Panasonic GM1 vs the others (including GH3 and BMPCC) from Andrew Reid on Vimeo.
Andrew from EosHD (Click here) reviewed the one camera my postman will finally bring me today…the Panasonic GM1! 🙂
His focus is on the GM1 video quality and his conclusions are quite surprising:
The GM1 is a surprise in low light. At ISO 3200 the GH3 has a lot of brown noise crawling over the image and detail begins to smudge. The GM1 here outperforms the GH3 with a much cleaner image with less noise and richer colour. It’s actually on par with the best Super 35mm cameras for video like the Nikon D5200 for low light. But it resolves more fine detail than the Nikon and has more features, despite being the size of a compact camera.
It’s precisely as a genuine compact camera where the GM1 impresses.
I will test my GM1 today. I know the E-M1, the GH3 and many other camera got a lot more attention by reviewers and testers. But I think the GM1 is the camera of the year 2013. Simply because at the end it does exactly what I always needed. Deliver me a top quality Image and Video quality performance in a real pocketable size.
GM1 preorder list:
In US at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto.
In Europe at Amazon Germany, Wex Germany, Amazon UK, Fotohanskeuzekamp, Cyberphoto Sweden and Wex UK.
64 Responses
Wow.
Haha I tweeted that article at same time, great minds eh…
nice!
Now if we could just marry the oly 5-axis with the GM1 video we would have a world beating camera. It looks awesome in Andrews samples. Binning instead of line skipping is the way to go.
dont forget to add blackmagic’s dynamic range and RAW shooting.
too bad you can’t cameras specify camera’s “a la carte”.
each company has its own strengths, and you can’t have them all.
that is really surprising! if I was looking for a new personal camera the gm1 would fit the bill nicely
amazing camera
When will Oly and Panny half their prices? I mean, I soon can get a small FF-body with lens for about the same price as the E-m1 with lens.. I just dont get their pricing, especially with lenses. We should start an uproar against overpriced lenses for small-sensored cameras!
Did you bother to see the video? Your precious FF A7R had mediocre video performance. So go to another forum and spout your nonsense.
You have to pay for the small complete package. FF lenses are just too big, and bigger is not always better… 😉 Why don’t you just buy the FF camera and be happy with it?
When will Canon and Nikon half their prices? When will Sony half the prices on their A7 specific quality lenses? When wilk Leica half their prices? When will Nikon reduce the size of their D4 to the size of the Df — since both use 135-sized sensors?
+1 🙂
I bet there must also have been people who said, back in the 50ies “why is a Leica M3 more expensive than a Graflex? You cannot even do decent sized contact prints with it!”
Then go and buy your precious FF camera. You might not want to use it but at least you will have saved some money.
You guys are not fair to him. He has the right to complain about price of anuthing he/she doesnt like or out of his reach.
And you all should be so narrow minded when someone complain about price of a product that is produced by a company you are fan of.
After all he has not said somehing to hurt you. There are alot of people I know who has considered to buy EM1 but as soon as they compare with big sensor camera they will ignor picking up EM1 due to price. Of course not every one care about big sensor or price since they have already got lots of investmwnt in m43 lenses. But wha I am talking about is those who has not invested in lenses they will do this compariaon.
*should not be
If he was saying APS-C, yes, your point was fair.
And in that case the fair anwser would be something like: canons, nikons and to lesser extent sonys have huge economy of scale, selling several million of most of their models. Panasonic and Olympus combined barely reach a million cameras per year world wide, so it otta be more expensive because they don’t have the same economy of scale. Then we could have discuss why that is the case, and I believe the problem is there crappy, terrible marketing, at least in the USA.
But he said Full Frame, not APS-C and really there’s no comparison in full frame: even top of the line m43 is way cheaper than the cheapest full frame (which then happens to be very bad and practically useless full frame). See http://www.stevehuffphoto.com/2013/12/03/my-pick-for-camera-of-the-year-2013-the-olympus-om-d-e-m1/ for example, where m43 wins against 3 full frame camera — regardless of price (which happens to be in the m43 favor).
Prime example of internet nonsense. Let’s see.
A quick look at Amazon will show you that proper FF cameras (ie not Sony toys) cost less than the E-M1, with and without lenses. So you wrote an obvious lie.
Then you feel the need to back up your lie, so you quote someone else (like a sheep), and you quote a prat (Huff, who is not exactly a great photographer, is he?).
You see the pattern? Write rubbish – quote someone else – maybe add a number or two. Somewhere else, you will find more rubbish, supported by a quote on the first piece of it. It can go on and on. Brains are blank. The unaware consumer gets screwed.
“Prime example of internet nonsense. Let’s see.”
What is? the thing you just posted?
Absolutely, lets see…
“A quick look at Amazon will show you that proper FF cameras (ie not Sony toys) cost less than the E-M1, with and without lenses. So you wrote an obvious lie.”
Show us the links, because the Amazon I’m looking at shows the exact opposite of what you claim, as do B&H and each and every local shop, unless you are talking about an oil-spot ridden second-hand D600.
“Then you feel the need to back up your lie, so you quote someone else (like a sheep), and you quote a prat (Huff, who is not exactly a great photographer, is he?).”
Hmm yes, back up claims, something you obviously can’t do with the lies you are posting here. Insert an insult here and there, and what do we end up with?
“You see the pattern?”
Yes quite, a pattern of you trying to dismiss things by being rude and arrogant and with total lack of any kind of argument or fact that supports your dismissive point of view.
And then they always leave their camera at home. One of my friends just bought a gx1 and 20/1.7 to complement his 5dmk3, because he wanted something more practical. By now, he spent some 2k on lenses, and hasn’t been using his 5dmk3 at all. On hindsight he thinks he should have bought an e-m5 or even gh3 instead, but let himself be held back by the exact same flawed logic as you use here.
The proper approach?
– consider your needs
– consider your budget
– consider which system can best forfill your needs within your budget
Note 2 things: needs is also about image quality, but also about things like handling, portability, obtrusiveness etc, and you need to consider the system as a whole, the body is a small part of that, and its price should be an accordingly small part of the entire consideration.
What you do however is claiming that one car is better based on the price of the tires and with total disregard of what the car will be used for.
“I just dont get their pricing, especially with lenses.”
Ever thought of the fact that lenses for smaller formats need higher precision?. That photography started with large formats was not only due to the large grain of early emulsions and the unavailability of enlargers, but also due to the fact that you can adequately focus the large focal lengths going with a large format by a simple bellows mechanism, whereas the tiny focal lengths in smartphones require micrometer precision. For lenses, there is no natural correspondence between format and price: Smaller formats require more precise focusing mechanics (due to the shorter focal lengths to be focussed), higher resolution lens assemblies (to compensate for the smaller pixel size), and more precise fitting (again to the less forgiving smaller pixel size), yet save on their smaller image circle (due to the smaller format), size of the tube, and on power of the actuation mechanisms (due to lower weight of the lens groups to be moved and shorter travel distances). None of these factors does automatically dominate the others. “Smaller should be cheaper”, though appealing to intuition, therefore is no valid argument.
Please note that in the commercial world there is no link between cost and selling price. Selling price is determined by market, targeted customers, etc. Cost is what it is, a company can not choose their cost as they can with the selling price.
If the margin, resulting of selling price vs. cost, gets too low, a business is simply not made.
Now cost is influenced from fixed costs and variable costs. The more items are sold, the lower the influence of fixed cost is. So cost per item drops with increasing volume, not linear.
Normally the volumes that can be sold are driven by price vs. volume market elasticity, in a first step this is normally estimated as a linear function.
Bringing both equations together determines the selling price with maximum EBIT achieved.
Simple as that.
Get a better job.
What are you waiting for? Go play with it and do’t come back anymore, tired of kind of posts
This means that the GX7 should also show the same video performance as the GM1 since they both have the same sensor.
But the gm1 has its limitations. Small battery,and no 60p.The gx7 does not has those limitations.
I wonder how the all intra codec from the gh3 is comparable to the standard gm1/gx7 codec
You didn’t mention a 29min59s video recording limit when comparing with the BMPCC.
Could it actually be gone with the GM1?
Hey Guys. What’s wrong with you all. Man..
This is a consumer camera, aimed at enthusiasts, and it is performing better than expected. that’s great. Let’s rejoice, not be unsatisfied because it doesn’t do XYZ, which is NOT supposed to do to start with.
Take a Fiat car that in a review turns out to be more rugged than (say) a urban SUV, in tough terrains tests. Impressive. But now people go crazy about wanting 4 Wheels drive and so on.. How realistic is that?!
Yes, it’s better then expected.
But I’m frustrated at seeing all these shiny new cameras and I can’t make any use of them just because they have these stupid artificial limits.
EU models get limited to 30min while non-EU models record hours on end without even dropping a single audio sample or frame at the 2GB border yet don’t allow for 25fps.
(I don’t understand why this doesn’t seriously piss off more US residents visiting the EU with 50Hz power grids. Half their indoor vacation clips are wasted.)
Would you accept your digital photo camera to be artificially limited to 39 photos per SD-card?
The GH3 has no recording limit so my guess is that the gm1 doesnt either. What happens on an EU GH3 is that the camera automaticly start a new clip with no frame drop or audio aout of sync.
Of cause the GH3 has that limit.
“In the model for PAL areas, motion image can be recorded in 29 min 59 sec”
My GH2s and GH1s can record more but only because they are hacked and there is no stable hack for the GH3.
My GH2, GH3 and GX7 do NOT have the 30 min limit. Just because it exists in YOUR market because of your silly taxation laws doesn’t mean the rest of the world is lumbered with it.
Have you shot (video) the GX7 for over 30 min? My understanding was that it topped out at 29:59, likely due to sensor heating rather than taxation. The GH3 is the only body I’ve seen that will go for hours straight.
Write to your government and complain. That limit isn’t there because Panasonic wants it, but because of EU import duty regulations.
As far as I know this 29min59s video limit is due to tax laws in Europe.
If a device can record longer video than 30mins, it’s classified as a camcorder (and not a digital camera) and people would have to pay more taxes.
So I highly doubt it will be gone with the GM1
Yes, that’s the reason.
It would add 2% or something to the (much lower) bulk-price the importing dealers pay before it goes to the small dealers and then to the customers.
*IF* non-EU models would allow 25fps the customer caring for video capabilities would have the option of importing a non-EU model, paying that <10eur fee(2% of the much higher end user price) and buying a new charger cable.
Actually I just checked….
both have 0% customs now.
http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/dds2/taric/measures.jsp?Lang=de&Taric=85219000&SimDate=20131206
http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/dds2/taric/measures.jsp?Lang=de&Taric=90065380&SimDate=20131206
I hope this means the end of this stupid limit in future models. I would happily pay extra 2% for an enabled variant. Instead I have to buy only Panasonic cameras and wait for them to be hacked by Vitaly
but I think that the ECJ has ruled (I think after a challenge by Canon)that taric classification is not affected if the limitation can be by bypassed through software upgrade or accessories. I did not know that camcorders are now subject to 0% custom duties, but maybe the Commission through in the towel, after that judgment?
Enjoy your GM1, Admin! It’s the one I’ve been waiting for too. I need to save harder and faster after seeing that video =)
It also goes to show that supported adequately small sensors have little to fear from the big ones. Probably in terms of thermal noise the yield is better.
To me, a mere enthusiast the only thing missing is the 5-axis IBIS, because tiny cameras are hell for handshake, and 5-axis is a dream for movies.
AFAIK for video we only have 3 axis.
Olympus reduces from 5 to 3 in video mode and Panasonic only supports 3 axis to start with.
Not that it isn’t a great thing for video still.
Are you sure about that, I am quite sure the 5-axis is included for video, using a 135mm lens on my E-M5 right now, I get the same level of stabilisation in stills or video from the IBIS, and it’s quite a challenge for the camera to keep that telephoto so still, works amazingly well. But anyway the panasonic 3-axis IS is completely disabled in video mode for now.
I agree with amalric, the 5-axis and the GM1 video would be a killer.
http://www.eoshd.com/content/8565/olympus-om-d-e-m5-review
“Even though the full 5 axis in-body stabilisation does not work with the Nokton 25mm F0.95 in video mode it still adds a slight crop when enabled – possibly because of a less effective electronic stabilisation mode being activated instead.”
That got fixed in a firmware update its 5 axis for video
Cool,
thanks for the info!
“5-axis IBIS” … and maybe a few more manual controls? And a few more pancake lenses?
We can dream about Oly’s response, or GM2, I guess.
Can I advise this solution of mine, instead of the Zacuto one, to shade the LCD and stabilise the camera?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/amalric/4789768782/in/set-72157629693142319
http://www.flickr.com/photos/amalric/4789763932/in/set-72157629693142319
tIt’s called the RetroFinder 🙂 Have fun!
Lol, much more enticing than the commercially available solutions. May be not inventive enough for a patent, but worth filing for a utility model; a commercial solution could use a stick-on-the-screen frame, with sliders to attach the finder.
So how do you attach that to the camera?
so can use at iso 1600? with noetremly bad noise? due o a very tiny sensor?
Pixel size is only comparable within sensors of the same generation and build.
A more modern sensor with smaller pixels and less noise can outperform a less advanced one with larger pixels in low light as well as in dynamic range. “Full Frame” has no intrinsic advantage. It’s just easier to build a better full frame sensor when keeping the megapixels the same but that has to actually be done.
oh really ?so why u can;t event think to a pic in iso up 1600 in any m43 sensor now thay are better than FF sensor fanboy failure even panasonic will leave this system m43 is dead
Hey, if you insist on trolling, could you at least try to write something remotely approaching English so we can actually enjoy your nonsense?
Haha, the word spaghetti is the fun!
Every recent m43has better resolution, lower noise and higher DR than, for example, the Canon 5D.
Sure, now take your meds, the nice guys in white are coming soon.
http://idata.over-blog.com/3/10/47/74/dont_feed_the_troll.jpg
A few days ago I got the chance to hold and handle the new 2013 cameras. Of them the GM1 interested me most and the Sony A7(R) impressed me most. The EM1 is superb, but a logical development of the ground-breaking EM5. The GX7 brings – to me – little over the EM5. The Nikon df? As lighter, but just look at the top of the camera with all “manual” controls it just makes me tired..
The GM1 is Sony RX100 size-wise, but with larger sensor and interchangeable lens is mouth-watering. Not as your only camera, but a perfect complement to any other system, be it m43 or……
Better to hold than the RX100 and seemingly as easy to configure and use. Have to agree with Admin, this is the camera of 2013.
I would argue that the manual controls are the best thing about the Df (and, if you are into FF, lens (backward) compatibility and the fact that it is smaller than the D4 would be the other).
Dayum, this is the camera to beat in this form factor. I hope the next generation processor will have a lower TDP so 1080p60 will be possible.
ADMIN, PLEASE POST YOUR REVIEW OR AT LEAST IMPRESSIONS IN USE OF THE GM1.
Thanks!
Dav
I shot Wed night with GH3 and GM1. Both on sticks unattended (live band). The GM1 had the kit zoom – was going to put the 25/1.4 on but needed a wider shot. Given the dark club both did OK but there are two big differences that may or may not affect a user. First, the battery on the GM1 did not make it through the entire 1.5 hour set. And as others have noted, it will not record more than 29min. The GH3 otoh, was “set it and forget it”, made it through the entire night on a single battery, and will shoot for 2+ hours non-stop. Different tools. The GM1 is a pretty cool engineering feat though, and I prefer the GH3/GM1 pair to GH3/GX7. ymmv.
“Simply because at the end it does exactly what I always needed.”
Finally, the cam, a perfect fit for your favorite 2.8/17mm lens.