Keep your feet and hopes on ground. This one comes form a new anonymous source so take it with a grain of salt. The sources said Sony will launch one new Full Frame E-mount camera at Photokina. And it will not be an A9 or other A7 series camera. It will be a Full Frame NEX-5 alike camera with no built-in EVF and priced very low (close to $1,000). The interesting thing of such a news is that this would be the cheapest Full Frame camera ever released and at $1,000 ( or little above) it would start to compete and eventually eat up the APS-C market share. And it would be the tiniest FF camera ever made too!
Until now trusted sources didn’t tell me about such a camera but we know that Sony patented such a camera design last year (article here).
———
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SR1=probably fake rumor
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SR3=50% chance it is correct
SR4=rumor from known sources
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0 Responses
They need to release more lenses and faster ones, too. Otherwise I am not interested in the moment.
Sounds great! Will it have a quiet shutter is the $1000 question! 🙂
No it will not have a quiet shutter unless they have a brand new processor which with faster readout. A lot more bandwith is needed for that., a lot of extra heat, too.
Even if had it would have a lot of jello effect in the result as it is a big sensor with more rolling shutter (much worse than the m43 cameras)
Maybe one day global shutter will come recording in RAW video, and no need for mechanical shutter but not now.
On the A7 the most annoying thing for me is the the magnification is too slow to select for MF or AF, so I would happily trade the EVF for a touch screen.
But that that price range (if they make it) they will leave out the touch-screen to make sure there is leeway from the next model. A big shame.
In that case, the prices of A7 will drop further before they take it out of production to come with a A7 mkII.
It’s compact until you add a lens. 😉
Compact = RX in my book.
lol, Sony. I love it, but people will hate it. “muh lenses”
a5: a7 – viewfinder + 1080p XAVC-S ? maybe silent shutter?
hopefully this is real and it drives the used prices down on the a7. It’s already close to $1k, just needs a kick.
No silent shutter unless it uses A7S sensor… unlikely.
People will hate it for a reason.
The most important thing when taking photos is the lense, the second important is the camera.
You choose your camera by the lenses you want to use.
The NEX System always did, since it exist, save on the lenses.
So its a camera system which is all about the camera and not the lense.
Even their compact cameras use faster lenses (The RX10 have an 24-200 f/2.8) and some lenses just will never exist.
For example the SAL70400G2 is one of the best lenses sony does have in its range, but it would be unuseable on the A7 due to missing stabilisation and if Sony would bring out this lense for e-mount, it would have f/8
Not all people hate it, only the one who actually take care of the photo they want to make and not just overjoy on how tricky and technically the camera is.
“Oh look how tiny it is, it also have an Full-Frame Sensor”, “Yeah but can you take good photos with it?”, “I dont care, look how tiny it is!”
You can use almost any lens you want on the a7 cameras. I don’t see why having a camera line focused on bodies is a bad thing in this case.
If someone completely overlooks the fact that the small flange to sensor distance allows the use of just about any legacy or other system lens you can think of, then this statement is true.
However, if people aren’t using adapters for legacy lenses, I’m not sure why they need a mirrorless anyway. It seems like they’d be better off with a DSLR.
without lenses it has no use. 14mm 2.8+ 24mm 1.4+35mm 1.4+ 50mm 1.2+85mm1.2…..then sony is serious. For now sony seems like childeren playing around. At least convince sigma to make lenses for emount!!!! Are they really incapable of making decent lenses? Btw i also have 2 nex cameras but am not happy without native lenses.
There are unlimited options for lenses on the E-mount. Adapters take you wherever you want to be.
I’m using my A7 with a 35mm 1.2 and absolutely loving the results.
You can also use canon camera with most other lenses. Thats not the point i want autofocus for photography. For now sony is still for amateures…..for video a7s seems to be a good option though
AF is for pussies. I shoot everything on MF lenses and the photos have more to them than those made by those milions of clicking monkeys…
I shot everything with MF. weddings, concerts, happenings, models and AF wouldn’t make none of them better, just flatter, emptier and without soul…
pavolsebo.com
I once got by hand on mirror solid lens from a rifle sight. I couldn’t use it on NEX because it’s backfocus is about 2 mm T.T
You are so right, I looked at Canon and they have all those lenses! They are so serious, but are yous seriously willing to pay $7786 for those lenses? And do you promis not to complain when those lenses are big and heavy when they come?
And look at Nikon, they are not serious as they do not offer a 85mm f/1.2 (best is 85 f/1.4). So Canon is the only camera maker that is serious!
For your information here are the lens prices for the mentioned lenses:
Lens Canon Nikon
14mm 2.8: $2359 $1700
24mm 1.4: $1749 $2640
35mm 1.4: $1479 $1619
85mm 1.2: $2199 $1599 (f/1.4 for Nikon)
——— ——–
total $7786 $7558
My Friend you don’t need to buy every lens available. Some like 24mm ( me ) some like 35mm more. The difference between 85mm 1.2 and 1.4 is not great. I’ll be more than happy with 1.4. Quality comes with some draw backs…price and weight. But if you want you should have the option. For filming the auto focus is not essential…though nice for family films etc. Photography which remains the real money maker for these companies is something else, manual focus is a hassle. If we would have some options not all just a few high quality lenses sony will be a winner. Without lenses no sane photographer in most segment would use sony just to have 400 grams less weight and have to use a adapter and focus manually.
Hope sony rehinks their strategy by not producing so many camera and almost no lenses. Make a few lenses and you only need a few camera’s which will keep their ground for a few years. Nikon has great lenses too….12-24mm is one canon doesnt have
farhad, if you don’t need to buy every lens available, then why do you insist that a company carries ALL those lenses? If the lenses YOU need are present, why do you have to complain that other lenses are not part of the system, even when you admit that you would not be buying them?
Quality comes with “drawbacks” indeed, like you said – price and weight especially. So you are willing to give up those things in order to get good quality? Awesome! So how come you are insisting to use the e-mount system? If weight is not an issue, why not use a-mount cameras? You’ll have a ton of top-quality glass available for your choosing. I am sure you are familiar with the a-mount Zeiss offerings, I don’t need to enumerate.
Your demands and expectations make sense only in your own head.
Sorry but this does not make sense at all! You name some lenses that Canon and Nikon have in their line up and tell that those lenses are needed to be serious in photographing. But there are people out their, very serious in photogrphing, using a camera with fixed lens, with only one FL (like the RX1, the Fuji X100, the Sigma DP series etc. Yo tell that those people are not serious in photography?
Then there are people using their camera to take pictures of wildlife or BIF, both very seious in photography, but only buy a system with large telelenses.
Then you tell that Manual Focus is a hassle for still photography, but it is OK for video? You know it is the other way arround, as when filming you have to change focus constantly, but when doing stills you can take your time focussing, or even prefocus and take the time taking the still… Many mirrorless users have many MF lenses and are not complaining, some even use them to shoot BIFs….
Then you say sony have to rethink their stratagy, but is that true? The said out loud that they will have at the end of this year 10 FE lenses and at the end of Next year 15! If that will be the lenses that you want or not we have to wait and see, but for now Sony is doing not bad. The mirrorless system is just 8 month old and it has some of the best lenses out there (like the 70-200 f/4, the 55mm f/1.8, the 35mm f/2.8)
(my replies to you suddenly disappeared, so I will repeat myself here)
Farhad, you are perpetuating myths about Sony. What do you mean by Sony not having decent lenses? Out of five FE lenses (the system we are talking about here), three are excellent and two are… well, decent. Also, why is it up to Sony to force Sigma to make lenses for them? That Sigma statement from yesterday is a joke, they didn’t have a problem making APS-C lenses, now they are complaining about what exactly?
You are complaining about no lenses for a system that got released half a year ago, the single mirrorless system that released that many lenses in its first months. Your assumption that photography is the money maker for these companies is at best random. The money makers are the cameras and video is today an integral part of them. And while manual focus might be a hassle for you, Sony has the best tools for it.
I said this exact thing when talking discontinuing of NeX-5T last week. 5T replacement, full frame, $1000. That’s why a5000 / a6000 the 5T replacement will be the A5.
This will be only a matter of time when Sony does this. It could be at Photokina, it could be later, but very soon we will see FF-cameras with <999dollar price-tag. And that will shake the market even further.
Is it the rumored Nex-5T successor? http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/sr4-nex-5t-discontinued-in-july-replacement-to-come-in-september/
I hope, that it will not be instead of A99II, many people waiting — and really in great need
… in great pain really.
Yeah, my a99 could stop working every moment! If Sony doesnt releasy an a99II i have to go for an D800 or 5D3
Yes because you won’t be able to buy another A99 if that happens… of which the 5D3 and D800 were also alternatives when you bought it last time.
If it stops working suddenly (very unlikely) you can send it in for repair. And if having your camera is mission critical you should have a second body on hand for such emergencies.
Thats not an option, i will have to sell all sony gear than and buy a canon then.
My only hope is that Sony releases an a99II
When the A99II comes out though, your A99 will instantly be rendered obsolete and will no longer take great photos. Are you sure you want this to happen???
errrr why is this rumour posted as FT2 as opposed to SR2?
Because these rumor sites are run by the same dude^^
stop asking random questions
nice but no need to have sony…onyl helps to reduce the price of ff cameras continously…..
We want: better af, more FE lenses (good performing ones!) macro, wide angle primes 24, faster 35, macro, tilt and shift, teleprime/portraiture prime 85/135, better flashes, no raw compression, no shutter shake problems etc….nobody wants adapter to put on a moutn lenses could be only a short solution…..bulk is like carriying a dslr with even more compromise af etc….
want A8 or if just only one model above the a7 then….. a9 with all possible technical features state of the art
Built in wifi
built gps
36 mpx
different options to choose with regard to size, quality, raw format (24 mpx, 16px)
5-6 burst rate
1/8000
1/320 flash sync
base iso 50 (real)
double sd card
IS stabilisation (like a99 and omd) 5 axis
4k video internal recording
no raw compression (without any)
weather sealed
evf like fuji xt1 (2 screen option manual focusing/magnification)
stronger battery
long exposure live bulb mode 60 s as omd em1
panorama mode/stitching
continously firmware updates
much better af system (phase detection or dual) like canon 70d or a7
real silent /quiet mode
you can build niche and cameras with different features for several purposes if some people like carrying two or more cameras or even investing in different systems for different purposes ok….
but the majority of users would love to have one camera one system with sustainability/long temr use..
Price doesn matter 5000 US dollars, 5500….doesnt matter could easily justify the price for this kind of camera….”the camera all you need” no compromise anymore” no carrying more than one camera…”simply perfect”…..just ideas for advertisement…..
if it has these features and you build the apporpriate lens line up it will sell like hot cakes …
it is so easy to develop and construct a bestseller if you want…..unbeilevable……
time will tell…
Sorry, but a $6000 mirrorless camera won’t sell “like hotcakes.” Sounds fun, though.
I think you’re almost completely off the mark here. You’re looking for features which are simply never going to make it into one camera, let alone a system as new as FE. Additionally, you’re looking for a completely fleshed out lineup of lenses such as that found in a long established system like Nikon or Canon. This is a new system which will take some time to develop for. In the mean time, many many users are enjoying the benefits of a short flange to sensor length and adapting very good and relatively cheap legacy lenses. In my opinion, this is one of the defining factors which separate the Mirrorless systems from DLSRs and a huge selling factor. You’ve dismissed it completely as something nobody wants to deal with, but if you look at many of the photos taken with E frame cameras, you’ll see that quite a few people are taking advantage of it and getting really great results.
It sounds to me as though you want just another DLSR. The Mirrorless system has it’s own set of advantages and disadvantages, and it’s pretty clear the disadvantages outweigh the advantages for you.
YES! I’M CRYING!! I HOPE THIS IS REAL
Wow, if this is true, it will be an instant buy! I already have the A7R and a bunch of older NEX cameras, but this is the one I’ve been waiting for!
Same.
Sony Alpha 7000? The real NEX-7 Replacement.
With what exactly? Sick of ‘real NEX-7 replacement’ comments. Does that LOOK like a NEX-7 to you?
More that the NEX 7 was an ultra premium CSC, ahead of the curve, this camera has the potential to do the same again. The Alpha 6000 doesn’t bring anything out of the ordinary, and the A7 series, whilst great and I love mine, are significantly above the $1000 price bracket.
Doesn’t bring anything out of the ordinary? I think you should look again to be honest. NEX-7 didn’t sell well, A7 sells much better even though it’s more expensive. The market for a premium version of what they already have (basically an expensive reshelled a6000 is hardly going to be a big seller).
If you bring NEX cameras on the market in such a big amount, where the cheapest is 300$ and all the rest lies under 800$, the most interesting being around 550$, who will buy a NEX-7 then, which is a real expensive camera with features that target manual work with hybrid lenses and adapters as much as AF work with top notch Sony and Zeiss lenses. If NEX-7 has been at 850$, it had sold as well. The average family father that shoot family shots or tourist remembrance shots only, will not buy a NEX-7 anyway. But for those who use NEX-7, the only possible replacement is a camera with 2 command reels, and here it doesn’t matter if they are both on the back or one in the front and one in the back like on common DSLR’s.
A 6000 is crippled camera, the useless program reel is on the wrong place while you need to bend the thumb to use command reel, if you use rear direction reel for command work, the work becomes even more crippled, the EVF is low resolution, and for the rest, except AF speed, new Bionz engine, and better menu system, and, not to forget, a better pricing, there is nothing that goes beyond the usual evolution in camera technology. The lower sales on NEX-7 show clearly who the mirrorless market is targeting, in DSLR style, the A77 took it widely over the A65 which sold bad compared to the flagship.
Now to rectify your comment, A7 sells badly, only A7R sold excellent and in larger amount, and this lasted until people discovered it’s disadvantages, you can buy used ones in all price ranges on e-bay yet. Sony struggles to sell the A7, the 36 mpix is what calls people to buy, not the 24, and beside that, making an inferior quality of the body front on A7 was to my opinion not a very smart idea that Sony had. You can get the A7 body for 1250$ online and 1450$ with the kit lens.
If you’re expecting every camera Sony releases to be revolutionary, you probably have expectations which are unrealistic. The A6000 is a great update to the lineup. It could use some better controls, but by all accounts it’s not what you’ve made it out to be.
they need to improve body material which doesn’t fell plasticky, add a few $$$ to price — that’s what is needed. seriously, how can $650 A6000 be replacement for $1200 NEX-7? :))
60 Megapixel Medium Format with 24-70 f/2.0 which fits into my pcket and you bought me!
you know thats not possible because of….physics 😉
Sony is able to break the law of physics, im sure 😀
The MF sensor part alone may not fit in some small pockets. Even with a liquid lens it would be too big to be pocketable.
why? isn’t 60×45 mm smaller than a business card?
A camera is more than just a sensor. Additionally, the flange distance necessary for medium format probably makes pocketability unfeasible.
The width & height are about business card dimensions but the sensor housing and associated connectors, etc, make it quite a bit thicker than business card.
Knowing Sony, you will probably have that in a few years.
I’m suspicious about this rumour. I can’t imagine that dropping the EVF would reduce the price by $700… I’m more apt to believe a price point of $200-$300 under the A7 as an entry-level FF body
You have to think the opposide way. Sony makes huge income with that cameras, so that automatically means they sell them for much much more than they cost in production.
They could sell the A7 for 700$ less without making minus, so why not drop the EVF in addition?
I’m still doubtful. That’s a massive price drop and I suspect Sony’s margins aren’t that rich. Don’t get me wrong, I’d love to see a FF at this price range. I’m just not getting my hopes up.
Well, the a99 dropped from 2800 to 1800 in germany and sony still makes prophit with it.
Thats 1000€ and they still make prophit! I cant beleive they ever sold it for 2800 😀
Just think about the 13’000 € for the SAL500 or the 7500 € for the SAL300, all absolutely unrealistic prices.
Canon build such lenses _with_ image stabilisation (sony saves up on that) and still sell them for less.
I think you have no idea how extremely overpriced Sony in fact is
I thonk.you have no idea how product manufacture works. None whatsoever.
I have, what now? Is this conversation stuck? Do you have knowledge how product manufacture works?
It seems like you dont have any knowledge yourself and just bluffed i dont have also so we can argue about something no-one knows if its true.
But seems like i crossed your plan 😀
Saying you have doesn’t make it so. Perhaps you should look up COGS (what you are talking about) vs Revenue vs Gross Profit vs Net Profit. You can’t sit there and say ‘they make loads of money on each camera’, when in fact they aren’t actually making money. This comes down to LOTS of factors, ones that you are not considering in a simple COGS vs selling price.
You haven’t ‘crossed’ anything, you have yet to prove you have any understanding whatsoever about making and selling a product. Just typical internet drivel.
Since the A7/R were released some time ago and that now Sony know what part of the R&D is covered they can push the price down, combined with saving the cost of EVF and assuming they did well with A7/R sales it should be doable.
When companies release a new camera there is a huge risk they might not recover the R&D costs and they insure themselves with higher launch prices.
Well, Sony never ceases to surprise us. Photokina is some months away. Hopefully more rumours from existing sources will surface 🙂
This was patented by Sony just after the launch of A7/R… It is VERY likely to be coming. In Japan the 5R was the best selling mirrorless, not just for Sony, but overall. They only have the a5000 which is really a 3N successor, this will replace the 5T as the top end compact E Mount.
I’m certain a sub-$1k FF is coming as well and I’ll be lining up for when that happens. This price point would really make FF affordable to the masses. I’m more apt to believe it when existing rumour sources corroborate this one.
There is also the a6000. It’s gotten great reviews so far.
It might also get the 16:9 LCD from the APS-C Alpha cameras, which imho are not as good as the LCD from the A7 models. But it will never be touch-screen so the slightly slow and awkward handling remains.
Despite all the handicaps it would still be a great camera as long as that huge sensor in a small body can work reliably. But it is an FT2 so…
Yeah, they’d need to cut corners where they can. I agree a cheaper LCD would make more sense to cut costs.
Cheaper LCD is quite okay as long as the good old FDA-EV1S is attachable.
Look at it some other ways, the price difference between NEX-5n and NEX-7 weren’t dissimilar. Also the FF sensor adds around say, $250-300 of the cost (not even that) so being a couple hundred more than 5T wouldn’t be a stretch.
I’d be curious to know how much smaller you could go with an FF ILC body. Would an rx1 sized body with e-mount be practicable?
Or just give us RX1 with 24mm and 50mm lenses, I could do most of my photography with those.
I’d struggle not to buy a 50mm RX, especially if it’s reasonably fast and stabilised.
That would work for me too.
For me RX1 with 85mm 2.0/1.8/1.4 would do it. Sharp wide open and great image quality.
Only bad news are good news…..;)
1. problem of all camera companies the leaders and managers/management
dont use their own products and cameras, no idea of customer
wishes…..why? less time? should have time for playing with your own
and products of your competitiors…you would learn a lot of
deficiencies, lack of features ….
2. the decision makers/
leaders/ management in every company/ camera comapanies as well only
focused on short term results/short cycle assessment and money not on
long temr success, customer retention/satisfaction, long term positive
image….you could save money and it could be a much more profit and
benefit with more forcusing on long term success even if you gain less
money on the short term but you could earn more on the long temr view
through customer satisfication/retention, less advertisement marketing
is needed (due to the well known brand and quality high products like
porsche, leica etc.)
3. engineers/product developers (lenses,
flashes, cameras etc.) have no or less power in the decision making
process of releasing products or nobody of these people sittign in the
leading (and finally decision-making) management…..
the head of
the company and the decision makers are full of: marketing gurus,
accounters, bankers, business administration, lawyers….etc.
sadly
and wrongly no engineer, product devoloper etc….who could tell them in
some cases please wait one month the product will be much better (less
bugs etc.)…..
Sustainability/long term thinking/long time cycle
assessment can be more worth than you might think…..even for your
balance sheets………..
The (economy is the) world will probably never change,……
Sorry for typos….i apologize too fast too lazy to correct 😉
Tl;dr
Sorry, I gave up after the first paragraph. It was like reading somebody else’s notes taken from a college marketing lecture. Unreadable.
Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah, blah blah blah blah blah blah blah etc. Sorry for the typos.,
good that you know the Sony bosses personally and know what they are doing after work. Oh and of course Sony doesn’t have engineers blah blah blah. Their engineers are excellent but Sony’s marketing is bad. That’s the truth 😉
noooow we’re talking… if it will be good, I might sell my A7 for that :>
if it gets NEX-7 body style with EVF, then yes, if it has no EVF, they can keep it.
Right now I am very, very tempted by the A6000, considering it pretty much the perfect crop sensor camera. My biggest issue with the previous generations of mirror-less cameras was AF speed and this is now beautifully resolved in the A6000. However, I am also tempted to stretch my budget just a bit more and get an A7 to experiment with full frame.
An A6000 clone with full frame sensor and budget price would be the best option to resolve this.
fast AF speed, but with a limited amount of lenses that support this pdaf system.
Do you have any source for this info, my understanding is all Sony & Zeiss e-mount lenses support the A6000 PDAF. The only other e-mount AF lenses are the Sigma 19mm/30mm/60mm and I don’t have a reason to think these don’t support PDAF as well, since the E-mount spec is open to all manufacturers.
Go Sony, do it!
Any sign of a FF a-mount announcement at Photokina (or just before)? A lot of people are waiting for this (and of course MORE LENSES) 😉
Definitely up for more lenses. A 90mm Zeiss macro?
Well considering there are 5 more this year including a macro does that count? I’m not sure why people.keep repeating this when it’s a known quantity.
He was talking about A-mount.
A-mount is in need of a new 90/100mm macro. No reason to by the ageing Sony 100mm when the cheaper and superior Tamron 90mm and Sigma 105mm exist.
So three macro choices is not enough?
Well I was really referring to a Sony branded macro. It needs to be very good though – G or Zeiss quality.
this is a drawing only, so nothing concrete. Now, I don’t know if I should once more talk about this in a NEX-7 body, since many of us await a replacement for our camera.
PS: please stop now talking again about the same old a6000 stories.
Sigh
should i laugh or should I cry? Seems to me you have the same problem.
accept the fact that a6000 is a much better camera than nex-7.
And that the NEX-7 replacement already exists… The A7.
you walk beside your shoes, don’t you?
7 billions of humans have 7 billions of opinions, and for each the only one that counts is his own.
I make MF shots only with hybrid lenses, so in what should then a6000 be, in my view, a better camera. It has 24 mpix, like NEX7, same focus peaking, reels and commands on places where you need to bend the thumb to reach them when working manually, and one command reel less that has been replaced by the useless program dial reel and installed on the false position, and a tiny bit lower dynamic range on the sensor. Now, the only better point I see is the new Bionz engine, but that’s all.
A better camera, …..well, if you say it, why should I dare call you a liar. It’s your point of view and opinion, not mine. Enjoy then a6000, since it’s a better camera than NEX-7. Yes, yes, you said it, didn’t you?
Now, imagine a 6000 electronics, sensor, AF, and a NEX-7 body, then i would say, a6000 is the better camera. Sorry it did not happen, but I do not blame you for that.
I really wish Sony puts full-frame sensor into a NEX-7 body.
Not going to happen.
I would buy a NEX5 FF for $1000 in a heartbeat. Hell, I’d get my husband one too.
Sony is going the Nex-5 route again, but with a FF sensor. They will add a touch-screen in the next generation, then a wheel dial on the next model…
Don’t think so. It will have controls closer to 5T and RX1 than going back to NEX-5 (original).
While I’m not too excited about the size, the “lowest priced FF” got my attention.
As another poster said, I hope features don’t come bit by bit. We all want fast AF, touch screen, buildin flash, wifi/NFC, etc
Haha, I happen to want none of that, but want EFC and a good burst speed.
Just a hunch based on technological and marketing constraints, but I wouldn’t bet on the A5 having a burst speed over 3-6 fps.
Of course, I have the same hunch, I’m just saying those are the features I want. But, quite frankly, I don’t think this model could meet any of my needs, except for the FF sensor and the most possibly better looking body(compared to the a7).
I hope it does not eat up the whole APS-C market. FWIW, I prefer APS-C, even at equal price.
Don’t woryy. Not everybody will be in a mood to buy expensive lenses. The A6000 is an incredibly competitive product (I am saying this as a m43 and Nikon FF user).
No EVF?? No Go! Tsk, tsk!
It probably wouldn’t be for me (unless they can develop a series of pancakes to make it pocketable), but I can see some people going for it.
Already owning an A7 this is not a big concern, as the A7 obviously has EVF. The gain on this rumored product would be to have a nice compact in an A6000 type form factor but one that transcends the APS-C with FF. Being that I regard video shooting just as important as photography, not having an EVF for tracking, and quasi-tripod-like support with tucked elbows, etc., only live view, this design will be a ‘no go’ (presuming in fact such a camera comes to fruition and then without EVF in the first place). The A6000 would still be the winner as a sidekick, E-mount-equipped second body.
Pancake would be nice but I doubt it trying to accommodate the FF sensor. I bought a 16-50mm as a separate lens in fact for when I want more compactness over the standard larger 28-70mm FF kit lens on the A7. In addition to compactness, being APS-C, I also gain 1.5x crop effectively giving me a 42-105mm zoom in a compact form.
As for me, I find fixed EVF is an unacceptable limitation to the point of being useless: I used to use the camera in different positions, the back tilted LCD is the way to go in most cases.
In bright light, no EVF? no thank you. Having to hold a camera like one is steering an automobile to shoot video, introducing instability as well, and especially for an extended period of time? Further, no thanks. As the old saying goes, ‘Different strokes for different folks’. There are obviously non-EVF / OVF solutions. Perhaps this rumored solution if it comes to fruition might be just for you.
The articulating screen of course is also useful and do use it as well both photos and video, in certain situations. But, I don’t want that to be my ONLY solution. I prefer Panasonic’s version which is more universal and not restrictive like Sony’s vertical up and down only articulating screen. But, that’s Sony and I doubt Sony will change their design philosophy any time soon.
It is generally a bad idea to shoot in that bright light. And it is a google glass alike gadged that is the way to go for VF, not that fixed crap IMO.
What is the advantage of full frame compared to what the a6000 offers?
Big, fat lenses that absolutely do not correspond to the (tiny) camera body …
And that’s supposed to be an advantage.
I’ll wait for the Panasonic-Fujifilm organic sensor.
If the Panasonic-Fujifilm sensor is full frame, you’ll still have the same issue with lenses. Personally, I don’t think the lenses are all that disproportionate, but I use mostly legacy manual focus lenses as I find it more enjoyable.
People are pinning so much onto the Panasonic organic sensor tech that it’s getting surreal. It isn’t magic, nor is it going to let us break the laws of physics.
SEL55F18Z is the advantage. 😉
True Focal Lengths and shallower depth of focus. Same as any other FF vs APS-C advantages.
If this is like an A6000 with a FF sensor,this is what I’ve been waiting for.
I’ve been holding onto my Fuji S5 and Nikon lenses all this time, waiting for something like this to upgrade to.
If Sony releases this along with several competitively priced lenses (current ones are too expensive compared to canikon IMO), this could be the move that helps their market share rise considerably., not just this year, but for many years to come.
FF without EVF? How to take photos under strong sunlight?
Ask that to the owners of the RX1. Also fullframe, also no (in-built) EVF.
Hope it is not the optional external EVF or use hand to shade the LCD, coz that really defeats the purpose.
How does it defeat the purpose? If you want a larger FF MILC with a built-in EVF, I have good news for you – the A7 and A7R are available to purchase right now.
In the case of the RX1, the answer is they purchase a viewfinder, but what’s the answer for this rumored camera? Can a viewfinder be added, if not it’s a POS.
In my case, my answer was to NOT purchase the RX1 (well, actually returned it.. twice!)
Please Sony, make an Integrated EVF version (even the Middle Hump would be OK)!
APS-C without EVF? How to take photos in bright sunlight?
No EVF? Here’s a solution for you, go buy the A7/A7s/A7r. Not everyone needs an EVF. If this camera is released and does allow for an external EVF, it will probably be some sort of new one which will be expensive. My thinking is it won’t be compatible with the EV1S viewfinder for NEX-5N/R/T. Maybe they put a hotshoe on this camera and you can use the RX1 EVF?
Same as RX1…add on EVF. This could be another “we can do it” type of camera. This could be the “5n” of the FF E mounts.
“Hey, check this out…we can make an even smaller FF camera…look at this! Ah yes, it will be an add on EVF…like the RX1/RX100m2.”
We can’t do it.
Where’s add-on rangefinder? Where’s add-on flapping SLR box?
Where’s removable AA/IR filter?
Why I can’t modify Linux on the camera?
Point camera at the subject and press button.
So now it has become a point and shoot camera 🙂
oh wait, do DSLRs make a picture if you point them and press shutter, don’t they?
Nex 5 format is too small to handle comfortably and ergonomically, especially with full frame glass. At least, I would prefer the Nex-7/A6000 body style.
Not true. The FE 35 and 55 lenses are very light, as examples.
For you, maybe. I use my NEX 5R mostly with FF lenses, everything from compact Contax G up to the big FD 70-210/4.
Plenty of folks have said that the A7 is too small for FF glass. If these cameras are too small for you, get a DSLR.
This isn’t true at all unless you have really huge or really small hands. It’s practically the same size as the NEX-7/A6000 with just a tiny difference between them.
This is a great idea. Sony is once again demonstrating its willingness to innovate in a camera market that is becoming increasingly stale.
I think this camera will be sold for well under $1000.00, and will probable pressure Canon, and Nikon into developing sub-1K DSLR cameras in order to effectively complete.
Sony should have done this a while back by putting a Full Frame sensor in the A33/A55 Style bodies they would have sold like hotcakes!
– FT2? New ratings system?
– Smaller than RX1?
No I think this is a rating system from another site…the admin could be running more than one rumor site and accidentally mixed up the rating system…
Body lone (if you take the RX1 body without lens) maybe about the same size? That would still be pretty small.
I tried one day to put my 24-70FE Zeiss zoom on my nex-5R, and it looked very unbalanced.
Anyway, it is still usable, and even if you lose most of the “size” advantage, you will still have some gain of lightness. But I think it would have been a good idea to keep the EVF.
You never actually lose that size advantage, as you can always take the lens off and use one of the pancakes. That’s what I don’t get about this argument. The NEX series may not look balanced when paired with a long lens, but they don’t have to be paired with a long lens. Aside from that, it’s nice to have a camera that can fit in a pocket with a pancake lens or tackle more serious long lenses with ease.
I really don’t get this ‘balancing’ story… I have 5n and mostly use it with old MF lenses. The balance is great – most of the weight is in the left hand (at the side of the lens), and shots are very steady. On the other hand, i used d7000 for some time (I guess that it’s a ‘balanced’ camera), and I would always get a pain in my right wrist quickly, because i was twisting the heavy camera body towards the lens.
Oh…” it will not be an A9″…where do I put this money
No way!
Comes out from a Four Thirds source?
Does FT stand for “Fantastic Tale” or something to that effect?
Tiny body, huge lenses, again…
Some will be big, some will be compact.
It really isn’t a valid complaint. Nobody complains about large telephoto lenses being too big for DSLRs. Lenses being out of proportion to the bodies to which they are attached is a fact of life.
It’s more than a fact of life, it’s a fact of physics. Those who believe you can have whatever focal length you want in a small and light pancake but who also want OSS and every other modern feature under the sun are deluded and are looking for the unobtainable.
It comes off more as whining about something in order to convince yourself that you don’t really need something than valid criticism.
Is it that bad or you just being a drama queen? –> http://camerasize.com/compact/#478.394,ha,t
FE 35/2.8 is exactly as tiny as the Olympus 17/1.8.
Why do people always compare the smallest and lightest lenses of a larger format to the largest ones of the smaller format. How do things look like on average? What about FAST lenses?
well? because FE 35/2.8 @ 3.5 produces the EXACT same pictures as Oly 17/1.8 does fully open, in terms of DOF and SNR, but much SHARPER. ISO is just a silly number. They could just change in-camera indicators so it displayed FF’s ISO 800 as 43-ISO of 200 (just as my point-and-shoot displays focal range in FF equivalent).
Probably Sony should say something like this:
Focal length: 35 mm (17.5 four-thirds equivalent)
F-stop: 2.8 (1.4 four-thirds equivalent)
I don’t want a fight on equivalence. I bought m43 for macro work due to the larger DOF on purpose.
Nevertheless you need to have 4 times higher ISO for the FF for the same picture, too, as you state or have longer shutter speeds. And comparing my m43 or XT1 to the D610 the difference isn’t that big any more if noise levels start rising. It’s clear, that theoretically FF has the possibility to get sharper pictures (if you have a higher resolution sensor to make use of it and noise is all controlled). The 35 is not the only lens. And on average m43 is smaller for the same AOV than FF (excluding old manual focus lenses and forgetting equivalence right now.). A 24-70 or 70-200/2.8 would not be small. I want to use FF to take advantage of shallow DOF, using only f4 zooms or slow primes is not interesting to me. I don’t print wall-sized prints, am not a landscape photographer, so the extra sharpness is most of the time not needed when scaling down anyway. My D610 delivers it, sometimes I use it, but I think if it were 16MP or lower wouldn’t hurt me that much in retrospect. My options satisfy me and smaller is not always better in my opinion. I hate fiddling around with tiny buttons and I find it more difficult to steady my OMD (IBIS turned off) than my FF DSLR.
How is the 17/1.8 the larger lens on micro four thirds?
I compare the 35/2.8 and the 17/1.8 specifically because I own both and the images that come out are strikingly similar except the Sony has twice the resolution and slightly thinner DoF. Either way, they do roughly the same thing, and they are roughly the same size which means from now on I leave my 17/1.8 at home and take the superior 35/2.8 instead.
How things look on average is a very good point, and very hard to say when Sony only has one compact lens out for this system. I was just looking at the Contax G lenses, and there it seems to be possible to do compact lenses across the entire spectrum.
I didn’t look specifically at the 17mm, but meant that usually people do a lot of cherry-picking. In your case it makes sense and seeing the autofocus performance of the Contax adapters today on this website could make this a viable option.
I much prefer this shape to the DSLR styling of the A7 cameras but the lack of EVF seems like an artificial constraint to differentiate it from the other models. A $1000 FF with a left side EVF and some small primes would move a lot of M43 users over and probably even lure Fuji fans. And Canon and Nikon would have nothing that even comes close. But without an integrated EVF it will always be too compromised to dominate the market. Sony should consider the innovative pop up EVF of the RX100iii in this camera. That would be unstoppable!
Totally agree. I’m a Nikon user and Fuji fan. But, this camera would turn me into a Sony user/buyer.
If Fuji-Panasonic’s rumored “organic” sensor is real, it may leap ahead of FF in terms of DR and resolution, if not DoF (which can be both a benefit and a limitation). I love Fuji, but own Canon and M43.
I think the sensor and shutter take up too much space where the EVF would sit in the left corner. Hence the bump on the A7.
For me, if this camera had the 36mp sensor, it would be my ideal small, lightweight landscape camera (coupled with some adapted M-mount glass). However, it is probably unlikely it will get that sensor.
Oh well.
Might necessitate a slightly taller camera, but would be worth a little extra height to me.
I’m sure it would be desirable to others too, but I still think it’s unlikely, given they already have a camera with EVF (the A7/A7r).
An A5 without EVF would make sense from a cost/feature cutting point of view, and would also fit with the hierarchy/feature set already established with the A5000 and A6000.
Just my thoughts.
Hand holding a 36MP camera which is this small without EVF and a third point to stabilise will not be easy. For me it’s too small, especially with larger lenses. And I don’t buy FF to use f2.8 f3.5 or f4 lenses only. The camera then looks like the lenses attached to a smart phone.
I use a tripod when shooting landscape, so not a problem. For me, the aim is to reduce the weight/size of the kit when out in the field.
Sony Alpha 5?! Bring it on! …something like this is awesome: http://camerasize.com/compact/#478.394,ha,t
Let’s assume for a moment that the rumor is true: NEX-5t body specs with an FE mount and full frame sensor for US$1000.
This would be more suicide of the type Sony has engaged in already. Essentially, it’s competing with oneself. Such a camera would significantly lower the E-mount (APS) sales AND the A7 sales. And at that price I’d strongly suspect lower GPM, too.
I’ll give Sony full marks for thinking different in terms of cameras and designs. The simple problem for them is that their market share is today no greater in interchangeable lens cameras than it was shortly after the KM purchase, and their share of compact cameras is significantly down. All that in a market that’s declining in size. More and more Sony’s moves are looking like random shots to try to find more traction in the market and less like a long-term, solid strategy. The thinking seems to go like this “if we could hold onto the existing Alpha users and the NEX users and generate new users through these new products we’ll grow.” The problem that I see is that many of the Alpha and NEX users are migrating to the new offerings and we haven’t yet seen a statistic that shows that Sony is actually gaining share at the expense of Canon and Nikon. It feels like a lot of running in place.
Another FE mount camera puts even more pressure on producing that full FE lens lineup. But that leaves not a lot of engineering and manufacturing for producing more E and A mount lenses, further sending the message to the E/A users that maybe Sony really wants them on FE.
This is not to denigrate the products, by the way. Sony’s built a lot of great products lately, including E-mount, FE-mount, and the RX cameras. What they haven’t done in my mind is rationalize their lineup, nor manage to market it in a way that nets them new share from the two market leaders. In essence, the long Alpha decline was matched with the NEX run-up, leaving them at basically the same market share in interchangeable lens cameras. Now they seem to be concentrating on FE and they risk doing the same thing to E they did to A.
Nikon isn’t doing any better: their newer initiatives (e.g. CX) DIDN’T get the F-mount users to move, nor did they attract new users.
I think having so many lens lineups isn’t helping these companies. Sony: A (crop and full), E, FE. Nikon: CX, DX, FX. Canon: EF-M, EF-S, EF. We’re just not seeing the lens diversity that makes for really full systems any more. Instead, we get about 8-10 lenses that fill out the basic and convenience sets. My guess is that two sets–and sets that actually share the mount, as in E and FE or DX and FX–are the max you can market successfully without hurting yourself. But they have to be complete sets on their own and they have to have intelligent overlap where they do overlap.
What I’d rather see from Sony is more and faster improvement on the A7 series cameras, with a faster rollout of FE lenses, plus continued logical iteration of the former NEX lineup, complete with additional E lenses, coupled with a solid, intelligent, focused marketing campaign. Basically they need to be in the “Ditch the Dinosaur” game. As in “Ditch your DSLR Dinosaur and get a smaller, lighter camera and lens system that matches or exceeds the performance you’re used to, and has additional capabilities and features those dinosaurs would envy.”
And potentially eat into RX sales if they release pancake lenses…
you can make all pancakes you want, you will never reach the perfection of RX series fixed lens systems in FF. Here, there is no compromise, the lens and the camera match to perfection and the program inside as well. If I had the choice between an ILS with 35mm pancake and an RX1 style camera, I would always go for the second if using other lenses would no be of any importance, and for me one 35mm is plenty of it. RX sales are anyway not mass sales and also not mass production, and Sony knows that as well. That camera is more a myth, that says simply, “we did it”.
That’s like saying a Canon 6D eats into 5D mark III and 7D/70D sales. It’s kind of obvious. You’re overanalysing.
Not exactly. A company needs a LINE of products. At a minimum, let’s call the minimum need entry consumer, consumer, prosumer, and pro. Maybe (and this is where it starts to get more complicated) they can support those four levels with two types of products (e.g. mirrorless and DSLR, or crop sensor and full frame sensor).
It’s when the companies get carried away with the possibilities that they rain confusion on the customer. Canon has M, EFS, and EF (plus small and large sensor compacts). Nikon has CX, DX, FX (plus small and large sensor compacts). Sony has A (crop/full), E, FE (plus small and large sensor compacts).
When you have four lines of products that all do the same thing (take pictures), it’s incumbent upon you to clearly point a customer to the right product for them. I’d argue that we’ve gotten to the point where none of the Big Three camera companies can do that. Olympus can, because they only have two lines now and one is dying rapidly. Fujifilm can, for much the same reason. But Canon, Nikon, and Sony have such a mismash of products that the customer they actually seek (new to cameras) has no idea what they should buy.
Go stand in a busy camera store (hard to find these days) and listen to the conversations between the sales clerk and those new-to-sophisticated cameras customers. They have no idea what to get because there are too many options, not clear enough marketing, and more. There’s a difference between buying an 6D and and 5DIII that’s easily explained: there’s a less expensive option that doesn’t have as many features and is a slightly lower build quality. Now try that same explanation with an A6000, A7, and A77II.
Hi Tom Big Fan here. I hear what you are saying and completely disagree. We live in a world of multiple options for everything. From a marketing standpoint a company that stands still, holding on to its nitch share will sooner or later find that share drying up or dieing. Sony has plently of experience with this, (Walkman, beta-max, etc). The majority of consumers research on line before making large first time purchases these days. As a former camera salesman, I wouldn’t find explaining the differences between the sony camera models any different than explaining the difference between a Nikon FE, FM, F3 or canon Sureshot.
I’ve written on this subject before, and there’s considerable scholarly studies that address this area. There was a school of thought in product development and sales that came out of the 80’s and the develop of Big Box stores that you wanted to increase the products in a line to an absurd maximum and then populate the marketing/sales message with lots of numbers. In some cases, the same exact product had different names so as to make price comparisons across Big Boxes impossible.
You could see this at Best Buy really easy (still can today): 3Ghz CPU, 8GB RAM, 500GB drive, 3 USB 2.0 ports, etc. When you did that for all 50 of the products on display at Best Buy, the conflicts in all those numbers and details couldn’t be resolved by the customer. Studies show time and again when you do that the actual sale gets placed in the hands of the SELLER. The customer will keep asking questions and pondering the apparent conflicts (that one is 3.5Ghz but only 4GB RAM) in the information they find until such time as the salesperson offers a clarifying solution to them. In other words, you can direct sales to what you want to sell today ;~).
The problem is that this doesn’t work so well in a mature, downward trending market. Now does it let you stand out. So you end up buying shelf space (notice those Samsung stores inside Best Buy?) AND you put spiffs into play (incentives to sales people).
Also, logical options are different than made up options. For instance, if I had the option of buying a camera with a 10-frame, 30-frame, or 100-frame buffer, that’s a logical option. When I have the choice of buying a swivel LCD, but only on one model which may not have something else I want, that’s a made up option.
Finally, note that car dealers finally came to grips with all that “research before buy” nonsense. Turns out that studies show that the more you research details, the more confused your buying decision is. You illogically then seek even more details. This is what is driving things like discussions of DxOMark, et.al. DxOMark, in theory, says there is a big difference between Canon and Nikon camera sensors these days. Yet I see pros shooting great photos with Canon cameras and with Nikon cameras, and I’ll bet you I can show you their output and you can’t tell a difference. In other words, at some point people deep end into details that aren’t actually meaningful to their decision.
As to your comment about not finding explaining the differences between Sony and Nikon cameras any different, that’s actually part of the problem. You’re correct. The lineups are so complicated and filled with details that explaining ANY of them has become necessary. Adding to that by adding another line of products doesn’t help at all. It just adds more study guides the sales people need to learn.
Back in the late 70’s I ran a chain of computer stores. In our stores we had everything from the Apple II (originally I, of which we were the second largest seller) to miincomputer like Alpha Micro machines. We sold a ton of Apples. Why? Because with pretty much everything else we’d spend hours trying to tell them the details of what it does and get them to step through all the decisions they’d need to make to actually have a usable system. With the Apple II? Couple of decisions and you’re done. It was approachable, understandable, and affordable in a league of other products that were confusing, ugly metal, and often very expensive. If you want to sell a lot of product, you need to get away from all that confusion and make the decision easy for a customer. No camera maker is doing that.
I agree with Thom here though. A lot of people that ask me what camera they should buy do it because they don’t understand what they are reading or looking at. And always it’s, “I don’t know what these numbers(models) mean.”
Apple was headed in the right direct with their iPhone with a simple model number and the attached GB values. It’s not technology; it’s always presentation.
I’m pretty certain that the ILC camera market is increasing and the low end compact cameras dying out. Do you have numbers to back your argument? If not and your assumption is not true, then many of your points fall through.
If the ILC market is on a rise or at least they believe that they can increase it with revolutionary products like the FF E-mount cameras then they are on the right path. You need to take a calculated risk, and there seem to be a very lucrative market for professional performing cameras in the consumer space of prices.
Maybe Sony don’t want to make insignificant upgrades. Like the NEX-5R –> 5T and what Canon are doing with their Rebel cameras and Nikon with the D610. I agree they should come out with lenses fast, but aren’t 10 FE native Sony lenses by the end of the year pretty fast, and 15 by another year?
Yes, I have numbers. I have the Japanese camera company numbers:
ILC 2012: 20.1m units
ILC 2013: 17.1m units
ILC 2014: 16.7m units estimated
I suspect you’re confusing MILC (or sometimes called CSC) for ILC. There the numbers are:
MILC 2012: 4m units
MILC 2013: 3.3m units
at the moment, MILC is running somewhere between those two for 2014
compact 2011: 99.9m units
compact 2012: 78m units
compact 2013: 45.7m units
compact 2014: 38.8m units estimated
So far this year, sales are under the estimates. So the end of the year had better be darned good.
I also track market shares and more, on both global and regional basis. Some of that I can’t share publicly because I do it with data that’s not public for an entity who will remain unnamed.
As I’ve stated several times in the past couple of years: if you want to increase your market share in cameras now you MUST take market share from a competitor. Through the end of 2013 there is no tangible evidence that Sony has done so with interchangeable lens cameras, and what little they may have done in that regard would have come from very small competitors, as Canon and Nikon both seemed to have retained their market shares.
Well, do like Ferrari and Lamborghini do it with cars, build cameras for the super rich with gold plating at excessive prices, maybe than the market stays constant and even increases. For sure, do not take a 1200$ camera, put a wooden grip and a shell, and sell it for 8000$, that is a joke then. I doubt that Leica is not reaching it’s goals and objectives, they never dump the prices.
As I claimed before, we are in a worldwide depression and crisis, and if the rich continue to nag the little money that low and mid class people earn by their greedy “want it all” policy, this will not change. If you want people to buy, do not cut off their buying power. On the another side, most cellphones take honest stills and most normal users, let’s call it the profane, do not ask for more.
Any cellphone with wi-fi, 5 to 7 inch tablet included can be bought between 100 and 800$ today, and even the cheapest has a 5 mpix camera today. The profane do not care too much about megapixels and interchangeable lenses, they look their shots on Instagram and that’s it.
On the end do also not forget that the market in pocket cameras is saturated and not everyone buys a new pocket camera every year. The expert class looks for improvement in technology, the profane keep their cameras mainly until they break and buy a new one then at a much cheaper price than they got the previous one. Nothing goes eternally and is endless, not even the universe, and here, stepping to 1 inch sensors will not change much, profane do not see too much difference in IQ and experts find the sensor to small for high skilled works, and beside that, cameras, mainly pocketable cameras, that use it are too expensive. I do not pay 1200$ for a 1 inch camera when I can get an A77/2 body for the same price, and here, versatility and all in one policy, changes nothing, at least in my point of view.
I think that the strategy of Sony is to get the APSC system out of the line and concentrate on FF and 1″ sensors, what is, to my opinion a bad idea. The fact we see here a real tourist ILS camera like NEX-5 in FF makes me think about this. Also this actual massive price drops on all APSC E lenses, giving Touit, a pair for the price of one, are signs one can not deny. But, Sony has in all it’s existence been the champion of innovation, innovation that was revolutionary and that they dropped as fast as they presented it. I think that they are somewhat too fast with marketing new systems and new stuff without even finishing and exploiting the one that exist, so is now the 4k trend in video the top must, while we have not even brought 1080 to perfection and to the possibilities it can be used for. We live in period of world wide depression, crisis, and this competition against itself, what Sony is doing, cameras being sold 30% less after 3 month and dropped after one year or one and a half, is not what one could title as a real valuable marketing strategy. I think Sony should repolish a bit the existing models, bringing a Mk2 and Mk3 with real improvements and concentrate on producing a better choice in lenses in acceptable price ranges without the blue stamp on it. The 2 APSC models in the a line they have brought recently and which are supposed to replace all they had in the NEX line before is just a joke, and for me no reason to buy one more of their cameras.
The problem, of course, is that innovation and even having better products, just doesn’t always win in the marketplace. We can go all the back to Betamax for examples at Sony of that.
One problem with interchangeable lens cameras is that they’re not only a one-per-household type of purchase, but they’re also one-time purchases. While there’s a small, vocal group that chases the latest-and-greatest, most of the ILC purchases are buy people who want to get a quality product that lasts them a long time. That’s why shifting mounts/sizes/etc. is basically a non-winnable game. The latest-and-greatest group isn’t rewarded for their legacy purchases (e.g. lenses still work as before) while the new purchasers worry that a company that keeps changing what they want to sell them is going to obsolete what they buy almost instantly.
Where opportunity lies is in complete market disruption: where everyone will have to switch at some point. For example, what happened in the switch from film to digital. Mirrorless, on the other hand, is an evolution of ILC, not a disruption of it.
That’s where you are absolutely wrong Thom. Change to mirrorless cameras is much much more profounding and disrupting than transformation from film to digital ever was. You could not tell the digital and film cameras apart from the outside, because nothing really changed in their looks. Same old lenses could be used, same old flip-flap mirror was still there.
With mirrorless cameras optical designers have much more freedom in their design. You can never really design a small high-performance wide-angle lens with old DSLR-cameras.
Second thing is a growing importance of the video. Almost NONE of the existing DSLR-lenses from any manufacturer are optimised for video as they have ultrasonic or DC-motors. They all are noisy during the focusing. Stepper motors that are used in almost every mirrorless lens are much better choice for a lens that is used both for stills and video. And before you say that autofocus is not important in video, think again. It’s importance will grow. That’s how people with their mobile phones are used to shoot video.
Change to mirrorless is slow as the lens line-ups are still far from perfect. Also people with large DSRL-lens collections will be reluctant to start from the scratch. But eventually it will happen.
In the end price will be the biggest differentiator. Mirroless cameras will always be more cheaper (and more reliable) to produce and calibrate as they have far less parts required compared to DSRL’s. Most of the people still buy just a camera + kitlens and that’s where the price competition will be fought.
Sorry, but this one has already been answered by the market, not me. Sony tried changing the mirror from a flapper to a non-flapper, essentially making the SLTs “mirrorless” and their sales went down.
I suspect that you’re trying to say mirrorless enables smaller cameras. Basically only in one respect: depth. You can technically make a DSLR the same size as a mirrorless camera in width and height.
I’ve pointed it out before–even on this thread–but Canon and Nikon have been lazy and not paying attention to changes in their loyal user base. I’m going to do an experiment on my site later this week that I hope proves that point some more. All the “leakage” away from DSLRs is self-caused, not caused by a total disruption. Big heavy bodies and lenses aren’t resonating with the DSLR crowd like they used to. So there’s a pretty simple solution: downsize. And in doing that they should also take complexity out of the way those cameras are built, too, as Sony did with the A7 models.
Everybody keeps harping on video. But the video market is at least an order of magnitude smaller than the still market. And there are better video-only solutions if you ARE into it. Even Sony has some ;~). Thing is, go look at any smartphone users’ memory. How many stills did you find? How many videos?
oh wait? isn’t the sony 16-50 powerzoom twice smaller than DSLR’s 18-55?
isn’t samyang’s 8/2.8 fisheye much sharper than its DSLR counterpart 8/3.5, while being half at mass?
>You can technically make a DSLR the same size as a mirrorless camera in width and height.
classic DSLR design uses AF sensor in the bottom and pentaprism in the top, so height is not the same. Hump in A7 is can be rid of.
> essentially making the SLTs “mirrorless”
The main point of mirrorless is lenses with smaller backfocus. SLTs take usual SLR lenses (you can’t mount rangefinder lenses on it), so in that sense SLT combine the worst: no TTL OVF of mirrorless and large SLR lenses.
But I agree that mirrorless ILCs are not disruptive.
>You could not tell the digital and film cameras apart from the outside, because nothing really changed in their looks.
Hm… Can you tell A3000 from 1100D from outside, or Fuji X-T1 from Nikon D7100? 🙂 A3000 even emulates sound of flap-flap.
Film -> Digital was disruptive even through there was major decline in IQ at first.
First, virtually zero cost of a shot.
Second, removes dependency on labs: no more caring about someone else seeing NSFW photos.
Third, it saves a lot of time.
What Sony trying to do now is to create their new ecosystem (small body, niche feature, high IQ, decent performance —> Emount); Mirrorless sales in market have shows increase year over year. This is making sense Sony focus on mirrorless specifically Emount. By releasing those niche camera with such prices if it not this rumor $1000 however the A7 price are alr fair enough to kick the momentum. So this ecosystem must get it done quickly before any others step into it. The most real competitor definitely will be Fuji. The next step we shall see Sony to polish existing camera minus areas and fix it with new camera and come along with lenses line up.
Try to imaging if today all capabilities from Amount FF able pack in mirrorless FF plus with serious enhancements (5X-IBIS, global shutter, ISO, etc), it make no sense why we do need a heavier DSLR body…. (the funny thing is that i used to read from someone saying that “small body + big lens = complaint”; in contrast i thinks that big body + big lens = happy) haha…
Mirrorless sales peaked in 2012. They went down in 2013. This year is anyone’s guess, but the early set of new products has sales somewhere between 2012 and 2013.
And again, Sony had a 10-15% market share in interchangeable lens cameras with Alpha. They have not grown that share, because they keep shooting Alpha in the foot and mirrorless sales are still less than a quarter of DSLR sales.
Don’t you think that a full frame camera that sells for less than a grand would help to make a sizable increase in market share? I imagine a lot of people who don’t currently shoot Sony would pick one up. If Sony has good value lenses to go along with it, they may attract some people who end up staying with Sony for many years.
Do the math.
Let’s start with the assumption that Sony has a reasonable GPM with the A7 at US$1800. Call that GPM 50% to make things easy. A US$900 full frame camera takes out the EVF according to this rumor. So some cost savings, but nothing approaching the implied difference in price. The GPM therefore decreases. Let’s be generous and say the GPM only drops to 25%.
So we’re into price elasticity of demand. Again I’m going to be simplistic so the math can be followed. If we sell X units a US$1800 with a 50% GPM, how many units do we need to sell at US$900 with a 25% GPM to make the same amount of money? 4X.
Sony has tried in the past to use price to leverage market share. It hasn’t worked yet. Why would it work this time? And, by the way, what would it do to A6000 sales, which are a bright spot in their line?
When I write about “rational product line” I mean that a company introduces multiple products that form a correct EoD curve with good spacing, don’t truly compete with each other, and provide logical choices to the consumer instead of faux ones. At the moment, none of the camera companies has a rational product line. I suspect if one did, they would be knocking it out of the park.
iPhone sales also went down on this quarter compared to quarter before that… You really can’t see a trend in a market that is few years old very and prone to be cyclic. By your own data the mirrorless market is showing growth if you just choose last year and this year as a end points.
Quarter to quarter is different than year to year, and you have to correct for new product intros, because they do temporary distortions to the curve.
We now have four+ years of data tracking on mirrorless. Generally, when something is going to supplant something else, you can apply historic formulae to the trendline and get a clear predictive statement. When you do that with mirrorless versus DSLRs, you don’t currently get that. Not that it will never happen, but the current data suggests that mirrorless is mostly stalled. This is the kind of numeric analysis I did in my PhD work, by the way: new technology adoption curves.
I certainly can be wrong. I’ve been wrong before. However, I’m not shy about my analysis. Equivocating analysis is not worth the time it takes to make it. The scientific method is to make a hypothesis and test it. The current hypothesis is that mirrorless is not on a road to overtake DSLR sales any time soon.
I will say that Canon and especially Nikon have been lazy. Their method of protecting the kingdom has been light iteration. There hasn’t been enough simplification, cost reduction, and serious engineering applied to consumer DSLRs by either. Tear down an A7 and a D610, for example: one is clearly engineered to be made quickly with few parts, the other is just a rehash of 1990’s designs.
Sony has many positive things going on in cameras. But there are also a lot of lose ends and miscues, too.
No matter how many new FE lenses Sony roll out, there will be people crying “no lenses”… A new mount is far behind of two long established mounts. They need to use ways where mirrorless cameras have advantages, and focus on them.
This gives us good hope that Sony will release a full set of tiny f/2.8 primes in the spirit of the FE 35/2.8. This would be great news. I might have to retire my micro four thirds system then…
I expect prices of bayer sensor cameras to continue to decrease as more and more people decide to wait for stacked sensors.
No one is waiting for staked sensors LOL, probably only you.
Speak for yourself. I’m waiting for new sensor tech before spending more than $1000. A sub $1000 FF camera would get me to spend some money. Otherwise, I’m happy to wait until the next tech arrives.
99% of the people that own a diigtal camera dont even know what ‘bayer sensor’ means…
I expect that is not at all true.
The majority of people do not care about the sensor technology.
totally right, all they see are 2 things, the price and here they often do not care about what they get for it, and second is IQ. The people with the knowledge are in anyway a minority on the market. Sony has made cameras versatile, they fit both categories, and even those who earn money with them turn to Sony’s mirrorless. With the speed of AF getting amazing at Sony, sports freaks and reporters will be the customers of the future as well. For sure, Sony needs to stop this fast innovative marketing strategy that makes them dump the product prices after 3 month on the market and the whole product itself after 18 to 24 month.
When someone else makes one first and the image quality or resolution is improved lots of those people that never heard of it or dont care now will have to have it
*WHEN*…
No one cares about bayer vs stacked sensor except a very small group of enthusiasts.
Probably it won’t fit into nex-5 body:
http://www.optyczne.pl/upload2/70162_A99_shutter_unit-1200.jpg
Any special reason that you think they would use the A99 shutter mechanism in this camera?
Uhmmm… geometry? Physics? They can build horizontal traverse(?) shutter, but it will be slower and probably more complex.
Geometry and physics is the reason for them to use the A99 shutter mechanism. Right…
Do you remember that ‘FF won’t fit in E-mount’ 3 years ago?
I speculate they would redesign shutter to be EFCS-only. And, E-mount cameras NEVER used the same shutter as A-mount.
http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/media/2014/01/shims-1024×835.jpg
http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2014/01/the-a7r-teardown-a-look-inside-sonys-awesome-full-frame-mirrorless-camera
http://camerasize.com/compare/#478,487
So what does this prove?
A7 is bigger than 5T not only due to FF, but also a lot more controls, and EVF.
more correct comparison: http://camerasize.com/compare/#33,487
It proves, that A7 shutter is as big as NEX 5 body.
You compare A7 with NEX7, but on the patent pic is NEX5… so… I think, that it’s just a “generic e-mount body pic” used in documentation. But yes, they can do full frame NEX 3F, or NEX 5 with electronic global shutter.
I think a full electronic shutter will solve the problem of a mechanical shutter not able to fit in a nex-5 type of body. I think with Bionz X processor it is possible to have a full electronic shutter on a 8-16mp full frame sensor.
Sony is very capable of doing this and to make it possible. If they can do it on a 12mp sensor of A7S then why not on their next full frame A5 camera?
Except they didn’t do it on the A7S the way you are inplying, because the full electronic shutter is limited to slow shutter speeds and a low resolution sensor.
This cheep FF will sell very good if they launch more lenses for it and if the price is as low as suggested!
can’t believe this. MORE CAMERAS?!?????? WHAT ABOUT THE LENSES?
Sony has many lenses yet, there will be more, and with adapters, there are so many that you need a truck to take them all with you.
Yeah, with Adapters 😀 ever tried to shoot an 70-400 without image stabilisation 😀 adapter 😀 good joke.
using adapters to increase price weight and size while decreasing performance. many lenses? o’really? you can only buy 5!! FE lenses. compare that to canikon with over 100.
better just buy a canikon.
at least they make lenses instead of just making bodies no one want cause there’s no lenses.
sell your sony camera, buy a canikon camera be happy.
Good buy
unfortunately they are not mirrorless. that’s why I’m asking for more lenses. why the fuck would we need more cameras if they only make 5 lenses?!??!???????
or you might need money to buy the existing lenses?
please share with me where you bought your ultra wide zoom? oh wait. there isn’t any for sale. 🙁 *sadface*
This is exactly what I was waiting for. I hate the EVF’s and other useless features creating large humps that ruin the portability and unneededly increase price, I only need a compact camera with very high image quality. I think I will buy one. Hopefully a very compact full-frame lens will come, but the Zeiss FE 35mm F2.8 is quite ok too.
Because why?? I love the hump!!
My pocket doesn’t. If you love the hump you have plenty of choice.
Don’t pretend you’d be able to fit an a7 in your pocket if there wasn’t a hump.
Yea, Im hoping for a pancake version of the 35mm FE lens to pair with this new compact FF-camera 🙂 Will it happen? Hell NO!
I feel it is such a great idea of less expensive and small but yet powerful FF camera.
And on top of this the camera potentially may have some more: touch screen, fast AF from A6000, some better video quality (with no line skipping in 1080p video), or even 4k video, 5axis digital image stabilization in video mode (like in RX100-3), etc.
what is missing is the 50mm FE lens with OSS. But sony does provide already it’s crop version. And it is an inexpensive, yet a good quality lens. hopefully they might design and issue the similar FF version.
“Oskar Barnack’s vision is a small camera making small, sharp negatives
that can make decent big prints.” Hopefully, they optimize the sensor for RF-lenses.
damit ..
the lenses make the size and weight….
So? You can always use tiny leica L and M leneses with adapters.
So far I have been restrained from getting the A7 series but I’ll certainly jump on this one! Actually I like the add on EVF on NEX 5R since it gives you an adjustable angle which is convenient but the downside is that I have to add it on every time I use it unless I carry a bigger camera bag and leave it on all the time.
I want to see more lenses and I am actually waiting to see a new FE camera. Hoping that the new one will have a fast UHS-II SD Card Reader and 4K internal recording. ALSO no overheating and continuous recording. 😀
Do not expect so meany features, I bet it will be a very basic package with mediocre video at best etc, but the image quality may be OK (in RAW at least).
Sony is growing really fast right now and I wouldn’t be surprised if the next PRO CLASS cameras are going to support UHS-II or 4K internal recording. Sony is moving towards getting more 4K content out there and make better business for their 4K TVs. It will be a double+ for them. Regards the quality I think Sony has it together. If there will be any issues I’m sure it will be fixed with a firmware update or the next camera. This isn’t something new for Sony. They have been working with 4K before. They just have to put the software in the camera(s) and build hardware fast enough to write it without being overloaded(=starts to overheat) with data.
We will soon see eight K coming in 2016.
There was a Chinese 8K tv demo online. Pretty much same as looking at reality. Dont forget to make it also 8K 3D. Then you WILL be scared watching a horror movie. XD
Honestly we can’t expect much from what could be the cheapest FF camera ever.
Expecting high end features like 4k internal recording (which the $2500 A7s lacks) on a $1k camera is putting yourself up for disappointment. The most we can expect is the 24 MP sensor from the A7 (to keep costs low), a plastic build and maybe the basic contrast detect AF system from the A7r rather than a hybrid system like on the A7.
If this camera does come out, it will sell by the dozen.
I don’t mean this $1k camera in this rumor but in general “the next FE camera.”
This will eventually happen though, no doubt. It’s the natural course of technology, and Sony is an expert at making things like a mad scientist.
Things other than lenses, that is.
What’s a viewfinder worth? $400-$600? So you take it off the $1,500 a7 and you’ve got a $900-$1,000 FE a7C (for cheapo). Maybe it’s making more sense to me than when I first reacted to the rumor but I still wonder if it doesn’t hurt sales of existing models. Why not come out with an a7II without a viewfinder and sell an optional EVF accessory? Best of both worlds.
The viewfinder isn’t responsible for a third of the body’s price, I guarantee that
wooohhooo!!!! $1K full-frame! 😀
Shut up and take my money!
I have a feeling that we are going to get rumors soon of new lenses and zeiss is going to have a 85mm fast prime.
i did discussed with hongkong sony’s stuff and he told me no more e-mount FF within this year, the next camera will be certainly an a-mount FF.
I think the size and controls of the a7 series is fine. just loose the viewfinder hump and im set. make it detachable or make it like the a6000’s or better yet make it a pop-up one! ala rx100iii.
In my opinion, I don’t think this is happening….at least not in this year….some of these rumors seem so random as if they were made up just to churn discussion
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I agree. They already have the A7 at a low price, why would they cut the legs out from that product line with something even cheaper?
What does FT2 mean?
Four-thirds 2
FT2 stands for Four Thirds 2 (4/3 rumors).
So this is an E-mount rumor that came from the 4/3 rumor site? And is rated a 2? I assume that FT2 and SR2 are similar in unlikelihood?
No, he just flubbed it. Clearly the two sites are related (see links at bottom of page). Andrea probably posts for all of them.
FT2 and SR2 are the same level of reliability.
THIS’LL BE YEAR OF A-MOUNT ??
“The Year of the A-Mount” post by Admin, a while back, was probably overly enthusiastic, but in his defence the year isn’t over yet.
Sony has already released A77II. If they update A99 with a 36mp sensor and release A88 with a 24mp sensor, that will already be 90% there. If they change their mind and release A58II as a mid-range camera or A65II, that would bring it to 100%.
A-Mount users usually don’t need availability of 20 different cameras. We just need a specific feature set, and Sony usually delivers mostly everything in one package.
Yes, A99 should have been 36mp from the start and AF system could have been better, but for most uses, it is an awesome piece of equipment that is not matched by any other brand. And no, D600/D800 or 6D/5DIII are not comparable cameras. Once you get a feel for EVF, using an OVF camera is like going back to antiquated equipment. EVF is a drawback only to a specific type of fast action shooters, which probably makes up 1% of the entire market and they already use Canikon anyways. There are advantages and disadvantages to every model/brand. We choose A-Mount because we find something in it that no other mount on the market offers.
To me that’s EVF and IBIS.
The year the a-mount rolls over and dies, more like it! Sony please show the a-mount more love.
You will soon see the a99s and a99r.
Could be the first FF camera i’d consider buying. Although to me, A77 body with a FF sensor (aka A88) would be more welcome than this.
Yes just what I want. But SONY please add a PASM-Dial already!!
Really? You need PASM on full frame?!
Excuse my ignorance or lack of knowledge, but PASM have always been a part of the top mode selection dial.
I’m confused what you guys are referring to.
There is an “autumn leaves” setting in A7R (menu diving required). 😉
Anyone asked for that in a FF 36mp camera?
Could it be Sony marketing is too lazy to put together focus groups so is now leaking trial balloons to SAR for market research? ;^)
Does this mean the FF Photokina rumor isn’t about announcing the a99II but yet another, albeit cheapo, FE to cannibalize e-mount APS-Cs and the current line of pricier FEs? Doesn’t make sense to me but Sony’s marketing department is in charge so it doesn’t have to!
What do you think?
Do they even have an official EU price on the A7s yet? I do not see it on any of Sony’s sites.
BTW, do they have a marketing department? That would be “stunning”. 🙂
I think Admin generated a lot of clicks without doing the standard multiple source check. Which is fine because most people want everything posted and so much speculation sends a thrill up everyone’s leg.
Sony has spoiled us with so many exciting body announcements! It’s going to be a long, dull summer between now and Photokina waiting for a99 (and a88?) details. More FT2s (whatever that stood for)!
FT2 stands for Four Thirds 2 (4/3 rumors). He goofed up.
It’s 2237 euro.
how about redesign the rx1 and figure a way to sell it for less than $1000. Now that would be a revolution. A compact FF, like the ricoh GR – only FF, and add the magic focus beans on the sensor. Come on – you could not keep this camera on the shelf. Every photojournalist would have this camera in there pocket. And anyone who was vaguely aware that there is anything better than a cell phone camera would want one.
Why would they want to sell the camera at way below profit maximizing value?
Yes, maybe the RX1 is at profit maximizing value (maybe). I am suggesting a redesigned FF compact that can be sold cheaper.
That’s going to be an extremely compromised experience. They wouldn’t be able to afford decently resolving glass for the thing.
Well – a few things:
1. The great thing about FF is that the glass does not have to be as good as aps-c glass. Aps-c is much harder on glass.
2. Do you think a sub-$1000 FF-anything would not be compromised relative to a $3000 body?
3. If Ricoh can sell the GR at $800 – I see no reason why Sony can’t sell something similar in FF for near that price – after all they have direct access to the sensor fabs – they own them.
Access to fabs doesn’t make as big a difference as you’d think—when AMD sold their fabs off there wasn’t any impact on prices, and Intel, who owns their own fabs, prices their products higher. When you own fabs you may not have to pay a middle man but you’re responsible for one of the most complicated R&D endeavors in any industry. Plus, full-frame sensors have very low yields compared to APS-C sensors; yields scale inversely and exponentially with surface area of an individual chip (which is why Intel, GlobalFoundries, and TSMC are increasing wafer sizes as higher transistor counts push per-chip sizes larger—they can maintain their yield per wafer).
Trust me, I majored in Computer Engineering at NYU.
I do trust you, and NYU’s computer engineering department.
This topic has been beat to death elsewhere on the internet. Yes, I know larger sensors cost more.
I am not an insider at Sony – am just a consumer. I was merely suggesting that if they could produce something like the RX1 for a lot less – possibly they could sell more bodies. Even if it were in the $1800 dollar range – this would still sell many more than the rarefied air of the $2800 dollar range. They have good engineers, I am confident they could find a way to make this happen.
You actually need better glass on FF than APSC as the sensor is bigger. That is why DX only lens are cheaper.
“better” glass is needed with higher pixel density. In general, aps-c has higher pixel densities than FF. Many DX lenses are cheap by design – it is a marketing issue.
THIS IS THE GREAT NEWS!
I’ll be an early adopter, because the lack of touchscreen is what that forced me to sell A7.
How many FF bodies will be announced instead of suitable FE lenses? I’m stuck with such a poor choice of lenses and don’t tell me about using f### adapters, rather go back to a dslr !!
Have fun. Sony will have 10 lenses for the line by the end of 2015. That’s an impressive start compared to any of the other platforms that have launched in the past 4-5 years.
Sounds great. Let’s wait and see.
This was in the rumors months ago, too. This new camera with the name A5/ A9 would be revolutionary the FF market with a very low price.The camera maybe hasn’t a view finder. Its not so bad, I’m not want a view finder, why i must pay that…. .
Please Sony release still this year a A5s/ A9s for a low price, too :-))))
No need anything tinier than the seven but just put the a6000 af into the seven R, that would kill the Nikon d800s.
I like the size of the NEX-5. I wonder if they can fit full frame + a6000-style AF in that small package.
I have been waiting for a cheap A mount FF camera, but Sony keep releasing E mount cameras! I feel I am stuck. I don’t want to buy a E mount FF because of lack of lenses. And I already have a bunch of A mount lenses. Even Sony said A mount is not going to die, but I don’t know if I can trust this anymore.
Wait for the A88 in september.
What is FT2? Is it SR2?
Great! This will help keep the FE lenses coming…Anyone still think that Sony isn’t committed to FE mount cameras. My pick for Photokina will be a FF version of the FS100 with the A7s sensor
Not buying another Sony full frame until a proper A-Mount is released.
Please Sony, a mirrorless A-Mount with best sensor about the size of original Maxxum 9000 body. Is that so freaking hard?
with Sensor Stabilization.
That’s not going to happen due to flange distance
If they make it water proof like the Nikon AW1. Then i want one
This is exactly the opposite of the direction they should be going. I’m sorry “small and light” “travel shooters,” if the A7/r wasn’t small enough for you (and arguably if the A58 or D71000 wasn’t small enough for you) you’re just pathetically lazy. Stop talking. Stop spending money. Stop asking camera makers to build cameras for you. You and the “retro” people are ruining the camera market. I just want an ergonomically non-incompetent camera with a grip big enough to fit my whole hand on. Why are Nikon and Canon the only ones who can build that?!
This is exactly the opposite of the direction they should be going. I’m sorry “small and light” “travel shooters,” if the A7/r wasn’t small enough for you (and arguably if the A58 or D71000 wasn’t small enough for you) you’re just pathetically lazy. Stop talking. Stop spending money. Stop asking camera makers to build cameras for you. Just buy a camera phone. You and the “retro” people are ruining the camera market. I just want an ergonomic camera with a grip big enough to fit my whole hand on. Why are Nikon and Canon the only ones who can build that?!
The retro people are ruining the camera market? I think the Nikon Df has the best ergonomics of any camera I’ve used recently, and if the Leica CLE can be as small as it is, while still having great ergonomics… I don’t see why that shouldn’t be achievable with a modern camera.
This is exactly the opposite of the direction they should be going. I’m sorry “small and light” “travel shooters,” if the A7/r wasn’t small enough for you (and arguably if the A58 or D7100 wasn’t small enough for you) you’re just pathetically lazy. Stop talking. Stop spending money. Stop asking camera makers to build cameras for you. Buy one of those Nokia Lumia toy cameras. You and the “retro” people are ruining the camera market. I just want an ergonomic camera with a grip big enough to fit my whole hand on. Why are Nikon and Canon the only ones who can build that?!
“Toy” Nokia 808 outresolves A58 with the best 18mm lens (gives the same FOV) you can mount on it.
Thats weird, those who wants smal and compact high quality camera and the “retro people” are ruining the camera market, while you, who want a camera to be just like those already made are the ones that pushes it foreward? Strange logic …
This attitude is exactly the problem. This idea that not futzing around with what works equals stagnation. I did not call for Sony to stop innovating. I want better sensors and new technologies and new ideas. That’s why I have an A7 instead of one of Nikon or Canon’s barely-changed-since-the-first-DSLRs-in-2001 cameras. But changing things that work perfectly don’t need changing just to say you’ve changed them is not innovating. Trying a completely different (and usually worse) control layout with every iteration of the NEX line, clearly without ever letting a photographer test them to see if they’re the least bit usable, is not innovating. Moving buttons where we can’t reach them is not innovating. Hiding things photographers need to use regularly in menus is not innovating. Making things too small to hold is not innovating. Making your camera look like a Leica rangefinder so people will pay more for it is not innovating.
I need a small camera to get it wherever I go. And I need a big sensor to make photos whatever I want (especially about color and shadow details). I get a briefcase when I go to work, not a bag. And there are papers and a laptop. And yes, the A7 is too big (thanks to fake-pentaprism!), the NEX-6 is OK. With fix-focal compact lens I can do photos everywhere!
While I refuse to abandon ship- I haven’t been buying products from Sony. In fact, I’ve been buying more Olympus products while I wait on another FF A-mount. However, I’m starting to not care as much. I still think the images I get off my A900 are excellent. The only product I find intriguing is the A7S due to it’s high DR and ISO capabilities. At least that fills a niche few cameras can do right now. But in the end, none of these cameras are truly offering something all that special. Incremental increases IMO do not warrant dishing out 2k or more. This might be a good year to just sit it out.
All I can think is how hard I would laugh if anyone attached this to Sigma 200-500mm f2.8. Seriously, I don’t know how much they could cut the price down to make this appealing product to consumers, Unless they can produce lenses in size of old manual primes it’s pointless.
Actually, this would be a great camera for astrophotographers, and for me, coupled with some adapted M mount glass and a carbon fibre tripod, a great lightweight landscape camera.
Just because you can’t see any use for it, doesn’t mean others can’t. Just saying.
Best way to buy Sony camera and its technology: The ones with fixed lens.
it makes no sense. they make small cameras and no lenses… those few lenses they make, are big… what’s the point?