Size comparison by Vlad (Thanks!)
The Full Frame for the masses is now here! The A7 and A73 (presentation page here at Amazon) are creating quite a buzz on the web. Here is a list of must read articles:
Brian Smith: Great field test with many image samples!
Sony Japan: Full size A7r image samples (image one, image two and image three).
Luminous Landscape: has one image sample and short hands-on description.
Blog Sina: It is the only site having posted A7r image samples. It includes some pics take with Zeiss ZM lenses. The photographer noted that the [shoplink 21606 ebay]21mm Biogon[/shoplink] does indeed show some vignetting and color shifting on corners.
Photoclubalpha: Thoughts by David Kilpatrick.
Ming Thein: His view on the A7 series announcement.
Imaging Resource: Hands-on by Dave Etchells (scroll down to see read his hands-on).
EosHD: RX10 has one new kilelr feature…5K readout!
Singlag: A7 and A7R with Zeiss 35/2.8 +55/1.8 with 100% crop with NR off
Dearsusans: What we learned from the A7 launch…
Editor’s note: All future E-mount cameras will have the Alpha/RX menu. By bye NEX menu! And the even bigger news is that there will be no more camera branded as “NEX”. By bye NEX!
I updated the preorder list and included many more links:
Specs and Preorders in US and Canada (Click on store name to see direct preorder page / some links via Dealsrunner):
Dedicated Sony announcement page at Amazon US (Click here).
Sony A7r body at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
Sony A7 body at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
Sony A7 with 28-70mm kit lens at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
Sony RX10 at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
Zeiss 24-70mm at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
Zeiss 35mm at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
Zeiss 55mm at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
70-200mm A-mount at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
Sony A-Mount to E-Mount Lens Adapter at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto.
Sony A to E adapter with mirror at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto.
A7/A7r leather case at Amazon, Adorama, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
A7/A7r vertical grip at Amazon, BHphoto, SonystoreUS.
Sony W Series Battery Charger at Amazon, BHphoto.
Sony FA-CS1M Off-Camera Shoe at BHphoto.
Semi-Hard LCD Screen Protector for A7-A7r at Amazon, BHphoto.
Specs and Preorders in Europe:
Sony A7r body at Sony DE, UK, FR, IT, FI, WexUK, WexDE.
Sony A7 body at Sony DE, UK, FR, IT, FI, FR, WexUK, WexDE.
Sony A7 with 28-70mm kit Sony DE, UK, FR, IT, FI, FR, WexUK, WexDE.
Sony RX10 at Sony DE, WexUK, WexDE.
Zeiss 35mm at Sony DE.
Zeiss 55mm at Sony DE.
And these pics are from SAR reader Rowland (Thanks you too!). It’s from a Sony event in Asia. You can see the ripped A7 and a Leica comparison. Click on image to enlarge:
One more comparison by Vlad. That time with grip attached:
299 Responses
You may have written a mistake with a73 instead of a7r, am I right?
Am I wrong, one of the pictures is an a7 with a Pentax SMC lens on it?!
Nope, you are right, indeed it is Pentax lens. 🙂
Sound like Sony’s letting die NEX and A-Mount at the same time – quite clever trick to calm down the fanboys 😉
Where is the A mount road map?
+1
????
Exactly where it was since 2006 – in hands of Sony management with no will to show it anywhere.
Canon and Nikon do exactly the same, so IDK why you’re surprised.
No more roadmap for A mount. It’s clear that FE mount is the future for Sony. I dont think they have resources enough to cover A, E, and FE at the same period of time
Please, stop this BS. FE will co-exist with A-mount just fine. We’ve been through this like 1000 times already. Sony just confirmed that again by the way of A7 release.
A-mount 70-200/2.8 G II is $2998
That is the road map.
I think Sony has just shaken up the pro-consumer market with the A7/A7r camera. Next year I think it’ll shake up the pro market with brand new Alpha mount cameras directly aimed at the professional user…
If introducing a sort of pro-sumer FF is what you mean by “shaking up the pro-sumer market”, I would agree.
I hope you are right about A-mount. I’m not a pro user, but I’m not just a hobby photographer either. I will pay a decent premium for pro-level service, durability, and serviceability, if the new A-mount body itself is worth it.
Hi,
The new cameras look great indeed.. Sony are very strong in the video professional/broadcast arena – so my hope is that they’ll re-align new full frame Alpha mount cameras released next more fully in the professional market. A true pro camera needs far more flexibility and manual control features (proper extensive bracketing options, full usb/wireless tethering, intervalometer) to list just a few..
I’m finding that Sony thinks that the professional market is only increasing prices. 2999 by SAL70200GII is theft.
Will it be 50% better than the SAL70200G to justify the 50% increase in price??
According to Photographyblog:
“Sony have announced that a new mid to high-end Alpha mount camera body is currently under development. Due to be released in 2014, the new body confirms that Sony are still committed to the A-mount system. No further details about the new body have been released at today’s London press briefing.”
How can you sell a pro camera with a limited F60 flash and $3000 70-200mm F2.8, no weather sealing, no improve optical design.
How?
Why would a sports/wildlife/wedding/journalist photographer be interested?
Even with a pro service.
Am I the only one wondering why in the USA you can preorder a Sony A7R, and get in line, without paying until you take delivery, but in the UK at least you pay up front, so they have the use of your money all the time you wait for the camera to be delivered?
This is not Sony policy just to be clear. For this kind of item that would fly off the shelves in no time, no deposit needed. And big store can afford to keep the item in case the buyers back out.
It is illegal in the US to be charged before shipment.
It should be in the UK, and the rest of the EU, too.
Hi!
I got some questions.
Will Sony release rangefinder-sized cameras in future, now that “NEX” is gone? Will current latest NEX cameras be updated to new Alpha/RX menu system?
Thanks!
Who says NEX is gone? NEX is still APS-C sized sensors.
sony rep mentioned that they are getting rid of the “nex” branding, and consolidating it all under the alpha line.
More Samples 7R:
http://www.sony.jp/ichigan/pre_include/images/ILCE-7R/photo-sample_a7R_01.jpg
http://www.sony.jp/ichigan/pre_include/images/ILCE-7R/photo-sample_a7R_02.jpg
http://www.sony.jp/ichigan/pre_include/images/ILCE-7R/photo-sample_a7R_03.jpg
Why in god’s name is it so hard for them to put a bloody touch screen on the damn thing…….
You’re not their target market.
I have no use for the bloody touchscreen, however I do hope they’d put the 4-way tilt screen used on the a99 in future models, or else I’d be stuck with landscape mode forever(waist-level viewfinding 80% of the time for me).
…and the electronic shutter…extra-low profile option with near 0 added cost, but they refuse to include it, and even removed the electronic front curtain on a7r…what’s wrong with these numbnuts…
The shot gun shutter will mask any moire! LOL!
(seriously, I hope they make it all electronic by the time they ship these beasts)
same reason Nikon and Canon doesn’t add that on their full-frame dslrs as well.
because you might touch it with your nose while looking at viewfinder 😀
+1
I always using it for portraits like these, for precise focusing:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12196364/gallery/2013.06.07/DSC02582.jpg
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12196364/gallery/2013.07.05/DSC04316.jpg
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12196364/gallery/2013.06.29/DSC04154.jpg
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12196364/gallery/2013.07.08/DSC04485.jpg
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/12196364/gallery/2013.08.16/DSC06193.jpg
You see, EVF is useless for them, because they all were shot from the chest or stomach level. This is summilux 35 asph fle on NEX-5n.
Because you accidentally press it with your nose when using an non rangefinder style EVF. I ended up disabling my touchscreen on the 5n.
So you can accidentally change settings with your nose whenever you put your eye to the EVF? No thanks.
Where can I buy that Hasselblad grip??? :):):)
Still did not find info on LA-EA4…
You must not be looking very hard…
http://goo.gl/D9ZRZi
I’m waiting for a Metabones adapter!
Big mistake! Sony LA-EA3 and 4 should have better build quality than any Metabones. Beside, you won’t have a Metabones A to E adapter.
Mistake too! there are metabones A to E mount for aps-c, full frame coming alter.
And you would pay for that over-priced, “dumb”, imprecise aperture control over the Sony one. But I admit, last time I checked Metabones, they didn’t have the A mount version yet.
Why? A FF speedbooster? … not that it’s possible…
Metabones makes regular adapters as well as the Speedbooster
A Speedbooster for my Bronica ETRS lenses!!
Metabones speed booster type adapters would be pointless on this camera – unless they are going to make some to adapt medium format lenses. 🙂
Yes too much PP (and too small) to judge anything.
Well, apparently rangefinder lenses will be working fine. That is great news.
Not on the A7. BTW, the fact A7 wasn’t tuned to work well with short flange compromised the whole system from the beginning. Because they will design their optics for the weak leak and thus you won’t see compact 35s, 28s, etc. Sony spoiled everything, as usual.
Bingo. They really wanted to use the warmed-over A99 sensor probably because it kept costs really, really low but it will hamper the system for a long, long time. Hoping I’m wrong. I really was about to order the A7 then I found out it doesn’t have the microlens adjustments that they A7r has.
What happened to the all-but-confirmed new 32mp sensor?!
where did you find this information?
i was convinced to get a7 for m lenses till now!
Simon, I’m reading mixed things. I really want to pre-order a camera but I’m holding off until I see some real tests with some wide angle M-mount lenses. If the A7 handles them without any of the smearing seen in the VG900 I’d rather go that route but I’m skeptical since more and more since point to it being a close derivative of the VG900/A99 sensor–not a bad sensor but not very forgiving.
Just a question … if someone would buy an A7r with 28-70 mm lens … is it possible ?
think you can arrange for a size comparison of the A7 vs the old minolta 9000? pretty much the same size but just to make people think about why modern DSLR cameras are the size they are. It’s easy to say the A7 is smaller than the A99 but there are reasons why the A99 (and A900/850, Dynax/Maxxum 9/xi) are the size they are.
People are so amazed about the size that they forget that this really is a normal pre-AF-era size and really not that amazing, it’s just a design decision.
Here’s a quick one: http://i41.tinypic.com/2cpqomo.jpg
Thanks for that link
Alpha menu firmware update for existing Nex’s, please???
+1
And I still remember NEX fanboys arguing how NEX menu is superb comparing to A-mount/RX menu. And there we go – now people ask for firmware update with a better menu.
For me personally it is not so much that the NEX menu system was bad, not by any means, but that I would like a unified menu system across all Sony cameras. Owning different Sony cameras it always takes getting used to the menu system when switching, especially when I have not used the camera in a long time.
I agree the NEX menu was not bad. It was just so different it took time to get used it.
In any case, once you set up the camera the way you wanted it, you only had to go to the menu to format the card.
In my opinion, the Nex menu is extremely bad. For instance, I regularly use BW HDR, HDR and Handheld Twilight, which are technically all quite similar, but all in different sub-menus, which they each share with options that I will never use (like fake tilt shift, pop color etc.). Also, switching between AF and MF takes much longer than switching the lens itself, because I for some crazy reason, the focus assist must be turned on in an entirely different menu.
Also, I often switch between Auto-ISO and adjusting ISO in parallel with exposure compensation. I could work around this particular aspect of the terrible menus on the sadly obsolete Nex-7, but not on the 5 and 6, where it means a lot of fiddling and button pressing.
Many of the problems could be mitigated by allowing to save the configuration. For instance, Canon’s high end G compacts have several customizable slots on their PASM wheel, which save all aspects of the current camera settings, so you could have one for BW HDR, and another one for manual portraits. Sony’s choice for the Nex-6 addresses the needs of casual photographers, but omits customs settings. Most serious photographers will leave the PASM wheel at A, and only rarely switch to S or Panorama, so the dedicated mode wheel goes to waste.
I really love the form factor of the 5, 6 and 7, and the sensor of the 5 and 6, and I absolutely adore the 24 1.8. Oh Sony, why do you drive me to Fuji?
I think you should have set up your camera properly. I had what you use available through the custom button next to the shutter release.
One press and you can skip through the hdr modes, picture styles, wb, and other stuff. No need to go down the menus to find those.
Rollei,
Agreed. You know what would really knock my socks off? If Sony had custom downloadable in-camera correction profiles for those two issues that can be corrected (colour cast and vignetting) for every M mount lens in production. That way you only worry about the smearing and discount those lenses for the a7/r use.
After that, what would really knock my socks off again is if they did so for other lenses too, like FD lenses, OM lenses, old Leica and Zeiss screw mount lenses…
My bad, wrong place for that comment.
I have a couple of questions. according to the rumor the camera is weather sealed but it is not listed in the specifications on the Sony website.. So is this weather sealed or not?
My other question is in regards to the removal of the NEX line. Since all premium cameras are going to be Alpha are they going to standardize a mount? Right now they have two full frame mounts, FE Mount and the A-Mount. Thank you in advance!
So the A7r works at least very well with the Zeiss ZM 18 /4 ultra-wideangle…
http://briansmith.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/Sony-a7r-Haiti-2201.jpg
I wonder how the A7 does with wide-angle M-Mount lenses. Given the specs on the sony website, the A7 does definitely not has the on-chip micro-leneses…
see the link below to compare the features of both cameras:
http://www.sony.net/Products/di/en-gb/products/o4j5/index.html#features
so much postprocessing, can’t understand anything
I’d like to see sample images of the cheaper version (A7, not R) with the 28-70 kit lens.. Does anyone know where I could find those?
What will become of the NEX7 replacement. No more APS-c?
Sony was wise to announce the 70-200 II along with all of the interesting new camera gear because it is a shamefully bad joke. They took a 10 year old + lens, slapped a roman numeral on it and decided the only way to differentiate it is to charge 50% more for it. They threw in the towel rather than attempt to create a lens approaching canon’s 70-200 II, the only thing the Sony G lens team could beat Canon on was price – they are charging 25% more than the Canon’s despite that Canon’s lens features excellent Image Stabilization, slightly closer minimum focusing distance and more groups & elements.
Shameful.
A7/A7R hands on video on youtube
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bnvgceTEV3c
thanks for the video, i was wondering how big is the camera
So.. A7 is larger than Leica body, and FE lenses are larger than M lenses.
Where’s this whole “hype” on killing Leica by Sony again? Told you that it won’t happen.
It’s larger than which Leica body?
Leica is wider, but in everything else A7 is bigger one.
http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/jj524/picrumors/picrumors001/_DSC5130_zps72e7e23b.jpg
http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/jj524/picrumors/picrumors001/_DSC5126_zps5756bde9.jpg
Yep, true. They have the A7 on Camerasize already:
http://camerasize.com/compare/#488,213
The VF and the Grip…that makes it thicker. Otherwise its very close.
I prefer to have a grip and a VF that sticks a bit to the back is nicer for my big nose so I appreciate that as well. Others wont and thats OK.
Let me summarize for you:
1. Size
2. NOTHING
3. see #2
4. [void]
5.
6. IQ?
7. DR?
8. Noise?
9. AF???
LIA, Sell all your M mount lenses now. It is down hill (price wise) for them from now. No one has time to poke Leica is dead and such. 😉
sony is not a leica killer…. leica is a leica killer
“21mm Biogon does indeed show some vignetting and color shifting on corners.”
Interesting…. hopefully thats not as bad as the Nex 7 otherwise that would be a problem.
I would say: No surprises, really.
It is unfortunate that he chose that lens to check (although it does give a reference point which is the good news) because that is tricky one. The CV15 also will do terribly on the A7r, I would predict.
This reinforces the theory that biogon design is not good for digital.
With that in mind, then the 35mm biogons won’t be seen on many bodies (although we still need to see some testing done with those)
I am hoping the G35 would work well, however, since it was the closest thing to a Summicron when the G2/G1 were out.
I don’t know about the sharpness across the frame, though. Digital sensor tend to show the most subtle weaknesses of every lens.
You have to keep in mind that you can fix the color shift with minimal hit in IQ, but it’s the corner smearing that is more problematic (can’t fix that). Color shift does occur in all Leica digital, but they fix it using embedded software. I would rather go with the former approach since I know how much I want to fix. We’ll have to see further testing, but I would not discount anything yet. If all the Biogon does is to have some color cast, then I would say Sony is already on the same level with Leica digital (or even better).
Agreed. You know what would really knock my socks off? If Sony had custom downloadable in-camera correction profiles for those two issues that can be corrected (colour cast and vignetting) for every M mount lens in production. That way you only worry about the smearing and discount those lenses for the a7/r use.
After that, what would really knock my socks off again is if they did so for other lenses too, like FD lenses, OM lenses, old Leica and Zeiss screw mount lenses…
+1 Trillion!
Hendrick, check out Phigment Leica M adapter for E mount.
Wow..well now, Phigment’s got the comms sorted…we need Sony to do the profiling.
It’s possible to snap a white balance correction shot, and the firmware automatically takes dark-noise subtractive exposures during long exposure night shots. In they same way, it ought to be easy to point the camera at a white wall, fire a shot and tell it to use that as a subtractive correction for vinegetting and color-shift.
Doesn’t the Lens Compensation app in the play memories store allow you to do this?
That’s to be expected with a Biogon design. If you want to avoid problems with with w/a lenses adapt ZF or ZE lenses rather than ZM lenses.
BTW Sony’s official Pre-Order pages all look like this: http://www.sony.co.uk/ILCE or http://www.sony.fr/ILCE …
I don’t know what to think about that Ming Thein post. He seems to think Sony should be copying Fuji.
Well in some ways perhaps Sony should learn from Fuji, shouldn’t they ?
What ways would those be? Designing retro bodies? updating firmare? (Fuji firmware updates often contain things that Sony cameras already had, like focus peaking, better MF control, better AF, etc)
Granted, jpeg algorithms still need working and Sony should be ashamed of that.
But other than this, I really struggle to think why would following Fuji help Sony. They have so far listened to customers (unlike many people whining would want you to think otherwise) If Sony hadn’t:
1) the A7 wouldn’t be here
2) the old hotshoe would have stayed in its grave
3)the option to turn off the MOVIE button and increase the bracketing parameter in NEX 7 wouldn’t have arrived
And thanks to not thinking like Fuji:
1) The RX1 is here
2) The RX100 is here
3) The A7r is here
But no, it has to be some optical hybrid of a viewfinder and a hollow retro build with some xtrans marketing hype that gets people wanking over the Fuji mojo.
Maybe he’s talking about the lenses? Fuji does have a good set of fast HQ lenses;)
I explained this a few times already. There is a reason why there is a 35m/2.8 and not faster. I can’t be bothered to repeat myself again. You just have to think about it, see what’s around, see what could have been, and come to a conclusion.
The lens lineup is the obvious bit. It’s a given : try to get the lineup right the first time.
But that’s a detail. What Sony should learn from Fuji is that a camera should be part of a whole coherent system. When Fuji introduced the X series, they decided to give it a specific number of features, including its old-school manual user interface (for better or worse, personally I’m not too fond of labelled dials), target a specific kind of customers, and stuck with it for the whole lineup, both cameras and lenses. At least until the X-M1 (but then, it would have most surprising if a camera company didn’t indulge in typical iterative obsessive herd behaviour).
Sony on the other hand has been all over the place for the last several years, changing the user interface / ergonomics from model to model, even within the same lineup, without any display of understanding of why this or that worked or didn’t work, releasing completely incoherent lens lineups, releasing a DSLR-like camera within their NEX lineup, going full SLT and most likely soon dropping it, hesitating between entry-level and expert for the NEX system, Going full-on full-frame with the A900 and then doing pretty much nothing for the system until they woke up and released the A99, and the list goes on. In other words, zero vision, zero visibility.
One of the reasons why only a few pros went for the A900 or A99 is Sony’s lack of vision and visibility. Fuji targets a different kind of customer, but they certainly clearly tells this kind “this is what we do, this is what we’re about”. Pretty much like Leica, or even Canon’s FF lineup.
Now if I buy an A7, how do I know in the future Sony will or won’t put its UI in the bin for something entirely different, or starts going mental on 24/ 28 to something variable aperture zooms, or yet again abandon the mount for some other endeavour, or tries to target so many customers at once the whole system looks like a disjointed mess, or introduce an aperture ring on future lenses, but then doesn’t do so on others, release nothing for it during one or two years, and then suddenly remember it’s got a FE lineup, use a touch screen on some model, but not on another one, put the VF to the left on A7’s successor but in the centre again on the A9, completely forget about releasing wide-angle primes for three years and then release a crapload of quickly badly made ones ? This is all very important. For example, people may choose Canon over Nikon because the former has this or that specific button that does this or that. How do I know what I now like about the A7 will make in the next model ?
This is not a pledge for conservatism, but proper design, or at least knowing that this or that design decision has been taken for a reason. At Sony’s, well, I sort of always wonder why we’re getting constant U-turns or even O-turns about design decisions at a systemic level.
What MTlab said. Yes! You nailed it: Sony’s design is non-iterative, in a bad and erratic way, which makes them unpredictable, and often bury good features on a whim of some sudden marketing intuition.
All I can say in regards to Sony’s overall behavior in bringing new products with a seemingly confusing vision is that:
1) When NEX came out, no one thought it would be taken up by enthusiasts adapting M lenses.
2) When NEX 7 came out, people started already asking for a FF NEX or a NEX 7-like camera but with less mp.
3) When NEX 6 came out, people were happy with it but then wanted a new NEX 7 with weather sealing and better ISO sensor.
All in all, the lack of product continuity is probably a symptom of a very fuzzy set of desires they are listening to and often complying with because of Sony brand’s lack of photographic history with a system except A mount.
You can’t say A mount SLRs are not consistent. SLT technology is not bad but people stigmatised it to the point that Sony has to drop it. Now they did it, they will come with something else in the future and people will still moan.
Now you get a camera you can mount any lens on earth and you ask whether Sony will carry on with it or not? Man, it’s here, buy it or not, enjoy it or not. This sounds exactly like the people who said who wouldn’t buy an RX1 because they said the RX1m2 will be better. Well, saying that is the same as saying they don’t want the RX1 to succeed.
Not buying this camera and enjoying the benefit of the size, the features and price means you probably want it to fail too.
MTLAB, you feel compelled enough to write such a long argument about your dissatisfaction with Sony direction. If Sony has such an uncertainty future according to you, why would you be here to argue your point when you can just go out and buy your Canikon? Would life be easier for you that way? Fuji does get it right with the optics (good IQ at reasonable size) but they made a mis-step with the X-trans. They finally admit their defeat by releasing a regular APS-C. Would that be the sign of abandonment of their tech? I sure think so. I think Sony is going the right way but with a few mis-steps due to the fuzzy feedback from the users. In short, if they gave you so much grief, why bother?
To put it short : I didn’t write about my personal dissatisfaction with Sony’s direction (or Fuji for that matter, I’m not a massive fan of their cameras either. Or pretty much every camera on the market right now anyway), but the fact that Sony has NO direction at all. Themselves don’t really know what they actually want to do with the idea of the camera (unlike Fuji which has a very clear idea of the kind of camera they want to sell you, or Leica).
Let’s hope this new FE lineup is for them the occasion to make a brand new start. So far, it’s my favourite Sony release in a long time. But my personal satisfaction isn’t the point here. It’s that Sony’s completely aimless all the time. As someone said, it translates in the fact that there is no other brand that’s quite as good as Sony when it comes to coming up with a good idea, and then burying it for no reason at all on the subsequent model. The NEX 7 for example, came up with a number of interesting ergonomical ideas. People complained about certain points of their implementation. Sony, instead of truly understanding what people liked and what people disliked, and why they liked or disliked it, threw it all away with the NEX 6. And people complained that Sony didn’t manage to keep all the good stuff from the NEX 7. Classic Sony.
LOL, when you put it short like that, I guess I have to agree with you. Too bad, Sony is the only one at the moment making a real effort into this segment (no matter how niche the majority seem to think). I, personally, will not buy any of these cameras since I’ll wait for the higher end one. I’m willing to pay for the more consistent design, better features and ergonomics. Definitely not a big fan of that after-thought EVF hump.
I too would like to applaud Sony’s effort. But right now IMHO Sony is a bit like the kind of child that’s very hard working at school but still get crap marks because of a lack of efficient methodology and a poor understanding of what’s asked of him.
MTLAB – Somehow you have summed up perfectly how i feel about Sony. I loved a lot about the Nex7 but annoyed it wasn’t a complete system. As a result, i jumped ship to find a system that was more complete with a definite path forward. While i like the look and idea of the A7r, I don’t think I could commit $$$$ to a company that shows little commitment to it’s own product line. I don’t want to be left high and dry with an expensive dead-end system.
The same story as with NEX lenses…
Personally, I don’t care too much for the hybrid finder, but that is exactly what Fuji lets you choose between (hybrid vs. EVF). I also do not mind whether a the body looks retro or futuristic, as long as there are no compromises between design and function. For instance, putting the viewfinder into a corner makes sense if you do not have a pentaprism, because otherwise your nose will press against the screen. The rangefinder design in itself is not retro, but just the most straightforward solution to stuff a bunch of electronics into a slab that is both easy to hold and stuff away (i.e. no unnecessary protrusions).
I like the Nex idea to highlight that the body has no need for storing film rolls left and right to the sensor. The most bulky item is the battery, and that gets to sit in the grip: brilliant.
On the other hand, there is much to be said for mechanical control dials. The Fuji always tells me about its settings, even when turned off. Setting the aperture at the lens is natural, because it is always lens-specific. With direct access to speed and exposure, I have the most important variables under control (if white balance and ISO choice work as intended). Give me a couple of memory buttons to call up my favorite gimmicks (like HDR or exposure bracketing) and a dedicated switch to go from AF to MF, and I am happy. The Fuji controls are not retro, they are simply building on the greatness of a camera UI that was perfected over generations.
Conversely, Sony’s designers behaved like the creators of modern cutlery or much of modern architecture: it looks super-sleek, but shits on what generations of past designers tested and learned, and is often awkward to use.
so NEX users are screwed. Is NEX camera will get update for the RX menu? i guess not. typical sony.
How so?
It may refer to the branding, not the APS-C e mount line.
Are any ship dates known yet?
Sony AU said mid to late November for AU and Adorama says early December for US.
what about the Apps from the App Store ?
Most won’t work with new ILCEs. It’s a dead end.
This is so exciting! I have some good Nikon lenses but don’t know what are the adapter options. The person on this video mentions “metabones” adapter allows him to focus and meter with a Canon lens. Can someone please tell me where I can find information about the different kind of adapters for Nikon lenses? thanks!
http://www.metabones.com/product/sony-nex/nikon-g-to-e-mount-nex-black-matt-detail
thank you!
Novoflex has great Nikon to E mount adapter. It’s cheap and works great on my NEX6. As far as working with new FF cameras you just have to wait and see, I’m sure more info will be avaliable soon
thank you!
does anyone know if the A7R has the same stupid filter+no filter of D800E or really lacks the AA filter ?..
Sony Nex A7x has definitly a great design however few native Nex Lenses and high prices will make these camera , a niche camera.
Some will not agree my statement and make me compare the price with Canikon ones but that s not the point ;)… Moreover we should have 60 lenses in 2015 and not just 15 unless they manufacture( first meaning “made with hands”) them ?
High price?
What’s the alternative to have a compact FF camera?
Yes 1500 euro for a body camera is high price for me :p
Anyway its FF instead of APS-C but after watching the video , im convinced i will spare a bit more and will look for advices for alternatives lenses
I think we are looking at it from different perspectives.
I look at it in the current market situation:
FF Compact cameras (smaller than FF SLR)
1) RX1 $2800 (comes with the kit 35mm f2) + $400 for EVF
2) A7 $1700
3) A7r $2300
4) Leica M $7000
5) Second hand Leica M9 $3000-4000
Now, $1400 is a lot of money in the great scheme of things. I understand that, but the cutting edge of photography has never cheap and this is the first time such prices are seen for such products, at launch.
Now, if you want to go cheaper, then stick with SLR and seek for a D700, 5D classic or 5D2. If you are doing this as a hobby, those are very good alternatives that will allow you to buy better lenses as you’ll have more money left after body purchase compared to anything else today, in production, new.
I’d like to see an RX2 with 50mm and 36mp but I fear the A7/A7r means the end of this line.
there is cheaper alternative for the ff A7 and that will be the RX2 , basically A7 less the EVF with tilting touch screen ,interchangeable lens camera, that is the end of sony fixed ff rx1’s, much cheaper and the size of NEX 5. Sony will have huge success by reducing the price at least $ 500.
Keep dreaming because the lens is not free.
There is not one lens out there that can do what the RX1 lens can do in that focal length in that size.
If an a7 is $1800, and the cheapest 35mm is a CV 35mm 1.4 (not the best 35mm) is $629, then you get $2429 for something that wont even touch the Sonnar in performance.
Some people tried with the 35mm Summicron f2 ($3k) on a 24mp M and still no luck. Same thing for the 35mm Summilux ($5k?) and still no luck.
Quite simply, the RX1 Sonnar is the best 35mm and only comparable to a good copy of the Sigma 35mm 1.4. But we know what size that lens is, right?
The 35mm attached to the RX1 was designed FOR that sensor. It is also perfectly calibrated and will always be that way. The RX1 will be the best 35mm and FF sensor combination, that is for sure. The RX2 will most likely not be cheaper. I just hope they do a 50mm version.
So we want:
RX2 with 50mm and 36mp?
RX1m2 with same 35mm lens and 36mp?
RX3 with 24mm and 36mp?
That’s the threesome the doctor advised for me.
Sounds good. That 24mm could also be 21mm.
18 too?
Starts to get too wide 🙂
Just hope Sony will be able to build a battery with longer battery life :p
About $7000.
Exactly.
For me the RX10 is the most interesting release. It will be an amazing camera for documentary work. But that price- too expensive. Will wait and see if it drops. But kudos to Sony, it’s definitely one of the most interesting releases in a long time.
It’s definitely surprising. It looks like what I expect next-gen / mirrorless a-mount bpdies to look like.
RX10 is not getting enough attention here, is a beast for video http://www.eoshd.com/content/11337/surprise-new-sony-rx10-sensor-full-pixel-readout-5k-raw-video-output
Whole A7/7R are basically the same quality we seen from the A99 and D800 with only 4-5 fps shooting and slow AF, nothing to get excited about
Yep, it is a good successor to the R1. I am just surprised by the weight and that they put the lower res EVF in it.
I do not think that it comes that close the APS-C R1, which had on its long end (24mm equiv.) an aperture of 2.8 (about 4.2 on a FF). The small sensor means that you can almost forget about shallow DOF on the RX10, because it will boil down to a FF equivalent of 7. (For comparison, the Zeiss 24 1.8 on APS-C Nex will perform somewhat like a 35 2.8 on FF.)
For movies, we usually want wider apertures than 7 to separate actors from the background, so even a Canon with a boring kit zoom might often be better suited for video.
The RX10 has all I could wish for in a bridge camera. Except the most important thing when compared to a compact: shallow DOF.
The 1in sensor means that the lens performs like an aperture of 7 when wide open, so forget about that cinematic look when shooting video.
Well, that settles it for anyone who thought it would be a small solution like the rx1 in interchangeable mount.
It’s a small DSLR, not a rangefinder killer, not an rx1/r replacement as many expected. I wouldn’t be in a hurry to sell my rx1 to get this. In a couple of years with tested AF and, good lenses, a real flash system it could compete with canikon but I think many people expected smaller.
Why not use Nikon or Canon flashes? Shoot, I’ll use Zeiss and Leica MF lenses and get the A-mount converter and use Zeiss A-mount lenses.
Its almost the same size as a Leica M, maybe even a little smaller.
Another size comparison, http://j.mp/19MRBkG
So when will Hasselblad release the wooden nex7 vertical grip?
Not sure what that photo’s about, but it gave me a good chuckle.
Given that there’s no NEX-7 grip, I couldn’t resist putting it there 🙂
Am I missing something or there isn’t an A7/r dedicated products site? That would be lame.
There isn’t . I think Sony marketing is really lacking in many ways.
This is just one of them.
Others are:
1) Making sure the professional photographers they give their cameras to get more exposure for the work they did with their cameras
2) Make sure they don’t have bloggers and other online celebrity photographers promoting their gear.
3) Making sure that their statements and branding are clearly defined across their products.
4) Establishing better partnership with professional dealers in some countries (like Calumet in UK, NL and DE) that have showrooms for people to test the products.
5) Establishing a forward thinking message that makes sure its cameras are not constantly compared to other makes which linger with conventional designs (SLR mirror vs SLT, modern vs retro, etc)
Completely agreed. But a webpage is so easy to make! Look at these beauties:
http://cameras.olympus.com/en-us/omd/
or this one:
http://www.olympuspen.com/en-us
or this one:
http://fujifilm-x.com/x-e1/en/
This is the sort of thing that tells people:
“We (as a corporation) love what we just made and we want you to enjoy it too. So we build this very pretty site because here we can give you all the info we want you to have in a pretty way.”
The design team must really hate the marketing team 🙂
Not yet in other country(ies) probably, but Sony Japan has.
http://www.sony.jp/ichigan/products/ILCE-7R/index.html
I think we were expecting something more akin to the Canon G10 and VII Photo website when that camera was around. Or something like the Fuji X100 when that camera was launched.
You know, something less corporate, more photographic aimed.
Yep, posted a few examples above.
Yes, that’s what I am talking about.
Can’t wait for A7 to start shipping, now I have to figure it out how to preoder one in HK with delivery to Eastern Europe because I’m not paying EU prices when I can get it cheaper;)
Rx10 is really surprised me, I wasn’t expecting alot from it but clean hdmi, nd filter, constant aperture, manual control? this is one hell of camera for documentaries
Interesting stuff today, but personally I’d really like to see something similar in A-mount…
All future E-mount cameras will have the Alpha/RX menu. By bye NEX menu! And the even bigger news is that there will be no more camera branded as “NEX”. By bye NEX!
Ce n’est qu’un au revoir mes freres, ce n’est qu’un au revoir,….
When Amazon says it is available in December 1st, do they start shipping it on December 1st?
ok… no more NEX… everything is “A”.. regardless of the mount….
And Sony did say they aren’t abandoning the A-mount..
So please Andrea, how about some A-mount rumors now that the E-mount stuff is all out and public?
all out? it’s time to start writing rumors about NEX A8\A9 with IBIS and stuff:p
The comparison in size raises a question, what did they put in the a7, where in NEX 7 was the viewfinder, since they pulled out the entire segment and glued it on top？ If whatever they put there really could’ve been sqeezed elsewhere…then the body really is a bad idea.
Whatever the case, they probably did sack the NEX designers.
I think it has to see with the bigger magnification and/or eye relief. On my NEX-7 the EVF is really nice, but on the A77 it does feel noticeably better.
So the EVF is bigger in size…no comment on that since I rarely use even NEX 7’s EVF, its display IMO is actually a little too fine, and focus slows when I look for highlighted areas with peaking set to low(for accuracy).
The highlighted areas are much more pronounced on the screen, since the pixels are larger.
Perhaps but then pull a Contax G2 and make just the viewfinder slightly deeper. Sigh.
I’d agree with you that a Contax G2’s design is better, but look at the bulk of these lenses, and the lenses in Contax G’s lineup, many would whine over the size of the lens if they released a body like that.
A FF sensor takes up quite a bit more space, so I’m not sure why this is a surprise.
the back screen is taller
I don’t want to be Mr. Negative here but why is the A-Mount 70-200mm f/2.8 ii priced at a staggering $3000??? The Canon 70-200mm f/2.8 IS II (which in my opinion is the best 70-200mm lens so far) retails for $2500. So why would Sony price version ii $1000 above the original and $500 above a market leader’s 70-200mm? I know the reviews aren’t in yet for version ii but I pray it blows away the original as well as the Canon and Nikon 70-200mm or else I may need to consider an option “B” for a new 70-200mm lens for myself.
Give up on A-mount and in late 2014 launch a new design 70-200mm F2.8 E-mount and put a nail in the A-mount coffin. lol
I’m generally open-minded about lenses until reviews come in…but the listed features, specs, dimensions, size, weight and appearance of the “new” 70-200 are identical to the old 70-200 – except the the price which is a shocking 50% higher. Some on here have said that the coating of the lens or front element has been changed. If this is the case expect precisely the same performance with marginally better flare control. That’s a $1000 coating, must be made from diamond dust.
Anyone brave enough to post M-mount samples shot with the A7? I’m disappointed to learn that only the A7r has the new microlens design (but no PDAF sensors?!)
This guy has one shot with the ZM 18mm. Can’t judge much from it, though.
http://briansmith.com/sony-a7r-field-test/
My bad, read your comment too quickly.
Joel it can either work well with old glass or have phase which one do you want?
Both. Why is that impossible or so unique?
because only the 36 has the microlens adjustments.
http://www.dchome.net/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=1228246&extra=page%3D1
someone used a cv 12/15mm on the A7
apparently not much magenta shift but quite a bit of vignetting on the CV 12mm
that’s really an extreme wide angle lens. So issues are expected 🙂
Thanks, but the google translate version of the page is hard to follow (plus there are no pics) so I’m not 100% sure if it was an A7 vs an A7r. If the only issue on the A7 is a slight color shift or vignetting that would be amazing! Those things can be compensated for in post pretty well. It is the smearing like that seen in the VG900 that is a real problem.
The Zeiss 35mm and 7R combo really delivers big time, as seen on Brian Smiths website. Check it out.
Can’t wait to see and hear more on these cameras!
I’ve got a small weight and price comparison at my blogsite in the ‘5 Reasons To Love The Sony A7 / A7r cameras’ article if interested.
I love that it’s about the same weight as my first film SLR – the Nikon EM
http://marsweekly.wordpress.com/
I ought to call to your attention that Zeiss did make a pancake lens.
The 45mm 2.8 Tessar:
http://www.myferraris.com/images/Contax/Contax_2002-12-15_0-08_Web.jpg
FINALLY! A true leica competitor! With autofocus! And a grip! And an viewfinder that isn’t an attachment! Demand for the M and M9 is going to drop and demand for M lenses is going to peak! Hoping zeiss comes out with some nice MF updates to those ancient biogons.
Before announcement – was looking for a good deal on Nex-7 and D800; after announcement – ditto! In my mind Sony has made a mistake that Fuji and Panasonic will capitalize on.
Not one test image shown so far is sharp at all.
I totally agree. The three full size sample images I have seen look fairly soft at 100%….like they could use a bit of un-sharp mask. I thought I was the only one to feel that way but obviously not…
unsharp masking isn’t going to bring back the eye lashes that I would expect to see. Thats a lot of software or jpeg softening for whatever reason.
> Photoclubalpha: Thoughts by David Kilpatrick.
Site seems to be down…
J.
Sony A7r specifications says “Use Wi-Fi or NFC (near field communication) for convenient cordless image transfer to Android™ smartphones and tablets. ”
Does that mean it won’t work with Apple’s iPhone? Tell me I got it wrong. NEX5R works with my iPhone.
Wi-fi to iphone yes, NFC – no.
Use common sense…WiFi is a standard protocol, it will also work on iPhone but you will need to set up the network manually instead of just touching the camera and phone to establish connection.
It will work you just have to set it up manually.
Why are so many people whining about the lenses. Sure, it will take Sony 2 more years to develop those promised 15 lenses, but how many lenses do the most of you use now? more than 15?
Plus the option to adapt existing Nikon, Canon, and Leica lenses. And a-mount lenses via Sony’s adapter(s). Plus existing e-mount lenses in your choice of crop or full/vignette mode. *FAR*, far better lens options than most new systems when they’re introduced!
The problem is, most people believe that the lenses are overpriced for their specs, meaning, the 55/1.8 should be a 55/1.4 with OSS, the 35/2.8 should be a 35/2, with OSS, the 24-70/4 should be a 24-70/2.8, then nobody would whine.
These prices aren’t irrational, it’s safer to say Zeiss is charging too much premium for their label.
With OSS? You’re kidding right? Who says that?
Why won’t Sony Canada update their website for preorders??? Hurry up!!
Available for pre-order now at Henry’s Canada
Thanks, I also see theCameraStore has preorders. But if history repeats, the Sony store will be likely to get them more reliably and fill the orders on Dec 1st. So I’m still waiting on it to update.
If I were to use my 18-200mm E-mount lens (the “original” Sony model) on an A7 or A7R (in “crop mode,” I assume), would there by any downside (as to image quality) versus using it on an NEX-5 series, particularly as to video? The lens has active stabilization.
Not so compact with the viewfinder on top. Skip- alpha will be out soon enough.
The three full size samples I have seen all look slightly soft…certainly not what I would expect from a 36mp sensor with no AA filter…
I’m reserving judgement until there are more samples out there from a final version.
“The A7R feature the most lifelike colors I’ve ever seen from a digital camera.” Brian Smith..
36MP Sony A7r vs 36MP Nikon D800E size comparison !
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2893/10312472905_d2a388ce91_b.jpg
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3815/10312533305_7b66bd3da9_b.jpg
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3780/10312750823_172ea9b7c6_b.jpg
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5524/10312655036_d36c4667e8_b.jpg
http://camerasize.com/compare/#488,291
Is anyone else having trouble finding how many dots the EVF has on the RX10? Even the Sony store doesn’t list it.
http://www.dpreview.com/news/2013/10/16/sony-introduces-large-sensor-high-zoom-cyber-shot-rx10#specs
if I have a canon fd 50/1.4 lens with nex adapter, will that work in ff-mode or just in crop mode?
ff
Tested A7 and A7R with Zeiss 35/2.8 +55/1.8 @ Hong Kong
The body itself is very good but the picture quality is just a “NEX with 35mm Full Frame”
Here is some sample and 100% crop with NR off
http://s666.photobucket.com/user/singlag/library/Sony%20A7?sort=3&page=1
may be i expect too much on PQ
Can I post this on SAR?
u can found more sample by other user at http://www.dchome.net and omuser.com
do you have direct links? Difficult for us non native chinese or korean readers to find them 🙂
try this one
http://www.dchome.net/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=1228252&extra=page%3D1
have some RX10 sample but not yet upload….
thanks for Sony Hong Kong, they allow 150 Home User to try their A7/A7R/RX10 and 28-70, 35/2.8, 55/1.8 today
singlag, No disrespect to you sir but these pictures (the way they have been exposed and processed) do not do any justice and frankly I would not make statements like a “larger NEX”.
What does “just a NEX with 35mm FF” mean?
same colour rendering, may be a bit better ISO/PQ than Nex-6/7 but it just feel like a “no crop” 35mm full frame sensor NEX-6 for my M mount lens ~.~
the EVF on A7/A7R is feel bigger and comfortable than Nex6/X-E1
The camera menu is much better than the NEX one
solid build and feel better than Nex-7
the only thing need to be improve may be is the sooc jpeg.
I still haven’t seen any 100% corner crops of any of the wider M lenses. Do you have any to share?
Could you post samples of the A7 (no R) ?
it means the A7 can do what we already seen in the A99, it is using the same sensor with only updated processing
I’d like to see sample images from the new kit lens..
My A7R ordered and I am first in line. They told me it should be here by Nov 29th!
For faster AF and will using RF wide angle lens, go for A7 (no colour shift with CV12/5.6)
For higher and sharp PQ, go for A7R
This is very interesting that A7 is better with ultra wide angle lenses!
Any other lenses tried, like 20-25mm?
Same as RF Wide angle lens on Nex6 and Nex7 (Higher Pixel)
Lower pixel, low colour shift
Shutter sound is like my old Sony A100, I like it 🙂
Some people say these cameras are all pre-production and not got
final firmware. I don’t know about that, but maybe small changes can come.
Nah, Ken Rockwell probably will hate about the missing DOF scale and aperture ring lol and Kai probably will say that the design is fugly.
Let’s wait what Ken Rockwell and that Chinese guy say. If they like it, I’ll buy it.
On this day Sony has brought to market a Full Frame ILC with AF & EVF that can literally sit in the palm of your hand – and for under $1,700. Most here would say impossible if polled a few months ago. Most here were expecting a price of $3,000 + now that this groundbreaking camera is a reality I am just astounding at all the biitching and complaining;
+1
A few of us are.
Like I said, every new post in this site incites the anal ventriloquists.
+1 I have a suspicion that many here are not interested in buying this camera anyway, and thus the subdued tone of the comments. The cameras are wildly exciting for anyone that’s been waiting for compact fullframe.
Ok, now I’m convinced that the new mirror less A mount FF body will be named A9 and A9R 🙂
The only thing I don’t like about this A7 / A7R camera is missing IBIS.
Yes, there seems to be more space for it behind the sensor than inside the RX1 body!
Yep, I am wondering what these cameras would be, given how great the A7/r are.
So as a commercial photographer, I don’t need a compact body, a full size A mount body works just fine for my job, as long as it has IBIS and bit grip. But A7/7R is definitely for my travels.
I’m really depressed that NEX has been discontinued. This is the worst news ever from Sony. What a schizophrenic strategy. So sorry to hear the NEX designers have been sacked… they really did an outstanding job. 🙁
They are rebranding the lineup not changing the actual cameras. Why fuss over three letters?
What about A mount????
See here:
http://www.photographyblog.com/news/sony_a_mount_not_dead_but_nex_is/
I personally think new full frame A mount cameras from Sony will be much more targeted at the professional user, aimed at competing with the Canon EOS-1DX and Nikon D4/D800E.. But we will have to wait until next year I think for the highest spec model(s) appear..
YesI agree, I need IBIS for future A mount camera.
Am I the only one that thinks the new Alpha-7 cameras are just TOO DAMN BIG? The huge advantage of my NEX-7 is the phenomenal image quality combined with the small size. I left Nikon, which I used for the previous 36 years (film and digital) due to the high image quality and small size of the NEX-7.
While the new Alpha-7 cameras are not a large amount heavier, they are MUCH larger (taller). While the price doesn’t put me off, the size absolutely does, and I will not buy one.
I’ll stick with my NEX-7 for the foreseeable future.
Sony has just made a huge mistake with the Alpha-7, and I believe their future sales will reflect that fact.
I don’t think they’re abandoning APS-c. They are just extending the upgrade path. Of course new APS-C, small, high end PAS-C cameras will come in the future.
Does SAL70200GII will be 50% better than the SAL70200G to justify the 50% increase in price?
Sony Japan’s website claims it is weather sealed and it is 4x faster to focus compared to the old version
LOL, then you have no clue how pricing and performance increment relationship works. By the same reasoning, we should all shoot with a coke bottle.
It’s not 50%….. In the UK the old one sold for about £1600, and the new one is going to cost about £1900. Get the Tamron and save a few £, $, €.
Do you know how to solve the problem of the vignetting and color shifting?
Remove all the filter including IR cut filter, and just leave the sensor and its micro-lenses.
I took the filters out of my nex-5n, and the vignetting and color shifting are all gone from my rough inspection.
Many lenses neglect to focus IR since it’s outside the visible spectrum. So removing the IR cut filter leads to smeared images.
Hallelujah!!
Samyang will release native FF-lenses for new Sony cameras:
http://photorumors.com/2013/10/16/samyang-to-produce-full-frame-sony-e-mount-lenses/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+PhotoRumors+%28PhotoRumors.com%29
Five lenses within two months!!
On the second thought, these might be designed for DSLR cameras, but just with the adapter built in. Nevertheless it shows that we should expect 3rd party lenses soon and hopefully also from Sigma, Tamron etc…
Given the timeframe, quite probably 🙂
I suspect that too.
You know who we need here? Who we really need here?
Schneider Kreuznach. I mean, if they deliver on their promises. They promised some really nice lenses for m43 but never delivered.
Now, if they promised something really nice for FE mount and deliver, I would be intrigued and very interested (HINT: 24/2, 35/2, 50/2)
LOL, all the same focal as their DSLR offer. I don’t know why it would take them that long to release them. Regarding Schneider. They got me excited over nothing when they said they would produce lenses (also for A-mount) competing with the Zeiss Otus. Well, I guess they should just go back and make even better filters.
Same shit, side view.
14mm f/2.8 seems interesting.
I am not very familiar with the NEX series, so I apologize in advance, should my question sound that uninformed. Does anyone know whether there is a system of (ultrasound) sensor cleaning in A7(r)? It´s absence was one of the turn-offs for me when considering Leica M. Thanks in advance.
good question
According to Steve Huff, sensor has electronic dust removal. 🙂
Great news! Thanks a lot.
I passed by mirrorlessrumors.com and I saw this thing about a Fuji FF and I thought: “well, that’s convenient” so I went to see Fuji Rumors.
You know what that post looks like? very similar to the post here where people were moaning about bringing a FF camera and not having their current APS-C work with the new camera. What is even more impressive is that this is the same people that defended the APS-C X Trans sensor as having similar IQ properties as the FF sensors because the X Trans magic was all you ever needed. No one is defending that now. As a matter of fact, they are asking for an RX1-like camera but with the hybrid EVF.
some say that Fuji could do it, but that they would be disappointed if it happens before they refresh their flagship X Pro 1. Then others say that Fuji should only have a fixed lens zoom FF camera. Others say that they don’t want to see big lenses for the Fuji X cameras since APS-C is where the good size is at. Only one of them got his neurons together and mentioned that the point was that even if Fuji (or Sony) did not have a full line up ready at start, there are so many M mount lenses to choose from that it would matter little at the beginning. He got no replies. I somehow think the Fuji users are more entrenched in their believes like Mac users are in theirs.
Funny, they say that the whole point of APS-C is to save in size and weight, when the X Pro 1 is so close in size to the M9/M8/M which are FF and the Sony A7/r are smaller than the Fuji X Pro 1.
I am a Mac user!
No surprise there… Not quite the full shilling are you?
But are you entrenched in your beliefs?
I somehow take you as an objective person who knows what he wants and therefore will act accordingly.
When I started in photography I couldn’t afford a Mac. But then by the time I realised that the one thing I would use anyways was Photoshop (and now Lightroom) I saw no real use to switching.
Just joking 🙂 Not important.
You got me there…
I feel sorry for the elephant.
“Honey!! I just saw our neighbor watching at our new car! He seems so jealous, that’s hilarious! Come on and watch with me behind the curtain!”
lol, Fuji users are insufferable. It’s marketing leading the blind.
I am a full time traveller so small form is important, I also like nice minimalist design which I can have with me at all times. The weather sealing of these cameras is a great move assuming it is seriously done with mild rain protection in mind. I had anticipated to see the minimalist design of the RX1/RX1r with the viewfinder incorporated in the body, no in-built fill-in flash (but one available for the ISO mount), interchangeable lenses, metal body and a faster hybrid AF. Although these cameras represent a leap forward for the camera industry products offerings as well as they will certainly prove to be great products with fantastic IQ, I have a few reservations. From what I saw I am dissaponted with the fat handle, the viewfinder bump, the noisy shutter and slow AF. When compared to the RX1/RX1r the A7/A7r are fatter and bulkier. Although money is not a problem and I would have been happy to spend for what I want, I think I’ll pass for this time, keep on with my NEX gear and see what comes next year or in 2015.
Would you also abstain from writing if you are such a patient and generous person?
I think this is a good spot to post your wants and needs. I have pre-ordered the A7r with lenses and will be more than happy with it but I would like to see a silent shutter, touch screen and IBIS in a future model. It would be great to make an IBIS version separate from the A7r if it is a lot bulkier and make the future A7R with a side vf and detachable grip for those who use mainly small prime lenses and want a rf look.
+1 for side vf and detachable grip, and of course, ibis
Let’s hope the battery door flap is well made. This is weak point on some DSLRs – and with these cameras many are going to need to swap batteries far more frequently.
Of course if you only ever take less than 300 shots, and charge the battery in the camera, it shouldn’t be a problem.
What will be the affect if I use my Zeiss 16-80 APC on the A7?
Just like what you’d get with that lens on an A99. It will give you a decent cropped (APS-C) or a heavily vignetted larger image. Not much point to buy a full frame body to use APS-C lenses.
Can’t wait to see the Hasselblad version. What will they be called? The Saturn or Galactica perhaps? 😉
That should be fun. Celestial? Galactic? Cosmic? Whatever the case, it will include wood.
I sense a Uranus joke coming.
Rather than Uranus I think ruserious is neither the mark
😀
Lunar Eclipse?
These cameras should work with Canon, Nikon and Samyang tilt shift lenses.
– provided the adapters don’t cause vignetting with t/s lenses
I believe that Samyung announced that they will release a native mount tilt shift for the E-mount
http://www.dpreview.com/news/2013/10/16/samyang-announces-five-full-frame-e-mount-lenses
Nativr as in not required of you to mount your own 10$ adapter.
They will do that for you and in return you will be stuck with a lens only for e-mount.
Better buy a Nikon version tiday and adapt to any other system if you wish later
Is the RX10 using a newer generation faster Bionz image processor than the one in the A7 cameras?
I was TOTALLY wrong about the aesthetics and design of this camera. I love the harsh lines and the concrete slab style grip extra grip–no added flourishes, nothing is there that doesn’t need to be, it’s modern, sleek, very efficient and I love it.
I was WRONG. It’s a great looking camera after all. Kudos Sony.
It does change your perception when you see it with the grip, doesn’t it?
So now that nex 5 & 7 goes to the design museum (where a7 will never get) will anything similar come? If so, Aps-C or FF?
So, if NEX branding is removed, that means future NEX 3, NEX 5, NEX 6 will become A3, A5, A6? So how about NEX 7? It cannot be A7 obviously, and I don’t think it can be A8 or A9 either. So will there really be any NEX 7 successor? An APsC, 24MP, Tri-Navi, PDAF, EVF, tilting LCD, WIFI, NFC, rangefinder style camera suits me well
I am blown away by the image quality of the distagon zm 18 on the a7… Images have this 3d hdr-ish look. I have never seen anything like that ..ever.
http://briansmith.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/Sony-a7r-Haiti-2201.jpg
Ok, noob question but what is that the old Bionz could handle a bust of 10 24mp images but the new one can’t?
like to know that too. perhasp it’s the larger sensor which makes it harde for the sensors. There could be a thing with image quality also. the 12fps bursts on my A77 hadrly ever result in 12 acceptable pictures to say the least. (or perhasp my A77 is broken 😛 )
S.Yu wrote:
“… most people believe that the lenses are overpriced …”
Zeiss lenses are overprised? Have you seen what people have to pay for lenses for their Leica cameras?
And “… for their specs, …”? You haven’t discovered any other differences between the huge number of different lenses in the world, than their specs??? E.g. 50 mm lenses can be bought from say 50 USD and to more than 1.500. Do you think that the only differences between these are their max aperture? If so, the cheapest possible lenses would suffice for you…
And you believe that “… most people …” think like you? I would say that most people interesting in the A7/A7R cameras WITHOUT DOUBT have observed the differences between various lenses in sharpness, contrast, colour rendition, “pop”, 3D-feeling etc.
Further, if you want to go from good to excellent performance (whatever product it would be), the complexity in design, the costs of rare materials, the difficulty to produce and the accuracy needed and the many and thorough tests at every step will make the costs explode.
And you want a 55/1,4 lens with OSS, and cheap too? Haven’t you spent one thought about why neither Nikon nor Canon like to go above 1:2,8 with their stabilized lenses? They offer only a few with 1:2,0 and NONE with 1:1,4. The reason for that shouldn’t be too hard to figure out. Lens stabilization work by throwing around one or two lens elements. This will be like decentralizied lens elements in non-stabilized lenses. Which is then a production failure, and will cause any serious manufacturer to try to adjust this, or, if not possible, to discard the lens.
If Zeiss (or anyone else) would charge too much in regard to the performance of their products, no one will buy these. As simple as that!
And in case you wouldn’t know – Zeiss is doing very good. They are by far the worlds largest producer of quality optics.
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Admin, the Reply function with Tree view structure doesn’t seem to work.
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Well, this time it did…
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