The last few months have been very intriguing on the A-mount rumor front. As I told you before the A77 successor and the FF model planed for a summer release have been taken off the roadmap. And the SLT-A58 is probably the last APS-C model featuring the translucent tech mirror. So the question is…what’s going to happen now?
I am working on the details of the new roadmap and this is what I can share today:
1) The APS-C A-mount models will be mirrorless. I am not sure yet about the FF models.
2) Both FF and APS-C A-mount cameras will come in early 2014
I still have no reliable specs about the new cameras. But if sources are not playing me fool than these cameras will be a mayor step forward compared to previous generation cameras and not just small upgrades. I marked this rumor as SR4 (not SR5) because there is still almost a year to go and to be 99% sure of the rumor we have to hope Sony doesn’t change the roadmap in the meantime. Although, I think it’s pretty much safe to say that now the roadmap is very clear and approved.
Personal note: It’s a a very exciting time here in the hidden rumor world. I am giving my best to birng back some excitment on the A-mount world. The last two weeks have been the most busy A-mount rumor time I ever had on SAR. Thanks to all sources for helping me out!
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Message to sources: You can send me more info anonymously by using the contact form you see on the very right of your browser. You can also contact me directly at sonyalpharumors@gmail.com.
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Reminder (SR = Sonyrumor):
SR1=probably fake rumor
SR2=rumor from unknown sources
SR3=50% chance it is correct
SR4=rumor from known sources
SR5=almost certainly correct!
247 Responses
I wish for mirrorless in both a-mount and e-mount…
Major step forward you say? I’ll believe it if this year Sony releases a NEX with excellent on sensor phase AF and either a) makes the lens calibration for it user updatable or b) implement a sensor AF system which doesn’t require lens calibration
If it is on-sensor AF, there is no need for a lens calibration function any more, if I read you correctly.
read up the implementation of the (on sensor) AF-D system on the A99 and start worrying
Is there a technical reason for af-d supporting a small number of lenses, or is it just a case of sony whitelisting lens ids in the firmware? Are the compatibility issues down to the a99 using 2 types of pdaf simultaneously?
Assuming an adapter is used, does pdaf on the nex 6 work with all a-mount lenses or is that also limited?
I can’t imagine how there could be any such technical requirement. But no one with any inside knowledge ever replies to that question.
I suppose that the on-sensor PDAF on the a99 is still subject to microadjust needs as it is still PD.
Or is there something else I need to know?
My Tokina 80-200/2.8 has strong back-focus on my A850(both of them) and A77. A99 doesn’t need microadjustment at all. Many of A99 owners tell about the same situations.
As I understand the Sony material, the A99 on-sensor focus locations only aid in tracking – the focus is still set by the separate PDAF sensors above the mirror. So adjustment can be needed. If Sony can hand off all the focusing to on-sensor sites then no adjustment will be needed – unless there is something in the lens design that limits the system with current lenses.
On sensor AF points cannot be used to lock AF on the a99, just aid the main AF module. I’m sure that if any manufacturer comes up with PDAF to lock on subjects, they don’t need to microadjust for front or back focus. But would like to see microadjustment as an option JUST IN CASE…
To take the mirror out of their entire line they must surely feel that they have a good PDAF on the sensor. I would still want micro=adjustment because I want to be able to tell the camera to focus 2/3 behind or 2/3 in front of the point of focus (for example).
So question is when you would choose e-mount and when a-mount, if you are not already invested in one of them. Until now, A-mount provided fast phase-detect auto focus while e-mount provided smaller body size.
With mirrorless a-mount, the difference is what – body size only?
… A mount allows in body stabilisation…
also true. NEX will not have this.
This actually scares the crap out of me. Mirrorless a-mount means it’s a matter of time before a-mount is dead. Building a dSLR-shaped body around e-mount would be trivial. I’d be okay with this — I’d buy an adaptor for my nice lenses — but the whole reason I chose a-mount was IBIS. I get nice, stabilized Zeiss f/1.4 lenses. With e-mount, the best I can do is a small selection of stabilized primes, like the 50mm f/1.8 OSS, which have rather mediocre image quality (possibly due to constraints placed on lens design to allow stabilization).
The 50 1.8 does not have mediocre image quality unless it is being used by a donkey. I have many Zeisses, and I can tell you from experience they aren’t that much better than the lens you are knocking. I will take the pepsi challenge with your Zeiss… you show me your best photos with it, and I will show you mine taken with the 50 1.8. Get ready to lose. 🙂
The 50 1.8 does not have mediocre image quality unless it is being used by a donkey. I have many Zeisses, and I can tell you from experience they aren’t that much better than the lens you are knocking. I will take the pepsi challenge with your Zeiss… you show me your best photos with it, and I will show you mine taken with the 50 1.8. Get ready to lose. 🙂
No it doesn’t. That’s because the physical size of the A-mount bodies will allow Sony to implement things that’s can’t be done with e-mount just because of physical space limitations. (In Body stabilization for one).
This was a natural evolution, one that I’ve been predicting for a long time.
Maybe this is about price point and Sony wanting to eat into CaNikon’s duopoly. Since there’s a whole lot less “moving parts” in a mirrorless A-mount camera, the price point should be lower than a DSLR with a flipping mirror and glass prism.
If that’s the case, the move makes sense to me.
Your trolling.
It seems to me that E-mount with PDAF and IBIS is the killer camera. It would be a huge advantage over A-mount because one of the big advantages of E-mount is that it uses almost any lens. Up to this point the drawback is that connecting other lenses to E-mount loses stabilization. An E-mount camera with PDAF, IBIS and a line of smart adaptors would be pure gold.
body yes. A-mount has DSLR shape plus a waste range of A-lenses (compared to the limited NEX lens range)
A vaste range of E-mount lenses wouldn’t be a waste! 😉
Maybe they’re going back to a standard reflex mirror. If they add the mirrorless tech they have from NEX, they could have the best of both worlds: an SLR that can provide fast PDAF and doesn’t suffer the 1/3rd stop loss that SLT caused, plus a mirror lock-up mode with a useful and fast live view using CDAF and/or on-sensor PDAF.
Adding a reflex mirror would make more sense than having A-mount bodies with just a bunch of air space in them.
Best of both worlds is not good enough for Sony. I want best of all worlds (not just the old-fashioned ones).
Thanks Andrea – that’s very reassuring to hear! I think a lot of a-mount shooters are breathing a sigh of relief…
I am very excited to see what awaits! And I will buy the next high end APS-C camera for sure! I love my A77 and I am sure the next generation will be even more exciting!
While A-mount users might have mixed feelings about this rumor, it’s great news for E-mount users. If Sony thinks that they can make the AF good enough without mirror, E-mount users should see a substantial AF improvement in future cameras.
And why have a mirrorless A-mount APS-C camera line when you already have a mirrorless E-mount APS-C camera line that uses the same sensor, processor, etc… but it’s smaller and specifically designed to be mirrorless?
Use of A-mount lenses? No, it can’t be that. If the phase detect AF is on the sensor, it will be the same on the NEX cameras, so you’d just need an adapter to use the A-mount lenses.
Optical viewfinder? Ah no, it will be mirrorless, so no OVF, just electronic like the NEX line.
Better ergonomics because of bigger size? Well, you can make a bigger NEX too.
Simply put, it just doesn’t make sense to have a mirrorless A-mount APS-C camera. It would be as successful as the Pentax K-01. So I think that APS-C A-mount will go the way of the do-do, and FF A-mount will go SLR-OVF way. Time will tell.
Maybe they’ll be range finders? Just because they’re mirrorless doesn’t mean they’ll be the same as the NEX series.
Exactly. I also can’t find any difference that makes sence except for those who already have A-lenses.
At the end it’s only size. Built in or lens stabilization doesn’t matter, available lenses will develop ..so why two systems on the same technical basis?
A capital thinking error.
The K-01 was a massive fail for completely different reasons.
A) It tried to compete with current mirrorless systems by being smaller, but it wasn’t really small.
B) AF through contrast detection was many times slower than those found in NEX, µ4/3 and Nikon 1 cameras
C) It was disliked more than almost any other camera, even just based on its looks
None of which has to apply to a mirrorless A mount camera, which like DSLR’s and SLT’s is more targeted at ergonomics and AF speed.
The pentax failed because it offered nothing over current mirrorless or mirrored systems
A mount mirrorless will also likely fail (or never be made) as it will not offer anything which a native E mount body (with adapters) couldn’t
No, that’s being way too kind. It actually fell short everywhere (size, speed, looks), as pointed out in my post. It was a DSLR sized body without the ergonomics, speed and usefulness (viewfinder…) of a DSLR.
Not everyone wants to fiddle with adapters that can never give the balanced feel of a camera incorporating the same features. And E mount glass is built to work with both CDAF and PDAF, which inherently imposes compromises on PDAF speed. Much faster SSM motors for example, are not suitable for CDAF. So those seeking speed, shouldn’t be looking at the E mount to begin with.
I fail to see why Sony couldn’t just release another class of E mount camera which is oversized (compared with regular E mount bodies) to specifically target legacy glass (not just A mount) users. Making it A mount is just needlessly limiting.
I don’t follow your points on CDAF/PDAF optimised glass, in the end both mirrorless A & E mount bodies would be using the same AF system (a combination of CDAF/PDAF no doubt) there will be no difference, other than being able to use & adapt more lenses to a native E mount body
I didn’t say they couldn’t release an “oversized” E mount body. I said it will still require adapters to work with legacy glass and A mount glass. Which will still compromise balance and ergonomics, no matter how we slice it. And I said not everyone wants to fiddle with adapters to use A mount glass. Thus there will still be demand for a native A mount camera.
And even if they were to use the same AF system, if they switch E mount glass to ringtype motors (none of the current E mount lenses have that, you’ll find stepping motors there), you’ll hear a lot of complaining from users of current E mount cameras having trouble using that glass with most of the existing E mount bodies.
So it it’ll need adapters, duh
I agree there will be demand for a native A mount body I just doubt it will be significant enough for sony to care about in the medium term. To put it in perspective how many A mount users were begging Sony to just update the A7/8/9xx DSLR bodies with modern sensors and yet sony still ignored them insisting on going down the SLT/EVF route.
I don’t see why an updated AF system would force e mount lenses to use ring motors, nor why ring motors would be useless on older bodies… I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and say whatever gives the best AF performance should prevail and Sony won’t give half a sh!t about old E mount bodies anymore than they did about iISO flashguns
The difference with the OVF route is that it required a lot of separate R&D to make it work longer term and many of the parts used (many of which bought externally) were expensive. Too expensive to make it profitable for a smaller user group apparently. And it would mostly lean on existing A mount users that wouldn’t be able and/or willing to adapt to EVF’s.
This is where a mirrorless A mount body differs. Especially if your scenario of using the same AF system turns out to be true. They would still differentiate themselves enough from CaNikon offerings to pull in people from outside the A mount and most of important parts can still be shared between E and A mount cameras to keep cost down.
Plus, Sony has a history of not been affraid to throw out many different outer shells using very similar inner parts.
I don’t buy the R&D cost of DSLR, users were already mostly content with the basic body, Sony could literally just stuck in a new sensor & appropriate CPU and existing users would maon about sony being a bit lazy but would have still gone for it. The R&D for SLT must surely have cost more than that.
Maybe the mirror box system is more costly than EVF (I don’t know) but if pentax can still afford to use it so can sony.
If a new mirrorless system with great AF comes out of this, why on earth do you think a canikon user would be more drawn to a A mount version over a E mount version which could potentially work (via adapters) with their existing lens collection??
Since past several years… Pentax has been sold 2 times (to HOYA, to Ricoh). Not a good example, what do you think?
The R&D put in SLT’s was to secure the transition to mirrorless (coatings and material for the mirror) and one for the future of the system (EVF for example).
On the other hand, no DSLR of the past years has gone without main sensor AF LV and Sony was already lagging in this area with its last (prism) DSLR’s. They would have had to offer CDAF (PDAF on sensor wasn’t an option yet, the dual sensor AF system isn’t suitable for prism OVF’s) and develop the fruitless CDAF attempt used in the A580 further. A complete waste of money with the existing lens lineup and possibly even with new lenses. See all the Canon attempts the past years for example.
Minor updates like a new sensor and CPU wouldn’t have made the A900 cameras really interesting offerings in a era where silent modes exist in DSLR’s, LV is expected, much shorter mirror blackout times are common, more complete OVF projections can be found in competing products and predictive AF algorithms from competition were already years ahead at the time of the A700 release etc. And the cost of parts mentioned, remains especially troublesome when sales quantities are very low and sales prices are extremely under pressure.
Zohee35 is right, end of story.
Mirrorless may very well be the future of all major camera mounts, maybe Sony has simply getting a head start (given they probably decide they couldn’t compete in canikon’s traditional arena, that may very well be the wisest or least bad route for Sony).
However accepting mirrorless is the future is one thing, accepting that A mount has a long term viable future in that environment is quite another given Sony could have all the benefits of it and more with E mount. As someone who is heavily invested in A mount I don’t like the idea of that one bit, but it seems like a no brainier.
Assuming mirrorless is the future the same fate awaits current canikon mounts as well it’s just they will last far longer than A mount and will enjoy a far more compelte and ready system while ours undergo a limbo period where A mount can’t yet be killed off, but E mount isn’t ready to fully take over.
I have to agree, a mirrorless only route means the death of A mount bodies, it doesn’t make sense to restrict a mirrorless body to A mount when you could have it as E mount and still support A mount via adapters
Agree.
OM-D can also put IBIS in its compact body, I don’t believe sony can’t put IBIS into NEX body, even maybe sony’s office said so before.
I don’t believe current tech can ensure the AF speed of tele lens on mirrorless body. maybe 8 years later can, but not now, I think.
and many guys turn away from a99/77, not because of ISO, but for EVF & operational response speed. Going mirrorless on a-mount , make a bigger “nex”, can solve this problem?
Somekind disappointed.
OMD is not compact and it has smaller sensor size so the comparison is not good.
F*cking idiots. Сouple of years and they will sucsesfully buried all that Minolta has вщту over the decades.
It was about time!
If it wasn’t for Sony, the A mount would have likely been “burried” about 6 years ago.
Welcome to 2013.
Precisely.
I´m worried about front- and backfocus wie Phase-Dedection-Integration. Please put a better BIONZ Pro processor and the Laser-AF (DSC V- and F-Series) in the NEX and we have a faster and more accurate Contrast-AF. It could be so easy, but why Sony use such a complicated way with old SLR-Problems?
To blind models?
They could use LED instead of laser diodes. The only drawback is much higher power consumption.
The Laser AF never blind any model because it was patternd.
http://www.steves-digicams.com/camera-reviews/sony/dsc-v1/sony-dsc-v1-review-2.html
I´dont get it, why build a mirrorless A-Mount-Camera with front/backfocus-problems because of unaccurate phase-detection, if you can also build a NEX with more accurate and fast and wider contrast AF, only if you used an high-performance processor (the current BIONZ is NOT high-performance!). If you wan´t a bigger NEX, than build it like a DSLR. If you want IBIS in a NEX, than use it. You don´t need A-Mount for this with old traditionally SLR problems.
I had A350, A200, A700, A850, A33, A57 and sorry i hate to miss focus only of defocus problems of lenses. Lens lottery getting on my nervs, so please make Contrast-AF faster. You only need a better processor. If the imaging section isn´t able to build such a processor, use it from the gaming or TV (BRAVIA 4K X-Reality Pro) section or ask Olympus or Panasonic…
Pls sony, we do not wish to be another guinea pig. Pro class cam need tested tried and true engines. Innovation isn’t gonna fly with pros if it ain’t dependable
If in the mkt currently we do see excellent on sensor PDaf mirror less, sure. But it will be a serious waste to see zeiss with ssm wasted on a poor af engine.
The only Pro that would buy this new design, are those who are already using Alpha cameras and will not be afraid.
The others will be those who make enough money and have few disposable thousand $$ for a body and a couple of lenses.
I’m in one of these two categories. If i like the specs, I will be buying.
Whats the point of mirrorless a-mount if we have lots of nex series cameras?
What’s the difference between an A77 and NEX 6 or 7? They both have different markets now.
Those will likely be the differences again.
Duh… You can mount a-mount lenses on it without an adapter.
I’ve just used my A77 on Prague International Marathon. While AF is quite good at tracting I hate the lag which it has before AF and EVF actualy starts to work. My old A200 was much better in this regard.
Use shutterbutton halfpress to wake up the camera before you move it to your eye. By the time it gets there, the “lag” will be mostly or completely history.
So, nothing new from what was published few weeks ago.
Ok, I’ve had enough of this site.
Either post rumours with actual *new* info or don’t post anything.
What is the purpose of this rumour?
1) We already read a couple of times that the roadmap changed
2) We also heard about the A-mount going mirrorless
3) And we also heard that things will be coming in early 2014
So what did you make here?
Oh, I know you generated more clicks on your ever bigger ads.
Enjoy, You’ve just lost a reader.
I miss you already.
I rather they keep some updates instead of go silent for one whole year. i am not checking this site for sonyalphasilent.com
The level of sense of entitlement nowadays is astounding. How about you just don’t read it?
You are pathetic, kill yourself.
How hateful and completely disrespectful!
Especially condidering that BMan is the A-Mount user who recently gave the alpha community this amazing shutter actuation tool! http://tools.science.si/index.php
Hardly the work of a “pathetic” member of the SAR community…
So, because he made some tool, it is ok for him to be disrespectful? Nice logic.
Yeah he might have been displaying a little entitlement, but come on…
I agree…how was BMan deserving of this kind of extremely hateful and uncalled for bashing? His post was simply asking a question.
Its amazing the human race has made it this far. We have enormous brains and yet often we act like chimps.
Give me a break. While I certainly disagree with CineAlta’s approach, Bman was hardly “simply asking a question.”
You have a break, for sure. It’s CineAlta’s comment that was ridiculous.
You do not like ads and you are not using an ad blocker?
Bubye
Please Sony, don’t forget video IQ on the next FF. At the moment a Canon 5d3 with help from magic lantern is giving us sharp video, with selectable resolution and RAW. Please take care! No more AVCHD 8bit 4:2:0 any more! Time has come for RAW in video too.
I would like to use my 24-70 CZ on a stills (great AF) and video cam…
Oh, yes Sony, please make sure you release yet another hybrid that compromises on both photo and video front by trying to make it work for both!
I believed the AF would never be as fast as the DSLT, sony is now releasing Generation 2 lenses which is about 4 times faster to put things back to original speed. I see that SAL70400GII is four times faster. Perhaps sony strategy is soon all Amount lenses will have Generation 2 in order to keep up with the AF speed of current DSLR in the market.
Do you sincerely believe that improving the speed at which a lens can move its internal elements in order to acquire focus will negate the disadvantages of having a slower autofocus sensor in the camera? If so, your common sense seems to be malfunctioning.
no reason to be rude
Thanks, o! : )
Al> Of course, I believed sony had made the sensor AF improve tremendously when they had decided to do this but to be on par with a mirror speed, it is not simply achievable yet. I hoped I am wrong too.
Sometimes being blunt is the easiest way to make people see their mistake. Of course I did not mean to be rude, I’m sorry if it came across as such.
Thank you Admin for providing us A-mount users this precious information 🙂
I guess the biggest question is in the future, will A-mount will still be a native mount or an adaptor-only thing?
There is really no unique selling proposition for a full bodied mirrorless camera with a-mount ranther than 1.IBIS 2. Better Grip
If its a full bodied mirrorless camera..it should be e-mount. A-mount should be in an awesome adaptor. 3 tytpes even. 1, An in sensor PDAF / CDAF optimised one for maximum image quality. 2, An SLT type for mazimum focusing speed ( sports/wildlife photogs ) . 3, A speedbooster type of adaptor for those wanting 1-stop better lenses and FF look!
if both also using mirrorless why need difference to 2 categories (nex and dslr)???
For me that separation makes a lot of sense:
NEX – The compact “Everyday-Camera”.
Alpha – The “huge workhorse” with better handling (bigger) and more buttons for direct access.
(The difference isn’t defined by the mirror.)
No exciting cameras from sony this year? I was wishing for an apsc sensor RX camera..
As I predicted 3 years ago when A55 come out. I thought it would be ready in 2015 but it is faster. If they can match A77 AF speed then they have a winner.
So are the new cameras going to be A mount or E mount? I am guessing E mount with an A mount adapter available??
keeping the mirror for FF suggests that there are still certain downsides to whatever mirrorless technlogy that they are to release, or that the new technology doesn’t work with a FF sensor. Are they using the area AOUND the aps-c sensor for AF? Could that be it? Or maybe they just want to bring the OVF back to the FF shooters.
More likely, it requires very fast read out speeds of the sensor (see Nikon 1). And the larger the sensor, generally the slower the read out speed. So if the technology is ready for APS-C sized sensors, it *could* take longer the achieve the same for a FF sensor. In the end though, it will be a matter of time.
This site is so full of smoke, mirrors and drama…
Going to just smoke, kind of like my house that burned 🙂
And you can participate freely! Isn’t it great!?
I’m really struggling to see what advantage going full mirrorless offers to A mount over SLR and SLT. Or is it merely a cost saving device, by making them all a NEX with a bodykit?
I didn’t upgrade to A99 primarily because I found its autofocus unit unacceptable. If Sony thinks making its successor have even worse autofocus is a good idea….well I’ve got news for them!
Well, lets see what they come up with, but I remain skeptical.
Once more Sonyalphrumors/Sony killed another sale. Just yesterday you said that Sony would have the Nex-7 replacement for sale in the fall. I was planning on buying one. Now you say new new revolutionary Nex and FF Alpha cameras will be available in early 2014. Why would anybody buy a Sony camera just months prior? I’m an old man; I might just die with my A900 in my hands waited for the next big improvement.
Why wait? The world today is evolving rapidly. So every time you see something that you want to buy there is potential something that is even better. But you live NOW. So if you want to buy something – so get it and use it! Life is short and there is no time for just waiting for something that might happen.
Where did you read anything about NEX cameras in the original post?
Reading comprehension seems to be a rare thing these days.
No mirror in A cameras is very likely means improvements in both A and E mounts…
unless they will use light reflected from the sensor for AF (Panasonic already holds at least one patent on this).
Agreed, but since the OP just targeted the A mount, no one knows when and which exact improvements will come to the NEX cameras. For all we know, some or all of it can already be seen in the (supposedly slightly delayed) NEX 7 successor which is still said to be released this year.
I hope you are right about that Zohee35. I have a vacation planed in the late fall. I would like to have an improved Nex with me.
Learn to read PLEASE! this post says NOTHING about Nex
Boy, did I just get jumped on! To my mind when I’m on a Sony Camera site and I see “APS-C” I read “Nex”. You are all correct, it could be another iteration of a small bodied Sony. My bad. Wishful thinking on my part. I would like to Sony offer a high end Nex-like camera that would be handy to lug on a vacation with the option of attaching my collection of old Konica and Alpha glass with an adapter, like a Nex already does. I have read that current version of the Nex are deficient in auto focus, as is my A900. That’s why I’m interested in the next Nex.
I’m a bit frugal and can not afford to chase every iteration of incremental improvements. My old A900 and vast array of Alpha glass serves me just fine. I lurk here on sonyalpharumors to find out if and when Sony is going to produce a camera I will be interested in buying. Sadly, the rumors of such a camera keep getting pushed further away in time.
Really, I wouldnt worry. It’s better to enjoy what you have right now, and be pleasantly surprised when the next NEX comes out, than to be constantly thinking about how your camera “is deficient” and you need the next thing. I’ve used the A900, and there is nothing wrong with that camera, just cause its older tech. Its certainly got a much better AF system than any current NEX out there.
lets face it u nex and e-mount guys…
Sony has already gave nex and e-mount its tombstone to compete in compact arena where its not that compact.
Sony will only make more new nex with no major improvements with e-mount.
And force u guys to pay even more for overpriced, sub-par lens with OSS.
why?
cause its a compact section they want to compete in!
it’s NEVER going to be full fledge system.
Enjoy with all your tinkering with adapters, unbalanced lens and even more non-existant flash systems.
troll
You may not have heard, but the traditional compact market is dying. Who wants to compete in a dying market?
At least Sony is doing SOMETHING. All the other makers are just sitting on their butts, using 60 year old technology, while modern tech advances passes them by. If you’re frightened by Sony, you owe it to yourself to find a more soothing, comforting, old school flapping mirror camera.
+1.
As expected Sony completes their transition from DSLR to interchangable lens P&S Cybershot. That’s what “mirrorless” really is. Should make Cybershot style shooters happy. Those that don’t switch to just using their cell phone, that is. Yes one might call it revolutionary to go back to cybershot only.
I’m surprised you didn’t compare Sony to H*tler this time.
There are plenty of P&S folks to make a market for this future camera. It will be a revolution for them to actually go to interchangable lens system of any kind.
Has been covered by NEX cameras for years.
The revolution is getting rid of the mirrors in system cameras targeted at the DSLR type of user. The one that cares less about size, more about speed, large range of lenses, including native lenses with lots of reach etc.
WK, I would take the Olympus OMD or the Panasonic GH3 over your bloodies a700s anytime.
Sell the old crap you have and buy few nikons and stop complaining.
I happen to know a lot of ppl who bought Alpha SLT and they use back LCD for framing…. Tadah!!
Ha, welcome to the future!
hhhmm… is Hilter in profane words list in here?
Ooops, Hitler of course
Nah, just played safe and didn’t want my post to disappear like Walt’s when he made the comparison. 😉
So who gets the prize for invoking Godwin’s law?
Well, the RX1 is a Cybershot, so not to shabby company I guess.
What’s in a name?
/E
Walt’s snobbery at it’s most nauseating.
If you hold Cybershot to such a low level, Walt, maybe you should buy one. It will match your photography skills perfectly.
I have a cybershot and just recently updated it. For when I just want to do simple photography like everyone else. I am well past the “photographing new baby” stage, however.
Wouldn’t it be more sensible for Sony to produce a body the size of a dSLR and include IBIS, but use the E-mount plus adapter for A-mount?
I don’t see the point of using mirrorless for A-mount at this time, you may as well stay with fast AF and SLT and lose the light but improve the sensor to negate that light loss.
It seems optimistic that Sony have suddenly got fast on-sensor AF.
No it’s not optimistic. Older cameras won’t get software AF upgrades (Sony is lagging behind competitors). Newer E lenses will be made as it is now, sacrifising IQ & compactness over AF speed.
I honestly can’t see the point of making a dslr sized nex. E-mount glass would be too small to handle comfortably and a-mount glass would have to be redesigned with oss and a new mount. You’d be looking at a lot of duplication for no real gain. On the other hand if an e-mount shooter really needs a 70-400 they can always use an adapter.
I’m with you in this. E-mount for bring-everywhere cam,A-mount for more serious(read:a lot of physical buttons)cam, with larger lenses.
E-mount lenses aren’t small.
Mostly. But there are some that can be considered small,16-50 for example. Small for a zoom kit-lens.
…and there are small A-mount lenses. The E-mount doesn’t magically reduce the physical size of a lens, look at the 18-200. It’s why I don’t have a NEX, they are pointless as a compact once you attach a lens.
Indeed. In a hypothetical case where flange distance didn’t exist, I’d have no problem mounting, say, the NEX 20/2.8 to an A99. Pancake lenses weren’t invented for mirrorless cameras, they’ve existed on SLRs for decades.
DSLR sized nex for f/0.95, f/0.85, 18-200 lenses maybe and so on
probably it will have dual A,E mount
You need a-mount for full-frame option. Still a lot of people prefer FF. And it allows you to use existing a-mount lenses.
There is already a FF NEX. I am constantly amazed people don’t know this simple fact.
I know, but we are not discussing extremely expensive movie-camera’s. We are talking about consumer oriented photocamera’s. Point is some people are expecting FF small form factor interchangeable-lens photocamera. They will only get that with a-mount, not e-mount.
Why did Sony want to get rid of the mirror actually? Very many love the sound of the moving mirror…
Probably because it’s not the mirror-flip-sound that makes a good picture.
and at a wedding ceremony the sound of a flipping mirror isn´t very helpfull…
Focal plane shutter is as loud as flapping mirror.
Significantly better with an electronic 1st curtain.
It’s better, but nowhere near silent as leaf shutters are.
+1
In manufacturing, you should always aim to reduce the number of parts, and especially moving parts.
Alpha line will continue as “E” mount only. “A” mount is dead, dead, dead. You can hope that Sony will sell it to another vendor, but there will be no DSLT, DRLR, or DSLR shaped bodies from Sony anymore. There will be no full frame replacement of the A99. However, full frame “E” mount is possible. If I’m wrong, well you’ll just have to wait a year to prove it, right?
I agree with the many that believe Cybershot will be the focus of Sony’s consumer camera market, with “E” mount being the ONLY interchangible system. “A” mount is dead, dead, dead. You may get lucky and get a couple lenses that are already in production, but that is it. SELL YOU GEAR!
LOL. There is a lot of DSLR shaped Cybershots in 1/2.3″ price range… Why Sony would remove them where they have been since …. years?
Ahh, you’re one of those end-of-the-world guys aren’t you Dan? The world will end in 2012 and all that. That didn’t happen so you’re making random predictions about electronics now? Well, I guess you have to pick something.
Your assertions fly in the face of what Andrea posts daily on here. Yes, Cybershots are the consumer line…apart from the RX1…or the RX100. But most Cybershots are targeted at point-and-shoot consumers, yes. That is a plain fact, not any kind of clever insight.
So what are you telling us exactly? Was the death of A-mount foretold to you in a dream? Or do you have some clever market analysis or inside info to substantiate your firm proclamations?
If you do, I’d like to hear as I’m very interested. Otherwise, you sound like just another goofball. By the way, I heard that Nikon is quitting the DLSR business and moving into cybernetic optic nerves (the voice in my head told me).
Haha, yep.
Hey Dan; something else I just heard!
So, Nikon, Canon and Sony are ALL quitting the DSLR business. In fact, they’re quitting the camera business. So is Pentax and Oly! Sell your gear! Dead, Dead, Dead! LOL.
How about you wait one year to prove you are right?
Dan, have you considered that NEX was the ‘experiment’ or proof of concept for mirrorless? Perhaps once A-mount mirrorless comes out, the NEX line will slowly be scaled back and eventually merged into A-mount. Not likely. But who knows?
Your doomsday frantic-freakout is quite silly. One would think you’d have learned your lesson on December 22nd, 2012, when you emerged from your bunker to see the whole world continuing on.
Seriously dude, go play elsewhere.
Hi Frank?
One shouldn’t mistake an acorn for a piece of the sky.
Cybershots are an evolutionary dead end in this era of everyone having a camera built into their phone. They can only make them sufficiently better than phone cameras for so long before they become too expensive to sell. That’s why camera companies are desperately trying to get people to move up to mirrorless or DSLR before their goose is cooked.
In fact it is not such a big change. The SLT’s are already mirrorless cameras because the translucent mirror is only used for AF but the sensor already provides the image for an LCD viewfinder. Taking away the SLT is not such a big step any more, not like if it were Nikon or Canon where the mirror gives you the optical view directly through the lens. Only big issue is the AF speed. If SONY manages to keep that up in a similar range to SLT/SLR, they will rule on the way to the future.
That’s the most sensible post here so far.
Assuming Sony get the AF part right, a mirrorless A-mount will be no different to DSLT in terms of operation. The immediate advantage will be slightly better image quality due to that half stop of light being given back.
Sony’s biggest challenge is to apply the new technology while maintaining compatibility with older Sony/Minolta lenses. Whether there will be compromises in this regard, I don’t know.
Breaking compatibility with legacy/3rd party glass would definitely be a deal breaker, given the legit criticism of Sony’s lineup…
Hopefully if this is the case they’ll have a compatibility mode with fewer af points.
“Whether there will be compromises in this regard, I don’t know.”
compromises are:
– phase dedection = fast but unaccurate af with front-/backfocus issues – contrast af is the only real mirrorless solution and so phase detection is a compromise like slt before (faster reading-speed from sensor with high performance picture processor for faster and more accurate contrast-af is the way to go)
– AF not compatible to legacy minolta lenses and older Sony/Zeiss lenses without SAM/SSM
– also probably AF issues with old SAM/SSM lenses not designed for mirrorless
– smaller focus area than e-mount
So a NEX PRO makes much more sense than mirrorless A-Mount and you can also use all lenses in the world
Big assumptions made there.
You’re assuming that Sony have made no progress with on-sensor PDAF technology or have not invented a work-around which enables the removal of the mirror but still allows the use of a dedicated PDAF module.
Phase detection is unaccurate. That´s a fact. Yes it´s fast but not accurate enough. Better processors with better object tracking (face detection) make phase detection obsolet. You don´t need lense calibriation and you don´t have defocus issues because of front-/backfocus. I have these defocusing issues with all my Sony A-Mount lenses, even with Zeiss and G! That´s a big plus for mirrorless and I don´t want to loose such an advantage because i had so much trouble with A-Mount. Also i guess there will be more overheating issues with on-sensor PAFD. For me it´s looks like a more complicated way with many compromises again than only use a better processor for faster CAF, bigger weather sealing body with IBIS for NEX, if you wan´t to make a NEX “more pro”.
And when i can´t use AF with my old A-Mount lenses like SAL-85F18Z, than what is the plus for me for a mirrorless A-Mount-Solution? I also can use the LA-EA2/3 with the NEX and have full AF for all Sony A-Mount lenses (except STF) and in MF I virtually can use all legacy lenses in the world.
How much progress do you think they’ve made, though? The state of current OSPD cameras are far from being ready for demanding use (sports, lowlight, children, etc). If Sony had made such a huge advancement you’d have thought they’d be shouting it from the mountain tops.
One would wonder how people took any photos with the oh so unreliable PDAF.
You can also make good photos with old analog film cameras. That´s not the point. It´s called engineering progress and for me it isn´t enough to develop something new with traditionally old issues. So why don´t only make CAF better without old issues?
I see what you mean, but could CDAF actually replace PDAF for tracking, for example? There is a problem inherent to the technology.
Why not? Olympus and Panasonic can do it. Every new generation their cameras have a new picture engine with new processor for faster and more accurate CDAF. I´m wondering why Sony not doing the same and enhance the old BIONZ. Slow CDAF is only a hard- and software limitation not technology wise like lens-defocusing issues with PDAF.
Yep, you might be right. The OM-D is certainly impressive with its AF. I guess, when they figure out the Continuous one, it will be over for PDAF.
And Dirk ruined the drama by making sense 🙂
Excellent post. And I agree. Find a way to get DSLR quality AF without the mirror (which you KNOW they did, otherwise they’d never go this route). It will instantly make every DSLR on the planet obsolete, clunky and old fashioned.
Including my D4 and D800E.
I cant think of a better gift to A-mount users, nor a better motivation for Nikon and Canon.
Totally agreed. Cameras like the D800 are nothing short of excellent, but it has more to see with the maturity of the technology and our current concept of picture taking, than with the future of the industry.
Perhaps there will not be full frame NEX. Given that all the new e-mount lenses are designed for crop sensors and the desire to keep the NEX bodies compact, I would imagine that this may end up being the key differentiating factor for the near-term. The success of the RX1 also mitigates that need.
Full Frame Nex = A-mount mirrorless FF
no… FF E-mount will be able to fit all my voigtlander lenses and use in FF, A mount will not
So if A-mount is going to go mirrorless, and they have the following over e-mount:
1. A better selection of lenses
2. In body image stabilization
3. Just as fast if not faster AF
Then why should I stick with the e-mount?
I assume they probably won’t make A-mount cameras much smaller when they drop the mirror because they will still need to have the specific distance from the sensor to keep the lens working. So e-mount will probably stay smaller in terms of depth.
Any other thoughts on why I should continue to invest in e-mount? I was waiting for the NEX-7 successor, or perhaps the FF e-mount. But considering I am only 2-3 lenses deep into the e-mount system I may just go for the a-mount full frame depending on what they do…
“1. A better selection of lenses” – I doubt all lenses will be fully compatible with a mirrorless af solution – that´s the reason why Sony only releases new SSM/SAM lenses and SSM II lenses
“2. In body image stabilization” – can also be done with e-mount with a bigger body, but you have OSS for native lenses
“3. Just as fast if not faster AF” – but not accurate enough with lens lottery again because of front-/backfocus issues
it may not matter for you, but i am tired of carrying around massive lenses with large dslr-like camera bodies, the NEX system with my voigtlander leica mounts and the RX1 is godsend to me 🙂
The world doesn’t need another 24mp FF camera. In 2014, that will be 5-6 years old.
Seriously hope this new direction pumps the pixels up. Seriously hope it’s not all “video” improvements.
Seriously hope there is a flash system with 3rd party support.
I wish my A77 and F58 flash had SONY SUPPORT, never mind third-party support. The fix for bounced over-exposure problems is non-existent.
I thought that was fixed in a firmware upgrade. My buddy’s A77 was totally fixed with the latest firmware: http://www.mhohner.de/newsitem2/hidden-improvements-a77-v1.07
He has the 58 and 43 flashes, both work flawlessly in direct and bounce mode. He is always using them – I know I would have heard complainnig if the problem came back! 😉
Are you on 1.07? If not, update. If so, perhaps your body or flash isn’t working correctly.
Yes direct was fixed in the latest, and no it didn’t fix it for bounced flash, which is why I said bounced. 😉
I’m glad your mates works, many of us aren’t so lucky. There was one comment that said their A77 was sent for repair and had some bits replaced. Unfortunately Sony aren’t interested out of warranty, so if there was a manufacturing defect that Sony are keeping quiet about, many of us are left with flash exposure all over the place. Mine has to be set anywhere between -3 and -1 ev.
My A700 does not overexpose, with exactly the same scene my A77 is all over the place.
Gotcha. We’ll, I’m sorry to hear that it’s not working – hopefully this rumored firmware update coming this summer will fix it for you. But the fact that some work and some don’t seems like a hardware issue, as you’ve alluded to.
A77 users were pretty much Sony’s beta testers. You guys should be used to it by now.
I hope with all the new stuff comming theres room for a super high res camera.
I dont want to wait ANOTHER two years.
I hope so to, if only to keep you from spamming this messageboard.
Holy crap man, give it a rest! We dont want to listen to YOU for another TWO YEARS!
Everyone in the universe knows what you want, you dont have to repeat yourself on every single post. Your constant whining is not going to make Sony cater to your needs.
Seriously…
How large are you printing?
At least 24×36″ usually bigger.
At 300pi 24mp will only do up to 13.3×20″.
Thats why i often seem obsessed with the “r” word.
Get yourself a copy of Genuine Fractals or whatever they call it now.
Your print size isn’t very big.
Many sar readers want the highest possible quality for thier limited size pictures. This is understandable and good.
I want that same quality for my larger more detailed work. Not an interpolated image.
We have had to live with the limitations of current technology and many have become complaicent, and even comfortable with those limitations.
I am niether.
I am perhaps overly anxious to take the kind of pictures I want have not been able to take while I am still around to enjoy them.
I own / print to an Epson 7900. While it is mathematically true that to print natively at 300 ppi you cannot print at 24″ x 36″, a 20+ mp well-taken photo (low iso, sharp) with minimal processing can be printed to 24×36″ very, very well. Before switching to an a99, I used Canon 5d2 bodies and printed to that size with great results. I printed 8mp Canon 20d photos to 24×36″ size and I was less satisfied with the result for some of the images.
One way I mitigate excessive up-sampling is through photo stitching. This works well for landscapes, architecture, interiors, and other non-moving still life subjects. Stitching a few images can give you medium format level resolution. Lightroom 4 does a much better job at upscaling than prior versions (plus it has print-only adjustments). Hopefully LR5 will build on this. I’ve read good things about Qimage.
Here is a helpful article that goes into a lot more detail on the subject:
http://www.digitalphotopro.com/technique/workflow/the-right-resolution.html
C.
Photoshop is best at 200&300%.
Perfect resize is better at bigger sizes.
Niether will add detail thats not ther!
Stitching will add detail but with severe limitations.
I do all these things because they are NECESSARY BUT POOR SUBSTITUTES FOR WHAT OUR CAMERAS CAN’T DO.
So if a new super res camera comes out we both get what we want.
Unreal, there it is, mentioned again.
Barry, I’m trying to understand your behavior, because it really is unusual. You have a very unhealthy obsession with megapixels. I’m assuming you’re a special needs person, and if that’s true, I want you to know I apologize for my responses to you. If you tell us what’s going on with you we probably wont be so critical.
You and several other sar readers are so comfortable with current technology that you feel threatened by the fact that I am not.
Perhaps the issue is not my obsession but your insecurity.
I’m not insecure, just trying to understand and be helpful. No camera released in the near-term will equal the megapixels of a stitched photo comprised of 4 or more images. If you want insane resolution, I recommend trying a Gigapan for your camera. The resolution is counted in gigapixels.
We all know that if you need the highest resolution single frame 35mm camera, then you only have one choice. Personally, I am not going to hold my breath that Sony is going to exceed the 36mp offered by the d800 anytime soon. Maybe (big maybe) they will equal it, but if you have unrealistic expectations of a 40+ mp camera than you are setting yourself up for disappointment, especially if you are actively holding out for a camera this year. I am going to suppose a digital back for a medium format camera either does not meet your needs or fit into your budget.
I am fairly certain that the level of comfort of the users here with 24mp is going to have any effect on Sony’s R&D or release decisions regarding their sensor resolution. It is what it is and one either learns to maximize it or move on.
Barry, you’re annoying.
SR4… more like SR 0.04
So you’re saying you know more than the admin?
Where’s your website?
I could say Sony will have a new product next year too, no kidding? Really? A new product.. next year!..
Stating the obvious isn’t really a rumor.
Thanks for trying though Bro
This rumor is not confirming a product or a camera, but confirming the continuation of a product line. I think its well warranted. But this, and your response, is irrelevant.
You said “more like SR 0.04”, meaning, you dont at all trust the rumor. And my unanswered question remains. I’ll repeat it for clarity:
So you’re saying you know more than the admin?
Where’s your website?
More like a rumor of the continuation of a product line don’t you think?
It’s all rumor and guessing at this point about what Sony has planned; we really don’t “know” anything.
Steve, you’re 100% right. My mistake, I worded that poorly.
Thanks a lot for the information! I was disappointed when the A78 release was canceled, but now I’m getting excited again! Sure, I can wait another few months for a bigger step forward. I just hope what comes next is truly impressive!
A-mount mirrorless FF = forget about the Leica/rangefinder audience
The great thing about E-mount is adaptability of virtually any lens.
Interesting if A-mount cameras would loose their mirror, but the ultimate camera for me would be native E-mount FF with IBIS. With this you would be able to use A-mount and all legacy including Leica. I hope we will get both solutions, native A-mount and E-mount FF.
Mirrorless ==> PD on sensor
Current a99 implementation of PD on Sensor needs a supported lens. At the mo, only a handful of Sony lenses are supported with *no* 3rd party lenses and no official support for Minolta lenses.
Will the new system go beyond this limitation? Will my sigma and Tamron lenses AF on these new cameras?
I sincerely hope so!
This is all very interesting of course, but I don’t think this post has really given any information than we already had. If I’m wrong, please let me know!
There is not going to be a FF e-mount camera. If you want FF choose a-mount. You could have figured that out yourself.
how did you come to that conclusion? I must have missed something.
You have read the article, you did not miss anything. You are just not very bright, that’s all.
Mirror lens 800mm a new subject
Sony should make it with all flat element ( 1st element and secondary mirror).
The prrimary mirror would be an off axis parabela ground to +/- 1/4wavelength therefore “OPTICALLY PERFECT.
The secondary mirror would be flat and located to the side eliminatint many of the quality issues associated with centering the secondary.
Modern manufacturing methods such as digital 3d printing will eliminate some of the reasons this was not done in the past.
Grinding can be don three mirors at a time to simplify the process.
This would be fabulous for wildlife.
No this lens would not be for the average person doesn’t but lenses are hand crafted and do not need to sell in super high volume.
Obviously barry you should make your own if you can make a flat piece of glass bend the light with no optical distortion.. I’m sure you should patent that…
The primary mirror is parabolic rhe secondary is flat.
Just like astronomical telescopes.
This would allow less critical allighnment with the off axis primary.
Although the lens would look strange ( being off axes ) it would be compact lightwieght and much higher guality than a catadioptic lens.
So a mirror only lens, rather than a cat? You do realise it’d be fixed focus?
The secondary mirror could move in and out in a curved channel to keep th image stable.
Alternately the entire lens to camera distance can vary. Thats why s flat secondary.
One additional option would be to add a third snd fourth flat mirror to further shorten the lens.
This lens would not be “TELEPHOTO”.
The primary mirror would be the only element that would actually converge the lightpath.
Inlike a “Cat” a diaphram can even be located at the focal point.
Sonys sensor based image stabilzation would work with this lens
Moving the secondary mirror would change the focal length, not the focal point. Moving the camera would have that effect, but at 800mm you’d need a damn long bellows to focus on things even remotely close. The whole system would be rather huge.
Still, might be fun as a DIY project. I can’t see anyone wanting to make such a product commercially.
Its a flat secondary.
It has no effect on focal length.
Look, all E-mount lenses have same diameter ‘tube’ at the rear end, like they can be deep-set into the camera or adapter. Do you think this is a coincedence?
Good point, but it maybe just place for tripod mount ring.
It may very well mean that A-mount style cameras have always been considered main stream with ‘true’ and ‘serious’ optics (DoF scale, mechanical coupling, IBIS, etc.) while E-mount bodies just kept compatibility within the Alpha line being mostly lite and uncomplicated.
I am quite worry about this news. Someone pointed out earlier, the SLT is “supposed” to be better than Canon and Nikon. I sort of believe in this technology, but in my opinion, it is not yet mature. The AF tracking and noise is still not as good as Canon and Nikon. I think there is still room for improvement, but now Sony give up on it and switch direction. I think the main concern is how to do AF. Without the mirror, it seems it has to rely on the on-sensor phase detection AF. So far, the performance is not good. So … “I guess” it will again take another couple years for it to get matured. And until it happened, we have no camera with good AF? …
I should correct myself that I am concern about this “rumour” …
SLT was better than Nikon and Canon in some ways, and worse in others. It was a ‘bridge’ technology. Sony intended it to fill the gap between the ancient DSLR theory and the new Mirrorless. And I’m sure they learned a lot from it, and gave the Sony users a lot of cool technology in the process. The mirrorless launch of A-mount probably wont be mature technology, but it will probably be much better than SLT tech. I’m sure they’ve solved the mirrorless AF issue, otherwise they’d never put all their eggs in that basket.
SLT was never intended to be long lasting. Remember, if anything is mature technology, that means its obsolete. I wouldnt worry.
As CanonJack said, the SLT quite probably was a transitional technology – the whole thing was used just to provide PDAF until the on sensor tech gets to speed. I disagree with you that “we have no camera with good AF”. It might not be the best, but let’s not exaggerate.
Just look at what the future will be – mirror less, EVF, etc. All things that Sony is currently doing. Why do you think Canon and Nikon introduced their cheaper FF bodies? Because the market wouldn’t pay for the D800/5D3? Certainly not. That is the only thing they can do with using older technologies – cut the price and try to get as many people as possible on the bandwagon, before someone like Sony takes the lead with something new. What is left to see is which strategy would work out better in the end.
WAITING MIRRORLES FULL FRAME, COME ON SONY DO IT NOW
Don’t hold your breath.
I think I’m both concerned about what a mirrorless a-mount system will have over nex cameras (aside from in-body is) and interested to find out what features may be implemented in the bigger bodied Alpha cameras without any mirror.
It seems reasonable to wonder if we may be begin to see hybrid viewfinder dslrs (with both an optical viewfinder and evf) from the other camera makers (by which I mean Canon, Nikon, and Pentax; I believe more than one of them may have a patent for that kind of technology) and whether that kind of technology (if implemented well) wouldn’t be more attractive to more people than big, mirrorless cameras.
Well, what does the current A-mount have over the NEX aside from IBIS and better AF?
Why would you do a hybrid VF? There are’t many shortcomings to EVFs and they are getting better. Compared especially to APS-C viewfinders, in a year or two, I am not sure who would want the OVFs.
“Well, what does the current A-mount have over the NEX aside from IBIS and better AF?”
Weather sealing, weather sealed lenses (or is it lens? the nice [and nicely priced] 16-50 2.8 I mean), more native mount lenses, a good excuse to buy a Maxxum 9 (which for someone like me who still thinks film is visually preferable to digital is almost enough – that was a really over the top camera).
I’m still inclined to think that if some kind of hybrid viewfinder technology proves really viable (ie the optical viewfinder wouldn’t be handicapped by evf and vice versa, there’d be no light loss [as there is with slt], etc) any number of people would prefer to have the option of an optical viewfinder for daylight still shooting and evf for low light shooting and video.
Well, there you have your answer to your concern as to what the mirror less A mount might have over the NEX.
As to people preferring the OVF for daylight shooting, I just don’t see it. On some forums and blogs that might transpire as being the case, but in the real world? More than half of Japan is using EVFs or LCDs, as an example.
Okay, but that raises I think the question other people have been asking on this thread: why not just add weather sealing to the nex cameras and lenses and drop the alpha line altogether?
As it is most Alpha lenses aren’t weather sealed – even the fancy new zeiss full frame 24-70. I think a worst case for Sony is that a mirrorless alpha could stoke fears about the future of the a-mount while at the same time opening up a market space for mirrorless, weather sealed aps-c and full frame cameras.
I think they will drop it sooner or later. The problem is they can’t just do it in a day. They will make a lot of current owners unhappy and they also don’t have the lens lineup for NEX – current lenses are simply not optimized for this use. So, preciseuly, they are trying to avoid a panic 🙂
It occurs to me too that if the new alpha af system is going to be entirely sensor-based then why not go back to an optical viewfinder (with a mirror, I mean) and bundle a hotshoe mount evf with these cameras (for low light and video shooting).
How are you going to AF with the mirror down?
Ha! But if the new af system is going to be both phase detect and sensor-based shouldn’t it work with a mirror present (and when it’s both up and down)? Shouldn’t it be possible to direct some light through a semi-transparent window (like on the Canon dslrs) to the sensor when the mirror is down and do the same thing (without anything in the way) in live view?
I don’t want to sound excessively critical though. I think that if Sony is willing to give the new Alpha cameras the kind of video capabilities and manual controls of the Panasonic gh3 they could be a really attractive alternative. For my money, aps-c (to say nothing of full frame) cameras have better image quality than m43 and in the end that’s the thing that matters most.
But it will be interesting, not least because Sony has a kind of product lineup with video that Canon and Nikon have with (still primarily) still cameras. And Canon and Nikon especially have a long history of skimping on features on everything but their fanciest cameras. With extra space leftover in these cameras (the Alphas I mean) will Sony start to give us manual exposure controls (on af video), raw video, timecode, ssd drives, and xlr inputs) thereby offering an attractive alternative (in the low four figures) not only to the likes of the gh3 but the new Blackmagic cameras and Sony’s own consumer and enthusiast-level nex camcorders (the fs-100 sells new for like $5500 after all)?
OK
its sony time to take advantage of the cross licensing deal with aptina.
kill the mirror, bring nikon 1 Af speed to entire line of alphas, not bad, not bad at all.
i owned a j1, and while it was a complete full of crap (from metering to liveview, passing by the engine, menus, and between) and nikon do their best to killing it (as in release 3 new lenses that were not new, but replacements for 1 year old lenses, did i mention selling 3 diferent models in the spawn of half year) BUT!!! i must give them prise for the only thing they do right SPEED, the AF speed is light years better than any camera without AF module, the sensor output speed was great, look at the slow motion videos it can pull off.
so… yes… HELL YEAHH!!! i will buy an alpha that is light years ahead of the nikon 1 crap PLUS the nikon 1 speed (AF and Sensor) without doubt it for a second.
The AF better be waaay better than the Nikon 1. Being able to autofocus properly outside of sunny daylight is important to quite a few of us.
I have just preordered the 2 Zeiss Touit lenses for use on the NEX 7 and the future NEX 7 sucessor. If this rumor is true and Sony decides to change the NEX 7 sucessor to an A mount, these lenses would no longer mount. I can’t fathom why Zeiss would release these lenses knowning Sony is going A mount unless they will keep E mount also.
Wouldn’t it make more sense to go E mount as someone stated to allows many other lens types to fit with the proper adapter? I have purchased 2 Leica lenses and using the NEX 7 till I receive the M 240. But given that Sony could release a RX1 with interchangable lens capabilites, I may just get a Sony. It’s cheaper, sensor is probably better and I can use AF lenses if I choose. This will only work though if Sony does not use an A mount.
What are your thoughts?
don’t worry, there will be a nex 7 successor probably around August and a full frame nex next year according to rumors. the e-mount is the healthy one of the two. Sony getting rid of the mirror in the a-mount cameras doesn’t mean they are getting rid of the e-mount line of cameras at all.
My guess is that you must not have A mount lenses you want to keep and still have stabilization or else the happy outlook about Nex is coming from where? Once an A mount person needs to start over… A few will get an apaptor and lose stabilization. not people like me whose see the end of an upgrade path.
Sony may retain the replacement body buyer, maybe not. Some won’t buy Sony replacements simply because they are mad.
Yup. No worries at all for E-mount. Just think about how silly this rumor is. The population of E mount owner probably dwarfs A-mount by atleast a factor, so why devote resources to building cameras just to support a small number of legacy glass owners? It doesn’t make any sense. The admin is trying, but you can wish and wish all you want, it won’t come true. The premise of this specific rumor is that a major improvement to the camera body will gain lots of sale and marketshare gains. As has been discussed in these threads over and over, the problem has never been the body. It’s the lens, accessory, and service. If Sony does release new A-mount bodies next year, you can bet it’ll be the death knell for A-mount. Sony’s new CEO has rearranged the roadmap so that they only release when they have significant improvements. Once word gets back to him that the 2014 A-mount cameras are STILL not selling well, it’ll be the final straw.
Don’t worry, keep buying E-mount. It’s the guaranteed winner in the mount war at Sony. I plan on getting the 10-18 very soon myself. There’s nothing of that size in A-mount covering that range of focal lengths. Just remember, E-mount isn’t trying to be the camera for everyone. There won’t be a 400mm because that’s not what this mount is about. It’s a street, family, and travel mount. That is 80% of the market. The other 20% of wedding, sports, and wildlife photography is already owned by Canikon DSLR. A-mount survive within the 0.01% of the market. It’s destined to die out. A company like Sony does not live to be a distant third.
Oh!Hope we get more news soon about the new stuff from sony :-/
My theory revolves around video quality jumping to 4k. This seems the only way Sony will be able to claim jumping ahead of Canon and Nikon. That’s how they claimed to jump ahead with SLT. This would also put fit in with their strategy on 4k tv.
To me, as a consumer, it is all about being able to use my existing lenses. Since we pay the same price for our lenses as most companies charge for the lens with stabilization built in, If the future camera does not have built-in stabilization deal–over for me.
“these cameras will be a mayor step forward compared to previous generation cameras and not just small upgrades”
We cant make judgement on Sony until we see these major upgrades.
We know and love and wish the Nex would flourish, but perhaps theres a new technology Sony has come up with that requires the bigger chassis.
Jury’s out
Wow, admin, this is amazing NEW info. Mirrorless A-mount!!!!! Does it improves image taking? No? But it’s still NEW, right? 1/3 stop light and less chance of ghosting? Ok, now, we’re talking!
Will it improve AF? No? Maybe? At least, it’s NEW, right?
Will it improve dynamic range? What, it might on sensor PDAF might decrease DR? At least, it’s NEW, right?
Will it improve the A-mount lens selection? No? At least, it’s NEW, right?
Will it finally make the bodies competitive with canikon? No? At least, it’s NEW, right?
Will it improve 3rd party support? No? At least, it’s NEW, right?
Admin, thank you for this NEW info on this NEW gimmick. How exciting. This is what all A-mount users have been waiting for. A new gimmick that keeps the status quo. Hooray for this glorious new gimmick!
Hip, hip, hooray!!!
Hey, don’t you canikon fans laugh at Sony! At least Sony is TRYING to innovate with NEW, useless gimmicks! What has Canon and Nikon done? What have they done since nearly perfecting rock solid, dependable DSLRs with massive selections of lenses that all the pros uses, huh? Yeah, that’s right, they’ve been sitting on their asses while Sony has been adding gimmicks after gimmicks! At least Sony is trying. Look at how lazy canikon is, letting Zeiss make all those sweet primes for them. At least Sony is trying! You watch, removing the mirror is going to shut up canikon’s laughter! You watch! Being perfect, dependable, and rock solid isn’t everything. Trying is innovation.
Just a thought – Even if Sony went out of business or stopped making A mount cameras, it doesn’t mean your current camera will stop working.
Go take some pics 🙂
[and yes, I have $$$ invested in A mount. But if that is the worst of our problems, then we have it pretty good].
Apparently you are very comfortable with todays technology and are very upset when someone like me says it isn’t good enough.
Perhaps the issue is not my obsession but your own insecurity.
I am not singling you out but rather responding to a number of sar readers with a similar attitude.
In whose world is this a good idea? Mirrorless A Mount? Count me out please!
You have to rely on the awkward to use live view (How are professionals going to shoot? DSLRs are supposed to be EASY to use)?
If they implement an add-on EVF like they did on one of NEX models that uses a hotshoe it could be a compromise I suppose, but what if you need to use a flash at the same time? Could be a tiny bit of a problem if you ask me!
This is probably the final nail in the coffin for the Alpha mount system, and it’s a sad day for Sony users everywhere.
Sony has lost direction, the SLT design was pioneered by Canon a while ago, and they promptly abandoned it without releasing any models
Seems strange to pour money into a system and then abandon it going to another (professionally) untested system.
I still have my A700, I love that camera. Last decent APS-C camera from Sony. I don’t want an EVF or 24 megapixels or even a movie mode, I just want a camera for one purpose: to take pictures! I’ve never wanted to use live view, and I never will. When was the last time you saw at any event a photographer using live view? Erm, never. Why would Sony want to drive the last few remaining professionals away from the product?
A smaller, lighter A-mount full-frame mirrorless camera with an EVF looks like a great idea, especially if you factor in the extra 1/2 stop of light reaching the sensor with the SLT mirror removed. It won’t (can’t) be significantly smaller than current FF DSLRs/Ts – mount specs prevent that – but it’ll be a less complex, lighter device and that’s usually good.
I currently own an a850 and a bunch of old Minolta lenses. A-mount compatibility was the reason I bought into the Sony system – that’s what allowed me to get a 70-200 f/4 FF lens for $150 instead of $1150, for instance. I love the old Minolta lenses. You pay a little more for the camera and save wads of money on lenses. Beauty.
Let’s have it. OVF purists can find cheap a850s and a900s on eBay. These cameras have the best OVF bar none and produce stunning images. I’ll upgrade for SD card compatibility (a850 uses CF cards), video and size/weight savings. Bring it on Sony, I’m all for it.
I MISS ONLY ONE THING UNTIL YET. A NEX, apsc or FF, doesn’t matter, that is MF only with MF only lenses, focus peaking, and at a cheap price. I do not need that stuff, video junk, and so on. A simple manual focusing camera with small and compact manual focusing lenses, what a dream. But, maybe it will come true some day, who knows, I am not the only one with that dream.
Apart of that, I await a correct NEX camera in apsc with that excellent 20 mpix sensor, not that rookie stuff that they have on the market yet. A58 has much I need, but just not the mirrorless design. Make that camera with a Nex body and NEX7 features, a small version of A7 would fit me, and I buy it right away.