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The video on top shows you how much the Full Frame sensor moves to stabilize the image. Quite incredible that there is enough space on E-mount to make it work!
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153 Responses
ав щиет сау куал
all other 5 axis IBIS from other brands makes some kind of noise, which can be annoying at some time, like for recording souds in video, I wonder if this system do the same and if a external microphone is needed ?
I was wondering that, too. But in this video I can’t hear much noise. Wait and see…
Wow. That is insane!
Very impressive. Hopefully they make the tech available across all lines (APC-S and 1 Inch systems)
Now that Sony have IBIS and probably the best sensors in the business, all that is remaining is good (and more) glass.
There is alredy exellent glass for FE-mount. We just need more of as well as a budget line.
“We just need more of as well as a budget line.”
That is very much possible now that they can eliminate OSS from future lenses; can be smaller as well.
Will it crop the image? cause as in RX100 camera it will actually crop the image when the SteadyShoot is ON!! and crop even more on different level of SteadyShoot !!
No, it doesn’t crop. At least there is no info on that on the press release.
RX100 has two types of steadyshot:
1) standard (lens moves, no crop)
2) active (lens and software, some crop)
This camera can have both.
not quite. AFAIK the A7II does no steadyshot in software like the RX100. It does it completely in hardware as you can impressively see in that video. Savvy?
Once again: 2 types of steadyshot on RX100, which are optional, and selectable. The first one only uses the lens OSS to reduce shake.
If that is not enough for you, the second choice also includes software to reduce shake, which crops part of the frame, as if you are using the warp stabilizer in Premiere Pro or another video editing program.
The RX100 has BOTH. I know this because I have one.
I don’t see why the A7II wouldn’t have software “steadyshot” ON TOP of the hardware steadyshot JUST LIKE the RX100.
http://interceptor121.files.wordpress.com/2012/10/img_2942.jpg?w=672&h=372&crop=1
Savvy?
No…
this setting probably affects video only
and video is always cropped.
Answering the OP: “Will it crop the image? cause as in RX100 camera it will actually crop
the image when the SteadyShoot is ON!! and crop even more on different
level of SteadyShoot !!”
Hence I explain, the two differences of Steadyshot.
Active steadyshot is only related to video, and crop happens.
Hardware can be used for both, no crop factor on either. Video just crops the ratio from 3:2 to 16:9
I don’t like cropping. We no longer use film and can use any HxW dimensions for video yet cameras restrict us.
If I need to use low res video to save storage, NEX wastes about 1/2 area of sensor…
I have news for you. Virtually every 35mm film print or slide was, in effect, cropped. Every slide mount I have has a dimension rather less than 24 x 36mm (usually a 2mm or so less). There’s always a slight overlap on the mount. Similarly, commercial prints were almost always slightly cropped.
Of course, if you have the time and/or money then hand prints can be as accurate to the exposed area as you like, but that’s not an option open to all.
In short, the odd mm or two was common with film, and it was never a big issue. Why should it be on digital?
that film crop wasn’t like throwing away half or sensor’s area
I suspect not, but the worst that might happen is a bit of vignetting in the corners.
I don’t think it’s gonna crop.
I was reading, long ago, something about the actual size of the image circle and they were presenting some numbers.
I can’t find that page anymore, sorry I can’t post a link, but the actual image circle is a bit bigger than the actual 43.2mm diagonal of the full frame sensor, this to avoid too much light fall off in the corners.
Some will say it’s 44mm, but it was more than just a mere 0.8mm more.
Without going to extremes (a tilt/shift lens has an image circle of 58mm, if I remember correctly, but that’s for obvious reasons) I think they were talking about some extra mm.
So, I think the sensor has enough “room” to move around and avoid going out of the actual image circle of the lens.
Maybe some others reader have more infos about it.
His query is unrelated to the image circle.
He mentions the stabilising of the image by way of cropping part of it to “move” the image and stabilise it, as stabilising software would do (making the image larger to have room for crop)
Google, Premiere Pro Warp Stabilizer to see this at work. Sony’s software steadyshot (known as Active Steadyshot in the RX100) uses software along with the lens’ OSS hardware to reduce shake in the same principle as Premiere Pro’s Warp Stabilizer.
Fair enough, but to me it sounded like it was.
Because since the sensor’s gonna move around in order to stabilise, most likely’s gonna fall out of the image circle if the last is not gonna be big enough to cover also those areas going black because of the movements.
Hence: it’s gonna crop away those black parts resulting from the busting of the image circle.
That’s how I’ve interpreted his question.
If referring to stills, then his answer is already found in A-mount camera user experience, which to my knowledge there is no crop since the A900 and a850 are, effectively, A7II’s predecessors and not once have I heard of cropping because of IBIS.
Exactly my point, put in a lot easier way. 😉
It will have to. The mount is already too narrow and close for many lenses, and if you start moving that sensor about, you are going to need cropping.
Sony has two kinds of IBIS, an electronic one (crops) and a mechanical one (doesn’t crop, instead moves the entire sensor). The A7ii appears to have at least the mechanical version. The RX00 only has the electronic one. Something like the A77 has both – mechanical for stills and electronic for video (electronic = less heat, hence the reason for its use in video). The only real disadvantage of the electronic IBIS on the A77 for video is that it crops the viewfinder (you see a slight zoom). There is no point in having an IBIS that has both mechanical and electronic crop, because you would have the disadvantages of both (sensor heating and viewfinder crop when IBIS is on). I therefore assume the A7ii will be very similar to the A77 implementation with respect to stills/video – mechanical, no crop for stills, electronic (with resulting viewfinder ‘zoom’) for video.
I know people that, when they see this, they would day: “never thought I would live to see this”.
that is one caffeinated little sensor…
how about the a7/a7r issues? is it fixed in this?
a7: sensor flare
a7r: shutter vibration
They still haven’t fixed the fuji troll defense …
what is the fuji troll defense?
I was just referring to the fuji fan trolling the A7 and A7R
why do you think it’s trolling? i could pick i_love_sony nickname if it makes your day.
The question is still valid, if you dont know the answer and are a sonyfanboy, pls be quiet and move on.
wait for a9
You could never do that with A-mount, as IBIS wouldn’t work with a lens in place. Just one of those extra fun things you can now do with E-mount.
Or as others would say, E-mount is more like a cool gadget than a photo camera.
Now I want a camera than can contact scan negatives.
I can do this with my A500 too. Remove lens, M mode, exposure several seconds and voila, see the sensor move.
Looks like the maximum amplitude of movement is much larger in the A7II system though.
Interesting. As IBIS requires the focal length, I wonder what it assumes.
The amplitude doesn’t surprise me. There’s more space around an APS-C sensor of course, and image circle isn’t really an issue. Then, for any given movement, it might also appear bigger, just in proportion to to the sensor. Incidentally, the Olympus MFT mechanism appears to move a lot.
However, this does raise the issue over how effective A7 II stabilisation will be on longer lenses if movement is more restrictive (as longer focal lengths require proportionately more movement for any given degree of yaw or pitch (but not roll – that’s focal length independent).
No doubt reports will come in. It looks to me that the A7 sensor movement is probably less than +/- 2mm. with a 500mm lens, that’s a pitch or yaw of about 1/5th degree, or 12 minutes of arc in either direction. (1mm of IBIS movement would halve that of course).
I meant that the amplitude in the FF system displayed seems much larger than with my A500. So the other way around of what you explained.
Then again, the claimed effectiveness is larger too.
Current alpha mount IBIS gets less effective as the focal length goes up. You can use IBIS to use a lower shutter hand held, but you cannot use it to allow a longer shake-free focal length hand held. Reason being that the sensor movement is massively magnified by the focal length at about 100mm onwards. Also, on later Sony Alphas, video uses an electronic IBIS rather than mechanical (to avoid heating). I’m guessing the new IBIS will be the same in both respects..
If the Olympus implementation is anything to go by, it should be quite effective at longer FL’s too (where the old system was less effective). But I agree this remains to be seen.
As for video, there are already demonstrations of the mechanical system working during video, contrary to the latest A mount cameras (similar to the A55/A33). It’s likely a magnetic “floating” design now, which imposes much less friction (thus heat, battery drain and audible noise) than the system found in A mount cameras (piezo actuators). And thus allow much longer operation without problems such as found in the A55/A33.
I once did a test with a friend comparing 2 brand new A55 cameras, using IBIS during video to see how long it would take for them to overheat and stop recording. One was clearly louder than the other and the more silent one, lasted up to twice as long (6 vs 12 mins IIRC) before overheating.
The new IBIS works mechanically for video too, as seen in demonstration videos. Helped by the fact that it’s a magnetically floating design, vs piezo actuators (A mount). Which means much less friction and thus less heat, less battery drain and less audible noise.
It probably works better for long FL’s too thanks to the extra axis and possibly also due to a larger amplitude and faster operation.
I’ve used A-Mount on 200mm and in-body stabilisation works well for me. With a 500mm it needs more care but makes a differences. However, it depends a lot on camera technique.
At 100mm you need a lot of yaw/pitch to exceed the travel of the sensor. Just 2mm of sensor movement will compensate for over 1.1 degrees, or twice the diameter of the moon as seen from the Earth – and that’s in both directions. At 200mm it’s one moon diameter in each direction.
There’s no doubt that OSS has an advantage on the longest focal lengths, but then it can’t compensate for roll movement.
“Enough space” will still vignette with lenses with exit pupil at infinity
I don’t know of any true image-space telecentric lenses which might be mounted onto. Possibly some exist, but I don’t know of any.
However, on a general point, it seems to me corner vignetting could happen anyway with an exit pupil far enough away and large enough that some masking might happen. There’s precious little room between the end of the lens barrel and the sensor for “image spread”, expecialy if the exit pupil is fairly large compared to the internal lens barrel diameter.
Of course, if there is a little vignetting, then it can be dealt with in PP by adjustment or a minor crop.
We will have to see, but no doubt there will be a shock horror story in a couple of months time and this will be presented as the end of the world, like light leaks or wobbly mounts.
I wonder if they will ever make an “A5”, more compact and without an EVF and associated volume…I would buy one of those. The RX2 could be the perfect compact full-frame if it would feature the 5-axis stabilization and curved sensor, but I kind of doubt that an hypotetically curved sensor could be stabilized this way at this technology point in time…hopefully I’m wrong.
on an ideal curved sensor, 3-axis should be enough 😀
Hoping hoping hoping for some sort of A5s. I can’t give up the amazing 12MP high ISO sensor, but I would LOVE to remove the viewfinder. Every time I look at it I’m upset about the coat pocket camera that could have been. A detachable viewfinder is greatly preferred, and I bet there is a huge market for a camera this powerful, but that much more compact.
The marketing could be something along the lines of
“Your Coat Pocket Is Your New Camera Bag”
Or they could just make a full frame like the rx100 III with pop up viewfinder. That would be awesome.
Popup viewfinder would be the ideal solution, as I do use the viewfinder only in harsh direct sunlight. Otherwise, I never use it. But if that weren’t an option, I would gladly pay MORE for the viewfinder to be removed. The A7s would suddenly become a lot more convenient and useful to me.
An A5s that is the A7s without viewfinder (but WITH 5 axis IBIS) would be the dream camera…….
Uhh, you want vibrations of wobbly sensor make you feel good when in pocket?
You still need to mount some lens. I don’t think a viewfinder makes a huge difference compared even to the 24-70 f/4 size, unless you’re gonna carry the camera in one pocket and the lens in another one 🙂
I actually have a large lens on my A7s most of the time, but I still manage to fit it in my coat pocket. It’s just that that damn beast of a protruding viewfinder makes it much harder to put the camera in or take the camera out quickly, which slows me down and annoys me every time. And it makes the coat pocket bulge that much wider and more unsightly. With some coats, that bulge means it’s way to tight to get out easily, or it doesn’t fit at all.
The reason I love mirrorless is because the smaller size allows me to take my high quality camera almost everywhere. I would be so much happier if that viewfinder simply wasn’t there.
The Zeiss FE 35mm F2.8 would make the “A5” as small as the RX1, with added optical stabilization (assuming the grip would also be smaller).
Does it sound like Darth Vader breathing or is he still working for Olympus?
Darth Vader is working the hardest in my E-M5 where the sound is louder than E-M1.
But there are reports it is even louder in E-M10. Tough I have to say in the E-M5 you only hear it if you are in a very quiet environment. 😉
It’s vignetting, a lot in the corners
I cannot image it on the a7r which is suffering a lot of micro-moves under 1/250 sec…….
uhm…….
I would prefer a tripod….. or waiting for a sincere street test swearing it does work
Any degree of vignetting in corners will have to await tests. In any event, it’s not the end of the world if about 5% is cropped out or corrected.
In any event, in many of the situations where handhold & IBIS is appropriate, corner behaviour isn’t so important as the subjects for action photographs, birds and street photography are towards the middle part of the frame and correcting vignetting in PP isn’t too much of an issue.
We’ll see, but tripod (for the right situation) is always an option.
nb. “hybrid” stabilsation, where OSS is used on the lens and IBIS just for roll correction won’t suffer any vignetting issues as the corners won’t move further from the image centre.
ok you are right. I fully agree.
Let us look from a different point of view, if possible: a pro point of view, HighIQ desire.
Could we accept wide angle limited usage with such a Pro High Resolution camera?
Could we tollerate approximation of corners because of IBIS or such a little mount diameter?
Could we tollerate thicker IR filter that impact so much (someone told) ?
Could we accept shutter so strongly shaking?
Could we accept light leak through the mount (ok at 128000 ISO…)?
Plastic emount that we have to substitute with brass made ring?
Were is going HIQ photography, only towards software manipulation ?
Ok, but for every day photography it’s more than a jewel.
The A7 II isn’t. of course, such a camera. We’ll see with the A9 (many of the issues you refer to, like IR & shutter are nothing to do with IBIS).
As for any corner issues caused by IBIS? We’ll see if it’s a real problem, but in any case, it’s use is optional anyway.
As for wide angle issues, then it may be that rangefinder-type symmetrical lenses will never be optimal on a digital sensor. Even Leica have some issues, and they optimise their camera for such lenses. The solution is simple of course. Don’t use lenses of that design type. All that’s needed is a lens design that places the exit pupil further from the sensor on WA lenses. Indeed, all SLR lenses effectively do that by accident as they have to adopt retrocal designs. The downside is such lenses are bigger than rangefinder WA lenses, but they can still be made more compact than DSLR ones (at least when accounting for the mirror box) as there is design freedom to place elements closer to the sensor surface. (Which is not the same thing as placing the exit pupil close to the sensor).
The light leak thing is a none issue. It’s been shown lots of other cameras also show it under the same artificial circumstances of a long exposure under bright light with a lens cap on. If you are using super-high ISO, then it’s not going to be under very bright light unless you are using some serious ND filters. If it’s under dim light, then the amount of any leak will be trivial.
Nor has any “wobble” been shown to be a realworld problem. As long as the lens is held plat to the flange by the leaf spring, then it has no ramifications for IQ. At worst it’s a feel issue when using MF.
These really aren’t fundamental issues anyway. I fractionally thicker mount so the leaf springs bind a bit tighter (which is all that toughmount actually does). After all, the A7S has an all-metal mount. The issue is more one of clearances than materials.
But it’s also overkill, for everyday photography. And you forgot the slow burst, bad af, lossy raw, bad focus control… More like a tin jewel.
And the sensor reflextions? We are down to a dung jewel.
OK we can drop the jewel thing at this pont. Which leaves us at dung.
And if tests prove there is no vignetting, will you admit you were wrong and were just trolling?
@voltron
I’d recommend learning the difference between trolling and analysing issues. The fact is that the throat diameter on E-Mount is a bit tight, and there seems to be possibility of some corner vignetting under some circumstance. No more than that. It’s not the end of the world as some would have it, and it wouldn’t remove the utility of IBIS if it did.
As it is, it’s fairly clear from this video that the total sensor displacement is fairly modest (most likely due to the throat diameter issue) when you compare it to similar videos of the Olympus MFT stabilisation. I very reasonable explanation is that the image circle allows for bigger margins in the smaller sensor (which will be true for APSC as well).
You might be better served to address the technical issues involved rather than making value judgements about people’s motives. I have no wish to see IBIS on E-mount fail. Quite the opposite, as it would be a great enabler for me to migrate from my A-Mount system as I’ve a larger number of lenses. I just want to understand if there are any downsides. Few technologies are perfect, and most platform transitions, whether it’s cameras, computers or any number of other things often present issues.
nb. a working definition of trolling for you
make a deliberately offensive or provocative online posting with the aim of upsetting someone or eliciting an angry response from them.
I’m impressed no one cares to reference IBIS behavior to A-mount cameras and find their answers…
Very similar principles.
Actually it’s probably not vignetting as much as you think – consider the perspective of the camera filming this video – then consider how close a mounted lens is to the sensor and the size of the image circle that is projected onto the sensor plane
Useless. Only gadget collectors would need such a useless feature. Real photographers would know how to hold their cameras to minimize vibration and camera shake.
Pffff, just wait and see, Canon will rain on Sony’s parade soon. Anytime now. You just wait and see.
infidels…
LOL, I think you just won the price for the worst trolling attempt of the week 😀
Good luck to that…canon?? hahaha,
Oh no doubt. It’s coming anytime now. And real photographers don’t need good low-light performance or high resolution either, because we know how to harness vacuum energy and create mini black holes.
Or a tripod.
Try photographing at a gig using a tripod, or sport, or wandering around tourist spots, or informal street scenes, or on a foot safari, or from a boat, or when you are trekking in the mountains Ethiopia, or Nepal or Peru or on the top of Kilimajaro. (To be fair I did have a mini tripod on some of the trekking trips).
Tripods aren’t always an option.
So you, as a “real photographer” that must be, thinks that IBIS is useless because maybe you never took a handheld photo with something larger than your kit lens 😉
Makes you wonder, Sony can design their native lenses to have a slightly larger image circle to allow for sensor movement. But what about 3rd party lenses? Maybe that’s what Sony meant when they said they can’t guarantee results. If the sensor moves outside the image circle, you could get vignetting.
HULK know photos of HULK have vignette, sensor will try run away and hide.
HULK see Sony sensor shake with fear of HULK!
too bad canon has neither this technology nor good sensors.
Too bad Sony doesn’t have Canon’s lens lineup
Great lens line-up that gets the love it deserves from my Sony sensor!
Well you can use Canon lenses on Sony. You can’t use Sony sensors on Canon.
Have you done this yourself? If I can mount a Cnon lens on A7MKII reliably, it would be a definite buy for me. The problem is I cannot trust the build quality of Metabones and, unfortunately, Novoflex hasn’t come up with an FE to Alpha adapter yet.
Get out troll! At least their sensor not shake of fear when see HULK.
HULK play with FECES!
Oh poor baby, but this toy is now out, so you can finally create decent pics.
But they have hundreds of legacy lenses that are useless on modern digital cameras.
me NO like “gravostyle_basicregular” !
Doesn’t the sensor seem a bit matte for a sensor? And other questions:
1. As a proprietary Sony design, is there anything that we should be careful about the sensor? (while cleaning, blowing, etc.)
2. How about dust accumulation over time in the gap around the sensor?
3. As it is mechanical, what is the lifetime expectancy of the moving sensor?
I know hands-on testing, release of the manual and/or interview with Sony engineers are required to answer such questions but please feel free to share your experience with Oly’s 5-axis IBIS.
Just don’t stick your dick into the mount and it’s gonna be ok. Most likely it will outlive your grandkids.
Don’t stick your d!ck into the mount and it’s gonna be ok. Most likely it will outlive your grandkids.
Admin, in case you’re looking for respect for your site, you should really do sth about trolls. Moderation of dpreview forums may set an example.
Dpreview is worse, what are you talking about?
Two days ago I wanted to make a humorous note about the never ending complaints that sony doesn’t have a strong lens lineup for FF mirrorless and sent this famous meme of 9gag with Batman slapping Robin with the following words:
– R: A7 series are good but the lenses…
– B (slaps): We know!
They deleted it within 5 minutes.
@SAR_Admin – how about at least adding a mandatory registration to avoid the anonymous trolls? Only registered trolls should be allowed! 🙂 It would make your web site a much nicer and cleaner place. Do all “regular” users need to sign a public petition to make it happen?
it’s a Disqus problem
Not really: https://help.disqus.com/customer/portal/articles/832187-guest-commenting, and seems like the guest comments are disabled by default.
“Guest commenting can be enabled at the Disqus admin > Settings > General page in the Guest Commenting setting.”
All Admin needs is to disable the guest comments back.
word
LOL
He can’t help himself. 🙂
Thank you for pulling several baseless assumptions out of your a$$ and forming them into a questions. This isn’t Jeopardy so don’t expect answers.
Let me summarize what we know about the A7-II so far…
1. Will it wobble? No.
2. Will it blend? Yes.
3. Will it bend? Unlikely.
4. Will it crop? Probably.
Will it play 45 or only LP?
minidisc
1. Is Oleg and Idot? Yes
2. Will Oleg eat $hit? Probably
3. Will Oleg bend over and grab his ankles? Yes
4. Does Oleg have a life? No
Why so scary to post under you real name? Do you wear a paper bag on your head IRL? If you like to eat fecies – I’m happy for you, but please just speak for yourself, you’re an illiterate dumbf-ck. Keep your self criticism private.
Prolly the same person who post’s as my name. I just ignore them now as entertaining their post’s is no longer fun.
Man, this person is annoying! IMO Admin should do something about the anonymous posts on this forum.
Will it SMASH!? HULK hope!
Looks like just one other thing to break. I hope not.
“KISS”, Keep It Simple For Stupid.
That was my initial thought, although these systems have proven to be robust.
Which brings to mind a question: let’s say you are shooting on an extended assignment where there is no service or re-supply, and the IBIS craps out–does the sensor have a default neutral position to which it is mechanically returned until the IBIS can be repaired or replaced? I would expect so.
It’s very likely to have a default (0,0,0) position, as it must be in this position where the sensor rests when the feature is turned off. So there must be some mechanism to engage/disengage the stabilization system from the sensor.
I wonder how much is the MTBF of this system. I’m not saying “it’s gonna break in no time” but all that movement… makes me think about it. IMHO not something to be used all the time.
This is Sony’s first round. I’m not sure I want to be the guinea pig. If they had said it indeed was Olympus’ technology then I’d be more inclined to trust it at first.
There has been in-camera stabilisation in A-Mount cameras since Minolta produced their first DSLR. I know this is a new implementation, but I suspect they know how to engineer such things.
I can literally see the battery life disappearing with every shake. Not good when battery life is already multiple batteries per day of shooting.
You literally cannot see that at all. IBIS will result in a battery hit but as it’s only active while taking photos it should be relatively small.
That looks like it would use a ton of battery power?
Moving an extremely light sensor tiny distances won’t use that much power and it will only be active while you’ve got the shutter button half down.
Isn’t it active in some regards for live view through EVF/LCD?
I’ve noticed a big difference in battery consumption using my FE28-70 OSS vs legacy lenses with no OSS
Nope, there’s no need for it to be active unless you’re focussing.
Regarding the FE 28-70, that surprises me immensely, what lenses are you comparing to?
My K-3 just got IBIS envy watching this. Don’t worry baby, Sony has no good affordable long lens options.
no one gives a rats a** about your crop sensor Ricoh camera
“affordable” – photography is not for the cheap/poor of us. if you really want to save money, stop flushing it down that Pentax toilet. it’s a zombie system, the only thing worse than a dead system
Don’t get me wrong I love and use the Sony E mount cameras every day. I just prefer OVF for bird shots. IBIS is a great technology and works amazing on the “Zombie K-3” and I am happy to see it coming to Sony too. Big fan of the Darth Vader IBIS in my E-P5 too. Cant wait to test the A7II with my Zombie lenses. 🙂
If you ask me, mirror less is making photography cheaper by the day. That is, if your into manual focus lenses like Minolta Rokkor, Canon FD….rangefinder stuff. Some of these lenses are so cheap acquiring them feels like highway robbery. Grabbing a A7 for 1k? Crazy.
$1000 for a camera is overpriced considering how basic the a7 really is in terms of ergonomics and controls, especially since it is now obsolete. I love how you Sony knuckheads mention old a** legacy MF glass as the solution to everything. please.
Well, I’m using it with nothing but A mount glass…and yes, I purchased some legacy MF glass as well. I see it as an option but not necessarily a “solution” to anything. I don’t think there is a problem with the camera that requires a solution.
It’s not obsolete either if we’re strictly speaking in terms of functionality and key features. Within the context of what current FF cameras cost, 1K is a steal. Obsolete would imply it is no longer produced or out of date- it is neither. They added a different grip and 5 axis- which if we consider Olympus is really old technology at this point.
You mentioned saving money and not “flushing” it down the toilet with Pentax. I would suggest that Pentax lenses seem to hold their value quite well. If you don’t want to flush your money down the toilet then we should all be shooting film or using at minimum 5 year old digital gear that has lost most if not all of it’s depreciation.
What exactly to you suggest is an acceptable price for a FF?
if you have to work a month to get $1000 , A7 is not for you, heck, sony is not for you, it is always a premium product. you can try samsung or cheap pns at discount corner.
Not that they would. But you know how high end cameras like a Phase one use pixel shifting to get even higher resolution. Tripod at least. Takes an exposure shifts the sensor a half pixel takes another image. Process into a double resolution image. I bet this is the technology. Now if Sony can set up an app to move the sensor that fractionally.
This Axis stabilization is a clear HOME RUN for Sony. It will peak the interest from a large spectrum of photographers. Credit to them for pioneering ahead
I disagree. It is one more gadget to impress the layman, surely a flashy one, but these cameras are full of serious errors that put me off no end. Besides, Sony has been hugely inconsistent on its offers and I really would not put my money into it.
Sony have listened to their customers and made changes to ergonomics, focussing, tracking and the mount and you’re still complaining? I guess there’s no pleasing some people. What are these “serious errors” you mention?
I always wonder why people who have no interest in these cameras insist on taking time to read and comment on these posts.
the latest E mount cameras blow the competition in almost every aspect, the new a7 2 ibis is no gadget it´s fantastic specially for people who use vintage lens.
I think you mean they blow the competition away….not blow the competition. Just saying:)
Really? Ever tried Canon or Nikon? That may redefine “fantastic” for you. All mirrorless, so far, merely blow. People should try themselves, touch the toys, play with them, learn them, then write their opinions.
How? Let’s take a D750 from Nikon as a worthy competitor to the A7II:
D750 FPS= 6.5
A7II FPS = 5
D750 = 2 card slots
A7II = 1
Nikon = Uncompressed RAW
Sony = compressed RAW
Nikon = 119+ lenses for full frame (just by Nikon)
Sony = 14 full frame lenses from all manufacturers
Nikon D750 = 7th best sensor on DxO, after D600 and D610
SonyA7II = not there yet, but A7 and A7s are #10 and lower. Only A7r higher, after D800E and D810.
So how does it blow them out of the water? And don’t say size and weight. That’s already been discussed.
the d750 costs $500 more
so in the end it comes down to what you really need and what cam works best for you to get the shot. it’s all about the picture
need high fps ? might be the new 7d mk2 is the cam for you
need img stabilization ? might be the a7II
want to show of because your cam is 3 ranks above your buddies cam on some pixel peeper page ? go with the d750 😉
Good one! Happy thanksgiving, if you’re in the US!
Though this doesn’t really address the original point by meow that the A7II blows the competition away. In fact, it kind of supports my premise that it does not.
The geeks with a brick wall and a tripod (no, they don’t need it anymore, there is ibis!) will be over the moon with this toy. It pushes the envelope, innovates, wipes the floor, trounces the competition etc. Photographers will smile and look elsewhere.
“Real” photographers will evaluate each tool without bias and award it on it’s merit. Sony continues to deliver innovative valuable tools to imaging professionals. By looking elsewhere, I presume it’s in the ground because that’s where you’ve got your head.
Naive comment. IBIS is a valuable tool for photographers in right conditions. Sony should be congratulated for innovation. Companies like Canon use sensors years behind Sony tech and introduce minimal upgrades to camera bodies for years while charging a premium price, perhaps this is the type of consistency you prefer.
I would and have put my money into Sony because they have been delivering of late.
You bought Sony? Just because they replaced something that works well with something “new” that does not work as well? And they keep changing systems? Who is naive? LOL. If your photography evolves, you are going to regret that move.
I’ll dignify a response when you make a valid point and cut out the waffle.
100 years of Photography without Ibis confirm all you tell us here. But, sorry if it may offend you, I am 64 and need no Ibis, nor do I suffer from Parkinson disease. This Ibis story is just a gadget that is in the mind of most today. I do not doubt that in certain circumstances it is useful, but as I said, 100 years of good shooting and pictures we all can still see, prove we can live without it. Some even forget today that we had nothing valuable beyond ISO400, and then we see that today, anything lower than 10000 Iso clean is just out …sic. Humans are too much spoiled by new technologies, and this is one more reason for the GAS syndrome. As you said, a valuable tool for photographers in right conditions.
Why do people get upset when they are offered the option of an extra tool from a camera manufacturer? It is absurd. I don’t disagree with some of your comments. I spent the first 10 years of my photography processing TriX + rodinal and carrying a Metz60 flash with battery pack because when the light started to go during weddings 400 ISO was about the highest I’d want to go. But I never said IBIS will make you a photographer, its just a valuable tool. Innovation is inevitable and just because it wasn’t released by a legacy camer maker first, is Canon, doesn’t mean you should criticize it. Now fake, gimmicky photographers like people will always exist….
Around 6000 years of domesticating horses certainly prove that we can live without cars!
Why are you even using such fiddle-faddle gadgets like computers when we have trusty typewriters since over 140 years? Spoiled by technology?
It truly is amazing. The sensor works just like a chicken head. If you pick up a chicken and move it around the head will try to remain upright and forward. Haha.
One thing that concerns me is that the battery will probably be drained an (X) faster based on the Voltage the 5-axis uses. I know im not the only person who thinks this way, but by the size and weight of the battery I would expect higher capacity mAh. Im not a professional in battery knowledge, but does having a higher voltage output = less room for mAh. Or is it more dangerous packing more in case of overheating, exploding. In any case getting a 2nd battery is a must have. Missing a moment in life will teach you that if you think otherwise.
And from this moment onward Sony’s version of IBIS shall be renamed LACHIS (Like A Chicken Head Image Stabilization)
Make it so!
LOL HAHAHA! That is funny! The chicken’s head is always “on-point” when its looking. Get it!? Haha Sony’s cameras are always “on-point” when taking a picture. What a corny joke.
you want IBIS. you want less battery consumption, you want it cheap, you want it this christmas, you want more lenses , anything else??? would you like a dessert too?
This should benefit the lenses without OSS. Also what came to my mind just now. Im thinking now you are able to take slower shutter speed shots with less to no blur with the 5 axis stabilizer that were difficult to achieve by hands with previous cameras. Someone will have to test slow shutter shots in hands. A7 vs A7II.
In other words, Prime lenses. Which is awesome, as you’ll get handheld stabilization with a huge aperture and a lot sharpness.
What all we do not invent in a society where drugs, alcohol, Alzheimer, and Parkinson progress constantly, hahahaha. It definitely serves to something after all.