Well this is quite a story and an embarrassment for Sony. My sources confirmed that the next A6000 definitely has no on sensor stabilization. And one of the source told me that:
The Sony Europe sites are undergoing heavy changes. And the company outsourced by Sony to do the website thought that also E-mount cameras have on sensor stabilization. That’s why they made the design you see on top of this post. It means even companies working for Sony are confused about what’s the difference between A and E-mount cameras! Bad joke I know 🙂
After reading the post here on SAR Sony quickly reacted and removed the sketch from their sites.
0 Responses
;(…
So wanted it to be true 😉
Now I don’t see how what a possible APS-C High-End model could offer to compete with a 650€ a6000 Body…
(guessing that there will be no IBIS in this generation at all)
It does seem like an odd decision, but Sony has to cut costs somewhere.
Still, I loved the NEX6. The only reason I gave mine up is that I kept losing shots due to AF accuracy. If they fix that one issue, the compact E-mount jumps back into the fight for best compact APSC.
(Also there are a few stabilized lenses available, so the new E-mounts don’t need it as bad as we think.)
I think the only way for Sony to get out of this blunder is to add stabilisation to the mirrorless cameras line-up 🙂
So stupid that they don’t also release bigger E-mount models. You could have in-body stabilization and auto-focus, AND the short flange distance of mirrorless.
Why? That entire demographic already owns a better system.
Not that preference of a particular type of camera has anything to do with demographics, but which system are you referring to?
As far as I know, there’s no such system. Not full frame anyway.
Yeah they’re called A-Mounts. They’re designed for that role.
Internal IBIS clearly doesn’t make sense for a camera design that is meant to be compact. The systems are large and would easily double or triple the cameras size.
Short flanges increase vignetting substantially.
The IBIS is behind and along side the sensor, would not hurt the camera optically. It would make the camera bigger by extending the area behind and around the sides of the sensor. The A55 is pretty small camera and had IBIS so it may not make the camera huge, but certainly bigger than the current ones. I think it is clear Sony made the same decision Nikon and Canon did and wants stabilization in the lenses for E-mount. The way people talk you would think the Alpha A-mount camera or Pentax DSLR should be the best selling cameras around. Maybe Sony will build the hybrid mount someday that includes IBIS and will let the legacy lens people have their cake and eat it too.
That’s why A55 had problem overheating with SSS on in video mode
A65 and A77 are not overheating due to a different reason. Its not the size, its due to the fact, that stabilization in these cameras is software, not hardware. Thats why there is a 1.25x video mode crop on these cameras.
@Stan get your facts straight, both have sensor shift stabilization
He’s right, it’s software stabilization. At least on the A57 it is, that’s why the video mode is cropped.
@pew pew, maybe you should read up a bit more on the way A65/A77 does stabilization in Video… Still IBIS on those 2 cameras is done on sensor, while video IBIS is done in software, thus a reason for the 1.25x video crop when in video mode. So before you accuse anyone about not having their facts straight, do some more research yourself…
Unlike you, I actually have A65 and know exactly how it works.
A-mount does not have a short flange distance, as clearly specified by Thomas.
“Short flanges increase vignetting substantially.”
Just no. You are a well of misinformation.
Dah!!!
The Comments are meant for the E-Mount in general. Vignetting is a problem with the large sensor, and short flange distances.
Here’s something to read, Educate yourself.
http://photo.stackexchange.com/questions/43451/how-does-a-sensor-cause-vignetting
That article confirms what I said. Vignetting has nothing to do with the flange distance, it is down to the lens design and the angle of light hitting the sensor as a consequence of that design. The technical flange distance of the mount in itself has nothing to do with it – it simply allows greater flexibility in lens design.
You didn’t read it
“Sensor based vignetting is a real problem for cameras with a large sensor and short flange distance (distance from mount to sensor). This is simply due to the oblique angles of incidence of light hitting the edges of the sensor, which isn’t really flat like a piece of film, but contains a stack of objects starting with UV/IR/AA filters, followed by microlenses, colour filters, then many layers of silicon with the photosensitive area at the bottom of a deep well!”
It’s not just vignetting. For me the most important issue is color shift – even dedicated E-mount lenses like FE 35mm can have a visible color shift all across the field. And that’s a native E-mount lens – no adapters used!
Yes, I did, but you clearly didn’t read my comment.
There is nothing with regards to short flange distance mounts that forces lens designers to create lenses that have extreme angles of incidence. Depending on the image quality aims and targets, a lens designer may, for example, extend the length of the lens to ensure the angles of incidence are less oblique.
The short flange distance of the mount is not in itself the cause of vignetting – of course, if the designer is willing to sacrifice some image quality for compactness, then they may accept more oblique incidence angles that lead to higher levels of vignetting and aberrations and choose to rely on software correction to counteract them. However, they are not forced to accept this. As I said before, the advantage of short flange distance is flexibility.
I know you want to believe that short flange mirrorless cameras (inc. e-mount) are fundamentally flawed, but that stems from your own insecurities with regards to the future of A-mount.
@Yeah BUTTS
I’m not worried about the A-Mount’s future. It will continue to be a Sony’s Flag Ship camera. However their situations where the FE-Mount are better suited, due to its smaller size, and light weight.
I’m just waiting until the FE-Mount technology has matured, and the number and quality lenses sufficient to carry out assignments.
The smaller E-Mount is looks like a excellent camera to supplement my current camera set-up not replace it.
However its Auto-Focus, stabilization system, loud shutter, and lack of lenses are items that need to be addressed before I am willing to buy one.
I think believe and ideal set-up includes both an A-Mount, and FE-Mount. There is no one camera solution, and those who limit themselves to one platform are simply fo0ls.
>> “Internal IBIS clearly doesn’t make sense for a camera design that is meant to be compact”
Funny, Olympus and Panasonic don’t have any problems with it…
Please tell me why every single E-mount model has to be compact, and why we can’t have one that has all the benefits of A-mount cameras and the short flange distance of E-mount cameras. Imagine all those old legacy lenses that will get a new life on that camera body.
Because 82% of the market is DSLR, and the mirror-less crossovers like the A3000 have been epic failures.
If you invest in mirrorless – why give up it’s advantage of a small size? If you can afford moving around with a larger camera – there’s no one reason to stick with mirrorless instead of a DSLR that’s superior in every other measurable way. Yea, there is legacy glass, but a) modern-day glass can be superior; b) DSLRs also can use adopted legacy glass; c) around 10% of mirrorless photographer ever used legacy glass on their camera, so don’t overestimate an importance of adapters.
>Internal IBIS clearly doesn’t make sense for a camera design that is meant to be compact.
oh wait… Instead of thin sensor, move the large lens elements in f/1.2 lens, now that makes sense.
I told you…
“even companies working for Sony are confused about what’s the difference between A and E-mount cameras!”
Shock horror
They need a children’s section for the E-Mount.
Does that mean they need a senior citizens section for A-mount?…
Works for me if I get an AARP discount! 😉
No an adult section would more than suffice.
Ironic that it’s actually the paranoid A-mount ’til I die people that are the ones behaving like children – BRWAT being the most annoying and obnoxious one.
@yeahbuttnope
I take pride in my work.
To be fair, I can see why a sub-contracted web design company wouldn’t know the differences between a and e-mount. Looks like Sony didn’t brief them properly…
That’s really sad 🙁
Haha !
Guess E-mount users are about to move to A-mount soon =)
wtf sony? seriously?
I look at all the excitement on the internet at the new cameras being released and wonder why sony seems to be just refreshing e mount cameras. The gh4k and x-t1 look very nice and I’m sure will tempt e mount users. It would be nice if they announce a FE wide angle is coming but really just give us something, anything that doesn’t feel incremental.
Maybe true for the GH4 if somebody wants/needs 4K but the Fuji XT1 is also nothing but a rehash of the same sensor in a different style body.
Perhaps you’re right on the X-T1. They claim the fast AF speed in the universe (or something like that). I’ll wait to see what real people say, but if they’ve made up a lot of AF ground then it would be hard to call it a rebranded camera even though the sensor is the same.
You have very short memory. SONY just released A7 and A7R recently! You call that just refreshing e-mount? X-T1 and GH4 are not even in the same league.
That is correct, they are in a league of their own. I was excluding them because i have excluded them as a camera I want. My NEX 7 is now 2 years old and starting to get the common problems like the peeling grip. Even though at f/16 of a wall I could only see a couple of spots, I thought I would get the sensor cleaned. It actually gave me around a stop of light back so I’m not in a rush to replace but want a camera released that is a replacement for me.
Oh no too bad :-/ Has anybody a guess if E-Mount APS-C will ever have IBIS? I love my Nex6 an it´s output. In my opinion in FF it´s technical not possible as the E-Mount is too narrow to move the FF-sized sensor and stay in the lightcircle.
Another question is when sony will release some highquality primes with longer focal lengths- but by the end of the year we will probably know more.
There already are E-Mount FF cameras.
Ah, FF with IBIS, sorry.
E-mount is an in-lens stabilization system.
A-mount is an in-body stabilization system.
I don’t get why people find it so difficult to understand and constantly whine that it’s not the other way around (A-mount users want stabilized lenses (especially teles), E-mount users want stabilized bodies… ridiculous)
People don’t whine that its the other way round. They just point out to the missed opportunity.
The whole point of E Mount system is that it is very flexible. It can accept A Mount lenses, Canon, Nikon & all the Legacy glass from so many manufacturers via adapters. If only it had IBIS, all those lenses INCLUDING A MOUNT LENSES will be stabilized.
Its kind of ironic that Canon & Nikon lenses are stabilised, but Sony’s own A Mount lenses will not be stabilized on any E Mount Camera.
It’s not missed opportunity, it’s a system strategy. People who use Canon or Nikon lenses on NEXes are tiny minority. Sony doesn’t want to create a mess in their own system, they’re focused on one strategy for E-mount, and that doesn’t involve IBIS.
Besides – you really want to be back in NEX3/5 era when bodies overheated after 15 minutes of shooting in a hot day? Cause that’s where it goes with bodies that small (and after A3000 disaster – NEXes will stay small for a long, long while).
Raghav, there is currently no way to use Nikon’s lens stabilization (VR) on an E-mount camera as none of the adapters for Nikon pass power from the camera to the lens. When you use a Nikon lens via adapter, the VR is not enabled. Canon IS lenses can be powered by using the latest Metabones adapter that preserves electronic connections.
m43 do use two different methods and noone complains.
>Sony doesn’t want to create a mess in their own system, they’re focused on one strategy for E-mount,
that is probably why they changed flash mount, introduced weird letter designations for NEX cameras, abolished NEX name, released a E-mount body in a DSLR shape, etc etc.
So they DO read SAR? That’s a good news indeed!
Booooooo !!!
BTW, i don’t know if people here read lots of IT news and such, but Sony is really not in a good shape right now :
– Bad TV market
– Selling the Ebook business to Kobo for North America
– Cutting Jobs
– Selling PC VAIO market
– Changing the TV Department
etc, etc
As a Smartphone users, we are millions waiting for the 4.3 Android Update firmware for our Xperia SP. Sony told us : “yaya, December”. Then, “Christmas will be ok !”, then “for new year, the firmware will be rolled out”. Then “Ok wait for early February”. And… yes, you can check XDA developers forum for the Xperia SP, 197 pages of angry and desperates users.
They are applying the same strategy in several departments. I think Sony is really bad at giving people what they want, and keep some follow-up to it.
It’s more of a “take it or leave it”. As soon as you got what you paid for, then don’t expect too much of Sony. And with the actual economical crisis, i think any roadmap must be taken with extreme precaution.
IBIS for E-mount needs probably money, money they don’t have that much for the moment.
+1
Halleluyah
Btw – I forgot to mention that the quality of the Xperia Z is so great, that the “waterproof” lids both are broken AND will not close at all. … so much for waterproofness. … Apart from the fact that it loses contact with the SIM-card all the time, and has lousy WIFI-connectivity (constantly weak signal)..
Sony != quality … 🙁
Weird, because my Xperia Z is still running solid and it’s been in water for countless times. But I guess it depends on the luck. Manufacturers are producing millions of phones, I doubt if not a single one would be faulty. And the same thing applies to all not just SONY.
I do follow the IT News,but I believe you’re typing the same stories there?
– Bad TV market
– Selling the Ebook business to Kobo for North America
– Cutting Jobs
– Selling PC VAIO market
– Changing the TV Department
– etc. etc. (what etc? or are you typing just to make it feel like a lot here?)
– Bad TV Market, SO they have re-structured the TV department
– Selling VAIO Segment to JDI (Cutting Jobs, but some of the employers would still be hired by JDI)since almost every PC brand is losing, I’m not surprised. Even Lenovo bought Motorola to raise its mobile sale to compensate the dying PC Market.
So they’re making changes to the divisions of their company that were losing money. You see this as a bad thing? The market disagrees.
Andrea, it is no joke.
Sonys setup is made by crack-smoking monkeys that roll dices.
+1
It would seem its not only Sony financial status that should get a junk rating
I’d say these types of “mistakes” are typical sony and expected of them.
Shows how well things are communicated internally and passed on too… But like a game if Chinese whispers…
Beyond pathetic, and sadly the NEX7 was my last Sony purchase, I shall move over to one of the dominating camera camps…
🙁
I knew it, and I totally cannot understand how this can happen. Even if I were the designer who made this image I would have double-checked the facts. And if I were the person who told the designer to make this I would have double-checked the facts. How can anybody be so careless!!
Are Sony working on IBIS for E mount cameras?
no
And you know it because…
Let’s just say that my friend works for Sony.
I wish Soy would just come clean and admit IBIS is technically impossible for E mount
Given that they’re using oss on e-mount lenses, it’s a safe bet that they’re not going to add ibis to bodies any time soon.
Panasonic did.
m4/3 got very different specifics to E-mount. On m4/3 every company can have a body, on E-mount only Sony will ever release bodies. That affects a way competition shapes.
Besides – m4/3 is a completely different story to APS-C sensors. People really need to finally understand that. Larger sensor brings it’s own limitations that don’t exist in a small one.
I think everyone was expecting this since we got that price of 650 USD.
What does it matter ?
Better EVF, faster AF and better sensor is a given.
I can’t say that I expected the Sony reviewers of the website to be as confused as the designers – to let such a thing pass. But again – that just shows what a system mess it is.
Sony is a profit-orientated company. They will not undermine their investment in the development and production of stabilized lenses. Same as Canon and Nikon. And profit is for them to find new customers that come from compact-cameras and are used to smaller cameras without stabilization. O.k. customers with small hands as juveniles and women are also welcome or guys that prefer retro-style as the leicas 50 years ago. So i don´t except anything on that road for me. I will stay with my 77 where i can hardly put all 5 fingers at the body – but nothing smaller…
Wow you are such a big man, congratulations!
LOL, I know, right? How insecure do some of these people have to be about their manhood or status as a grown-up that they need to blow so much smoke about how big and strong they are? It’s kind of sad, really.
That’s exactly what we thought will happen – people confuse systems thanks to new naming conventions, and in the end: noone knows what is what.
Sony was totally foolish dumping NEX name. Seems like now even their own staff doesn’t have any clue how these systems differentiate.
No surprise here. European sites had the E-mount IBIS image removed back on 1st Feb as picked up by Serg on the original post.
It would be very nice to have some specs by now, the camera is only *five* days away, come on ! Even SR3 or SR4 would do…
If my child spoke to me like that, they would be sent straight to bed.
Infantilizing hyperbole – killer combo! Make the misogyny even more obvious for bonus points.
Maybe a carefully planned leak to keep up consumer interest in the system, because they need a few more months to perfect the technology?
Four years ago when I started SAR I thought that I would be a marketing noob and companies would be smart in that. Now after four years I learned that:
1) I am still a noob
2) But big companies are noobs too
🙂
The web site is the responsibility of the sales and marketing people in a company, not the engineers and designers. You cannot expect marketing experts to also be camera experts.
I doubt if anyone in the marketing division would recognise an IBIS if it pecked him.
If a marketing expert does not know his domain, well, then he is not an expert. Anyway, this story just shows neither the cheap sub-contractor nor the marketing department responsible for that part of the web site doesn’t give a crap about their products.
+1 wise realization 🙂
That is really bad news and a turn-off !
The whole reason for entering Minolta in past time was the IBIS, so i did not have to buy all the expensive lenses. Really a great and major selling point
I want a nex7, but not w/o gps and IBIS.
A real shame ….
Minolta had IBIS? Wake up man! Google for yourself what IBIS means. Minolta had antishake.
IBIS = in-body image stabilization. That’s exactly what Minolta had in their own bodies.
Don’t be a jackass.
Minolta antishake is not quite as good as Olympus IBIS. And Minolta never had IBIS
Minolta Anti-Shake was a form of IBIS.
Haha, Dirk you are an idiot!
The Sony E mount is pure Sony product. It has no Minolta legacy whatsoever.
If you are waiting for Sony to put IBIS in the NEX I believe you are going to be sorely disappointed. They have on a few occasions said that it was not possible.
There was a chance to start afresh with the FE FF mount but there too they went with OSS lenses so it looks like they will never do it.
Panasonic has put IBIS in a few bodies because the m43 mount is large enough and the sensor size is small enough to do it. In Sony’s case they wanted the ‘smallest’ mirror-less body tag and hence made the flange distance and mount size too small to incorporate IBIS.
If they had use the Nex name, this confusion wouldn’t have happened 🙂
No 5-axis IBIS = No buy !
No 10-axis IBIS = no buy!
Reply from Emir = no read!
5-axis IBIS got one huge disadvantage over current Sony stabilization – it’s much more fragile. That’s something people buying Olympus bodies don’t realize – they spend 1000$+ on a rugged camera, but in fact it’ll break after first hard contact with concrete, unlike competition (neither Pentax nor Sony stabilization systems come even close to Oly’s 5-axis when it comes to how bad it’s shock resistance is). Oh, and Oly still got glitches with it, when it can randomly move sensor blurring photos.
So don’t get too excited. Right now the only way to get reliable and very effective image stabilization is the one in a lenses.
Same here,, they will not get my money. Sad because i really thought that this time..
This was a sick joke Sony played. Sadly I knew full well it was a mistake but it was sad to see it got so many peoples hopes up only to be crushed.
Honestly it was a bit too much to believe considering Sony is sticking with OSS lenses and they have on occasions said its not possible to put IBIS in their E mount cameras.
I’m surprised anyone believed for a second that E-Mount would have IBIS.
Sony clearly does not intend to do that, since they equip E-Mount lenses with OSS.
you mean, they equip SOME E-Mount lenses with OSS… and this is not enought (for me and others I think)
Canon and Nikon also don’t equip every lens with OSS. 70-200’s have it, 24-70’s don’t.
But it doesn’t mean that they plan to introduce IBIS anytime in the future. They’ve clearly chosen in-lens stabilization, and so did Sony with E-Mount.
I agree, but:
Sony does so much stuff we cannot understand, so why not hope for stuff even if there is good reasons against it?
I just would have loved having legacy glass stabilized…
I’d also love for my legacy lenses to be stabilized with IBIS, but Sony would also love for you to buy the closest E mount equivalent from them new…
if only the new lenses had the same feeling with manual focusing (I’m looking at you focus-by-wire)…
A-mount lenses don’t have lens stabilisation, so adding it to an E-mount camera makes perfect sense. It would allow A-mount lenses to be mounted via the adapter and be stabilised and the E-mount lenses that aren’t stabilised get the benefit too.
Perhaps Sony wants people to use A-mount lenses on A-mount cameras – ever thought of that?
Perhaps if Sony supported A-mount bodies properly, then they would want to use them on A-mount cameras. Ever thought of that?
Sony supports A-mount bodies in exact same way they support E-mount bodies. Whatever they got a body you are interested in or not – that’s a separate problem.
That’s an excuse!
Really? I never would have guessed… but wait! That’s what I said and I think I was booed. 😉
I don’t know why people keep thinking E mount will get ibis, I think it’s clearly a lens based stabilization system. Trouble is people keep imagining wanting something hard enough will make it happen. Doesn’t happen in Sony land lol. Just look at the lack of N7 successor (and please don’t give me the lame “it’s coming at Photokina” answer) as proof…
Panasonic added IBIS to the GX7, in addition to the OIS in their lenses. And the Panasonic lenses are fully compatible with Olympus IBIS bodies — you just pick if you want the lens to override the IBIS in a menu setting.
It is really great if you are using older lenses via an adapter, which I know Sony E-mount users enjoy as much as m4/3 users.
And then they made the idiotic decision to disable it in video mode.
Probably not idiotic, just that they couldn’t afford to let it be known how half-baked their IBIS was. Better to stick with OIS than do it terribly to the point of uselessness.
Agree.
The geniuses at Sony corporate marketing were envisioning the NEX line and decided consumers want small. The smaller the better. Small for small’s sake. The dream: We want cameras the size of a postage stamp some day. Toss everything! Toss mirrors, EVFs, IBIS, comfortable grips, the hump, decent AF, everything must go! Let the engineers sort out the mess.
Any Sony marketing team dissenter at that meeting was told to eat another donut and shut up. 😉
I think Sony has recanted somewhat from that dream and others like Fuji (e.g., retro X-T1) and Olympus certainly get it but it’s hard for Sony to go back on some decisions, particularly IBIS.
The fact that Sony went OSS lenses cements the fact there’s really no going back on IBIS. Technically, of course, there are solutions but I expect the best we’ll see along those lines is if any true a-e mount hybrid comes out it logically would have IBIS since it’s mostly a transitional body to send a thrill up the legs of a-mounters. Back in October it was an 80% reliable SAR rumor (meaning it has 50-50 chance? 😉 ). Unfortunately, it’s supposed to be high-end (SR4) so it probably won’t be the real answer for most of us Sony needs to produce.
Maybe another $1,000,000,000 loss (their latest sad performance figure) or two will wake the guy’s up at corporate they need to rethink a few things.
Seriously… how can even their internal teams tell the difference between E mount and A mount? They are so compatible… remember what their loser marketing guys said?
Given my personal strong preference for on lens IS, the only news here is one of corporate incompetence.
Reminds me a little of the Leica ‘mini M’ campaign
Can you blame a company for a simple error on a website ?
It was *so* obvious it was a simple mistake in the first place.
Yep it shows very sloppy project management by someone at Sony
“Trouble is people keep imagining wanting something hard enough will make it happen.”
Indeed. People around here seem to have a habit of convincing themselves that certain features will be introduced, then act all wounded and lash out at Sony when it doesn’t introduce said imaginary feature.
IBIS in e-mount will not happen – people need to accept that.
Don’t think this is the place to put people on the psychologist’s stool.
(Though you got that right I guess)
I don’t think one is psychotic because they expect Sony to make good design decisions and get upset when they don’t. Not that I convinced myself they’d include it because it’d be a popular feature to salvage what’s a disappointing line-up thus far in 2014. Just the opposite, I figured it was bull and said so at the time.
But there’s always hope! 😉
I think it should be easy for Sony to add at least electronic stabilization for video like in cheap camcorders. It should work together with OIS.
it crops the image. but still if someone wants to use that why not, but tbh you can achieve better results with proper editing programs.
Guess m4/3 still has that advantage then.
Sony ! Wake up !
Panasonic is in a house !!!
http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/9542/gh4-4k-panasonic-video-camera-official-topic
Damn how I hope the A6000 can compete with the OMD-1 in terms of features. IBIS is one feature that I have been waited for so long. I think I will pass A6000 and hope for the March-April launch.
I love the NEXes for 2 things:
1. Great small cameras with good APS-C sensor and a nice setup of e-mount lenses, many with good OSS
2. Great cameras for ancient glass.
For the latter I would like IBIS but I understand it would conflict with 1. I hope they will come up with a prime NEX and the A3000 form factor that would definitely have room for IBIS.
With compact interchangeable lens cameras, there is currently a choice between big sensor and IBIS.
The instant someone else offers both together, I’m likely to say goodbye to my NEX.
And that knowledge means I’m not willing to invest heavily in NEX lenses, because I’m not sure that I’m staying with the system. So Voigtlander is getting my lens money instead of Sony, because I know those will transfer to whatever body I get in the future. (and most Sony primes don’t have antishake either)
It feels like a marketing decision instead of a technical one that means Sony aren’t adding IBIS to E-mount which seems stupid.
Be the first to offer a body with IBIS for a little extra cost and size, and anyone ‘like me’ looking for compact quality would have little reason to consider others.
Let someone else get there first, and those same users will already be invested in a different system.
+10000000000
I wish I could stabilize my vintage lenses on a FE mount. Why not IBIS? I really don´t understand.
Its highly likely they CAN’T physically fit IBIS in the NEX mount. The sensor needs to move a bit for IBIS and there simply ins’t enough distance between the mount and sensor to allow for IBIS.
Plus Sony has chosen the OSS path and that means no IBIS as they can charge you extra for OSS lenses over non OSS lenses like how Nikon and Canon have done.
Lastly Sony gets no money when people use legacy lenses so at least some people might buy OSS lenses instead of using legacy glass.
That’s actually a good point regarding legacy lenses. With OSS they really force you to adopt newer lenses. That increases the likelyhood that consumers will end up spending more on the system. This I would think is the driving factor behind not including IBIS.
Wouldn’t it be possible to make a little crop when IBIS is active (say 90-95% from FF) ? That would be enough (?)
This is why I’ll never move to e-mount. The only compact camera system that makes sense to me is micro four thirds. APS-C cameras still mean bulky lenses of similar size as FF glass. You might be trading some insignificant weight but the size is of little value IMO.
Olympus and Pany can make stupid small cameras AND lenses that are super compact. They also offer IBIS. Makes sense right? If I’m using one of these cameras I probably have no interest in a tripod. With 5 axis your handheld shots benefit- period! With native prime lenses you also have a compact system that is just rediculously unobtrusive. Here is were the real advantage of mirrorless can be fully realized.
As for e-mount, IMO, it’s just another handicapped Sony system. I’m not going out to shoot wildlife tele lenses with any of those attached. 70-200 on an e-mount camera? Hell no…not even an F4. Why would I do this??? Why?
My point is that the real value is at the extremes. DSLR for the big stuff and micro four thirds for the small stuff. Everything in between is like a sports sedan…you know what class of car those fall into right? It’s called compromise and no thanks.
So why do you come to SAR and better yet, get stuck in 100+ post discussion threads?
I’m an a-mount user.
+1
Well it’s a real shame that Sony can’t have FF IBIS mirrorless. Pentax/Olympus and now Panasonic have no problems doing it. They also don’t have any overheating problems with the video. Oh well. Wasted opportunity. I really hope Fujifilm is the first to have a FF IBIS mirrorless system. Maybe Canon and Nikon can jump in on Sony’s missed opportunity? I sure hope so.
@Anonymous:
> Well it’s a real shame that Sony can’t have FF IBIS mirrorless.
> Pentax/Olympus and now Panasonic have no problems doing it.
Errr… No.
FF + IBIS = exactly 3 cameras in the world: a900, a850, a99.
FF + Mirrorless = exactly 4 cameras in the world a7, a7r, M9, M9p
FF + IBIS + Mirrorless = ZERO.
“Pentax/Olympus and now Panasonic…” are aps-c or m4/3. Pentax 645’s medium-format has no image-stabilization, that I know of… not in-body, not in-lens. Glad to be corrected if I’m wrong!
Pentax has the Q system with IBIS. But yeah, real shame Sony missed this opportunity.
Easy to be wise after the event but it does seem Sony and to some extent Panasonic are so interested in bragging rights “this is the world thinnest, smallest etc”. Well that means compromises have to happen.
The thing is: when aftermarket adapters & legacy glass turned into a significant part of the buzz for the NEX line, Sony was caught by surprise. Nevertheless, it *IS* significant now, and they’re no longer surprised by it.
A-mount = long flange-distance (due to the legacy of the mirrorbox & pentaprism) is inescapable. IBIS is part of the legacy there, and from an engineering standpoint the IBIS motors simply fit much better into the larger camera.
E-mount has MUCH less room for an IBIS system, but this is an engineering problem that is solvable with time & advancing tech (not being an engineer in any camera-maker’s design department, I’m not in a position to say HOW CLOSE such a system is to being viable at commercial prices…) . Full-frame models *MAY* suffer from the issue of such lenses on the small E-mount bayonet not having *ROOM* to cast a large-enough image-circle to move the sensor and stay within the image-circle; this issue may NOT be amenable to simple “advancing tech” solutions — if your E-mount flange is sitting where you need optical glass to be, you’re SOL.
BUT STILL — the allure of having an IBIS body that is *SO* *ADAPTABLE* to all that quality glass out there, is a siren song that would be hard to resist.
I would abandon the A-mount in a heartbeat for such a system:
– Decent controls & ergonomics (cannot be TOO tiny — I need both control-free gripping surfaces, and plenty of manual controls so I don’t have to menu-dive)
– Sturdy body & fittings; like a 7series at minimum.
– FF sensor
– Short (ish) flange-distance, allowing simple adapters for all prior SLR/DSLR lenses.
– IBIS, programmable to match focal length even of older “dumb” lenses.
– Focus-peaking (or similar) for non-AF lenses
– Decent AF-speed (I don’t need world-leading) for AF lenses
– VERY GOOD accuracy of AF (doesn’t have to be “world’s best” but if I miss 1 shot in 5 due to AF miss-lock, I am *not* a happy camper)
– VERY GOOD predictive-AF / AF-tracking (ok, so AF misses on *action* shots can be higher than 1 in 5!)
The above CANNOT be realized in an A-mount. It MIGHT be managed in E-mount.
I wish it had ibis, just because sony lens with oss tend to be expensive…
Come on Sigma, Tamron, et al. Don’t rip image stabilization out of your existing A mount lenses. Leave it in like you do for Nikon, Canon, and Sigma mounts. You could clean up in the e-mount world using the LA-EA4.
Why would Sony put IBIS into a cheap camera and not have it in their A7 and A7r???
They will just put it in the A9 and A9r… Screw you early adopters LOL!
Who’s the bargain basement blue light special Ad Agency that publishes without proofing for client approval?
Miroslav confirms: Will not buy E-mount cameras until they have IBIS. Sony camera designers did a huge mistake.
+1