There are also two A-mount news to report after yesterdays big Sony event:
1) Sony finally shows there is a future for A-mount
By openly disclosing the two new A-mount lens releases for 2015 Sony brought back some confidence in the A-mount system. Finally after many words from managers we also got some…facts.
2) A-mount and E-mount differences fading out:
The A6000 already started to get one step closer to PRO DSLR autofocusing performance. The one major advantage of A-mount over E-mount left was in body stabilization. But now that advantage is gone.
I am wondering how Sony wants to promote the A-mount system. It will be harder for Sony to justify the existence of an A-mount system unless Sony does “invent” something that cannot be done on E-mount (like Z-shift or other crazy features).
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I was really hoping for an A99 II with new sensor next year. But now they released the A7 II with IBIS – which makes me think different.
All I need is a A-E-Adapter with the AF system from the A77-II and a A7R-II for my CZ A-Mount lenses now.
So You Think the Adapter will do?
its abit of a :/ feeling, but its what we might be looking at in the future :/
the annoance factor might come into play, and the cost of adapters…
The “Z” shift was done years ago on the Samsung Contax Autofocusing Film Camera!!!
Wait wait what? Samsung? Its Kyocera -.-
Imperative Sony offer a 24mm fast autofocus prime (made by zeiss would be fine:) and an 85 or 90mm fast prime. A 35 f1.4 would be nice too. Plus a couple of Macro lenses.
3 versions of the 24-70 is quite enough, thanks
I am sure sony will make an E-mount 24-70mm F2.8 one.
I think there’s ALREADY a 24mm f/2 lens of Zeiss design. Admmittedly for the A-mount. Did I miss something?
If E mount can break the code and add in IBIS then why not just make a small, compact MILC A mount full frame? Just do it- there are no longer any rules to this game.
You can remove the mirror/SLT in A-mount camera,
but you still need to left some empty space between the sensor & lens.
You won’t able to attach Cankon lens in the smaller A-mount Mirrorless FF.
The main reason to add IBIS in E-mount is to attract more Cankon & A-mount user to E-mount. But making a smaller A-mount FF, won’t make people switch system.
The empty space isn’t a big deal. I usually need a place to pack skittles with me when hiking anyway. Besides that, it’s only an inch. Just leave the dang thing empty and slim everything else down. Basically, release the A9 with an A mount attached.
I prefer A9 with free LA adapter, you get the best of both worlds 😉
If the adapter has a fast PDAF module with wide AF coverage, which the current one does not.
free is the annoyance you’ll get with it
Comparing the A7II to the A99 it will still have a crippled ergonomic. It would be better to have a A99 body style for the A9 as the grip migration of the A7II shows. Its nice to have a compact style but it doesn’t help when your hand are hurting all the time and you lose control.
I agree then use an Adapter to put E-mount lens on!
Thinkinginpictures – I think you’re right outside of the Skittles – since they would add to sensor reflections. Mirrorless A-mount is next.
The rest of the body could be slimmed a bit, the EVF could be moved to the corner and the hump goes away, dual card slots, built in flash, internal 4k, dual Bionz processors for fast FPS, fully articulating LCD, larger buttons and so on. It would be chunky like a Leica, but it would work.
because A-mount is dead?
Probably.
Why have 4 product lines?
If Sony manages to pull off a DSLR-quality mirrorless, they can just release FE versions of all A-Mount glass.
I think that will happen. If they match A mount offerings (albeit with slower lenses) by the end of next year- well, what’s next? Faster lenses, bigger bodies- that’s what. Ahhh, so frustrating.
As Andrea noticed, 1) and 2) contradict each other…
The future of A-Mount depends directly on being different from E-Mount.
So far there hasn’t been an E-Mount camera that can reach A-Mount performance, but A9 may be the 1st, and after that FE 24-70 f/2.8 and such would start making sense.
A99-II is coming in 2015, and Sony is updating its lenses for the 3-4 years that this camera will be relevant, but it reluctant to promote A-Mount or make new lenses for it. 24-105 f/4, 35mm ZA never materialized, and since Sony is making a full transition to mirrorless, probably never will.
Unless Sony changes the game as well and A99-II features some breakthrough tech as well. As it turns out, these guys are full or surprises.
The question (imho, and essentially what Andreas is saying) is: What _technical_ (i.e.: engineering) reason does Sony have to continue the a-mount? If there is none, a-mount will die. Owners of (mostly FF) a-mount lenses will use adapters and use them on (mostly FF) bodies — that is, E-mount (FF). If there IS a technical limitation to E-mount that is not present is a-mount, Sony will continue a-mount as long as it is profitable.
My _guess_ is that the release of the two new a-mount lenses is due to their being already well-along in development, and Sony seeking some return on the investment in their development (practically a no-lose and therefore no-risk proposition). I think they represent a latency in a-mount development, _not_ a return to a-mount as a focus of investment/thinking by Sony.
I move the probability that a-mount is dead even higher today. I don’t mind — I will use my expensive lenses on EF bodies via an adapter, as well as continue to use my much-loved a850 and a900.
May be theye could come with a new A-mount modular camera system (lens / body / back) like MF cameras allowing for a fully customized combination of all components?
What aspects of performance are you comparing? E-mount can match or surpass A-mount in IQ. In autofocus performance, the A6000 is very very competitive with A-mount. Frame rate and buffer, again, the A6000 is right up there with A-mount. (11fps vs 12fps?). Within full frame models, I agree that the A7 performance doesn’t quite reach dSLR levels yet, but the gap is quickly closing, as demonstrated by the A6000.
I also wouldn’t be shocked if these new SSM A-mount upgrades, may also be sneaking in greater E-mount compatibility. I wouldn’t be the least bit surprised if there is a new adapter in the works, no-SLT Mirror, that will make the A9 compatible with the newest SSM lenses. Thus, for people who want a 24-70/2.8 lens, the Zeiss SSMII 24-70/2.8 might be fully functional on the A9 with a simple non-mirrored adapter.
The gap is quickly closing, but haven’t closed yet.
As for the SSM-II upgrades, it has been mentioned on local forums that those may be designed to make A-Mount lenses work with OSDPAF. This way Sony can, for the time being, keep A-Mount and provide fast-aperture lenses for A9.
The gap is closing MUCH FASTER than most of us were anticipating. A year ago, people were saying that AF wasn’t in the same league… Then came the A6000.
It was looking like Sony had decided to rely on OSS for E-mount… Then came this very very surprising announcement of IBIS in E-mount — Not just any IBIS, 5-axis, superior to A-mount IBIS.
Increasing the compatibility of the A-mount SSM lenses with E-mount should be a no-brainer for Sony. They already try to market the “Alpha lens selection”.. and they make half-honest claims about All Alpha lenses being compatible with E-mount. If those SSM lenses were compatible with a simple “spacer adapter” as opposed to a whole SLT apparatus, it would make the claim more truthful. And it would instantly fill the biggest gap in the E-mount lens lineup — 2.8 zooms and long telephoto zooms, as the 16-35/2.8, 24-70/2.8, 70-200/2.8, 70-300G, and 70-400G might all become truly compatible with E-mount, with a simple spacer adapter.
My honest question is what has changed / has been improved on the lenses compared to the old version? is it only a “II” added or are there more important changes. I’m thinking to replace my old sigma 24-70.
But lately I’ve lost my Sony fanboy attitude and I’m rather suspicouse toward any anouncement
Sony makes on A-mount
Well those slides list the same three improvements for both lenses. Namely faster AF speed, dust and drip-proofing and improved rendering performance due to reduced ghosting. Not really game changers in terms of the results the lenses will actually produce.
At the time I bought the Sigma the CZ was far to expensive for the ratings it stored. In the meantime I’m more interested in IQ, especially Corner Sharpness. Do you know how the current CZ 24-70 performes?
I do not know first hand how it performs. Apart from the 16-35 I only use the CZ primes. But as for the 16-35, I am definitely not happy with its corner sharpness and I doubt this update is going to remedy that.
Thanks for your input 🙂
Price.
I think these new developments on E mount FF are great. I have nothing against E mount, I use A mount at the moment. Assuming the AF performance of mirrorless could catch up with A77II then there would no longer be any reason to stick with A mount. If Sony produced an APS-C similar to the A7 II body, with AF at least as good as the first generation A77 then I would switch tomorrow. I would find it difficult to pay A7 FF series prices (for lenses in particular), however the A7II body type is much more appealing to me than the A5000/6000 shape.
My speculation about the amalgamation of A-mount and E-Mount:
With a special adapter [ as we’ve seen already with that big silver ring mounted on an A-Mount camera ] you could have either a_mount or e-mount.
As you change the adapter the sensor will be shifted to accommodate the correct flange distance for that mount. This will be the so-called Z-shift.
I doubt that at the introductory stage the Z-shift will be used for focusing. That might come later as an “upgrade”.
To accommodate the focusing on the sensor, the lenses need to have stepper motors which I suspect is what is in these new versions presented here.
This is not new. Canon has been doing this on the quiet for some time already with their STM lenses. So we can expect Canon to also bring out a mirrorless FF system soon.
Just a thought.
Nice idea, as long as the Z-shift is reliable and it comes in a A99 Style body with nice ergonomics. My guess for Sony that the final design of the A7 System will look like a sibling of the A77.
I don’t think there will be any kind of amalgamation. It is more likely the cameras will be natively E-mount – A-mount support will be through adapters. The A7II already points to this future.
There will be no more A-mount body. A9 will replace A99. LAEA-7 will be announced with the A9. SEL24105z and SEL85F1.4z will also come by the end of next year.
Crazy talk.
Only a little too forward-thinking. All the geniuses were called crazy at first. 🙂
So are crazy people, and most of them aren’t geniuses.
It makes absolute sense to continue both lines (A and E mount) even when AF and lenses are equally developed on both mounts. There will always exist people with large hands and longer fingers just preferring the larger A-mount bodies and lenses. Remember also that your eyes are not getting better with age and you all will be glad to find a bigger alternative, whether it is a watch, a calculator, a smartphone/tablet, an LED-TV or a button on an DSLR
Nothing prevents Sony from making an A99-sized E-Mount body.
Minituarization is tricky.
Making something bigger is not the problem. Just look at all those enlarge-your-junk ads.
online advertising is usually based on previous searches and page visits,,, just sayin’ 🙂
AND, using the a99 chassis for a E-mount body, Z-axis focus could get squeezed in.
If A-mount continues to be developed, it won’t be solely for the benefit of people with large hands! It’s a big “if” and these new modified lenses do not constitute any sort of confidence in its long term future.
E-mount is not limited to small cameras – I expect the A9 will be larger than the A7 and will have more of a DSLR influence.
Slightly bigger body doesn’t seem like enough of a reason to maintain an entirely separate product line. And technologically, there is no reason you can’t make an E-mount with a “big body.” Wouldn’t it be much cheaper and simpler for Sony to produce an E-mount with a “big body” then maintain an entirely separate incompatible competing and overlapping product line?
You can have larger bodies with e-mount. The short register is an enabler, it says nothing about the size of the body. Having said that, I can’t imagine Sony producing an e-mount as large as an A99, let alone something the size of a Nikon D4S.
I said a long, long, time ago here that we would end up using our A mount lenses on E mount body+adapter and got accused of being a troll.
Same here…… First the fanboys attack for honest and obvious discussion… Then when those “troll predictions” become true, the fanboys turn around as if they never attacked those predictions, and they start to embrace it as if it was what they wanted all along.
I got called a troll a year ago for saying that Sony was focusing on E-mount, for saying that Sony was going to start making the E-mount a pro-camera competitor. And I got called a troll when I said I suspected Sony would first start to reduce their lineup of A-mounts, not eliminate them overnight. I was told that Sony would release 3-4 A-mount bodies in 2014, that I would be proven wrong. When my predictions came totally true, the fanboys change their position…. “nobody needs lots of bodies… Sony is the greatest company on earth for giving a good adapter”
Adam, you’re just a complaining douche bag, do you ever stop crying like a frikin baby?
Douching is one of several disgusting American practises right? Do you live in the cradle of decivilization?
You were spot-on. Now that there’s IBIS, if Sony improve their SLT adapters, then there’s no case for new A-mount bodies (assuming they produce an e-mount body with similar ergonomics to an SLT/DSLR body).
You’re still a troll.
I remember a few of those conversations in the comments in here from a couple years ago around this time of year. You still got a few you are dreaming responses not that long ago but now I doubt there will be any.
As an A-mount user I have to say that I also fail to see the case for both mounts in the future if its true that the A9 is faster than the A6000. I suppose that it’s not out of bounds to imagine that sony sees this as a stop gap measure until the FE system is beefed up. Since they are in the “impossible” achievements here It could also be that the famed dual mount might see the day of light. And to continue with pipe dreams I also love the one of Sony releasing new LAEA-(x) that would allow you do upgrade the focus sub-system of your A7 for A-mount without having to buy a new body.
I recently switched away from A-mount, after almost 20 years with it. As expressed by admin, how can Sony really market the A-mount to buyers? As we look into the near future, what are the competitive advantages of A-mount over E-mount and over CaNikon?
2 years ago, A-mount fans claimed A-mount wasn’t going anywhere, because:
-E-mount was for point and shooters, E-mount doesn’t have have full frame or professional grade bodies — No longer true.
-E-mount autofocus can’t compete with A-mount: No longer true for APS-C, and won’t be true for full frame much longer, in all likeihood.
-E-mount doesn’t have enough lenses. If you believe the roadmap, there will be 20+ FF lenses by the end of 2015 — the same number as full frame A-mount.
-E-mount lacks IBIS — Not sure you *NEED* IBIS to be successful — Canon and Nikon dominated the market for years without it. But to the extent that this was an advantage of A-mount, it’s gone now. In fact, as of now, IBIS in E-mount is BETTER than the IBIS in A-mount.
What have we got left? “A-mount, for people who want a slightly bigger body”??
For people who want the best traditional dSLR, those buyers will gravitate to Canon and Nikon.
Fortunately, for those heavily invested in A-mount glass… IBIS on E-mount, really can make using adapters much more appealing. Stick the adapter on the A7ii, it basically becomes an A-mount dSLT camera.
In fact….. what’s really the difference between the A99, and the A7ii with adapter? IQ should be about the same. AF should be the same. Image stabilization should be better on the A7ii than on the A99. Other than 6fps vs 5fps… I can’t think of any advantages of the A99 over the A7ii+adapter. Okay.. dual card slots and longer battery life.
a lot of “shoulds” at the end.
In my modest opinition the less loose plastic mounts holding the glass the better.
Make a suicide pact with Adam Brown, end your misery.
Adam, How has the transition been for you and do you use A-mount via LAEA adapter ?
I didn’t transition to E-mount, lol. To me, once I made the decision to leave A-mount, it was a blank slate… Could go to Canon, Nikon, E-mount, Fuji, Samsung…
But it became, was I more interested in a more traditional dSLR, with all its pros and cons.. or the more modern mirorless, with all its pros and cons.
The problem with the largely neglected development of the A-mount, is that while it could be the best of both worlds, it was becoming the worst of both worlds–
A traditional advantage of traditional dSLR over mirrorless —
– Much larger lens selection. But really, Sony’s A-mount full frame lens selection was never more than “adequate.” When an A-mount user criticizes the lens selection of E-mount.. it’s like someone from Minnesota saying that North Dakota is too cold.
-Traditional advantage of traditional dSLR over mirrorless — OVF is better than EVF for action tracking and some other circumstances — Sony already got rid of this one in their traditional dSLR.
-Traditional dSLR advantage — longer battery life — but Sony already sacrificed this in dSLTs.. see my Minnesota v. North Dakota cold analogy.
-Faster autofocus, better tracking AF — my A99 was “fair” in this regard, but behind the best Canon and Nikon when it came to AF.
Traditional advantages of mirrorless:
-Smaller and more compact — but obviously not my A99.
-dSLR image quality equivalence — because the SLT mirror blocks light, A-mount actually gives lesser image quality. It may be really close, many A-mount fans will say it is negligible, but it does exist.
– The most up to date features and technology…. Some of it could be added to the A99 with firmware, but Sony doesn’t bother.. So many of the newest tech features in mirrorless still haven’t reached Sony full frame A-mount. Zebra stripes, eyeball AF, etc..
So my A99 began to feel like… “a mirrorless that isn’t quite as good as Sony’s A7 mirrorless…. and a traditional that isn’t as good as Canon/Nikon traditionals.”
Sell everything and kill yourself, it’s the only solution.
It’s nice to see people still interested in the future of A-mount. I hope that Admin will scan his rumor box and show us a glimpse what 2015 may look like for A-mount user not charmed by the E-Mount+Adapter future.
These “new” lenses for A-mount just make me worry more for its future, Sony is doing nothing to fix the holes and weak points in the A-mount lens line up and yet claims to want to keep it as high-end oriented system. The only way for a high end system to survive without entry level models is if it offers some compelling reason to change (such as better lens selection, better AF, better fps, higher quality glass etc.). A-mount lacks the lenses to survive as a high end system, very few Canikon users will be tempted to switch from a system offering a vast and diverse lens line with extensive upgrade options for both bodies and lenses to the A-mount ecosystem which lacks the diversity and in many points the quality of the lens selection. The main advantage that Sony had in the A-mount was the entry level SLT cameras that offered full AF at 8 fps, yes the A77II still retains some of that advantage but less so than in lower end markets, that advantage is now mostly gone without entry level cameras to draw people into the system.
Totally agree, A-mount offers very little to somebody that has already invested in a Canon or Nikon system and in order to grow and not contract the A-mount market, Sony would need to have people switch to A-mount. I don’t see that happening in any significant numbers for the following reasons:
– Very few would switch from Canon EF or Nikon F mount to Sony A mount due to lack of lens selection and the camera bodies don’t offer enough compelling additional features. On the other hand, E-mount offers being able to use their old lenses on new cameras and, in the case of Canon users, the only real upgrade path for megapixels and dynamic range without having to buy a whole new lens set.
– Logical upgrade path for Sony compact users is not the A-mount, it is the E-mount and cameras like the axxxx series
– There is no real benefit in image quality to A-mount over E-mount and performance advantages such as AF, frame rate will dwindle over time as they are already doing.
So the A-mount remains primarily for those who have already invested in it and therefore, by definition, the number of users for A-mount will dwindle as people move on to other technology, die, or lose interest. I just can’t see any real growth for A-mount while there is E-mount growth potential. I know A-mount aficionados will not like this post but I feel it is reality. I wish it weren’t so. I have used cameras using this mount since the Maxxum 7000.
i’m still using the 7000- roll of film in it now with Sony 135mm 1.8 attached.
I still have a working MD-11 🙂
You are only partly correct because lenses are only partly compatable.
If they were made fully compatable you would be fully correct.
A naive question to the more knowledgeable people here. What are the technical limitations for Sony to adapt the current full frame a-mount lenses, with their existing optical formula to native e-mount lenses by adapting the lens to sensor distance which I understand is done with the LAEAx ?
“by adapting the lens to sensor distance” – that’s stuff that Samyang does, not a serious companies.
It’s fundamentally impossible. You simply can’t change the optical characteristics of a lens without adding an optical element to shorten the rear focal length (which would most likely have nasty effects on IQ). If you have to insert an optical adapter between the lens and the camera body, then you might just as well insert a slightly longer one without any optical components.
Then there are other issues. Most, if not all, A-mount lenses have focus drive systems and electronic interfaces which are sub-optimal for hybrid or contrast AF systems, so performance will suffer.
In short, what you want isn’t feasible. Most likely you can expect improved adapters for A-mount lenses.
You must not haveeven read the question…E mount is shorter distance and laea4 is only for focusing.
No optical element needed
No I didn’t. What I said was the existing optical designs can only be used by adding an optical element to reduce the rear focal length, and the extra would degrade performance and not be much shorter than using an adapter.
Of course, the optical design could be altered for some types of lenses. For instance, it might be possible with retrofocal and telephoto designs to tweak the rear elements to bring down the rear focal length, but that’s hardly the same optical design and, even if it was done, is likely to be sub-optimal. (Of course, the approach won’t work at all for symmetrical designs).
Compared to this amending of designs, it’s far better to come up with an optimised design. Otherwise they might just as well extend the length of the barrel. It would be a lot easier.
You dont seem to understand.
A mount has a longer f1ange distance therefore only an extension tube like device is needed.
No optical elements are needed . Nothing has to be desighned…to convert A mount to E mout.
The laea4 provides an slt mirror only in order to facilatate autofocus.
Of course I understand. Read the damned question. It’s asking what can be done to exploit the shorter flange distance using existing lens optical designs. In other words, more than just positioning the lens optical elements further away than the difference in the mount register distance.
nb. I don’t need a basic training in optics. I didn’t do 3 years of a physics degree for nothing. What you are talking about is trivially obvious. It isn’t dealing with the question.,
Why would anyone choose a complex optical solution when a simple mechanical solution works better?
Which is what I said. The only advantage of the optical solution is to make the overall length a bit less, but (short of a lens redesign), the gain is likely to be very small.
Lens voltage, motor speed, and ID are optimized to the camera system and different manufacturers do these differrently.
This is not because of some system limitation but rather a deliberate step to keep each system proprietary.
There is absolutely no technology issue that would prevent standardization or compatabilty.
There may be small technology issues to resolve but nothing that cant be easily resolved.
I think they will eventually get rid of A-mount and have a camera that excepts both A & E & perhaps take a larger battery. They can always make a dslr like FF multi mount. I see nothing wrong with this since you can still use A-mount lenses on a larger body.
Is it too crazy to think we could just end up with an E mount camera that simply has an A mount. I mean, just another version of one of the existing E mount cameras? Makes sense to me.
Would not work since E and A mount lenses require a different registry distance from the sensor. This is why you need to use an extension type adapter to use A mount lenses on E mount mirrorless cameras.
My thoughts exactly. Something like the “Alpha mount”, as the changes made to the naming suggests.
Agreed. That is why we are seeing 35mm 1.4 Emount lens. That is the proof right there. A-mount users needed an upgrade from the old Minolta glass. But E-mount got the new glass because it will be the future system.
Here’s a crazy idea for A-mount that E-mount can’t have: Bring back the OVF, or make a hybrid O+EVF for A99-2
And bring back the paddle wheel while you’re at it.
It’s simply not going to happen. Ever. Too expensive for a tiny market and clearly working in the opposite direction to technology. OVF is a niche product, it’s dominated by Canon and Nikon and will be left to them.
As for hybrid optical/EVF, that’s even more unlikely. It would be extremely difficult to do on a DSLR style camera and would involve a lot of compromises. If such a thing appears, expect Nikon and Canon to do it.
Proof?
Come back in 5 years’ time. Care to lay a bet that Sony will reintroduce OVFs having said that they’ve produced their last DSLR?
Need numbers. Like, just how much does an OVF cost to implement? What’s the actual cost? Fuji can make a hybrid, Canon and Nikon seem to make a profit off of it. Where did this notion of it being extremely difficult to do come from…alls I’m saying.
No, no OVF, but MF sensor…change A-mount to mirrorless medium format (or even SLT – its probably possible, just like it was possible to squeeze FF SLT module into laea4). Current A-mount lenses = crop mode.
“The A6000 already started to get one step closer to PRO DSLR
autofocusing performance. The one major advantage of A-mount over
E-mount left was in body stabilization. But now that advantage is gone.”
– I’m laughing hard. Well done Admin, said like a true E-mount fanboy. I’m sure many people around here are proud of you.
I have been of the same mind as it seems like all E mount all the time. However I must admit I am intrigued by the new A7II. The IBIS was a big issue for me and getting an E mount seemed like a downgrade because of that. Now I am waiting for the new A99II to see if I make the jump to E mount or not. And as many said here, a better adapter for my A mount primes would make it easier to decide to go to E mount
From what I see A-mount will be reserved for f2.8 zooms, f1.4 primes & large tele lenses.
Zeiss Distagon T* FE 35 mm f/1.4 ZA is coming for E-mount. Amount will be slowly phase out.
A mount won’t be phased out, if Sony was planning to phase it out than why release a refresh of three lenses they already have, why not just continue making the old ones and make more profit from the old design. Sony also spent a bunch of money to design the AF system in the A77II which was recently released, A mount will be rolling with E mount for a different group of shooters. I personally like the options Sony is giving to its shooters.
Sony refreshed the lens to easy the transition. Sony can’t cut off Amount in one month. Newer and redesign lens will be made for the future system, E-mount. E-mount makes way more money than A-mount ever will. 35mm F1.4 will design for A9 series. Then a new 85mm F1.4 and 135mm will be release for E-mount.
We need a more seamless adapter for A mount. The LAEA-4 is ugly and bulky. The bottom mount should be removable so it doesn’t stick out. How about a camera where it could be slid in the front- virtually undetectable as an attachment. I’m thinking random here- I just don’t like that thing. It makes me want to punch kittens.
+1
“I just don’t like that thing. It makes me want to punch kittens.” LOL. Nice… 🙂
One problem of the LA-EA4 is that it needs a motor to drive older lenses’ AF which is in the bottom part of the adapter and would probably be quite hard making removable. The other problem is that Sony’s sensors still don’t seem to be capable of driving phase detection AF in A-Mount lenses without the addition of an external PDAF sensor (which is why Olympus had to go to Panasonic for their E-M1 sensor), and, in Sony’s case, their SLT mirror.
…and thats the reason we must buy what Sony tells us. It has to be mirrorless even if it’s crippled
I wouldn’t bother with adapters. I tried it when I got my A7, and It just didn’t do it for me.
The best Sony set-up for me is an A-Mount for my three f/2.8 zooms, my two most used primes, and a maybe macro or fish-eye.
When I’m traveling light I just take the A7, and the 55mm f/1.8 (I’m not joking I’ve tried plenty of lenses for the A7, and the 55mm is a system seller, its as good as the 135mm f/1.8)
With IBIS on e-mount bodies, I see now point in major new A-mount bodies. The priority will surely be on improving the available SLT adapter to improve AF performance. After all, if you can get “pro-level” ergonomics and performance on an e-mount body with great PAF performance along with the added flexibility that e-mount gives you for either native or legacy glass, then why go for a native A-mount body?
Of course this is predicated on the A9 matching, or exceeding A99-style ergonomics and performance (using an adapter), but that is surely the minimum target.
Speed is the entire reason people buy SLTs. Sony’s SLTs can do up-to 12fps. The AF speed, 12fps on the latest model is 100% WOW.
The next gen FF SLT will probably do 36 to 46mp @ 12fps with a 90% hit rate, and this level of performance won’t be available on mirror-less for very along time, and by the time it does SLTs will be even faster (16 to 20 fps).
Its like catching a moving train.
Personally I’m keeping one of each.
I suppose that’s true, but the A6000 can hit 11fps. In any event, I wonder how far this needs be taken. Having a machine gun approach to photography means spending a huge amount of time spent wading through lots of images on the computer. I suppose for that ultimate sports or nature shot, it may be necessary, but I know that feeling of sorting out the dross and the ruthlessness you need to sort them out.
The A6000 makes 11 irritating noises per second, and has a hit rate of three or four if you’re lucky. I’m hoping they’ll be a A7000 that’ll give me better hit rates next year.
I hate shotgunning it, but sometimes I really don’t have a choice.
You’ve a screen name which is a near homonym for an early type of machine gun and you don’t like gunning it?
If Sony does indeed intend to conquer Canikon market share IBIS is a major major step in the right direction.
As for lenses..a good 200-600 f4.8 or 5.6 for around $3000 would be a malor step to fill the gap in the lens lineup.
Since A-E mount compatability is a much faster course that building a lens system than all new E mount lenses…Sony should carry the lens optimization feature one step further in the new a9.
The camera shold recognize the A mount lens voltage, af speed , id etc and automatically adjust its own af system to those parameters…
This would allow a simple adapter rather than an laea4 type adapter and facilitate mirrorless high speed af on A mount lense.
If Z shift and a hybrid mount become a reality this would also facilitate that.
Lastly…this same automatic optimization/recognition could also adjust to Canikon speed/voltage/id and if they change thier protocalls a simple firmware update would always keep Sony one step ahead of Canikon.
Thes relatively simple steps…combined with the innovations we already are aware of..would facilitate Sony market dominance.
Canon and Nikon will probably both introduce thier competing pro mirrorless systems sometime in 2015.
If they take advantage of thier strength the will maintain full compatability with thier current lens system and that will be difficult for Sony to compete against.
Full compatability plus the most advanced camera will surely dominate the market….but lack of full compatability will make market dominence much more difficult.
Lastly from the consumer point of view…full compatability means we can use any lens on any camera…the consumer benefits..more competition generates better products..
And serious Canikon users woud be far more likely to buy a Sony camera if they do not need to replace thier lens collection to use it.
They are then far more likely to buy a Sony lens next time if they own a Sony camera to put it on.
Sony promoted SLT tech because it’s an electronic company. Prism and mirror are costly to produice. And it was a way to differenciate their products against canikon. I think once they will lead the mirrorless business and secure their position and finances, they will be able to attack the DSLR market by produicing traditional DSLR A-mount with an OVF. O with half electronic/half optical viewfinder for example.
I actually own a nex but i believe E-mount really have too few battery because it is LCD/EVF dependant.
This problem kill the main advantage of E-mount, mobility. Don’t get me wrong, i think EVF are amazing too.
Ever hear of the A850, A900, A700 etc. You’re argument is total BS.
Why are you mentioning those? Sony stopped manufacturing them exactly when their financial problems started
From my own personal experience I started shooting Sony with mirrorless (5N), than A7 from there started looking into A mount lenses but got turned off due to lack of OS in lens to use on my A7. Since A7II announcement my interest for Minolta and Sony A mount is back. If I get some A mount glasses in the future I would definitely be getting an A mount body as well especially an APS-C body for the teles. It’s like what Apple did with their iPhones and ipads, they got people interested in their new stuff than once people got a taste of it people started to buy their old stuff like their Mac computers. Therefore A mount is very important for both Sony and consumers. I actually hope Sony will start releasing more A mount lenses to compete against Canon, Canon in my opinion has the best lenses in the market. But it will take time, it’s only been less than 10yrs since Sony took over Minolta. Future looks good for photographers.
I want a D4s and 1DX competitor like this. C’mon Sony, bring this thing with 12Mpx, max. ISO 409600, 12fps, the best AF module you can offer for Fullframe cameras!!! I would pay for this.
I second to this 🙂 However, this “artistic impression” is lacking buttons for quick rating/protecting photos during the review and recording voice comments. This is essential for photojournalistic work.
You might pay for it but there obviously isn’t a market for it and Sony know there isn’t or they would sell one!
Yes, there is. Current A850, A900, and A99 owners would definitely buy one, and it’s a large pool of users who own over 10 to 15 worth of A-Mount lenses already.
ahh speak for yourself on that one. A a900 , 850, 99 user going back to 12mp? No thanks, give me the resolution and dynamic range at low iso I’m happy. Don’t care much about fps either, 3fps is fine.
That being said it would be nice to have a selection (like the a7 series) as I’m sure some would appreciate the high iso.
I didn’t see the 12mp. I’d want it with a 46mp sensor able to do 12fps and the option to upgrade to a version with a tractor beam.
Did you see the post here in SonyAlphraRumors about how in the FIFA World Cup 2014 (sponsored by Sony btw) there was not a single Sony camera in the field? Mainly, all of the camera present were Canon and Nikon with big lenses. Guess why?
Hint: Sony doesn’t offer a true Sports camera. Not until the ILCA-77M2 was released with the great AF module, but it was released too late for the World Cup. There is a market for camera like those. It’s just that Sony doesn’t seem interested getting into it. There is also the lack of (current) telephoto lenses like the 400mm F4 and/or F2.8, 200-400mm F4, 600mm F4 or 800mm F5.6. Yes, Minolta had some of those, (400mm F4.5 and 600mm F4). Also the high prices of current 70-200mm F2.8 II, 300mm F2.8 II and 500mm F4 doesn’t help either.
One of the main issues with Sony, is that they don’t offer options for Sports photographers and/or press agencies. Those are the ones that pay big money for lenses and cameras. They have addressed (sort of) the first issue with the release of Sony PRO, but there is still a lack of equipment needed.
Dude that should have been a red flag. Sony’s going to take that market by force like they did with mirror-less. They’ll just launch a 12fps 46mp SLT with DR, and ISO to kill for.
That’s what they do for a living. If you don’t believe me watch the A7II launch presentation again.
Great camera, and I wouldn’t be surprised if this eventually happens.
This image got me too excited; I think I need to go take a cold shower. 😉
BTW off topic
I ‘ve got a glimpse on the Canon watch side and it is interesting to hear the same thing.
In short: Sony’s mirrorless is good, but their ergonomics and lense line up is nothing to talk about.
Is there anybody who can answer me the Question how the actual CZ 24-70 2.8 A-mount performes in terms of corner sharpness?
http://kurtmunger.com/sony_24_70mm_f_2_8_ssm_carl_zeissid256.html
It probably has the shares corners of all the 24-70mm f/2.8 on the market, or at least it did when I bought it. It was a system selling lens.
Its AF speed is incredible, and its probably a bit faster than my 70200G2.
I bought it in 09 to use with the A900, I’ve used for five years with no issues. It’s a must-buy for A850, A900, and A99 users.
Faster than the 70-200? That’s a pretty fast-focusing lens! I seriously gotta get that lens (the CZ 24-70, that is); maybe the prices on the G1 will drop once the G2 is released… For my mid-range zoom right now, I’m using an old Minolta 28-70 f/2.8 G lens; phenomenal image quality, but the AF is super slow (and noisy!) and the MFD is awful, too. It’s served me well and saved me a bit of cash (over buying the CZ), but I’ll be very happy when I can upgrade.
The two refreshed A-mount lens is a great new in itself, however it would be even greater if they were designed in a way to be compatible with Fast Hybrid AF through LA-EA3. This would be perfectly reasonable move if Sony wants us to believe that there is only a single “Alpha” system. Would greatly futureproof the lens purchases and make the transition from A- to E- much more seamless.
I think Sony’s intent is have customers buy one of each.
I don’t know if Sony will triumph over Canikon on the Pro Market, but surely is taking a big slash of the pie in the ProConsumer market, and right now is there were the money is, for professionals photographers, change to another brand is not a very easy step to do; but for Sony make this this transition more easily it must cooperate with third parties to improve the use of adaptors as the Speedbooster, that will help Sony to gain more presence in the camera body market once more and the professional to keep the lens investments.
About the E and A mount debate, is not a secret the the E-mount system has been taking very long steps to equally the benefits of the A-Mount, so the E-mount system can become bigger for the user that need faster lenses, but the A-mount cannot become smaller to compete with the size advantage of the E-mount, plus the advantage of the E-mount system on the video size of the business.
The next step will be to improve the LA-EA adaptor with a smaller focus motor and more focus and tracking points.
So for me, the A-mount eventually will fade out.
I think I’m on the same boat. I don’t care if they go for e so long as they provide the features from a mount and a good LA-EA for my a mount glass. I just hope future LA-EA’s don’t omit screw drive focus motors.
A mount will be like the 43 system: many pro lenses but no one wants to buy them because the system is outdated and replaced my m43.
The advantage of the a mount bodies should be a huge optical viewfinder and solidness as well as much longer battery life. Imho the next a99 should be a a900 but with the greatest sensor tech and and video features as well so you have a contender to the canon 5d and nikon 800 series.
You mean…the sacred…the hallowed…A900II!!!! If only it wasn’t a dream.
why not a huge EVF instead.
OVF does not belong on mirorrless. Period.
Yeah because the A900 sold so well against Canon and Nikon…..It has been long established that the majority of Sony users prefer EVF, just get over it and move on, there are plenty of other models of dSLR if you need your holy grail OVF.
Agreed. The A900 was (is) a great camera. I love mine. However, I find myself using it less and less, as the advantages of the EVF on my A99 don’t really leave me wanting the OVF anymore. Plus, the A900 was a boat anchor comparatively in terms of weight. Still, I can see why simply just prefer OVF; there is a certain “purity” to it. Honestly, though, that ship has sailed, and if people continue to pine for a similar replacement of it, they’re going to be left disappointed. When the A900 was released, it was the best OVF out there, and the only camera with that level of resolution – the D800 of its time. Yet it still didn’t even make a dent in Canikon’s market share. With the new A7 cameras (and to a lesser extent, the a6000), Sony is finally starting to gain some market share, actually getting people to switch platforms (w/ lens adaptability being a major reason for that). There’s no going back, no money in it for them to do so.
If the majority of sony users preferred frozen pizza over a real one, stonebaked 😉 with all the fresh tasty stuff on it i’m sure you would go for the frozen one, too.
or maybe they rather just take a screenshot of it with their full frame E Mount camera and post it on facebook via their I Phone
Sony should include the LA-EA4 for free as part of the A9 package. I know that will encourage me to make the jump from my A99 to full frame E-Mount. But you’re right – the 5-axis stabilization in the new a7ii has basically closed the gap and now there’s really no reason for Alpha users to hold off. After the a7ii this week, I’m about 90% sure I will transition to E-Mount by February of 2015.
Join the heard. The grass may not be greener, but Sony has been pisssing on it enough to make it look that way.
but as soon as you taste it …
Nothing is free, why would new E-mount users want the LAEA4? we want new stylish E-mount lenses. (and we are getting them yeah!)
did you already get some of this grass?
Because users coming from A-mount will want to still use their extensive lens collections? Enticing the A-mounters to jump over to E-mount only helps their sales numbers.
So they canbuy the LAEA4.
It’ s not sensible to make people who only use E mount pay for the LAEA4, or A mount users who already own the LAEA4 pay for another LAEA4.
If they want to encourage A mount users to jump over, perhaps they could reduce the price of the LAEA4, but handing them out to everyone who buys an A9 would be silly as that’s obviously going to increase the price of the purchase even for people who don’t need it.
Nope, they’re for A-Mount users who use A-Mounts cameras, who take a large A-Mount of pictures, and make a large A-Mount of money every year.
Actually E-Mount users are buying A-Mount cameras, and A-Mount users are buying E-Mount cameras.
Sony is getting plenty of us buying into both systems.
Ha ha! Well played, Maxx… 🙂
If Sony could/would make a better LAEA adapter, and include it (at least with the high-end cameras), it could phase out A bodies without necessarily phasing out the A mount right away. Better coverage for AF points, maybe a little faster … and ideally a little cheaper … would make E cameras “universal” enough to justify narrowing the focus to one line without ignoring the ecosystem that’s been around for decades.
Sony will support A-Mount as long as there are enough buyers, of course and those should be happy, that E-Mount is getting constantly better prepared to replace A-Mount camera bodies one day. Compared to Sony’s coldness about Firmware Updates for E-Mount cameras this is quite some comfort.
There are plenty of buyers and the SLT has been raising eyebrows and fostering sales.
The SAR community is in it’s own little bubble racked with self doubt, panic and a strange inferiority complex. As far as I know the A series has been selling well in asia and there is decent demand. The one thing to keep in mind about large asian companies is that they plan for long term. They only entered the dslr market a while ago and imho have been doing quite considering going against the big 2, thats even if only looking at A mount.
Look at companies like olypmus, panasonic and fuji, do they have the slr (or semantically similar) market share that the sony a mount has enjoyed? Not everyone is as fickle as the internet forum consumer grade photographers.
Asia is one of the main markets where the E-mount has taken over, as the people there tend to go for the smaller cameras over DSLRs. North America and parts of Europe are really the lone holdouts on people clinging to DSLRs (outside professional use anyway), still thinking they’re superior cameras. Even they’re starting to transition, though, just quite a bit more slowly.
There isn’t a transition. Most of us are tossing our second (back-up) DSLR (normally an old A900 or A77), in favour of something new. A SLT, and MILC make for a great set of cameras
DSLRs will always remain the faster cameras, and while the A7II is faster and better stabilized it’s no DSLR replacement.
the difference between A and E bodies now are the bigger aperture lenses and bigger body with more port, buttons and better handling on A mount.
Do people here just take pictures of statues? The important difference is AF performance.
The A-Mount is moving towards a FF only future. I doubt you’ll see any new or updated DT lenses in the future other than iterations of the 16-50 f2/8.
The A-Mount is for those of us that need the fast zoom’s, a fast AF, and decent ergonomics.
LOL I often wondered. It looks like:
1) They only shoot statues or brick walls
2) They never use flashes
3) They all want the newest stuff, even if it is inferior
The A-mount’s real advantage is third party support, which unfortunately has taken a big hit with Sony seemingly abandoning the system. If I’ve understood this correctly, Sony likes this whole proprietary nonsense business such as keeping the FE autofocusing technique secret. I will absolutely not get into the E-mount system as long as there are only a couple of manual focus 50mm’s and a few not so varied lenses from Overpreiss for it.
I was thinking speed. The next FF SLTs will probably be 46mp, and do 12fps.
For all the people thinking that a-mount is dead – go and buy a77II… it simply works and feels good in the hand.Plus it has a proper way of moving the focus point. Now with the firmware update it will work even more. The real switch to the e-mount will happen when Sony people make a proper adapter for a-mount lenses with proper af. Now one of the adapters is useless, the other can focus only in the center eventually. Nowhere near what now a77II can do.
A mount is dead, long live the a mount! I think a7ii ibis is actually a sign that they have decided to drop the a mount once and for all. It will take a while but that’s where they’re heading. The god news is – this means the a mount will live long after the last a mount body. You Will get full a-mount functionality within free mirrorless system.
I’m confused by this post… The A mount is still a thing?
Is Leica still a thing?
Nope. Most of their lenses are now designed by Konica-Minolta. Maybe Konica should design them “A” nice DSLR camera too.
http://www.43rumors.com/also-the-leica-45mm-f2-8-lens-has-been-designed-by-konica-minolta/
Skip, tried uploading pic..didn’t work.
Alright guys, check it out. You don’t have to wait for the A7II. You can have it now- awesome right? I’m only charging 300 bucks for this upgrade. I know – great deal. Exotic bubble wrap and the wrench not only actuates the shutter, it can be used Mcgyver style if you find yourself locked in a closet. I’m now taking orders……