Back in February RED sued Sony because of patent infringment reasons. And RED said that it want the Sony’s F65, F55 and F5 cameras to stop their further sale and have them literally “destroyed“!
Yesterday Sony (news on pro.Sony.com) officially announced that it will sue RED: “for infringing 7 of Sony’s patents in the United States District Court for the Central District of California. Sony believes that the Red ONE, EPIC and SCARLET cameras, various digital still and motion camera modules, and various accessories such as the REDMOTE infringe our patents. Sony is seeking both money damages and an injunction to stop the continued sale of Red’s infringing products. Sony makes significant investments into the research & development of technology related to the cinema camera industry and intends to protect those investments against companies that infringe our patents.”
Yep, RED shouldn’t have started this. If Sony wins this may signs the end of the RED business.
P.S: Despite everything Sony is now shipping the F55 (here at BH) and the F5 (here at BH).
28 Responses
Frankly I thought that this will happen when RED started this. They somehow forgot that Sony has really large number of patents and there is high probability that some of them are used in RED.
If it was Samsung vs Sony, then it might be interesting, this at best for RED will end up in some sort of “tie” and be forgotten. In worst case they will simply end.
Yes because I am sure Samsung have lots of Pro Video related patents for all their Pro gear… Oh wait, erm… Is Samsung Galaxy ‘Pro’? Yeah nah.
I think if Sony really wanted to sue RED out of existence (as a business strategy) they would have done so already. I think this is a gambit to leverage an open exchange of IP. Probably best for both parties and definitely best for us the consumers, because it will be mean that both RED and Sony will have to continue to compete by using innovative features and not solely through courtroom decisions.
That said, if there is real, purposeful infringement of IP then I think there should be repercussions. Patent disputes have gotten a bad rap and patent trolls are really pretty vile, but patent laws really are important for promoting research and development.
Well, it was bound to happen.
This is American style. Lots of patents and lots of legal battles.
We better stop buying things, you never now if it still exist, due to all the patent cases, Apple, Samsung, LG, Sony and so on and so on.
They know when they use a patent from another company. Nobody thinks of the customer.
Frankly I want Sony to come out on top on this one!
What did RED was thinking when they decided to sue Sony and even going to the point of saying that Sony had to destroy their cameras? RED was really cornered for Sony’s new cinema cameras since right after the announcement, they immediately cut the price of their cameras and right after, they came suing. I think they can set this even and Sony will ask RED some amount to at least pay some bills because of this.
RED’s real problem is that they have based their business on being cutting edge and selling advanced models at high prices. This can only work for a few years as what was advanced becomes routine.
The tech market is littered with companies that started out with prestige products and were overtaken by progress. Fairlight, Silicon Graphics, Sun.
Never start something you can’t finish!
It wont be the end of RED. This more about having leverage tokens. Lets imagine Sony knew about RED’s patent infringement. Sony does nothing, yet. Sony brings out competing products at lower prices and waits. RED sues for what it may be real patent infringements. Sony then shows they also have an ace under their sleeves. In the end it may end up in a shake of hands and a statement of understanding. Sony says they have settled their differences with RED (probably allowing RED to use those patents under the pretext of Sony using REDs patents on the same terms) We all live happy but RED slowly but surely knows that it will have to compete for price and other features that are unique to RED.
Sony can win this one in a slow game. Clever.
well, fact is, these days, there are very very very rarely that any Mfr can build their product based purely on their own Research, innovation, design, and manufacturing. Especially in the hardware department. And Software is pretty much a case of either one is so closed and proprietary that it can only work on its own or it simply need to adopt to accepted standard ( ISO, EU, GIS etc … )
This would mean any hardware ( or software ) today is likely to be sharing patent / coding / parts with competetions / like products.
I think RED is just so over engrossed in their old time business model and fail to realize this is no 1970’s. LOL …. I for one is happy that SONY bring forth the F5 and F55, Now, Panasonic, Canon, let see something along the line too. And there will be others too. RED just need to face up to real world.
Let everyone sue every else- Apple, Samsung, Blackberry, redberry, strawberry…generates news. Not a good one for anyone concerned.
At least lawyers get rich. Oh wait…
And what patents are they fighting about (sony)?
Sony has been hemoraging money for the last few years. At this point Jim Jennard may have more money than Sony. This could get very interesting, as in the Chinese curse “may you lead an interesting life.”
Lol sony has about 1000x as much jim does
Sony is carrying over $100 BILLION in debt, at this point I have more money than Sony.
Not to smart when it comes to finance are you? Debt by itself means nothing, you could have billions of debt and be fine or be bankrupt with only 100,000 in debt. Just add up all the assets and then subtract all the liabilities (debt and other things owed) the difference is what the company is worth, and Sony is about 25 billion dollars ahead of the game… If you had more than Sony I think we would be seeing you on the top of the Forbes list of wealthiest people.
Uhm, no.
Sony has $14 billion in debt, nowhere near $100 billion.
Source:
http://www.stock-analysis-on.net/NYSE/Company/Sony-Corp/Ratios/Long-term-Debt-and-Solvency
I think there now will be a meeting, some coffee drinking and some
hand shaking. Then Sony and Red will agree about something we never will
know anything about. Maybe the best for all of us.
This reminds me of another photo company that started suing for patent infringement, they are no longer in business either.
C
who?
for real, RED start all this, and this is pretty much what they bring upon themselves. When they said they are going to sue Sony for Patent ,Infrigment I go and read the whole text they put forth and I must say the reasoning is pretty slim. Their action or rather reaction to Sony’s announcing release of F5, F55 speaks for itself.
I guess RED just have to accept the fact that SONY is capable to deliver a market disruptive product, namely in price / feature but then its not unexpected. Its long known that the business model all the PRO cine / video gear Mfr doing had always been pricing exclusive to the point where they can gguarantee their hugh profit. There is technically no reason why those same feature cannot be adopted in a workhorse priced product. In short, RED is like IBM in the early 90’s with their inflated priced Mini, OS/2 and PC ( IBM ultimately exit the whole PC market ), or Leica in the M4-2 Days.
Well truth be told, Sony just see a changing and emerging market of Cine / Videography that is hugh and growing and sees a need for such a product at reasonable price. The scenario play out like the Nikon taking over the Leica as the PRO’s in the 50’s and 60’s
As for the patents. Lets figure it this way, both of them are referring to Patent that are both highly specialized and yet over generalized in many way that it can easily be a case of this way or that way. This remind me of a very old case of Automotive engineering case of similar when an engineering firm sued Honda for infriging on thier design ( of ecliptical inlet/ outlet valves on Motor bike engine , the case did not even got to court as it was deemed no valid for a case ) Similar things here betrween RED and SONY. Most of the claim I see is simply not really sound, but lawyers of course would disagree with me I am sure.
Damn straight. Bring it on.
I support Sony! Red after years didn’t keep the promise with the project of the Scarlet for 3000$ and deserves to be TERMINATED!!!!!!
What’s with all the RED hate? Do people really want to see an innovative company and its employees put out of business? Its a company that’s brought digital cinema to the masses (when I say masses I’m talking small production companies, indie film and doc shooters – not people buying Nex cameras), and its raw codec/workflow has become an industry standard for TV and feature production.
The Epic can produce a 4/5K image as good as the new Sony’s in a much smaller/lighter package and with Canon lenses, not much more expensive cine lenses. The F5 and F55 wouldn’t even exist at this price point if it weren’t for RED cameras, Sony would still be pricing them at $200,000 to compete with Arri and Panavision.
American greediness is killing himself.