As you know Canons first attempt to compete against the growing mirrorless market is the release of the Canon G1X which has a 4/3 sized sensor which is slightly smaller than Sony’s APS-C. If you were wondering how close the sensor quality could go to the best Sony NEX cameras than see those DxOmark results (Click here). It’s nowhere near the Sony NEX-7! Speaking of the NEX-7. The only real competitor the Fuji X PRO 1 got (finally) a price. It’s available for preorder at Amazon (Click here)…for $1699. That yes will be a strong fight between Sony and Fuji!
P.S.: Today Canon reported big loss and slow camera sales. So kings can be dethroned?
NEX-7 preorder search links: [shopcountry 8454].
125 Responses
canon made a HUGE tactical error not getting into the mirror-less game… there seems to be a huge market for people that bought into the amateur DSLR craze then realized it’s a lot to lug around, a lot of whom are turning to mirror-less cameras as the solution (cuz if you can change lenses, it’s like… a professional camera right??). Not to mention all the DSLR users that want a smaller alternative for vacations etc that can compete image-wise with their SLR setup. It’s mind blowing that Canon hasn’t capitalized on this yet.
I’ve been a dedicated Canon shooter years, but after using the NEX 3 for a year, I’m seriously considering switching to Sony… I can have a DSLR setup, and use all my lenses with full AF and IS on my Nex for vacations, amazingly modular system.
Cause it is a professional camera as is a Diana for that matter. Im really going to have to stop getting paid to use these things that aren’t dslr. 35mm is a weird format. I never had much use for. In the studio we are Leaf digital or 4×5 still and for my documentary work it was leica and now nex. Just did 3 months in China with a couple of c3’s. Sold now nex 7’s. Why can’t you use your NEX all the same ways as your canon accept for maybe sports or hard core its happening now journalism? Thats the only time my Nikons even get out of the bag anymore and thats more hobby then what pays my bills.
I agree, DSLR = Pro is an odd argument that I see made all the time. If you’re a sideline sports photographer then sure, buy a Nikon D4 or Canon 1Dx and have at it.
However, since the vast majority of professionals are not sports photographers I have no idea why a DSLR is still a requirement. I can’t think of a single thing a photo journalist, wedding photographer, or portrait photographer needs to shoot that can’t be done with a high end mirrorless body.
Olympus’ upcoming OM-D will be especially interesting. Weather seals, extremely fast AF, built-in wireless flash control, plenty of resolution, built-in image stabilization…..and all in a body that weighs under 1 lb. Why exactly would a photojournalist want to lug a Nikon D700 or larger around for miles at a time when cameras like the NEX-7 or OM-D can get the job done?
Are you kidding? Using mirrorless for weddings, action photography or even shooting playing kids is nonsense. Did you try it? Without fast autofocus (phase detection) it is not possible to shoot any subject moving towards or backwards camera.
Nikon mirror less has fast phase detection AF then it possible for mirror less to have phase detection.
Also sony has adapter with phase detection then when you need it you can use it or can live without mirror 🙂
“Fast AF” doesn’t mean PDAF, oly and panasonic has fast AF which is not PDAF based
But PDAF ≡ ugly solution is true statement. Hope better algorithms will be developed soon to get rid of this obsoleted nonsense.
There are other types of photography you know.
If it was just SW thing to make very fast contrast detect auto-focus then it would have been done already. It is not solvable just by better algorithms. Problem is that it relies on data from main sensor which in less then perfect light can not supply new image for auto-focus control algorithm in short time to make decision about change in focus. Less light implies much longer auto-focus for contrast detect algs. It can not be solved just by SW ever.
use mirrorless for weddings? and the wife: ahahhahahah go away
There are people who can and do shoot weddings with rangefinders like the M9. Not for everyone, certainly, but it can be done.
if CDAF is not good in poor conditions of light? why does the nikon V1 changes from PDAF to CDAF when the light conditions are not very good?
rangefinders are way different from nex 😉
I don’ t care pdaf/cdaf. It must be as fast as current pdaf, thats the only reason why I’m not into the NEX system. Oh, and the absence of an e-mount 35mm f1.8/2, but that will be solved by Sony some day.
@Marek
I have no idea why you think it’s impossible to shoot a wedding with a mirrorless camera, but I assure you it’s not. Case in point: 3 years ago two of my friends got married. I didn’t want to shoot the wedding myself (as I was more interested in the party), but I promised them I would take my Olympus E-P1 and snap some shots for them throughout the night. I noticed the wedding photographer walking around with a Canon 5D, but you know which two photos they have hanging on their wall? The one I snapped the moment they exchanged rings, as well as a photo I took during their first dance.
That was just with an E-P1, arguably the slowest mirrorless camera ever. I would have no issues at all with something like a Panasonoc GX1. So perhaps you might not be able to use a mirrorless camera at a wedding, but that’s not the cameras fault.
Nikon V1 probably switches do CDAF in low light situations because its on sensor PDAF sucks in low light. DSLs have dedicated AF sensor with large photo-diodes for PDAF which is more sensitive then main sensor. Combined with AF illuminator it beats CDAF speed in any situation.
Well, we can use any (crap) camera to shoot whatever we want and make impressive photos, even fashion. But with better equipped camera we will get great results more frequently.
Good point. There was no wedding photography prior to the big runup into autofocus 20 years ago.
If I was about to make a contract with a wedding photographer who uses P&S style camera I would run away.
Might want to un blackout your site. The protest is over.
I keep holding my breath, waiting for Canon to drop a mirrorless bomb-shell on us… I’m going to be really pissed if they announce their own mirrorless line that’s EOS Lens compatible right after I buy a Nex 7 🙂
Don’t worry Canon already shown it’s response with G1X, same Nikon with V1. They don’t want to eat in their DSLR lucrative market, so in theyr mind mirror-less should not have performance which compete directly with DSLRs. Nikon chose a small size sensor with intercahngable lenses, Canon chose an APS-C sensor with non interchangable lens.They may come next year like Fuji did with an intercahngable system but this means again one more year for Sony.
Sony took another aproach, as anyway it was not so big in DSLR market.
Panasonic did not have this problem at all as they don’t make DSLRs but they are stucked with 43 system, which looked a good idea , but will allways underperformed comapring with APS-C because it’s size. Plus Sony does not make 43 sensor but makes APS-C for both DSLR and NEX so same development resources, ( and sells them to most of their competitors also).
Fortunately, it looks like Canon is even slower than Sony at getting in on the mirrorless shenanigans! That means no EOS ILC until Sony + lens makers release some more native NEX lenses.
I have been a working photographer for since I was 17 and an intern at the St. Louis Post Dispatch. Shot the Rochester Red wings baseball team for the Rochester Free Press while in college and many other events through college. Have Work in MOMA, Had a commercial studio in NYC before moving into feature films and I get the feeling I own less gear then most the people on this list. (well short of all my studio gear that isn’t cameras) Now I have nothing against gear heads but you can not measure anything by the quality of some reviewer applies to a given item. It means nothing. You go out you use it and you find the thing you like that fits in your hand and thats how you make good works. Because you have what you feel comfortable with. I would put my work with a diana camera up against image taken with a Leica on ektar 25. In fact some of my best work is on 4×5 polaroid which is incapable from the diffusion transfer from being sharp at all. I like the info. Its all interesting to me but for those out there that think they need a Leitz lens to make AMAZING SUPER AWESOME WORK. Forget about it.
+1
I’am using a Nex 3 beside my alpha 850. But what I really miss are excellent lenses. Sony build quite good body, but there are no corresponding lenses. All the e-mount are not what I would call good to excellent. It is the same for the A-mount. Sony wake up, we need lenses.
One more comment to the article above. What do you do, advertising for Sony? Be serious and compare comparable cameras. Not a compact Canon with a mirror less Nex. I think for a compact camera the Canon G1X is the best you can bye.
DxO is an evaluation of sensors, so cameras with “equal” size sensors are correct to compare. Therefore m43, Canon 1.5″ and APS-C is in the “same genre”. Perfectly valid in my mind. Also it shows this Canon sensor is just the ordinary 18MP sensor in a 4:3 ratio cut.
I’m tired of hearing people say Sony doesn’t have any good glass. The “G” series and Ziess lenses for @ mount are top notch and to say otherwise is rubbish. Would like to hear what lenses in particular you are complaining about?
As far as the compact and mirror less comparisons go I think it’s fair. The canon is still an $800 camera and it’s as close as Canon is to a mirror less at this point. Maybe you should compare it to the NEX 5n…whoops maybe not it still kicks the crap out of the Nikon and Canon.
I thought Sony are saying they know they need more quality lenses for NEX?
When I see a NEX sensor compared to a m43 sensor, my first thought is, yes but what happens when you put comparable lenses on those cameras. Suddenly the NEX looks like it should be compared to a DSLR.
I would love to buy into NEX, but the range of lenses doesn’t work for me.
@Xlan
> Be serious and compare comparable cameras. Not a compact Canon with a mirror less Nex.
http://camerasize.com/compare/#257,33
Viewing the link above – remind me which one is the *compact* camera???
I could have compared the Canon to the 5N, but that is even more embarrassing for the GX1:
http://camerasize.com/compare/#257,34
And the sensor on the 5N is still better. And in the UK the 5N (with kit lens) is £200 cheaper than the G1X.
Maybe the facts have a Sony bias, rather than this site.
Well said Matthew
Compare on price. Because that’s what 95% of customers will know about.
They won’t know sensor sizes or any of that stuff. They want something better than a normal compact, but without the lug of a dSLR
The NEX-5N is cheaper than the Canon, and destroys it in IQ. Clear winner, sorry Canon!
About the quality of the glass for Nex… I havent seen a kit lens as good as the 18-55 (in that price range). I’ve made usable (with processing) photos of insects from a distance. In my opinion there are few lenses, but their quality exceeds the needs of ¿90%? of hobbyists.
Speak for yourself. We are not talking hobbyists !
If you’re not talking hobbyists, why are you talking NEX?
Bengt, who are we talking about then?
Agree the 18-55mm lens is great for a kit lens.
Yeah, the SEL-1855 is a pretty good lens to walk around if you want to take advantage of the NEX-APS-C-Sensor and don’t like to carry a big bag of lenses. For the same reason I’ve started to like the SEL-16F28 with the VCL-ECU1 & VCL-ECF1 Converters. Both lenses have quality limitations, of course, but that’s why one chooses the NEX system, because a DSLR would be too bulky and and a cellphone camera not nearly as good.
BTW I dislike this labelling pro vs. hobbyist. There are people making money with cameras more stupid than most of the amateurs, while of course some of them might better collect stamps. Having the camera for one’s needs is everything that counts. Peace.
get over yourself and try to think. It is completely normal to compare similarly-sized sensors, not to mention the cameras are in the same price range.
And I guess you haven’t tried the new e-mount Zeiss.
Check this guy’s photos, as you see they are taken with the kit lens. It’s not only me, but I think the simple kit lens is a rather good lens.
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1042&thread=40463566
Though I agree that the NEX lens selection is limited, I agree with others that the G1X is indeed comparable to some m4/3 and NEX, especially when you factor cost and size. Actually, the NEX-C3/5N and a bunch of m4/3 cams are cheaper, and with pancakes, are smaller/lighter than the G1X.
How is the G1X a good buy if the Pany G3 has a big high-res EVF, similarly sized sensor, swivel touchscreen, and hotshoe for less money?
I think the point is, that’s the closest thing Canon has to offer that section of the marketplace… I agree, not a really good comparison, but I lay the blame on Canon.
LOL
The Canon PowerShot G1X is a small compact camera and the NEX7 have an APS-C Sensor xD
really sad that people really try to compare those :/
Also DxO Mark Scores can not compared like that.
Just take the Alpha 65 and the Alpha 77
They have completely different Values, but why they have the same sensor? What happened
The Alpha 77 have a different ISO Range than the Alpha 65, so the ISO Score gets calculated different.
The Overall Score and the Dynamic Range Score doesnt tell anything at all.
You have to look at the closer test and compare the single values than you will see that the Alpha 77 for example only wins because the ISO 50 and the ISO 16000.
Best example. Nikon D3s have more than 3000 at High ISO Score, Canon 5D Mark II have even not 2000
Even torought the D3s have only 12 Megapixel and so should be much better, it is only every minimal better, the much higher score is because the 3Ds have a wider ISO Range (especially in the High-ISO Section, if its good or not).
The Some cameras get score/points even beeing not good at this disciplin, only because the vendor build in some incredible high iso range.
Mostly a difference of 300 points or even more could be just a very slightly better quality which can not be seen by eye
ISO scores is junk, but 3 bits of color and 3 stops dynamic range really counts.
You can certainly compare those sensors. The Canon G1X sensor is bigger than m4/3 an just slightly smaller than APS-C.
It’s very close to APS-C size and is intended as a competitor to mirrorless. So we compare. And while DXOmark is certainly far from perfect, when you see such huge differences, the conclusion is obvious.
You’re wrong about the ISO scores. Cameras are all compared at a single point, 32dB SNR. It doesn’t matter whether their ISO range extends further at the bottom or the top.
It does matter when looking at maximum DR scores as the highest DR score is usually achieved at the lowest ISO available. Same for the other values.
“Canon PowerShot G1X is a small compact camera”
What?
The G1X has a APS-C sensor! go do your research before you talk gas!
Its right between m4/3s and APS-C. And worse than both.. not good exactly. m4/3 are much better choice or even Nikon 1. Ofc if you cant or dont want Sony/Samsung solution.
“go do your research before you talk gas”
LOL, why don’t you?
If you weren’t a hypocrite and actually did your own research, you would know that a typical APS-C sensor (1.5x crop) is 40% larger (area wise) than the G1X’s sensor, and the G1X’s sensor is only 16% larger than a typical m4/3 sensor. So, it is in fact closer to m4/3 in size.
oh shut up mate! The point is that you can compare them… they all have decent sensors in them… near enough the same size… its not a mobile phone sensor to a medium format really is it??? you donut!
the G1X has a 4/3 aspect ratio sensor with is slightly larger than m4/3 so all was correct, i suggest you do you research.. its not and APS-C sensor at all.. and even Canons APS-C sensor is smaller than anyone elses
G1x has 1.5″ sensor which is smaller than standard APS-C. http://www.dpreview.com/previews/canong1x/
who’s talk gas again?
Wonder how can Canon get more points than GX-1. I mean, they have even worse ISO performance than m4/3s? Thats achievement! 😀
not to mention they all mediocre kit lenses, meaning lumix-gx1 and the nex7 could easily bump up they score with a premium fast lens. canon cant do that.
also happens that it the ugliest
Yea thats kinda that issue, if you want some ISO help in m4/3, you can simply put on 25mm f0.95. With Canon you cant do anything (except use of flash).
Its not much real competitor, bit like super-compact, but still just compact. Not sure what everyone expected from Canon sensor, but I thought they will at least try to match Fuji X100.
look at that, I sure would have thought the Canon sensor would rate much better, hmmmm. interesting.
i would guess that the hipster world would really get a nervous breakdown if the Fuji X Pro 1 also brings in lower results than the Nex 7 😉 after seeing some new images from the Fuji im not so sure its the Nex 7 killer either..
http://www.f64.ro/blog/2012/01/20/test-fuji-x-pro1/
Image Quality?….. Nex-7? sigh…..
I am delighted at the excellent performance of the NEX 7, yet I would have hoped for more competitive results. That is, although I am a Sony shooter, I want Canon, Nikon, et al. to continue to produce top notch cameras. I want stiff competition for the NEX 7. Why? Competition is good for us all. It drives the camera companies to try harder. When they try harder, we photographers will benefit. From that perspective, I am looking forward to the release of the Fujifilm X-Pro1.
So much back & forth ! Want a chuckle – take the link to DXO mark & uncheck the NEX-7 & replace it with the NEX-5N. It even kicks the crap out of the others. Funny stuff! Sony ain’t perfect but it is making things hard for all the others.
Yep, should have been the 5N embarrassing Canon instead of the 7 embarrassing Canon.
😀
G1X uses the old 18mp sensor chopped. Of course it SUX. 7D has been around 2 and half years and this is a chopped and no doubt economized version of the sensor.
Compare GX1 with 7D and you’ll realize Panasonic is still two years behind Canon.
http://www.dxomark.com/index.php/Cameras/Compare-Camera-Sensors/Compare-cameras-side-by-side/(appareil1)/769%7C0/(brand)/Canon/(appareil2)/754%7C0/(brand2)/Panasonic/(appareil3)/619%7C0/(brand3)/Canon
“Panasonic is still two years behind Canon”
Well… the GH1 came out more than 2 years ago but has a higher DXO score than GX1 and G1X, and is almost as good as a 60D even though the 60D’s sensor is much bigger.
Canon’s 18mp is Canon’s most basic sensor while GH1 and GH2’s sensor are Panasonic’s top of the line and not in production.
Are you not forgeting that tiny fact, that 18 mpix APS-C Canon sensor is his only APS-C sensor at all? Which is one in same time one in 7D, which is supposed to be top-of-the-line APS-C camera?
And frankly, its pretty crappy sensor. 7D itself is decent camera (except some wierd AF behavoir sometimes, but occasional hard reset prevents that), but sensor is crap.
Fact that GH2 has pretty much similar performing sensor (but output itself is actually more pleasant) as 7D isnt much achievement for Canon, but its for Panasonic.
Canon needs to update its APS-C sensor true but the best Panasonic is still behind Canon’s crappy sensor.
No, that Panasonic sensor would beat the 7D for SNR when chopped at the same size. 😉
On other hand every camera using Sony 16 mpix APS-C beats every camera using Canon 18 mpix APS-C.
Last decent Canon APS-C was inside 50D (if you dont mind bit of noise) and before that in 40D. Thats quite some time now..
It really does go to show that Sony are the leaders in sensor tech. Or that Canon are deliberately further crippling their G1X against their own DSLRs by using old tech (cut down) in their ‘enthusiast compact’. Why? I really don’t get Canon’s line of thinking. Either separate on features or performance (IQ not speed performance), not both. Also they must be working on a new APS-C, so why not use a cut down version of that?
Canon make some ok stuff I guess (I’m not a fan, but I can appreciate that others might be), but I hate their attitude, deliberately holding back so they can up sell, sell expensive add-ons (GPS?) or convince people to upgrade. I know everyone does this to some extent, but I always feel like Canon are always just holding back. Things like USM and IS, instead of replacing the old model as such they just make a new more expensive version. I find that very annoying and is why I will never go Canon.
you all are full of it:) go out and take pictures, stop comparing!
🙂 i always text here during longtime exposures via my phone 😉
Oh yeah, this is not thing surprise to see canon lose money. time being canon lose money, future canon lose the crown! 😀 its just a matter of time! Canon will be the shadow of Nokia lol…
Sony please bring revolutionary improvement in new SLT fight to Apple – FujiApple 😀 lol…
I think it’s no surprise NEX-7 blew Canon G1X away giving its apparent bigger sensor. What’s interesting is G1X overally outperforms the 4/3 sensor in Panny GX1, except in the noise department. It’s a shame Canon is still reluctant to join the mirror less interchangeable crowds. Time will tell if this decision is wise.
Who has ever won by limiting their customer’s choices? If Canon forces Canon users to not go smaller with a mirrorless ILC that has a decent sensor, and that option is indeed available somewhere else, then they can only stand to lose business.
If they believe that they will keep their business stronger by not giving the option for diehard Canon fans to use their glass on a smaller system, then they will probably start to lose new customers and much more slowly lose current ones (some will inevitably want a smaller system).
I would really like to know if any company has been more successful not embracing new technology which by all accounts seems to give greater flexibility and usability to sensors (shorter flange and ability to do things without a mirror like extremely fast shutter et al..)?
I think Sony really nails it in this regard – They provide a highly regarded system which you can buy into fairly cheaply (NEX/Mirrorless). They provide a way to invest in the system and be confident in doing so because you can buy Alpha lenses and use an adapter (allowing future upgrades). And they provide cutting edge technology which pushes the bar a bit with each release. That seems like a fairly successful strategy. As long as they keep on that path they’ll be leaders shortly. Really Canon has a huge base of users which will keep it around for a long time, but the strategy seems to indicate they’ll take a back seat until they realize they need to play catch up (which isn’t the end of the world, just not exciting really).
Hopefully Sony doesn’t screw it up. I think they’ve done very well in the last few years.
Canon has already indicated they’ll release an MILC this year. They have also emphasized image quality takes precedence over down-sizing. This is a direct criticism against Nikon’s lame 1-series. Expect at least APS-C format.
Rumors indicate around the August-September Photokina period.
It’s apparent Canon still has no idea how to improve their low ISO dynamic range. Rather pathetic. They deserve to be pummeled here.
However, DXOMark data on high ISO performance can be ignored ‘cos their tests fail to uncover the massive in-camera RAW processing (shown by DPReview) that’s going on within the Nikon 1-series cameras.
@ lifeispixels: “no surprise NEX-7 blew Canon G1X away giving its apparent bigger sensor”. This statement lacks a substantive analysis of the issue.
One needs to understand how DxOMark measures the overall sensor scores. It is significant to remember that it does not directly reward a sensor for its resolution, especially so for resolutions that are already considered high enough (12 MP and above).
Now, what it means is that even if you cut the NEX-7 Sensor into half to get a 12MP sensor which is much smaller than G1X’s sensor, the resultant hypothetical Sony sensor would still receive a score fairly close to NEX-7’s, and much higher than Canon G1X’s. This is because the resultant small sensor would have the same color depth, dynamic range, and ISO performance, which are the three primary factors that affect the sensor score on DxOMark. The only difference would be a smaller resolution, which does not significantly affect the DxOMark.
Remember the DxOMark score of NEX-7 is 81, while G1X is 60. Based on the DxOMark scoring algorithm, I would not be surprised that the hypothetical half-sensor cut from NEX-7 to score above 70. If one is to completely follow the sensor size argument, you would not expect this sensor to score above 50 (because it is even much smaller than 4/3).
The bottom line: Sony sensors beat Canon sensors because Sony now has an upper hand in sensor technology. Just perhaps two years ago, this was not the case.
Not sure where your Canon report came from. But this is from Reuters:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/01/30/us-canon-results-idUSTRE80T09Q20120130
Quotes:
“Like other export-focused Japanese manufacturers, Canon, which makes 80 percent of its revenue overseas, has been hit by a strong yen and a weak economy, on top of last year’s floods in Thailand that closed a printer plant and ruptured supply lines…
Canon forecast 2012 operating profit of 390 billion yen ($5.1 billion), up from last year’s 378.1 billion yen, but some way below the average forecast of 470 billion yen from 20 analysts…
Profit in 2010 was 387.5 billion yen.”
“They’re forecasting a rise in 2012 earnings, but given the impact of exchange rates, they’re taking a harsh outlook on profits,” said Mizuho Research Institute senior economist Koji Takeuchi. “It’s not negative overall, but Canon’s indication of a cautious view will not be lost on the market.”
“Canon, which made its first camera in 1933 and now has its IXUS and PowerShot cameras competing against Nikon and Sony Corp, aims to sell 22 million compact cameras and 9.2 million interchangeable lens cameras this year, up from 18.7 million and 7.2 million, respectively, last year.
Nikon said in November it expected to sell 16 million compact cameras in the year to end-March, and 4.7 million digital SLR cameras.”
Not sure what you are talking about.
At the very least, they are still making (increasing) profits and not losses like Sony.
They lost DSLR sales in 2011 Q4 compared to one in 2010. I’m sure sales will be even smaller in 2012. SLRs are dying breed.
Canon plans to sell 9.2 million interchangeable lens cameras in 2012 (as opposed to 7.2 million sold in 2011). They did not specify how many are traditional DSLRs and how many will be MILCs. 🙂
Plans are only intentions. They had plans to surpass 2010 Q4 sales in 2011 Q4 but failed. I very doubt they will succeed in 2012 (I’m sure they will failed though :D).
Why compare Q4 alone? 🙂 BTW, show me the link that talks about this.
Regardless… they are still doing much better than Sony: SLTs fail in comparison to Pentax DSLRs and NEXs fail in comparison to Oly’s PENs.
Most importantly, Canon is making profits unlike Sony.
You got it all WRONG! Obviously, you need to improve your reading comprehension skills.
From http://thedigitalvisual.com/canons-president-to-step-down-amid-poor-q4-2011-earnings-report:
“Although the world’s largest camera maker saw an increase in net sales from Q3 to Q4 2011, their year-on-year totals fell 9.7% from Q4 2010.”
“If there’s one shining light amid the bleak financial news, it’s the continued strong sales in the DSLR sector. The company states:
Although Canon was affected by supply shortages caused by the quake and flooding, efforts to ramp up production and boost sales in response to robust demand resulted in SIGNIFICANTLY INCREASE in year-on-year sales volumes for such digital cameras as the competitively priced EOS Digital Rebel T3i/T2i/T3, along with the EOS 5D Mark II and the new EOS 60D advanced-amateur models.”
Yup, their DLSR sales are doing FANTASTIC. The drop in profits is correlated to the weak global economy and strong yen as indicated in Reuters report.
@Doodah
He didn’t get it wrong at all. It is stated in the quote you provided yourself:
“their year-on-year totals fell 9.7% from Q4 2010.”
Q3 to Q4 is also nothing surprising, it’s the Holidays. And while the article says that there is an increase of sales for certain models, it is hardly indicative of your claim of FANTASTIC sales.
@Vlad
Denis stated “They (Canon) lost DSLR sales in 2011 Q4 compared to one in 2010. I’m sure sales will be even smaller in 2012. SLRs are dying breed.”
The report from thedigitalvisual states otherwise:
“Although Canon was affected by supply shortages caused by the quake and flooding, efforts to ramp up production and boost sales in response to robust demand resulted in SIGNIFICANTLY INCREASE in year-on-year sales volumes for such digital cameras as the competitively priced EOS Digital Rebel T3i/T2i/T3, along with the EOS 5D Mark II and the new EOS 60D advanced-amateur models.”
IOW, Canon’s DSLR units sold very well. (Their closest competitor, Nikon, only managed to sell 65% of Canon’s DSLR numbers.) However, Canon’s OVERALL year-on-year sales still fell because camera phones are nibbling away their compact camera numbers. 🙂
Point. 🙂
:))))
sad there is only 3 cams can be compared – there is no place for Nikon in row – and yes Sony is playing in own league with mirrorless cam. And if there will be no Sony – look at other pretenders – all in near same level – and this is company that have much more experience in foto than Sony.
the nex 7 image quality??? maybe a iso -1000 the real deal is fujy forghet about sony its all crap, buy an a900 and you will get a camera without a lens system and ps.. minolta is not sony.. minolta is a legendary trademark and rest minolta like ricoh is not pentax
I found my peace with Sonys photografic division. I know they have a system not as good as Canon or Nikon, but I always feel sorry about the Sony-party who try to find technical singularities to demonstrate that Sony is better than Canon or Nikon. But beeing true, Sony is far away from a system that satisfys the majority of professionals.
A sensor is only a minor part!
Canikon fanboys always go on about “professionals”. Well news just in, “professionals” don’t always shoot Full Frame and the VAST MAJORITY of the market aren’t professionals anyway. It’s the same old tired argument being trotted out by the same old canikon fanboys…
good said by a sony fanboy we are all on the same boat 😀
yea if you want the best “image quality” you can schot with p&s, but if you whant that thing that today is very rare called “Quality” then… go with everyone but no sony… evf? are we kidding?
QUALITY? Go shoot better than this guy http://razooma.net/projects/ ))
P.S. Andrey Razoomovsky, one of the most called-for photographer in Russia, shoot with Alpha
o my….UGLY!!!!!!!!! simply photoshop all! oho so if i buy an alpha i must buy photoshop! (no a raw developper, a repair all program!)
What are those photos or pc graphic?? seriousy if this is a photographer i am obama
Dude, you stole my nick 😉
Thats lots of tits..
Might not be best way to show how good Sony is.
http://500px.com/viv
This might show it better. 🙂 Guy is using mostly Sony A850 + 85mm f2.8, he shot Olympus before (IMHO really good photos with Olympus).
As always its bit more about who shoots it than with what.
sony alpha nex 7 so good at low iso … from iso 400 is like a pice of mud… sony can beat only p&s from canon & Nikon & Pentax & olympus & Fuji its the shame of the modern photography with its evf and blurry optics (non zeiss)
Sony sony sony… nex are good for boys and girls…. very young boys and girls like near born
buy a canon and you can laugh from the heaven to a sony 😉 crap plastic
ahaha while others companies are annuncing the only thing sony can do is compare the crap nex 7 (way way worse than 5n) to the others by using DxO? bhiuaababa tur on television sony
I wonder how many here owns a Nex7 , the A77 and an OLED EVF.
And how many are regurgitating myths from reviews and perceptions.
Too much emotions into gears… gears doesn’t make your pictures better instantly
yea photographer is the first thing but if the camera like nex 7 suks over 10 iso you can cry
Really ? Strange I don’t find iso1600 sucks on my a77. Could be a matter of judgement , in any case , no need for brand wars here. We are here to discuss alpha mount developments .
here at zeiss city we said: zeiss for sony are zeiss class C real zeiss are for cinema not for crap mirrorles or dslr
Yeah whatever…
yeah whatever i tried nex 7 nex 5n and nex 3 …. nex 5n is way way better… nut nothing can replace a dslr im sorry but nex concept is for an average photography 1 cm camera with 1 km lens? are we joking? sony will fish with those crap
You mean you owned all 3 nex models ? Wow that’s a hefty investment . So 1 cm camera with 1 km lens isn’t photography, is 1 km body with 1 cm lens more ?
To me it all adds up to the same distance. And a matter of preference .
All are “real” Zeiss, but if someone wants “true” Zeiss, then C/Y or Contax G mount. Thats last of “true” Zeiss. And some in Hasselblad mounts.
Actually Zeiss lens for Hasselblad are probably most Zeiss-ish and in same time one of best lens in world, unfortunately bit expensive.
And for Sony Zeiss lens, at least 135mm f1.8 perfectly accomplishes what I would expect from Zeiss lens.
Why do all the trolls have TERRIBLE spelling and grammar?
I think its one sad, angsty little teenage boy commenting under several different names.
Maybe, that’s because some of “trolls” are not from english-speaking countries? As for me, english is not my native language and it’s not so easy to express my thoughts without making mistakes :))
I agree I think kinder, kira and kiosko are all the same poster. I can excuse poor english if it’s not your native tongue, but what really shows lack of intelligence is random bashing of another manufactures products just because you own the competition. No doubt in my mind that some canikon products are better than Sony, but Sony do produce some digital imaging products that are better than canikon.
Let me settle this.
You’re all wrong, you’re all Sony fanboys, not real photographers!
The original post by the webmaster came from his ass. He said I guess kings can be dethroned!
Instead of supporting photography, it cause fanboys to argue. I know photographers that would smoke 90% of the people on these forums using a disposable camera.
At the end if the day canon & Nikon will continue to be the top brands for dslr, and everything else will be a competing market.
The crux is which day you are talking about . Today, tomorrow , a month from now , even a year from now , Nikon and Canon will stay top. Will that be taken for granted ? God knows,.
Kings have been and can be dethroned . History have said so , nothing stays at the top forever.
Agreed…look how fast RIM (Blackberry) feel from grace.
Ok, Canon and Nikon are top-brands…but why top-brand Nikon use Sony sensors? Why Canon still haven’t made any crop-sensor with satisfying colours and DR? I used many cameras and lenses and see the results. And that’s why I use Sony. We are(me and my girlfriend) working as photographers. I work at 2 magazines for 2.5 years, and 1.5 of them using Alpha-system. Designers at my work love A850’s shots much more than that of D700 and 7D of my colleques because of great colours and DR, because of luck of AF misses. They’re professionals and they khow what they’re talking about.
I have dozens of photosessions every month(fashion, jewellery, interiors, weddings, and so on) and I’m pretty happy with the result I get. I have 2 A850’s, Minolta 16/2.8 fisheye, 17-35, 28/2.8, 50/1.4, 85/1.4, Sigma 105/2.8, and I can’t understand the Ones to talk nonsense like “Sony is not for professionals, Canon rules” 🙂 Tell me, what combination of any other manufacture will give the the result of A850+Zeiss 135/1.8? I see pictures from Canon 135/2.0 + 5D Mark2… Are U kiddin’?
http://www.mywed.ru/ – it’s the best wedding site in Russia. The are dozens of photographers who shoot A850/900 and get excellent results. Are they no professionals? They are much more professional, than trolls to say bullshit here. Didn’t they understand anything in cameras/lenses? Haaa!
KodaK
Don’t You like the quality? http://www.mywed.ru/photographer/detail/photo/262790/
Canon should simply offer a mirrorless full frame camera to take advantage of their massive lens range. I said so when Nikon failed to realise this while entering the mirrorless market and now I see how right I was, because people are attaching Canon lenses to E-Mount via Metabones’ adapter. Would be easy for Canon to create a mount system with short flange distance and simply add an adapter leading through the electronic contacts. Then they’d had all the freedom to continue their DSLR system plus creating new lenses for the shorter flange distance.
IMHO this is for people who KNOW they are going to be using just one or two lenses with their mirrorless camera, so that if they are happy with what G1X’s built-in lens could provide, they that’s all they need.
Not to mention one thing that kept me clear and away from NEX series is their absolutely monster sized lens. Yes, the camera is wafer thin, and it is not easy to do that. But the lens, come on, try and give us some itty bitty lens that is easier to pocket and still give us a bit of zoom range.
Also if you already use a Canon DSLR and Canon DPP for processing RAW, G1X is perfect for the times when you don’t want to carry that 1D something or 5D something around. Like when you are strolling in the park, taking a large DSLR plus a L lens is sometimes a drag… (Yeah, I know… I used to own a 5D MKII+24-105 kit)
I’m actually seriously considering selling my A55 and get G1X instead, because of a few reasons:
#1. Even if NEX-7 is better, it costs almost twice as much without lens.
#2. Yes, NEX-5N with a lens is going to be close in price, but size matters, and other than that fixed focal pancake lens, everything else is absolutely huge.
#3. Honestly, just tell me you are not drooling at G1X’s control dials, and imagine how nice it would be if your mirrorless camera could have that.
#4. Canon DPP is about a few lightyears ahead of Sony’s RAW processing software. No I don’t really feel like buying Photoshop/Lightroom, nor am I interested in finding the warez version of them on the net. If Sony could just produce something that have 80% of the ability I’d be thrilled. (I kept telling my friends to use RAW with their DSLR, and I’ve always been wondering why few non-Canon users heed the advice, I guess now I know.)
Soon to be (?) former A55 owner…
From what you have said, a high end P&S will probably suit your needs more than a DSLR/SLT if you dont like post processing and the bulk of those camera. Although, you mentioned nothing about image quality. If its just the dials etc, I agree GX1 offers better control options than the NEX5,3. Against the 7, i am not so sure. Of course G1X will be much cheaper, then again, its probably not comparable to pit the price of the 7 against it.
On #4, wonder what is the problem you find on Sony software. Generally, I didnt like all the software that comes with the camera be it Olympus, Panasonic, Canon or Sony. As non of them gives me the ease I derive from Lightroom.
Then again, it all boils down to individual preference, which is perfectly alright . Cheers
Post processing with Canon DPP when I was using 5D MK2 was a JOY, it does so much so well and so quickly, you almost thought that this software would cost you another hundred or two US dollars, but it is free. I actually bought a copy of bibble pro when I got my 5D MK2, but it was such a pain for me to use that, I go back to Canon DPP again. Lens correction is always kinda off on Bibble, not to mention it give skin tone a very disgusting red cast when processing A55 RAWs.
I’m okay with a bulky camera if it have similar image quality to 5D MK2, I only sold it to avoid the massive price crash that is sure to follow the release of 5D MK3. But I guess I sold it too early.
I got my A55 because of the very impressive ISO performance and the high burst rate. And it did that very well, I only wish it could have a better RAW processing software that comes with it. Other than that, most other complaints I have against this little gem is mostly small issues that fall into the category of “would be nice to have…”
I actually tried to go back to a few point and shoots, well, no it won’t work. Gotten spoiled by the uber high ISO performance of 5D MK2 and A55 (not as good as 5D MK2, but hey, this camera is a lot cheaper too). It just don’t work for me, the noise is just too high.
For comparing G1X against the NEX series, I only put NEX-7 in due to the content of this article. Which compares those two cameras. I personally like the more mechanical style of G1X’s setup, since everything is there, and there is no need to reference to LCD display. But hey, that’s just personal preference,
One thing I gotta wonder tho, what version of the camera was DxO testing, isn’t G1X still not released yet?
The G1X is in a different market segment to all of the NEX cameras. A complete NEX-7 system will cost twice as much as a G1X. If spending twice the money didn’t buy you a better camera, you’d be pretty upset, yes? Similarly, the G1X is now clearly the leader in terms of image quality for the compact (fixed lens) market segment. Expect others to follow suit.
In Japan, Canon was #1 in every digital camera segment that they had a presence. The only one where they have no presence in mirrorless. Is that representative of the entire world or just indicative of Japan? If it is the same the world over and if Canon didn’t make money on digital cameras in 2011 then who did? And how did they do it?
Oh no, a BARE NEX-7 costs almost twice as much as a G1X already, that’s NEX-7 without any lens. And what’s a top end body with out some good lens? I’d say it would triple the cost of a G1X if you mate NEX-7 with a suitably quality lens.
Today, the use of the name “Zeiss” on Sony lenses means nothing. Sony bought the rights to use that name on their lenses. It is a marketing ploy and nothing more. Anyone and everyone that feels that it means something or that it is somehow related to real Carl Zeiss lenses is falling for Sony’s marketing ploy and that is exactly the reason that they bought the name.
You do not know what you are talking about. Zeiss designs optics for SONY. Lenses are produced by SONY under Zeiss quality control. Lenses designed by Zeiss have unique properties. They are designed for corner to corner sharpness unlike lenses of other manufactures who prefer center sharpness. Zeiss lenses have top quality coatings.
after reading this whole thread, i see nothing but a bunch of loosers, arguing about who has the best camera..this is exactly what camera-manufacturors want to see..bravo!
I gotta complain about one Zeiss lens… 16-80 ZA… It is a lens with one of the worst manual focus ring, it is really not that good. I got it for a while, and found that lens is really not up to the Zeiss mark that it bears.
I personally feel that Sony adhere to Zeiss standard when it felt like to, and kinda sidestep the some requirements when it suits them.