Picture of the A77 has been used by Mobile01 to show you where the A99 pixels are.
The taiwan site Mobile01 (Translation here) explained how the 102 AF point system of the A99 works. As you know the A99 has a Dual Phase Detection system. There us a 39 point AF sensor that uses the reflected light from the Translucent mirror. And there is a 9×7 pixel phase detection system on the sensor itself. It’s the same 9×7 system used on the Sony NEX-5R. That makes a total of 102 AF points and eleven of them are cross point.
P.S.: Full Sony NEX-5R preorder links at AlphaCameraDeals.
64 Responses
That’s cool
NO PHOTO
Link is broken but I’ll take your word for it. So in short, Sony is using the NEX system to build their new flagship? Yikes!
Snobbish nonsense.
open non translated link in google chrome
@admin
Corrections
They say the NEX-5R uses a 11×9 = 99 Phase detect pixel on sensor
where as the A99 uses a 9 x 7 = 63 phase detect pixel on sensor.
So much for the “PRO” A99 camera!! 😛
I absolutely love my A900 with Zeiss but lately I’ve been pining over the D800 reviews. Maybe I’ll get over it once the official announcement is revealed. For now I keep hearing Sony ‘is like a box of chocolates – you never know what you’re going to get’.
Yeah, I guess it depends on what you shoot. I thought about the 800 because I really like Nikon v Canon. However, I shoot a lot of sports and inside events handheld. The 800 turns out to be too slow and now there are rumblings about the mirror slap causing image blur at less speedy shutter speeds. Saw this on a couple of forums and was even linked to Nikon’s own 800 manual stating the problem and was told to shoot as often as you can with the use of the tripod. I believe Sony will get me what I need in the 99. I love my 850 for daytime normal shooting, but is too slow like the 800 for fast moving action and auto focus accuracy in poorer lit areas will be slow and sometimes inaccurate, something that I anticipate being remedied in the 99 as well as improved high iso performance.
Thanks ‘poke’ as I really, truly, honestly needed to hear that! I do favor the Zeiss auto-focus glass for the Alpha mount but I remain skeptical as to Sony’s direction. I already knew about the tripod thing’ and I invested heavily on a RRS 33/BH55 combo. Besides, at my age with medical issues I already need a quality tripod regardless of the camera I use.
The design of my A900 is very clear with a no-nonsense approach and I guess I’d just like to see that with its replacement. Moreover, I struggle with a mere <$200 spread between the specs’ as we currently know them vs. the already proven specs/performance of the D800 series.
I cannot tell if this is good or not. Reading translation was a bit choppy. Is there any reports from people testing the camera on the speed and accuracy of the 99’s focus? Any report or leaks regarding images? 9 more days!
Not to put more thought into the matter 🙂
I had an a900, now I have a D800. Honestly, it’s no contest. The D800 has more resolution, and the high ISO when shooting RAW is EASILY 2 stops better if not more. with careful noise reduction, I have delivered images to clients at ISO 12800. with the a900 I wasn’t comfortable going above ISO 1600. as to the above, the mirror slap is not a cause for concern. It is especially well dampened in the D800. That manual states tripod use when possible because of the 36 MP. It takes a higher shutter speed (or better anchoring) to eliminate all blur at 100% view with such a high resultion: think medium format technique. I have not had any issues so far.
Saber – I am looking closely at the a99 because of Zeiss glass. They have that quality and look that I keep longing for. I missed my a900 ONLY because of the zeiss glass. That camera is a dinosaur compared to the new nikons. Like a caveman, it is slow, clunky, has poor support, and although it’s great at low ISO, it’s nothing compared to the D800.
I too am worried about Sony’s direction. Sony has zero support for professional shooters, but they have the absolute best lenses. I had to look twice as hard to find lenses and accessories that I need for Sony mount, and people frowned and dismissed me as an uncle bob when I had sony equipment. Again, I don’t want to sound overly negative, because I will be renting an a99 when it’s available (with zeiss glass). If it can at least come close to the D800 for high ISO and usability, I will gladly jump ship for those sexy lenses. It’s just all up in the air right now. I don’t want to adopt a new system and then have Sony abandon full frame development to focus on NEX cameras
Hi mattp,
Thanks for the perspective and I actually feel the same way regarding the ZA lenses for the Sony. You nailed it regarding ‘usability’ since there is more to what makes up the total platform. Honestly, I have my fingers crossed for the A99 to be the better mousetrap OVERALL, and it would be wonderful if it can focus with superior accuracy. I don’t want to give up on Sony but they do make me nervous with their consumer gimmicks mentality.
This is really surprising to me. Viewing a900 vs 5DMKII vs D800 raw file comparison on DPReview doesn’t show any significant noise differences in any of these cameras. Sure there is a little difference, but nothing I can see showing up in a print anywhere. What am I missing here?
I just checked again… LINK:
dpreview(dot)com/reviews/nikon-d800-d800e/32
The a900 actually looks better than any of them at 1600iso. Virtually no difference at 6400iso. What gives?
Make sure to set the comparison to RAW.
oops – that meant to go under Saber’s post. sorry!
I think on sensor PD sensors is for Nikon D600 and Sony NEX-VG900 camcorder.
For A99 they are not necessary, they are there just because all cameras share the same sensor.
@LEdgars
The Sony A99 sensor has a resolution of 24.3mp where as the one in Nikon D600 is rumored to be 24.7mp.So i don’t think the D600 is going to get the exact same sensor as seen in A99.
The nikon D600 has a 0.4 MP advantage over the A99,there is a good reason for it ,since the Sony is trading the 0.4mp image pixels for a 63 phase detect AF pixels.Now i believe the phase detect pixel have to of larger size in order for them to work effectively,hence the loss of 0.4mp compared to D600 sensor.
I have to read up on this I guess: does this leave ‘holes” in the image to be filled in by postprocessing?
That’s one way to put it. The phase detection pixels do no capture imaging data used for the final image. These pixels are interpolated by the use of surrounding pixels. Similar to how Nikon did it with the V1/J1 sensor.
And before people jump to the conclusion that you will notice this, remember that more than a few of our (extra hot/dead) pixels are / have been cloned out for good in a similar way at the beginning of each month…
Thanks for the explanation!
Andrea wrote both cameras will share same sensor.
My interpretation is that Sony a99 actually don’t need on sensor PDAF points. Not for AF system, may be for some marketing e.g. 102 AF points, dual or even triple (if CDAF will be used) system etc.
Of course there is no holes, but interpolated image. As Spoon answered.
ha ha ha
so much for the touted 102 af points. and btw, a single on-sensor af phase detection pixel does not equal a normal af focus point. A normal AF focus point is made up of multiple *large* pixels.
So I guess the whole talk of 102 AF points (to appear to beat the Nikon MultiCAM 3500) was just BS.
If you misinterpreted what was meant by 102 AF points, you only have yourself to blame.
Anyone with even a moderate understanding of camera technology would have realised that there wasn’t going to be 102 “classic” PDAF points.
You are, in effect, laughing at yourself.
+1
Do we know at this point how many AF points are actually selectable? They’re some more than 11 I want to hope!!
That makes 40 AF points in my book…
Fine by me as long as they are better spaced out around the frame than previous Sony cameras – need to be AT LEAST on the 3rds…
+1
102 – 63 = 39
Sorry, I’m confused : the 39 point (from T mirror) are not cross-type? Where are the “102 AF points all cross-type” ??? In burst mode the on-sensor AF points will be probabbly unusable.
No doubt 11 of the 39 PDAF (off-sensor) points will be cross type.
Only 11 cross points? Pretty lame for a new top model.
More than pretty lame (if true), but also further evidence that Sony still doesn’t get the importance of fast and accurate AF, and that single line sensors simply are not capable of doing the job in far too many practical shooting conditions. This assumes Sony hasn’t come up with some way to improve the performance of the non-cross sensors, which it hasn’t thus far and I doubt will be the case.
Except the fact that they are assisted by dozens of AF sensors on a separate plane in a way we haven’t seen before. Sounds to me that people are jumping to conclusions based on almost nothing.
It’s not that the D4 *without that extra AF plane*, fails miserably with just 4 cross sensors extra at more than double the suggested price.
Of course just assumptions…
On sensor PDAF points is much smaller and less light sensitive. They couldn’t much improve AF in low light, which is main problem for all cameras. You never know if Sony just improve sensitivity of PDAF main sensors.
Remember, they can benefit from hybrid focus system, that is supposedly as fast as pure PDAF and as accurate as CDAF as well: best of both worlds. So no real need for cross type sensors anymore.
I don’t particularly like it though, it looks pretty lame indeed, no need to utilize outdated hardware approach: there are software methods that did anything phase detection can do.
I do not understand 🙁
We all have read the rumors saying how fast the AF is on the new camera……If AF speed rumors are true, that all that matters.
We shall see
It is not just a question of speed. It’s a question of whether the system can focus on all sorts of subjects/targets. That’s one of the biggest problems with Sony’s AF systems thus far – the single line sensors cannot focus on far too many subjects, making them useless. It doesn’t matter how fast the camera may focus on the “easy to focus on” subjects, if there are too many situations where the camera has problems achieving focus at all. That’s the big problem with the lack of cross sensors, at least to date. Whether or not the new system in the A99 can overcome these deficiencies, without apparently increasing the number of cross sensors (based on the rumor) remains to be seen. I certainly hope that the new system is a significant improvement, but fear that it may be more marketing hype than practical improvement.
Yes, I shoot a850 and use both of the f2.8 Zeiss zooms and the 85 and 135 prime and the 70-200 f2.8 G and do notice problems compared to my Nikon d700 partner using any of these lenses. Friday I was at a pre-performance stage event for photographers and battled to get focus lock, something I don’t experience with the Nikon at the same lighting levels.
I hope Sony has this working better with the a99 and even better by the time the rumored 2013 full-frame ships.
Guys! Let’s wait Sony’s explanation of how this system works. Who knows, maybe one even non-cross point assisted by for example 4 on-sensor points will work better than ordinary cross/dual cross…
By the way, maybe on-sensor points help to avoid front/back-focus, who knows?…
I find it funny to follow the outcry that it will not be 102 “real” AF points. And even some jump to say it will only be 11 cross type points. And then someone starts to comment on that, as if it was a fact.
The 39 ‘normal’ PDAF points would be not so bad in themselves. Backed up by 63 on-sensor points and CDAF, why not hope it will be great ?
A77 has 19 points (15 cross), A900 has 19 points (9 cross).
So, I am guessing somewhere btw. 20 and 30 of the normal PDAF points will be cross type.
A77 has 11 crosses, not 15. A850/900 has only 1 (double) cross.
Denis, you beat me to it.
Sorry?
Correcting the info about the A77 and A900 AF systems and the number of cross sensors.
No way the A99 will even have 15 cross points. My biggest fear is Sony might layout all 39 sensors as in previous SLT cameras.
I’ve been very much looking forward for the A99, but if there would be only 11 cross-type AF points, that’s a deal breaker!
5d mark iii has 41 cross-type points, what’s up with that??
When I heard about 102 AF points I thought Sony was going to finally deliver the best AF system. But 11 AF? That’s less than the old 7D I sold a long time ago to switch to Sony…
Welcome at Sony!
Sarcasm? 🙂
Where did you read 11 crosstype only?
It will have 9×7 cross type on sensor + extra on the SLT-AF-module. In total it will be 102, which comes from 63 cross on sensor + 15 crosstype on SLT-AF-module in total you will have 78 cross type !
Read the corresponding Sony patent, before you make a statement like this. 😉
Lets see how it actually works before we call it a failure.
😉
You are blaming the camera you never see.
The link is broken…
But there is something I could not understand…
Why double PDAF ???
Usually PDAF + CDAF (Nikon V1, Nex5R & 6) is of interest because of Speed (PDAF) + precision (CDAF)
But why double PDAF ???
Because A-mount lenses not optimized for CDAF, in e-mount world CDAF optimized lenses is the very good reason to implement PDAF + CDAF.
what lens is that?…new lens?
NEX-5R with LA-EA2 should have PDAF + on-chip PDAF + CDAF!
Anyone to try this out?
But why the price?
I’d rather have 2 super new cameras coming soon too.
I know. That’s pretty expensive nowadays. Considering Panasonic has one coming with excellent video production in GH3. Then the Nikon D600 for about 1,500 rumors. Also from Canon. I think I’ll settle on GH3 if it’s suppose to be the fastest focus. Then slap a fast lens.
I always use one focus point. Center.
Me too.
….but thats only because none of the others work very well & are in the wrong position anyway…. 🙂
Sony= gimick personified.
Sony is just so wrong. They don’t get what actual photographers want. Instead, they are making dumbed down, gimmicks-loaded cameras for snapshooters pretending to be photographers. This 102-AF point hype is another example. 102 the big number! 102 yes but only 63 on sensor but only 11 cross-type.
I hope they at least don’t blow it in the IQ department as they did with the A77…
We don’t know if it’s a gimmick or not until performance is tested.
I have yet to encounter an on-sensor PDAF system that worked well at wider apertures. The sensors are just too small to have a long enough baselength.
Maybe by using a dual system they are able to tune the off sensor points to a longer baselength than normal for more accuracy and use the on sensor points for speed. We shall see, I guess.