Mobile01 (translation here) posted the full A7r review. The cool thing is that they tested all current Sony E-mount APS-C lenses and on these images you can see how the lenses will cover the Full Frame area.
Specs and Preorders in US and Canada:
Dedicated Sony announcement page at Amazon US (Click here).
Sony A7r body at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS. TheCameraStore Canada.
Sony A7 body at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS. TheCameraStore Canada.
Sony A7 with 28-70mm kit lens at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS. TheCameraStore Canada.
Sony RX10 at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
Zeiss 24-70mm at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
Zeiss 35mm at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
Zeiss 55mm at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
70-200mm A-mount at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
Sony A-Mount to E-Mount Lens Adapter at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto.
Sony A to E adapter with mirror at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto.
A7/A7r leather case at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
A7/A7r vertical grip at Amazon, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
Sony W Series Battery Charger at Amazon, BHphoto.
Sony FA-CS1M Off-Camera Shoe at BHphoto.
Semi-Hard LCD Screen Protector for A7-A7r at Amazon, BHphoto.
Specs and Preorders in Europe:
Sony A7r body at Sony DE, UK, FR, IT, ES, NL, BE, CH, AT, SE, FI, NO, PT, WexUK, WexDE.
Sony A7 body at Sony DE, UK, FR, IT, ES, NL, BE, CH, AT, SE, FI, NO, PT, WexUK, WexDE, Amazon UK, Amazon DE, Amazon FR.
Sony A7 with 28-70mm kit Sony DE, UK, FR, IT, ES, NL, BE, CH, AT, SE, FI, NO, PT, WexUK, WexDE, Amazon UK, Amazon DE, Amazon FR.
Sony RX10 at Sony DE, UK, FR, IT, ES, NL, BE, CH, AT, SE, FI, NO, PT, WexUK, WexDE.
Zeiss 35mm at Sony DE, UK, FR, IT, ES, NL, BE, CH, AT, SE, FI, NO, PT,
Zeiss 55mm at Sony DE, UK, FR, IT, ES, NL, BE, CH, AT, SE, FI, NO, PT
Zeiss 24-70mm at Sony DE, UK, FR, IT, ES, NL, BE, SE, PT
Asia:
A7r at Digitalrev.
A7 at Digitalrev, Amazon Cina.
A7 with 28-70mm lens at Digitalrev.
68 Responses
Amazing how many of them have square image circles. There goes he dream of round sensor or square one for that matter.
Also amazing how little would it take if the would cover FF in many cases.
The square image “circles” are caused by the black plastic mask on the rear lens element (used to reduce reflection inside the lens/camera system). They might cover significantly more when this mask is removed.
The square areas are caused by the windows at the rear end of the lens. You could break that out and get round areas.
I just tried to remove the rear shade of my SEL 1850, it is fixed with three little screws and comes off easily.
But then some electronic stuff is exposed, I might have to cut something out of black paper with a round hole and put it into instead.
Now the A7 body for testing is missing 😉
I am curious but I doubt the corners will be useful even when exposed.
“How little” is a complete redesign of the lens. i.e., a different lens. e.g., An APS-C 50mm/1.4 lens is an entirely different animal than a FF 50mm/1.4 lens. A lens cannot magically (or with “little” anything) have a bigger field than it was designed for.
Removing the rectangular baffles of the APS-C lenses would only produce a usable image circle circumscribing the rectangular field. Yes, they are there for stray light suppression in an APS-C system.
– Bert
Could someone more knowledgeable than myself suggest what are the likely negative aspects of using the LA-EA4 adapter with the A7R and legacy Minolta AF lenses – apart from the additional size?
Good question, I’d like to know that myself. It’s hard to get that info also hard to get side by side controlled image comparisons taken with a tripod between the 7 an 7r.
I will be renting both and the laea4 adapter and a Metabones adapter and trying a tilt shift lens on both of these cameras to see how I feel about it or if I am waiting for a new A mount…which is most likely.
You can make a pretty good guess by looking at image quality on current FF Sony cameras and how the focus performs on current NEX cameras with the old adapter. If there is a big difference it will most likely be with the widest of the lenses — say wider than 20 or 24mm. The extra pixels of the 7r may help the better lenses, but we’ll have to wait and see.
The A7R has the AA filter removed for superior sharpness, now the LA-EA4 adds a mirror instead…
I would go for an A7 with LA-EA3 and do manual focusing (there might be focus confirmation in the viewfinder but idk).
Also when you compare A77 with NEX-7 (same sensor) on DXOmark, the SLT has worse lowlight performance (more noise).
Only when you shoot sport events with long tele you might need the fast AF with the SLT adapter.
so with the laea3 would that cover ff?
thanks in adavance
What do you think the possibilities of having aa filter on/off control from the user.
I am not as tech as some of you guys, but this seems like it would be a post capture process that should be an option.
An AA filter is physical, in front of the sensor. An AA ON/OFF option may eventually be invented, in the meantime Pentax slightly moves the sensor in the K3 to create blur which reduces aliasing (and sharpness).
And yes, LAEA3 covers full frame, but offers no PDAF.
I appreciate the info!!
Yes, the LA-EA3 is designed for FF.
The missing AA filter on the A7R cannot be made optional because it is built behind the curtain as one unit with the other stuff covering the sensor like IR-filter, microlenses etc.
it CAN be made optional.
Microlenses and CFA are physically are on sensor, and AA/IR filter is a completely separate issue.
Though, adding/removing filters on sensor will change effective flange distance slightly, so manual lenses won’t have infinity focus and LA-EA4 will work improperly.
With that adapter you get the same AF system as in LA-EA2, but with FF coverage.
So you will get all the AF points but all in the center, so not quite the same as A77 or A99 and no stabilization. Plus, non-SSM lenses are noisy. Otherwise, it will work very nicely.
Who would have thought – they don’t cover. And even in those areas they cover – outside of APS-C (and even inside with many E-mount lenses) sharpness, CA etc might be horrible.
New system is new system. Abandon hope all ye who enter here.
Interesting. Looks like you could happily take a full-res (for APC-C) portrait crop from most of those E-mount lenses even with the camera held in landscape orientation.
I think it is A7 review.
The rectangles in some cases suggest that the rear plastic is the limiting factor rather than the glass. Superfluous limitation or structural necessity?
You got a point there, I am curious what the coverage would be without the plastic casing.
Has anybody tried the Sigma trio 19-30-60 on the A7/R uncropped ?
If you did so PLEASE PLEASE let us know the results + some pictures
Thanks
+1
I tried the 30mm at Photoplus but I wasn’t able to save any images. It looks somewhere in between the SEL35 and SEL1018 at 18. So not quite full-frame 🙁 It probably cover APS-H with some severe vingetting. I too was hopeful.
I think the short flange distance worked against us here but maybe Sigma will come out with similar lenses in FE mount. The E-mount world is desperate for a 24mm, 85/90mm, and 135mm. Those are all focal lengths that would be appealing to APS-C and full-frame users.
What about sigma’s 19mm and 30mm 2.8?
I would be willing to bet that the Sigmas will cover only a circle like the SEL1855. They really have very small diameters (exit pupil?), which make them cheaper and lighter.
Out of interest. Macro lenses designed for crop sensors can give full frame coverage if you use a thin extension tube. Whilst this will limit focus to the close-up and macro region it is not a problem if you use the lens as a macro lens. In other words both the SEL3035 and the forthcoming 50mm Zeiss f2.8 Touit will easily cover the FF format, if they are used with one of the E mount auto extension tubes. As I say, this does restrict its use for close-up and macro photograhpy, but then again this is what these lenses are designed for.
They are NOT designed to be used with macro tubes, however. Yeah they will work, but I am not sure if IQ will get any better. By using crop lens on FF body you reduce effect of spherochromatism; but this does not improve lateral chromatism (which is known to be weak point of SEL30F35)
I was thinking about this. If we use a SB with a DSLR MF lens on A7(r), does a 28mm MF lens has ~20mm FOV (28×0.71) on this FF sensor? Putting aside heavy vignetting. Please comments. Thx.
Oops.. Sorry. My bad. This will not happens. I mistaken this as a wide angle converter placed on top of the front element.
Lately, I have seen alot of posts and people wondering about using E mount APSC lenses on A7(r)
uhhh idk it could be just me that is not understanding it but why would anyone use APSC lenses not in APSC crop on a full frame camera?
I guess some find these heavy vignettings awesome?????
More freedom in how you want the picture cropped.
Happy Friday SAR!
While I know many people (such as myself) have decided which new full frame camera to get, others are still trying to decide between the Sony A7/r and the newly announced Nikon Df.
If so, just thought my post this week: ‘The Nikon Df And the Sony A7/7r – Which One To Buy’ (The Definitive Guide) might be of help.
http://marsweekly.wordpress.com/
Never had seen rectangular vignetting. Hipsters MUST know that. It may become a new trend on Instagram.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slide_projector
This particular vignetting is due to the rear plastic element that might be removed and give completely different results.
The same might be true to other APS-C E mount lenses.
Since the Sony 50/1.8 vignates the less, My personal wish is that the Sigma 60/2.8 DN will work perfectly uncropped with or without that plastic rear cover and than having a great moderately fast relatively long normal lens for cheap.
A7 review and File compair D600 6D A99 XPro1
http://www.imaging-resource.com/camera-reviews/sony/a7/#IQC
Finally some nice, in-depth testing.
Great results for both the A7 and 7r!
From their test, they also report that focus is very accurate, none of those focus concerns that NEX series have.
Focus speed is faster than I expected, yey!!
Does anyone know if the slr magic 50 0.95 e-mount will work on a7/r?
I emailed SLR Magic to ask the same thing, and they said the E-mount HyperPrime 50mm f/0.95 will work on a7(R) but it only casts an APS-C image circle, so it’s only usable in crop mode.
The HyperPrime CINE 50mm T0.95 DOES cast a FF image circle, and is available in E-mount, but it’s also 3x the price…
Many people seem to assume that there’s no middle ground between APS-C and FF. Of course, the camera will only output fixed sized crops, but there’s no reason why intermediate crops can’t be used in post-processing on images taken with APS-C lenses. This might still allow a wider field of view than the APS-C crop (or different aspect ratio) without getting into the extreme edges of the image. Of course, it would require a degree of judgement at the time of framing the image and some knowledge of where the usable portions of the image will be, but it’s still potentially very useful.
+1
Yeah, that’s what made the old Canon APS-H bodies so awesome. Quite a few crop lenses were usable, some even gave no increased vignetting.
seems some lenses cannot cover FF just because of the light block shape at the end of the lenses. may be able to cover FF with the light block removed.
Nope. See above.
I just want some lenses! I can easily see myself eventually switching over to FF as I was just blown away by the images even on the LCD of the A7/A7r duo at the Photo Plus Expo, but first I would like to fill out my lens collection and what I’d love is for some telephoto primes. Maybe the e mount system is the wrong system to be hoping for those types of lenses (I’d only need up to 135mm) and I should consider switching to a mount.
Any rumors of upcoming lenses, either FE or APSC? I also wonder if Zeiss will continue to produce their touit lenses or abandon that route and start producing FE glass only.
The next FE lenses will be a macro, a fast prime and a wide zoom.
Given the existance of 35mm and 55mm primes, I’d imagine the fast prime would be an 85 f/1.8, or maybe even a 28 f/2 (wishful thinking!)
The wide zoom I’d guess will be 15-27 f/4
The macro will probably be a 60mm or 70mm f/4 or f/2.8
So, basically everything with a rectangular image circle has some sort of mask on the rear element? Does that meant the 35mm and 50mm does not have a removable mask?
for 35/1.8 and 50/1.8 it just seems to you that they don’t have rear mask; it reality they have.
it’s not noticeable on these photos because, basically, FOV what you see is a some kind of convolution of exit pupil (quite large for these f/1.8 lenses) and rear mask.
for dark lenses like f/4.5-6.3 you can see
Do you think that by removing the mask on the 35/1.8 and 50/1.8 it will change the coverage?
I have both lens and I’m getting pretty excited. Too bad I’m at work right now and don’t have a A7 body yet to check. Can’t wait until I’m home to check if the masks are removable.
Slightly, it will. They will produce perfect circle instead of slightly squared circle.
I was able to remove the mask of my 1.8/50, but it will not add much judging the images above.
The 2.8/16 and the 3.5/30 look more promising, sadly those have bad corner performance on my NEX-5N already so they will be even worse on FF, maybe like a Fujian.
Macro shots with extension tubes will be interesting because they enlarge the image circle.
Correct, Booze, and more specifically, a convolution of a field point’s particular ray bundle at the plane of the mask.
Remove the rectangular mask you get circumscribed circular field.
Vignetting of the circular field occurs at lens edges and mounts internal to the lens, both in the front and the rear. This allows optimizing performance of a given focal plane size, or conversely, a given field.
Especially the zoom lenses show strong rectangular vignetting at the long end, those I would expect to cover full frame after removal of the rear mask.
Also DT lenses for A mount may be of interest, i have seen an example somewhere that Sigma’s new 1.4/30mm covers full frame and Kurt Munger states in his review of the SAL 35F18 that it does so at close distance focus.
hah, terrible. have fun selling all your plastic fantastic lenses.
It is sad to see people considering using APS-C lenses on full frame. The fact is Sony needs to focus on producing high-quality lenses to match this system. Without them, unless you only shoot 35mm and 50mm, or prefer manual focusing, the A7/A7r are too limited. Why buy a full frame sensor camera and use APS-C lenses? I think we would only see such a silly discussion on a Sony forum…
Agreed, I understand if it’s a temp solution (until more lenses are available) But if you purchase the A7/R and plan to use the camera in crop mode only, you might as well stick to your NEX really.
Don’t quite know why you are on this “silly” Sony forum anyway, but maybe because people still have those lenses and not everyone has heaps of $ laying around, in order to run to the shop and buy a whole set of new gear. Buying a FF and using NEX lenses makes the upgrading path a bit softer on the wallet.
And you can still use the APS-C lenses in crop-mode on the A7-cameras.
More interested to see how the older FF Minolta AF lenses perform.
Does this camera have a Hemi?
i think the vinyette is pretty interesting for some lenses, could be good for some arty protrait shots for example.
if theres a emount teleconverter that would be a work around too
or a mount apsc lens > 1.4 tc > adapter
for the lulz 🙂
Wow, that’s horrible. I feel sorry for those who spend $1000 on a Carl Zeiss 24/1.8 or 10-18 and it’s not even futureproof.
I feel sorry for people who continually post silly remarks without thinking first. APS-C format lenses are not designed for full frame sensor no matter what brand. How does their incompatibility somehow imply they are not future proof? If the future of Sony camera’s only had full frame sensors then maybe your pity might make sense, but I don’t see APS-C dying any time soon. NEX format isn’t going anywhere, they are just rebranding everything so E-Mount APS-C lenses still have a future.
Just think where Sony would be if they invested as much in lens support as introducing new camera bodies. It’s mind-boggling that they continue to introduce more bodies with limited native lens. I suppose they are counting on people using legacy glass, but that does not always work so well, especially for us underwater shooters who need small native lens to fit our underwater port systems.
Seeing these conversations on Sony FF frame bodies just makes me smile and think of how long I’ve waited for lens for my NEX7. Fortunately, Zeiss has and continues to come to the rescue at a price mind you 🙁 Still, thanks Zeiss for supporting the e-mount platform in both FF and APS-C. Hope you FF guys don’t have to wait as long as us APS-C shooters for glass. I mean we still don’t have any macro lens (other than the 30mm which is way too short for average macro use) after how many years?
It would be nice to seem a couple moderately priced longer macros (70-100mm) or wider primes (10-14mm) from Sigma. Their lenses are very sharp for the cost factor and tend to keep to the small form factor which works for us UW shooters and folks who want a high IQ travel system. Seems like they’ve been rather quiet on the e-mount line since the release of their popular art series.
Anyone hear any rumors on that front for APS-C?
Nice test… Has anyone shot video with the same lens test to see how it crops to minimize vignette? It might just be a little on the sides. We don’t really know how much crop is added to the video mode. Since this camera will be adapted by a fair amount of video people due to the uncompressed hdmi output, cine lenses with the right adapter may even have less vignetting, especially anamorphic lenses. Any comment from someone with a camera?