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Back in June 2013, Panasonic & Fujfilm announced, that they were developing an organic CMOS sensor, which, amongst the others should be capable of:
– industry’s highest dynamic range of 88dB
– 1.2 times higher sensitivity than conventional sensors to capture clear images even in low light
– range of incident angle expanded to 60 degrees for faithful color reproduction
But since then, we didn’t hear anything about this almost mythical organic sensor. The last thing I’ve heard from sources, was that Fujifilm and Panasonic were having problems due to too much heat being generated and high battery drain. And 43rumors said the sensor is stil 2 or 3 years to go.
Will it ever become true? I don’t know. Many of us also started thinking, that Fuji and Panasonic completely dropped its development… but maybe that’s not the case.
In fact, on February 1st, at the 2016 IEEE International solid-state circuits conference, Panasonic is giving a talk about an “over 120dB Dynamic Range Ultra Low Noise Organic CMOS sensor”.
So, if this is the development of the same organic sensor that Fuji & Panasonic announced back in 2013, then it means that not only they didn’t drop plans on it, but they were even able to improve its performance, boosting its dynamic range from amazing 88dB to astonishing 120dB+.
I know many of us just started salivating, but we better be careful with this information. It could still be a pretty long way off, before we’ll see it implemented in a Fuji/Panasonic camera (if ever). But in any case, on the 1st of February, we should all listen carefully at what Panasonic has to tell us.
thx to the FR-reader for the link 🙂
Read Page 18 of the IEEE program
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39 Responses
From 88 to 120db+ sounds too good to be true. So much DR, like the human eye?!?
I don’t know if it’s the same dynamic range of the eyes, but for sure we are getting pretty close to it. Something for the X-Pro3 😉
If X-Pro2 bring the organic sensor, it will be a real revolution, not just a marketing evolution.
I’m afraid it’s too early for the X-Pro2
maybe we can see it on medium format fuji camera. Or wish on xt-2
new sensor tech is almost always first used for small-sized (but large-volume) sensors.
For sure as an organic sensor would mean no X-trans at all.
No organic for X-Pro 2.
A young healthy human can distinguish between 14-18 DR stops of dynamic range depending on the contrast in the scene.
6 dB equals one full stop. 120 dB equals to 20 DR stops, more than our best vision.
Wikipedia says 1 stop is 3db: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamic_range
So that’d be 40 stops sensor!
+ 3dB = double power
+ 6dB = double amplitude (voltage & etc).
In this case, 6dB is one DR stop.
And what is the amplitude supposed to be here? 3 dB is one stop of course.
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/16500012
96 dB is 16 bits in amplitude, but not in energy. You can quote as many other forum entries or comments with the same mistake, unless you can find negative luminous energy somewhere in the universe, that is not gonna change. But if you do, you will also win a Nobel prize. 😉
Believe what you want, if you search for in deep sensor characteristics you’ll see the dB numbers and if you divide the numbers by 6 you’ll get the DR stops. I forgot the exact mathematical formula but the info is correct.
Then the quantity in dB is signal to noise ratio, not dynamic range.
Yeah…according to another in-depth article on the DR subject, 4dB would be about 1.36EV…so ~2.94dB would be 1EV…
The article is German though…
http://www.lunatics.de/Archive/1129
That should actually be way more than the human eye can do (“in one pass”). However, the advantage of the eye over the sensor is that it can adapt in no time. So it’s more like a “native HDR-sensor”…
Sadly it is lIkely still a long way from production ready. If they had it ready for the X-Pro 2, Fuji would definitely get my money. But, a 24 mp cmos sensor that is only incrementally better than the one in my X-Pro 1 will likely not be worth $2k after tax. We will soon see, but the organic sensor would have been a great reason for the long wait.
That said, perhaps the organic sensor is the reason for the long wait, as Panasonic is now talking about 120db – perhaps the 88db version is finally ready, and it will be introduced in the X-Pro 2…
I want to believe..
Could this be the collaboration I read about Panasonic and Fujifilm working on, an organic sensor that would result in a 41MP APS-C sensor?
http://www.dpreview.com/articles/4263474764/fujifilm-and-panasonic-organic-cmos-sensor-industry-leading-dynamic-range-and-sensitivity
EDIT: Disregard this post as I’m a tool and missed the date of the article above.
As the admin said, that article is dated June 2013. If you look at the images in that DPR article and in the FR article (click “June 2013”) you will see they are identical. So, yes, this is the collaboration.
LOL My bad missing that!
Are you sure it isn’t planned for April 1st?
LOL
+100db Single-Photon-Detecting look more interest to me.
@ 6.6
That is most advance image sensor that sometime call Quanta Image Sensor.
I believe that a sensor like this still will be located in industry/military application before cameras
why, so that they have the means of ultimate control over anyone? but yes, it seems inevitable. at least until the faith in the economy of things falls completely apart.
Sounds like aerospace/military/scientific/CCTV kind of sensor. Vast majority of consumers will have no idea what to do with such DR.
That’s not a problem. 1) aim at meal. press shutter. 2) aim at boy/girlfriend on beach. press shutter. 3) aim at kid eating spaghetti, post on facebook. There’s more?
120dB means 20EV dynamic range at base ISO. (Yes, 20 not 40EV!) Perhaps you think that is too much for any use, but if one reformulates that into “14EV DR at ISO 6400”, I think everyone get the point..
“Everyone” are whining that the current Fuji RAFs are huge for the 16 megapixel camera. Now imagine a full 20EV 24 megapixel raw file, lossless. In glorious 32 bits. Everyone needs that, right?
Or maybe we’ll compress that 20EV range in a 14 bit file… which means tone mapping. You know, there’s a standard tone mapping algorithm that pleases everyone.
Everyone got the point?
maybe the user of such a senzor could get a night sky exposure in less than 30 seconds…. justa thought.
meh: http://www.amazon.com/SanDisk-Extreme-256GB-Memory-SDSDXPA-256G-G46/dp/B00NP63XGE/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1448847753&sr=8-7&keywords=sandisk+128gb+sd+card
Nope, 40 EV. 0.3 dB is one stop.
so you would bar me from having the fun, aye? yous so mean!
On the same day Panasonic will talk about a “210ke- Saturation Signal 3µm-Pixel Variable-Sensitivity Global-
Shutter Organic Photoconductive Image Sensor for Motion Capture” according to the program….
yeah,compose organic and global shutter, i wish it release tomorrow and watch this innovation,LOL.
Look Single Photon detect image sensor this it much talking on new generation of image sensor.
If organic pixels are half the size of regular pixels, does depth of field get 1 or 2 stops shallower? Would an APSC sized organic sensor provide the same or shallower results than FF with old style pixels of today?