Paul Genge from Sony UK said at British Journal of Photography that the firm has still to make a decision on whether it will use its Translucent Mirror Technology in the upcoming models. And he said that a new Alpha full-frame camera would replace the A850 and A900 released in 2008.
That is more or less all what Sony had to say about their future Fullframe plans. What do I know more in terms of fullframe rumors?
1) The roadmap for FF lenses and camers has been shifted forward for a couple of months. Like it was for the A77 everything has been delayed. I will give you more info about the new Fulflrame lenses soon.
2) There will be more than one (probably three!) new fullframe cameras in 2012
3) Not a single one of those will have a classic DSLR design (no classic mirror, no prisma)
4) The A99 (one of the three cameras) should be unveiled before the Photokina 2012 show in September (I am not sure yet when Sony will announced about other one-two fullframe cameras)
5) Sony developed a new 36Megapixel fullframe sensor which will probably fit inside the A99.
Of course I received more details, but I need to double and triple check them with other sources. I ask my sources if they cans hare me some bits about the future Sony FF roadmap. As you know you can use the anonymous contact form on the right sidebar or write me at sonyalpharumors@gmail.com. Thanks!
What I can also say is that my trusted sources are sure the new FF cameras will shake the world. And I am sure they mean it very honestly!
See you soon!
Andrea
140 Responses
Confirm no DSLR design. But MAY not use Translucent design. So what now? Mirrorless full frame? o_O
Wow, I don’t think mirrorless a-mount will be ready in a year. But I welcome Sony to surprise us. There is a patent of PDAF directly on sensor by Sony (should be similar to Fuji’s) and maybe it needs larger FF sensor to make it work.
@hanugro + Carl
I wish you were right. A mirrorless a-mount camera should be possible. Let´s leave the price aside.
I think within 3-5 years, all new a-mount model will be mirrorless.
They only need to be 44.6mm (+2~5mm for the mount, case, LCD etc) deep. That’s only a few millimetres deeper than a NEX-7 (42.6mm).
And it’s not like there’s any film chamber to add width and height to it. Just need to squeeze in a battery, storage, processors and viewfinder somewhere.
I see no reason they couldn’t make such a camera smaller than, say, an M9, excepting being slightly deeper.
Building the box of a NEX9 should be easy but it is still missing native E-mount FF lenses.
Yes I know you can make the Hubble telescope fit with the right adapter.
With a flange back distance of 18 mm it will be a much bigger challenge than either APS-C or Leica M9 to get the corners sharp.
Look for specialized sensor with shifted micro lenses and in camera lens correction.
All of this will drive the price up.
One of the legitimate reasons the Leica is so expensive,and their flange back is 27.80.
Maybe Sony will surprise us with the first curved sensor. LOL
Even the M9 and its tilted micro-lenses and firmware suffers from excessive vignetting and colour shifts on wide angle lenses (the angled microlenses don’t help the long path length through the IR filter which causes clour shifts). I can’t help but think that retrofocal designs will be required for wide angle lenses on an FF version of the NEX to produce a more telecentric design. At least Sony don’t have FF E-Mount legacy lenses to protect. Of course it will increase the length and sizes of wide angle lenses.
if sony release a mirrorless fullframe and performance is excellent, i will sell off ALL of my DSLR cameras, and just keep some lenses for the mirrorless.
IMHO, Sony should make 1 DSLR and 2 dSLT for FF. One is a plastic $1500 body only dSLT, one is high end dSLT with metal body cost around $2500 and finally a top of the range dSLR for $3000. All is using the same sensor.
Agreed…
$1500 FF will realy shake the world.
Promises of amazing pucture qaulity is nothing.
Given the price of the A77 body, I think it’s unlikely to be so cheap.
Happy to be proven wrong, of course.
sony should learn when the a900 came out, it was soooo cheap for a fullframe but it did not sell because quality was behind d700 and 5dii when those came out shortly after, then they changed it even cheaper to a A850 but still could not sell because quality and high noise issues. Sony should learn its lesson this time to not hold back on price and make their flagship model #1 in PHOTO QUALITY (like how nikon d3s shook the dslr professional market).
!!!
Excepting that the A900 produces better images than the 5DII and D700.
BS posts on the net about the 900/850 being a poor quality, noisy mess have done much more harm for the camera’s sales than any actual shortcomings with its imaging.
No. The reason Sony sold less was because there were already huge userbases of canon and Nikon customers waiting for full frames.
The a850 and a900 still hold their own right now as some of the best cameras out there, period. Built like a tank, and the high ISO is actually very good with a decent raw converter. You have sheer megapixels and full frame sensor on your side when it comes to high ISO.
That may be the reason for three full frames. Sony can hit three totally different price points. If technology gets to the point where full frames can me made inexpensively, can APS-C sensors be done away with? Could Sony then concentrate on full frame and NEXs only?
If you go to ronharris blog, you’ll see that he tossed the 5DMKII because it didn’t render flesh tones properly. we know how those flesh tones are the money makers in porn, don’t we all?
Stop dreaming… we already preordering A77 for 1000USD/EUR… oh NO! for 1500EUR!
I agree… It’s sad… 1000$@the beginning vs 1500$@the end :/
Just use the 77 body and put in another sensor (worried about the new 36 Mp IQ though). I think 24 would be quite nice..
The competition has something to say about pricing too….
I don’t think anyone would be surprised if Canon and Nikon don’t also release several new FF cameras soon and a $2,000 USD price point for the low-end model would seem reasonable based on history and the current pricing of cameras like the a77.
Depending on specifications and performance, a price spread at 2k, 2.5k and 3k would likely be a big “win” for Sony and the possibility of securing a following among professionals.
You guys expect Sony to produce a FF plastic body to couple with the high end CZ lens and price at 1500? Dream on folks every FF body comes with a price and if you know it is FF will it be priced at the cost of an APSC?
Be realistic.
Hey Sony,
three FF? Please, just make only one but make more lenses so we can use FF!
What lenses are there that you really need?
tilt-shift?
ultra-telephoto?
They are the only real gaps for full frame users now
Sony has a world-class 16-35, a better 24-70 than canon, a 70-200 which is equal. Plus the zeiss 85 prime is nicer than the L, and the 135 is the fastest available. The 24 f2 is also exceptional. I’d say they need a good 50 1.4 or 1.2, and maybe a 35 1.4 refresh, but they aren’t critical gaps.
The lens lineup is nothing more than an excuse now.
I want an f1.4 wider than 35mm.
Canon has made one since the late 70s, Nikon and Leica have each made two different focal lengths. Minolta had one designed before selling shop.
The world only STF.
It has always been an excuse, and for these people, it will always be an excuse. In the old days, they were complaining about in-lens motors and stabilization. Now that we have both, they must complain about something else. The trick is to ignore them; they (99% of the complainers) will never buy the lenses they complain about even if they existed anyway, so they don’t matter.
What about NEX-9 with FF and A mount? It is possible?
David, I agree with you!
I own those ZA’s and I believe them to be as good if not better than Nikon and Canon’s offering.
But what has been worrisome is the lack of recent interest and the neglect of maintenance of its a-lens catalog and largely focusing only on the DT product.
Granted, FF is not where the money is for Sony and it looks like the FF product is coming soon, and to be fair as you pointed out before, Sony has released several new lenses that can be used on FF cameras about one a year.
Right now, Sony only has one full frame camera in production and its sales likely are dismal, so it’s understandable why Sony hasn’t spent millions on revamping the FF lens line-up.
But, if it’s true the rumor that Sony plans to release three full frame cameras in 2012, then it would be nice if Sony refreshed the old FF lens catalog with new coatings and better motors suitable for video and other enhancements to take advantage of the incredible sensors expected to be inside these new cameras and even try some weather sealing to match what’s going on with the a77 product.
I think having a SLT *ONLY* FF line up is a mistake. It’s not all about being technology sceptical, there are solid reasons why one doesn’t want a EVF, and especially professional photographers have very clear ideas what gear they want.
It would be sad if Sony gives up one of the best OVF (A900) out there, the only bigger OVF is from Canon in the 1Ds.
@StickingZoom
The biggest beef is the refresh rate as it can’t keep up with fast movement. If they sort that out with a new FF SLT I think pros wont have much to complain about, no? I say that and make sure the resolution is the highest ever seen, it needs to mimic a OVF in every real way. If they can do that then I think they have killed any real issues to be had. Unless I am missing some points?
It was stated in one of the previews that the A77 EVF crushes the shadow detail in a high contrast situation. With an OVF you would see the shadow detail.
It’s something I can live with for the benefits that an EVF brings, I’m not too sure that future A99 users would agree though. 🙂
@carl
+1
I don’t get why so many here assume HIGH ISO = IQ !
For me, Sony color + dr of a900 trounce 5dii, d700
It is always SONY color that keeps me in the system.
With a900, you have to use it to believe it!
not everything can be shot at iso200. especially indoors and you want to keep the fill flash low powered as to not bury the ambient background. thats the problem with the a850/a900, it only looks good at iso200.
The difference between 200 and 320 is very subtle.
I agree. Sony should keep at least one FF camera with an OVF. They have a beautiful OVF in the A900 and would be mad to give it up entirely.
An OVF in a full frame camera is miles better than any in an APS-C camera, but I suspect an EVF in a full frame camera is going to look the same as one in in APS-C camera.
One DSLT for fast focus and full video control and one DSLR for full use of sensor quality please.
Sony doesn’t need to “like no other”. Please just “make believe”. Don’t be stubborn.
“What I can also say is that my trusted sources are sure the new FF cameras will shake the world.”
The problem is that they have all said the same about the A77…
And I bet Nikon will do better with the same sensor than A77… and probably pentax as well.
A77 is good… very good indeed…But it didn’t shake the world.
As usual we have lots of idiots who think they know more than a team of engineers and think they could do better than Sony… and they are writing bad things…
A77 is a very good camera… but it’s only a “normal camera” for the actual times… Then Nikon will improve it… Canon will publish something better and lower the prices… etc… Everything’s normal…
It’s a shame that we can buy a Canon 5D Mark II cheaper than a A900 or A850 (actually discontinued)
Where did you buy that 5D2? I always thought A850 is the cheapest FF cam ever in the world. Not by much though.
http://www.warehouseexpress.com
5DMkII currently £1689 body only (but with free battery grip)
A850 currently £1999 body only
A77 pre-order £1149 body only
Yeah. In the US 5DMkII is much more expensive than A850.
Look at the buying options. The prices are much more ridiculous for the 5DMkII.
Google Shopping:
$2029 for 5DMkII
$1969 for A850
And of course, from Amazon.com and dpreview’s affiliate links the 5DMkII is still @ $2500.
Personally, it’s an unfair comparison as you’re comparing a store-specific promotion as opposed to release price.
But that’s just me. I’m sure there’s always someone who try to argue.
Canon 5D Mark II – 1787€
Sony A900 – 2295€
Sony A850 – Discontinued
I think spec-wise A77 is far better than any of the CaNikon nowdays and I doubt that they will bring something out with the same or better specs with lower price.
ON the other hand you can’t really talk about IQ until we have an officially released 1.0 FW and RAW handling for A77.
In my mind if the IQ is going to be good it is the best of mid-level DSLRs.
BTW Sony is shaking the world just by using new technical solutions with great efficiency, I mean translucent technology had only a few problems in the first generation and now…
+1
You said it all …
Let the rumor to rumor, we come to the disappointment …
New machine is coming that will shake the world (FF)! It was not the A77?
September what? 2011 or 2012?
2012 obviously. The Photokina is a biennial trade fair and there is none in 2011.
We want a Nex 9.
And here we go…! The new season of upcoming rumors begins =D
I was waiting for new rumors to come. After some peace with the released equipment, new rumors are welcome. Hope this year of new rumors will be more exciting than the one that has just ended with the official a77 and nex-7 announcement. Keep the good job Andrea.
Now, regarding this rumor…I think Sony should leave a traditional OVF model for both APS-C and FF lines. At least 1 model of each one.
So that we get
2 Entry level SLT (a35/a55) and 1 Entry level SLR (whatever comes after a390 or the a390 itself)
2 Mid level/Professional APS-C SLT (a65/a77) and 1 Mid level/Professional APS-C SLR (whatever comes after A580 or the a580 itself)
2 Professional FF SLT (a99 and whatever goes along with it) and 1 Professional FF SLR (a900 replacement)
At least keep that lineup for 1 or 2 years then make full transition to SLT if they address any limitations found on FF dSLT (taking into account comments from professional users as a feedback for upcoming releases). But anything that provides the best quality is very welcome. And don’t forget lenses…Lenses are more important than bodies. They should put the best of their effort to fill gaps between both A-mount and E-mount lineup. F/4 versions of their F/2.8 lenses and starting offering updates to their lenses (like putting SSM on old screw-driven AF lenses and weather sealing). Release again old good Minolta lenses with updated optics if required. That way, I think, they could get more attention from professionals, and then, from consumers in general (because seeing a professional using a Sony camera in soccer games, conferences, etc is what makes consumer and prosumer look for the offerings that Sony could provide)
I smell Nex9 FF 😀
NEX-9 FF – that smells really good!
But please: big enough to handle it with a man’s hand…
Sony should release a real “sport camera” also. Not so many MP’s and a large buffer. Not all people need +12 MP cameras. So would be nice to be able to choose between “MP king camera” and “sport camera”.
Looking forward to those lens rumours.
Personally, I would love something similar to the d700. Rugged build quality, low(er) resolution sensor (maybe 16-24mp) and great high ISO. Then give it a fast flash sync and all the other essentials like microadjust etc.
If they can do those things, I don’t mind if it’s SLT or SLR.
I guess that’s the most desired FF on earth; and it seems that Nikon is the only one smart enough to understand it and build it.
A bit OT but do you people read the A35 review on Photographyblog?
http://www.photographyblog.com/reviews/sony_a35_review/conclusion/
“The area that we’re most impressed with is the noise performance. It’s a pet peeve so we were gushing over the higher ISO settings which showed little or no noise at all. The EXMOR sensor gives punchy primary colours but not so much that they look unrealistic. In fact, in some cases, we preferred how the Sony recorded the colours to what was in front of our eyes.”
That is one great little camera!!
yes, and now think this sensor in the A65 😮 that would be perfect …
That said, I *LOVE* my a850. It is an amazing camera. The image quality is absolutely SICK.. with nice lenses, the amount of detail you can pull out of a scene is crazy.
It’s also a pleasure to use. The huge viewfinder makes composing and seeing what you are doing so easy. Big chunky buttons and stiff dials to adjust anything you want without diving into menus. It feels solid, so I don’t have to be paranoid about it falling apart (unlike my a500 and a580).
The high ISO is still very good too. It still easily beats my a580. On a pixel level, it is less clean, but the sheer amount of detail and texture it can capture over-rides any advantage of the little sensor. At ISO3200 you can still make out textures on clothing, see the stitching, see individual eyebrow hairs etc. Whereas the a580 is cleaner, but less details.
Sometimes I do miss the live-view and tilting screen of my a580, but I really love the a850 for being a simple photographic tool. Couple it with a 16-35, 50 1.4, 85 1.4 and the zeiss 135 1.8 and prepare to be absolutely blown away.
yeah, wait guys, it will be a NEX-9 and a A99 again with the “biggest resolution” (in comsumer market) with 65MP and the “fastest burst shooting” with 16 fps for 3 frames until buffer needs clearing 😉 not to forget the 5-way twisting, sliding, tilting and jumping screen!
Oh wow, that will be great, the only problem will be that no professional will be interested, only the hobby photographers with too much money… but it’s the same target group like the A77 aims for 🙂
A77 was supposed to shake the world also, but the only thing it shook was the confidence of the Alpha owners.
I agree.. I am thinking time to move to a different system.. Sony just can’t get it together in the DSLR world..
RIP for that miserable, worthless, A77 piece of junk that no one has used yet. Has there ever been so much stupid criticism of a camera one or two months before anyone ever used it?
Hasn’t shaken my confidence, I want one now!
Keep up the good work, Andrea.
Is there truth to the lesser FullFrame Sensor of 24MP?
Let us know more when you can. I’d like to know more about the two new 50mm’s.
Is the Rokkor name coming back?
Updated 58mm 1.2 and 1.4 Rokkors would be awesome.
A FullFrame NEX with E Mount and Sony will get all my photography money in 2012.
Lenses! We need lenses! 😉
I’d really like to replace my good old Tamron 24-135 by a Sony/CZ 4/24-120 SSM or similar. I would order it for 1000 EUR immediately.
Dear Sony,
Here we go again!
PLEASE keep one OVF Full Frame Camera WITHOUT the movie mode function – don’t really need it!
PLEASE lower the ISO to 25 and have 50, then the 100 and onward as normal. – not too much to ask isn’t it ? 🙂
PLEASE have the live view function with the ON/OFF button.
PLEASE keep the weather sealing metal body same as present a900.
NEW megapixel monster higher than 36 with NO noise issues ? – We know you Sony can do this! 😉
MAKE & KEEP the OVF Full Frame Camera aiming for Professional/Advance photographers.
Thank you! 🙂
A Full Frame User.
P.S. Would like you Sony bring back Rokkor Lenses with Automatic/Manual Focus for OVF Full Frames. Pretty Please and am sure Carl Zeiss won’t mind! 🙂
Yay, so many more bodies! *dance*
Seriously, Sony……..
Please Sony, just one of them with OVF!!!!!
We are classical professional user coming from Minolta. We need Optical View Finder. And if possible think about a built in flash type Minolta 9 series in ’90s .
You would like we all shift to Canon or Nikon?
Please consider this possibility!!!!!
Saluti,
Giuseppe
Italia
If they’re going to introduce such high MP sensors into their FF camera’s, they should at least have the option of pixel binning. A 39MP bayer sensor with the option of 2×2 pixel binning would ideal and would produce more manageable pixel sharp ~10MP images with less noise.
The SLT mirror is great for fast action and video, but in every other situation, all it does is to rob you of 1/2 a stop of light. They should have the option of a flip up mirror like a regular SLR. I’ve heard comments that say there isn’t enough room for an SLT mirror to flip without hitting the back of the lens but if it can be engineered for a regular SLR, I see no reason why it can’t be engineered for an SLT.
39 MP ? I though it was said to be 36 MP. But this may make me go for FF afterall. With a crop factor to DX of 2.25, I can get 16 MP in DX-cropped images from this FF sensor. That will surely do for me. Now, if they can improve high iso of the FF sensor about half a stop more compared to the current DX, I do not need more than that.
doh!
well a 6 kind of looks like a 9 but upside down.
Trick question: what are the benefits of in-camera 2×2 binning compared to binning during display and printing (beyond smaller file sizes)?
yeah, wait guys, it will be a NEX-9 and a A99 again with the “biggest resolution” (in comsumer market) with 65MP and the “fastest burst shooting” with 16 fps for 3 frames until buffer needs clearing 😉 not to forget the 5-way twisting, sliding, tilting and jumping screen!
Oh wow, that will be great, the only problem will be that no professional will be interested, only the hobby photographers with too much money… but it’s the same target group like the A77 aims for 🙂
hope to see some nice new cameras soon…
oh shit! no more high megapixel pliz, what we need is good image quality with very clear image n low noise. just that’s it. i don’t care if sony to make SLT or DSLR.. and bring us some new lens for full frame like ultra wide lens variation and some fix tele for profesional
@reinz
I think thats how Sony could differentiate the a88 line from the a99 line. The a99 should be a studio camera in my opinion. With amazing resolution, high mega pixels, sync speed to match a medium formate camera, etc. With the a88 that should be a camera that can be used for sports/events or even double duty in studio but the high iso performance should be absolutely stunning on it. The mega pixels for the a88 should remain at or around 24mp if they can pull of great high iso performance at that mega pixel. Also a99 should have built in battery grip and a88 maybe not.
Does permanently attaching the V-grip actually serve a purpose? I seldom remove mine, but it’s nice to have the option there.
@carl Im not a pro shooter, I would consider myself semi pro (I shoot editorial work every so often). Not sure what a full time pro shooter would say about the pros and cons of having a built in grip as opposed to a detachable one. With that said, I rarely if ever remove the group from my a900, but as you said I guess it would be nice to have the option and now that I think about it, the Leica S2 has a removable battery grip. I went to a preview of the Leica S2 when it first came out, man what a camera! the a99 needs to best it though!
yes i think that can be, like a nikon in D700 and D3s, D3 they are have differentiate segment camera for studio n all around. sony must learn from that if want to survive for competition dslr. hope that can be true, i wish sony a85 or 88 have a medium megapixel or not high than 24mp and more concern about noise handling and best image quality.
for internal battrey grip i don’t think so, if sony want sell a cheap camera than the other, they will skip to attach build in battrey grip in camera. maybe to lower the price production 😀
@reinz
for sure man! I used to cover events for one client. It would be dark as heck in some of the venues and good high iso performance was a must. I hope Sony can sort out its line up. I think they need a high end aps-c i.e. one just above the a77 that has larger buffer and better/faster refresh rate on the EVF and more AF points. Then they need to make the a88 like you said, the low light, speed demon with great IQ. Like the Canon 1d Mark IV. then they need to come with something that would punch a medium format camera in the nose i.e. a stellar a99 for studio work.
If the NEX7 outsells the A77, I wonder if Sony will bother with a DSLT/DSLR FF? NEX8.5, NEX9, NEX9.5 will be the cameras.
What I would like to see is a FF NEX camera with an A-mount or very small/minimal adapter to A-mount and a massive program to size reduce the lenses. In other words, and AF M9 type camera.
eeeeemmmm…then what you do with the 44.5mm registration distance of A-mount? FF with A-mount will be as big as required to meet the requirements. So FF “NEX” A-mount is unfeasible. Even if you say small/minimal adapter, It will be as big as a A-mount camera. So it doesn’t coincides with the NEX philosophy.
Any other cameras smaller than the a900 won’t fits in my hands, so don’t go wishing that it should be discontinue!
Hello sony, are you listening?
We want Full Frame NEX!
full frame nex, full frame nex, full frame nex!
YES! A FF sensor with offset micro-lenses and/or curved image sensor (and maybe even a Leica M mount!)
And in body IS
We may get small mirrorles FF, but it will not be NEX. It was said so many times here and there over various forums, rumors etc. – E-mount is APS-C only. Period.
Who says they have to keep the E-mount?
It might be a small mirrorless FF but no NEX? (so no E-mount as you suggest)…then what you do with those 44.5mm of empty space? Unless they provide PDAF on-sensor, mirrorless FF but no NEX will be nonsense since you’re wasting too much space.
The NEX-7 is about 43mm thick, which is barely smaller than the A mount flange distance.
A hypothetical mirrorless A mount camera would be more or less a slightly thicker version of that.
Sony, please jist give us 24-30Mp with high ISO that spanks the 5d II and is as good as D3s. 36MP is crazy, 26MP would dominate Canikon and if it can be done with killer high ISO you will get converters! If you have already designed 36MP sensor then work out a pixel binning high ISO mode as already discussed. I am a pro and I talk to loads of other pros everyday, I know what they and I want….please please answer our requests and I will never ever jump ship!! Hope you are reading this SONY!
Agreed. I’d much rather see the higher ISO performance of the Nikon D3 on a 24 MP sensor, with higher ‘action’ frame rates, than a 36 MP sensor that falls off badly after 1600 ISO.
1st – Full Frame NEX with same registration distance as APS-C NEX… A smart E-Mount Adapter that automatically switches Full Frame to APS-C… E-Mount secured.
2nd – Traditional OVF Prism Attachment to satisfy all who want tradition mirror/prism viewing. Release a series of finders like the old Mino XK, Nikon F2, and Canon F1… Hell, make an adapter that accepts the old finders and really shake the tree.
3rd – Create a new EVF attachment which allows Alpha AF on Full Frame NEX.
4th – Create a Tilt Shift adapter… WITH LEAF SHUTTER
A-Mount tilt/shift at APS-C format.
Medium Format tilt/shift at Full Frame format. (Sony creates a couple lenses but also allows adaptation from Hassy, Mamiya, Fuji)… If not leaf shutter, then full sync electronic shutter… just raise that flash synch please.
Everybody happy… except the competition.
Some nice toys there, but I’m struggling to see how Sony would profit off several of them.
Profit?
There are numerous varieties of tilt/shift adapters available for NEX. And dedicated TS lenses are commonplace. If there were no profit in this, then they wouldn’t exist.
Sony already makes an Alpha lens adapter. So they must see profit potential.
The ability for leaf shutter would only increase the professional applications. Companies have been profiting from leaf shutter systems since the beginning of photography.
Raising flash sync has always been a profitable selling feature.
_____________
How could this NOT increase profit potential? It’s a no brainer. Someone just has to balls up and give photographers what they want. Doesn’t mean that you have to buy it. But it can be there for others who want it.
I’d place my order right now if it existed.
I sincerely hope Sony is keeping their Sports and WIldlife shooters in mind when they have their discussions on ‘FF models with, and without EVF’. My mind is still open until I actually hold an A77, but there are certainly some initial reports saying that the tracking of the EVF is less than desirable for ‘real world’ action and lower light photography. The recently posted jet-ski videos in midday sunlight is idea shooting for any AF and EVF tracking system. Real world working professionals find themselves shooting more often in less than optimum lighting situations supplied by sports arenas and stadiums. As well, are the wildlife photographers who are shooting in their fading ‘magic hour’ lighting.
It might be wise for Sony to make sure that those shooters are taken care of with a premium Optical viewfinder, especially in the context of the up-coming, higher-priced telephotos on the horizon. Even if it means a few less fps than the A77’s 12 frame burst.
I don´t think sony is prepared to launch a professional camera, since it´s lens lineup is far from being complete. You need that 500 and 600 f4 for sports and nature shots, a complete pc lineup (24-50-90) and of course a 24 1.4 and a new 35 1.4. I don´t understand why sony launched a 24 f2, unless the reason is they are not interested in the professional market.
You are absolutely right. Now please leave Sony, go away, and don’t come back.
Maybe the approach of other makers, two different models for two different professionals. 36 MP for the studio shooter with lower frame rate. And a 24MP model with higher frame rates for the Sports and Wildlife shooters.
24MP versus 36MP is not enough. In terms of amount of light per pixel it is only 67% for 36MP sensor. This means that it is less then 1 F-stop difference. For example by using 24MP sensor you would get the same noise performance at ISO 3200 like using 36MP sensor at ISO 1600. FF sport camera would have to go much less then 24MP, let’s say 16MP or less to make a difference.
Hey Marek,
Yeah, frankly I’m fine with less pixels. 16 MP @ 10 fps FF would be fine. I have the A900, and 24 MP is plenty for portrait work. I’d like to see better ISO performance. If that means less pixels, than I’m fine with that.
Andrea already wrote in SAR a couple of times that one FF cam would be 16MPx. Thought she wrote 16, 24, 36MPx before.
I’m waiting to hear more from her about the Sigma-like-sensored cam. Hopefully they have changed their minds and implemented video in it.
“He wrote”
Everytime I see here that Sony is developing a new sensor with “moar megapixelz!!11!1!” I want to scream, really loud.
Haven’t they got it yet, that advanced users/pros aren’t really THAT keen on having more and more megapixels?
Also that you’ll NEED better lenses that cost a lot more?
To the point, I guess, mostly only professionals will be able to afford camera + lenses (that do justice to the sensor) and those professionals, maybe, are already shooting medium format (even more now with the ‘affordable’ Pentax 645)?
Are there true, actual photographers, from different fields, helping Sony with those cameras?
Ok, rant over. I’ll just keep my fingers crossed that Sony will address the “high ISO crowd”.
+ 1
And sorry but no they haven’t got it I think and fear.
I also fear they don’t use any real world photographer to help in directing upcoming products. Otherwise A77 would have an incredible 18mpix sensor instead of this 24mpix thing.
It bugs me that EVERYbody is praising Sony’s 16mp sensor (the first batch -used on the A580, A55, D7000 and K-5) and now the, apparently, improved Nex 3C and 5n), yet, Sony themselves think it’s not enough and insist on putting more megapixels and not-so-great performance.
*sigh*
Heshe!
My bet…
From entry level to high end:
PS. All in A-mount with same sensor
1. 1500$ Mirrorless CDAF – Compact design
Would be a perfect second camera for a pro shooter
PS. I do not think in sensor PDAF will be already here
2. 2000$ SLT EVF – A77 A700 size
The most logical according to the Sony line evolution
3. >3000$ SLR OVF – Traditional design
Essential to keep a certain category of pro users
I see that NEX-9FF camera with 36 MP will be slightly bigger than NEX-7, a major improvement from NEX-7 I would expect.
At the same time I would like that Sony would develop a battery grip for the NEX version cameras like this Taiwanese company did. http://www.ownuser.com.tw/e_mig_snx5.html, you can buy them at eBay is just extra battery for your camera with no extra functionality but Sony could make something capable of controlling the camera and I hope this is not asking too much.
By the way see this Korean site for NEX-5N they always do great reviews including the functionality of the camera by making nice tests with videos too. Most of the stuff you may not understand because is Korean but the pictures and videos speak for itself.
http://www.slrclub.com/bbs/vx2.php?id=slr_review&page=1&divpage=1&select_arrange=headnum&desc=asc&no=239
Uggghhh!
Just release a camera line with interchangeable chips and finder mechanisms. Everybody gets what they want, and future upgrade is ensured.
A short registration NEX FF body would satisfy everyone and be capable of morphing into any type of camera that anyone needed wanted.
_____________
Chip and Finder evolution should be independent from Camera feature evolution… just like it was in the film days. Film was basically an interchangeable chip. You chose your film for a particular type of shooting (and processing). Chips should be the same. Some could be just JPG or TIF. Some could be completely RAW based. Some designed specifically for High ISO…. and some designed for Tonality and Color.
Base it all around 3rd party Apps that tweak everything to the individual vision or ease of use for beginners.
I like your ideas here. Maybe this is the coming revolution from Sony. With a modular system like this, you could start with the most basic of cameras and add to it as you could afford it. This is the way the medium format camera work with interchangeable backs etc. Where did I read about a camera attempting to do this some time in the past? I know someone out there will be able to pull up a reference to it.
When someone states that this camera or that camera should be a studio camera what does that mean and who makes the definition of how a camera is used and for what type of photography?
I own several cameras but I shoot using a FF both in and out of a studio setting and I’ve been known to terrorize friends and family at thanksgiving dinner table with a a850 and a CZ 16-35/f2.8 and a big hooking flash on the shoe. I also have a friend that carries a Phase One and not only to a weddings but to trade shows events and street events.
What’s important is having the best tool for the job at hand.
And often the same posters claim that 24MP or 36MP or apparently any MP amount more than what they own is not needed or should be needed only as a studio camera.
Really?
I like high MP cameras and I’m looking forward to Sony’s FF replacement having more MP’s and better ISO and image quality than the a900.
When I shoot street carrying my a850 I often pair it with a small 135/f1.8 lens. And because of the 24MP’s of my Alpha and the sharpness of the Zeiss 135mm lens I can crop the heck out of my shots and I don’t need to use a gigantic 70-200/f2.8 lens painted white and shouting here I am, to do it.
Now, I’m sure there are tradeoffs and maybe the current state of the art in sensor design makes MP’s meaningless at some point , but If more MP’s can deliver more resolution and more flexibility isn’t that okay?
Studio camera = maximum performance at base ISO and good flash support.
Never thought of the ZA 135 f/1.8 as small. When I first saw it I was shocked how huge it was. But yes it is smaller than the white beast. Guess it’s all about perspective.
the price should be more than $3500USD!
I rather like it lower than higer. I guess you want it to be something only rich people can buy?
btw, if sony make a full frame nex, can E-mount lens currently now be compatible with ff nex? or we must buy new lens ff e-mount again? >.<a
Sony will not make a ff nex.
Stop dreaming.
well the great thing is begining from the dream 😀 i believe sony will make nex full frame because the prospect is very good 😀 and the competitor is just leica with a very2 high price,
I think there’s no FF NEX lens, at the moment. Of course I mean e-mount lenses.
Nope…there’s no FF E-mount lenses available…
And I do believe a FF NEX camera will be developed but for 2013 or 2014 announcement. If they see that an APS-C NEX-7 is being preordered in good quantities even with the higher price tag compared to entry-level NEX cameras, then they could develop a FF NEX camera at even twice the current NEX-7 body only price.
only 36Mpx?…:(
“3) Not a single one of those will have a classic DSLR design (no classic mirror, no prisma)”
If this means no Optical View Finder,
Bye bye Sony…. 😀
36 megapixel? Damn,..I was hoping for a much higher resolution and noisier high ISO image.
What I really want Sony to build is a FF Alpha that is 45 (or more) megapixel with a picture unusable beyond 1600 (or better yet, 800) ISO.
C’mon guys,…Imagine how well a camera would sell with a “45 megapixel” sticker on it. WOW!
Cliff 😉
And now the FF folks who have been sneering how it did not matter if APS lost OVF are going to get the same treatment, no OVF for FF. But Sony is trying to string you along that there will still be OVF when there won’t. Just like they did to APS people.
You will have to do everything, all types of photography with EVF with it’s lag, which won’t go away. Enjoy!
The only reason I got a900 was because of its OVF.
What other choice did you have?
just remove the slt mirror and use a external ovf for the appropriate range. will be much brighter too, and brightness will no longer depend on speed of the lens. They can all be f1.0 lenses through the ovf. nobody complains about highend rangefinders using external ovf.
sony won’t give you a control to turn EVF and LCD off at the same time.
and of course battery life is going to be joke (around 400 shots)
and why should I reinvent the wheel? when I can just switch back to canon or nikon. i don’t know about you but SLR design works beautifully for me. I don’t need 12fps+ I don’t need no fancy a77 tech. I don’t need video mode. All I am asking is a Big & Bright OVF. Is that too much to ask?
No, it’s not too much to ask. It’s currently available. Buy it. For those who like the A77/65, they will buy it. I don’t need to hear your whining…
eeeee then go to Canon and Nikon =| As you said…That’s your requirements, that’s your liking, that’s your way to work. Are you providing them BIG money for development and investment? Nope. Then you got 2 options… go away or wait and see what Sony has to offer. Who knows? Maybe SLT is the future after all. It just need more refined adjustments.
But many people still will buy fancy a77
Will autofocus lag be faster than EVF lag?
Even when I used the ZA24-70 it still take a second for my eyes and then the camera to adjust, good enough for the EVF to catch up.
EVF lag is overrated. Just a tool for OVF proponents to justify themselves.
With who you talking, Walt? Less than 1% of Sony folks are FF camera users. There are so many wishes and demands, but most of this people maybe never become FF users. But, it’s nothing wrong with APS, it’s much less expensive and less in weight and size.
Is the new 36MP sensor a Bayer sensor?
IMHO not having a FF camera with an OVF is a mistake, pros requiring the very best IQ will choose Canon & Nikon, due to the ghosting issue with SLT cameras and the image delay of the EVF, causing you to miss the decisive moment.
The lack of a range of lenses to match Canon & Nikon will also hurt Sonys FF sales
If SONY would make a FF DSLR that looks like the a77, but was identical in features to the a900 except have a 16 MP sensor like the a580, I would SMILE so large that the top of my head would fall off, and I’d be decapitated…LOL!
Finally, a sensible DSLR…Nah, too much to hope for, Not enough to brag about, everyone is too concerned with what NIKON and CANON are doing. It just might have the IQ at high ISO that everyone is screaming for…ya think?
Let people focus on Canikon. They won’t realize what hits them. 🙂
yes sony, please FF mirrorless with M-mount. 24MP is enough but super duper clean iso.
So far, Sony A900 price is ridiculous in comparison with far better Canon 5D Mk II…
Sony please keep one OVF FF (real DSLR) camera for the purists and professionals. The A900 has a great viewfinder and NO EVF is good enough to replace it. So Sony if you’re going to make three different FF cameras, make a NEX-9, an SLT-A99 and please don’t forget the DSLR-A950. That one’s essential.
Gone quiet around here hasn’t it!
For a tiny proportion of shooters FF folks are certainly vocal. And expect to be catered to when no one else is. High quality OVF is as necessary in top end APS cameras as it might be in FF. There is no difference in that need in the two types.
Sony should actually support OVF, not just produce one OVF camera as some have suggested, that they would most certainly ignore updating, just like they did with the a700 but put all the improvements in it too. Just like they could from the a77’s improvements for still photography. Even the a580 they kept unavailable a lot.
Quite a few are looking for a camera for still photography at a high level, not a camcorder for those who insist all cameras be just P&S/video because that’s all they know.
Eeeerr..ok. Isn’t this type of slim body A mount lens camera something Sony should have made from the START? Now they’re waist deep with dslr, dslt,NEX, and now some A and E mount hybrid. Holy crap Sony, just pick a Camera System and just STICK WITH it instead of being so wishy washy like MINOLTA was. OOOOPPPS..Sony is Minolta now. No wonder.