirely giving up FF, and without having to invest a lot of money in a double range of glass.
If sony plans a solution that includes built in image stabilzation then i vote for it even if it increses the size of the camera slightly. I would even accept a small price penalty to achieve this.
On the other hand if the solution does not include image stabilization then there is absolutely no reason to build it in. Use an adapter in that case.
People will only use nikon ir canon lenses if stabilzation is not included, not a mount.
I will still only biy the camera if it is something new.
I will not buy another 24mp camera no matter what they put on it.
Heres another thought.
If sony uses a moving sensor it can serve multiple functions
1 Shift the focal plane to allow a or e mount.
2 Sensor shift image stabilization.
3 Sensor shift auto focus to allow auto focus if manual focus lenses.This will allow use of smaller more economical lenses.
4 Built in automatic extension tube for the closer or macro focusing. The lens can also be manually focused as a focus limiter for faster auto focus with the sensor
f)stabilized hybrid sensor
The problem is the A mount: it requires stabilization on the body and phase detection, both can be solved with a sensor with stabilization movements and (more powerfull)phase detection photodiodes.
there is something not mentioned in your post Admin…how the heck they get the right diameter for both A and E mounts on several of the approaches made to give a “solution” to the hybrid proposal. All possible options made to get it working for both the A and E mount registration distance but none for the difference in diameters (Except for option D and E).
I still call this BS unless I see the actual product. (And if they adopt the option E, then it is not a hybrid anymore) And guess what? If they adopt any of those options, it will be so big, that it won’t be called NEX anymore and will become a new series along with the NEX and SLT series.
f_ Ditch the mirror.