Sony is one of the big sponsor at the Football World Cup in Brazil. Even photographer are “forced” to wear Sony 4K advertising vests. But as you can see from the 360 degree pics posted at Visualise.com not a single of them shoots with a Sony. It’s all about Canon (and few Nikon). Let’s hope Sony will mae a real Alpha Full Frame Sports camera that will convince some of them to switch over to Sony!
Thanks Marald for finding and sharing the pics!
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The problem is more in the lenses. Only with an adapter you’ll find a lense for the A7(r) and by this you won’t have a fast enough for sports AF.
For all the eight months since release, Sony hasn’t managed to build a lineup that covers specialized photography. Disappointed!
took me a sec to see the sarcasm… I get it.
however, there are also no A-mount rigs (as far as I can see… somewhat difficult), and Sony did have years in the case of that one. But what would they offer that is not already available from CaNikon? and for a pro to switch it would need to be substantially better (be it service, hardware, or work flow), not just marginally.
Still practicing 🙂
Yes, for a-mount this could be argued significantly more successfully. I think the biggest problems for Sony are consistency and support, as far as pros go. The problem is, I think, that while the pro market is needed to drive sales, it is also a rather small one. A difficult balance, especially for a newcomer.
I think, if you wanted to attract the Canikon pro crowd it’d have to be with a kick-ass A series camera. By that I don’t mean super-resolution, but something that’s extremely responsive and far more transparent in video mode than the current DSLR’s they’re using. That new digital Sony ND filter (whatever it may be) would be a huge selling point to a stills guy who just cannot justify the time it takes to screw-on an ND filter if he wants to snag a professional looking video clip. Sony’s multi-interface shoe is a great selling point for “low maintenance” audio accessories like the XLR adaptor (especially the new compact version).
For this I’d say the current generation one FE cameras are off the table, they’re just too sluggish, especially if you’re coming from a pro-level DSLR, granted though, video on the FE cameras is markedly better, but these guys are stills pros working under serious time constraints!
glass.
Where does it say “Canon” in the photo?
hahahah
they are wearing sony’s vests but using Canon’s cameras and lenses?
You read the title!
No, nwimu has a blurry monitor!
Comments can’t be blank.
Agreed.
Unfortunately both Canon and Nikon are ahead of Sony in tele lenses development. Only the SAL500F40G which is relatively new and it is still not as good as the Canon one. The 70-200/2.8 and 300/2.8 are older Minolta designs. After the new 400/2.8 Nikon will come out with more fluorite lenses to catch up with Canon but Sony won’t be so quick to catch up.
The 135/1.8 SSM will be one that is right up there with the best.
Sony can push models using FLD glass which performs like fluorite for a fraction of the cost. Sigma uses plenty of FLD in its new ART lenses.
Sony should produce a 400mm f/2.8, 400mm f/4.5 and a 600mm f/4.0 lens using FLD these models would obviously sell for less than the competition, and likely generate significant revenue.
You wear what pays you and use what pays you. Smart. 🙂
No big loss. Sony still makes a range of electronic products. People may still bite and buy them (except TVs and smartphones).
No native glass and quality not always at the top and they are pricey as well.
Curious!!?? All my lenses are Sony brand and the 16-35, 24-70, 85, 135 and 300 are the equal, if not superior, to anything equivalent. As to price, that depends upon how you make comparisons, but they are generally no more than Canon or Nikon.
If you do need something outside the Sony range, Sigma will often fill the gap and there is no doubting the quality of most of their lenses either.
Let’s put in other side;if they cost the same they doesn’t perform in the same way.I can agree with some lenses like the 135 1.8…But if i have to choose Sony and then rely to third party brand,personally,i look somewhere else.
That’s a really strange myth that has developed around the 135 1.8. Because the lens is so excellent, it is impossible to say anything against it, so it is instead quoted as the single ‘decent’ option for Sony users. In reality though, there are plenty of excellent lenses in the lineup, many of them better either in price or performance than the competition, or at least easily as good of a value. With cherry-picking, one can prove that every brand is crap.
Maybe he was talking about the AF being slow.
I agree that the 135/1.8 is one of the best lenses out there for DSLRs (south of 200mm) but personally, I would go for a 135/2 APO if I wanted a fast lens for anything other than portraits or the Sigma 150/2.8 OS Macro if I wanted a good macro lens around that FL or the Schneider PC-TS 120/5.6 if I wanted a lens with some movements.
I doubt he was talking about AF. The APO is more expensive and doesn’t have AF, but if you so wish, you can probably adapt it even to a-mount. I would personally choose the APO-Lanthar 125/2.5.
The 125/2.5 is definitely a nice lens, James. I don’t think the Sigma 150/2.8 OS is second to it in colour correction:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/hitoshiozaki/8854002691
https://www.flickr.com/photos/hitoshiozaki/8701951378
James? The comment system is failing again. Anyway, I haven’t compared the Sigma to the Voigtlander to have any opinion on its colour rendition, but the latter strikes the best compromise for me in terms of performance, build and size. The Sigma is almost twice as heavy; AF and stabilization don’t make up for that.
In any case, as we see, plenty of options for Sony users 🙂
Ok… got rid of the James part. Won’t happen to those who have a registered alias 😉
While the 125/2.5 exceptional, I don’t see it being with the high prices it’s going for in the second hand market. Btw, were you able to see the links I posted earlier?
Btw, by colour correction I was referring to CA correction.
Oh, really? The issue is registering? Interesting.
Well the issue can be solved by registering afaik
That second part of your comment wasn’t visible two hours ago. Strange. Yes, the Voigtlander is indeed very pricey now. Frankly, its release price (I believe significantly less than 1000US at the time) shows how overpriced lenses are becoming. I still find it of interest though, given the overall package. The Sigma might be great (it actually looks pretty neat), but at 1.2kg, it’s a no go. The new Zeiss APO is apparently better, but it is almost as expensive, heavier and not a macro. I want versatility. It would be great if Voigtlander releases an SLII version of the thing, but they seem to favour selling the Zeiss name, which brings more money. They only keep the lenses which don’t rival the Zeiss offerings.
Well some of their M39 and VM lenses do compete with ZM ones. Who knows, they might release a new 125/2.5 one day. See what happened to the Nikon 28/1.4 and the C/Y Distagon 21/2.8 when people were putting down 4K each thinking no replacement would come. I have the same concerns about getting a 200/1.8.
Cherry picking or not,when you pick,you are looking for the best basket otherwise you will remain with one sweet cherry in your mouth and you will want more but you will have the rest not sweet at all.
You are making the same argument, only this time using a metaphor. So, same reply from me : Sony has a very nice basket, full of sweet cherries. As long as the basket is big enough for your needs, there’s really no need to go for a bigger one.
I used the same your metaphor to explain to you that if you are satisfied with their offer,go on.If you think to start a personal equipment today hoping for the future release is not worth,and I talk for personal experience after years of minolta.
The way I used it, it was a term, not a metaphor
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cherry_picking_(fallacy))
I am not sure what do you mean by your personal experience. The available lenses for Sony can be seen before you make an investment. What is precisely the problem?
I repeat and i stop here:if you are satisfied go on.
This is as much a ‘marketing fail’ as it is a ‘fail’ to assume everyone at the world only drinks Coca Cola and only eats McDonalds.
* everyone at the world cup
Especially the players. Can you imagine them binging on burgers and swilling gallons of coke and running around to score a goal? 🙂
“Usain Bolt’s triple Olympic triumph in
Beijing was fuelled by 1,000 McDonalds chicken McNuggets, according to
his new autobiography.”
http://www.espn.co.uk/athletics/sport/story/254395.html
🙂
He is just cashing in on the triumph. Smart fellow. 🙂
I’m not sure why so many seem to think a company can instantly produce a full range of lenses to cater for such a relatively small market and make money!
Personally I think Sony are making great strides and are actually increasing their pace of development. Once this base is established with the increasing reputation for their cameras, as they expand their lens range more and more will be happy to take up Sony.
Of course, even that will take time as existing well established photographers have a significant investment in their equipment and they would have to get a big return to make the cost of swapping, both financially and learning a new camera, worthwhile.
Mark my words, though, it will happen!
Peter,personally,i am not saying that they have/can produce a full range of lenses with a relatively small market and make money;they can’t!That’s is the answer to the picture above where nobody shoot with a Sony camera.
And….i am totally agree with you,i just have nikon dslr equipment but even if i had to start right now i will be not convinced in the sony lineup right now,even if some cameras are interesting.And this i think is true for the amateur and the professional.
“I’m not sure why so many seem to think a company can instantly produce a full range of lenses to cater for such a relatively small market and make money!”
Plus one here, although it can be argued that they had 8 years for developing a-mount. Still, long and fast lenses are certainly a very limited market. I imagine 91% of all photographers fit into landscape/travel/street/family, of which 76% use kit lenses (Vlad’s 2014 statistics).
They don’t have to come up with anything.
Sony already owns the right to produce the Minolta Maxxum G-Series 400mm f/4.5, 600mm f/4.0, 200mm f/2.8. The HSM are almost as fast as the newer SSM equipped lenses.
The only new lens they’d have to design is a 400mm f/2.8.
All they have to do is re-produce the original models, because all of them are already excellent performers.
Agreed, if Sony is to catch up with Nikon and Canon in the general market, spending their R&D and manufacturing on lenses very few people can afford doesn’t seem very smart. When you have a solid line-up of the stuff general photographers use, you can spend some time and money on specialty lenses. There is so many pieces of this puzzle with optimized cameras, full line-up, support, pro-services etc. Almost all of that has to fall into place before you get the people in these pictures to switch brands. And considering how many of them would probably just prefer a camera they now, and to keep a system where they have made considerable investments in gear, it’s not an easy feat even after that.
So which is it? These are stills photographers and you complain they wear 4K shirts? Uhm ‘4K’ is a video thing, nothing to do with stills and the ONE video camera you can make out is a guess what?! Sony 4K model…
I posted something… but… erased?
It was the same at the world cup in South Africa 4 years ago – nothing new
You will be pleased to know that Sony is the exclusive supplier of the motion camera equipment. So everything you see moving is shot in on a Sony…
It can’t be as we all know that pros won’t use an EVF….oh wait…
I’ve already seen multiple Sony 500mm f/4.0, and 300mm f/2.8, and a couple of 70-400G2 being used at the games already.
The G-Series are easy to pick out because they’re super bright paint sticks out like a sore thumb in a sea of Canon’s.
I bet a couple of them are attached to an A77II.
Since the majority of people won’t have a clue what the Sony Alpha logo means it doesn’t matter. Most people will continue to be unaware that Sony make dSLR sized cameras, they will not have clue what brand the cameras and lenses in use are anyway.
Most people are not “us”.
It’s the other way around… people think Sony has serious DSLRs to offer. How else do you explain the A mount sales and people whining here afterwards? ;P
admin…are you a newbie into watching sports? i have seen other manufacturers being sponsors and “forced” journalists into wearing those vest regardless of the brand they use to work.
but going further into the topic…unless sony lower their prices, offer a high end ovf model to compete against the 1dx/d4s and forget for a minute about the video features and release a 600mm f/4, 400mm f/2.8 at competitive prices, offer pro support around the globe for their alpha cameras and start approaching journalists agencies, they will always be behind Canon (and nikon) at these events.
The EVF/OVF is irrelevant. Stick an EVF on a pro CaNikon model and they will love it. Anybody thinking pros automatically don’t want an EVF is an idiot, some will, some won’t.
Actually, pro sports shooters will not go for an EVF as long as it is unable to return the viewfinder image to live action when shooting in continuous high-speed advance. No EVF camera is yet able to do this, and it makes tracking fast moving subjects near impossible during a shooting sequence. The first couple of photos may work, but the subject will be increasingly out of position within the frame and then cut-off and eventually out of the frame. Longer viewfinder blackout periods also are a disadvantage (cameras like the 1DX and D4 have incredibly fast moving mirrors and minimum viewfinder blackout for a reason). Until EVF’s can operate as well as cameras like the 1DX and D4, pro sports shooters are highly unlikely to adopt EVF cameras.
you think so? i like evf from the a99 and a7… but there is something preventing pros from enjoying evf cameras….i’m not a pro so idon’t know
edit: i know that some people got into the Sony ship because of the a700 and a850/900 but after the slr/slt change the only pros i know that are using sony cameras aren’t shooting sports.
The biggest issue is the ‘global pro support’, offer that and it will change. The lenses are secondary.
Plus one to A77II’s comment and add to that video features that are becoming more and more relevant to professionals. You have one single point going for you – support.
the right tool for the right job , sony a99 for example is not as advanced as canon 1dx but the price difference is huge and the lenses is so expensive to make and sell for very small market relative speaking , that market of sport photographers was not what sony aiming for, i am not saying it cant shoot sports but its not the best yat , i think sony a99 , a7r ,or what ever new is good for wedding landscape , and a7s amazing for video and super low light , sony has great advantages with its mirror les and slt design that separate it from traditional market of dslr
what make sony much better for pros
3 things
1- flagship model that has double processors high mp sensor , sony can do this easy they are hardwear company
2- lenses super wide zoom , 14-28 2.8 for example , super fast zoom like 400 2.8 and bring back the minolta 600 f4 and improve that 135 1.8 optically as well
3-have more flash options , cheaper and better one
this is very simple thing to do in 2-3 years ,.,. and i think sony will do it eventually
There’s the 16-35/2.8 already. And they should bring the Minolta 200mm APO before anything longer.
Why make a me-too camera like the CaNikons? Want pro sports photog gear, you can buy that already. Let Sony keep innovating instead.
Canon
200mm f2
300mm f2.8
400mm f2.8
500mm f4
600mm f4
800mm f5.6
200-400mm f4
Nikon
Ditto.
Sony
500mm f4
Sony is just not in that game.
Sorry, Sony has indeed the 300mm f2.8.
If you have a source to buy Minolta Maxxum glass (www.ebay.com or KEH) I recommend the 600mm f/4.0 G-Series, 400 f/4.5 G-Series, and the stunning 200mm f/2.8 G-Series. They are probably some of the best lenses of the entire Minolta Maxxum G-Series, its a real shame Sony’s too stunned to produce them under the alpha product line.
If you think the 200/2.8G is stunning you’ll sacrifice 1 1/2 kidneys if you used a 200/2 IS 😉
Well they do have a 300 2.8 as well. Doubt anyone in their right mind buys one though 😀
If you’re going south of 200, there are lots more that Sony doesn’t have.
But even when there would be a sports Alpha body – is there easy access to pro oriented service (renting, repair, workshops etc)? And the lenses… don´t get me started – long, bright tele lenses with fast af for rent? Can Sony make better deals with big agencies than Canon? It will take Sony many years if not decades until they reach pro sports photographers.
Thank you admin for the post, it was funny! LOL
No they shoot with the new Canon 7D MarkII prototypes…the MarkII will have 4K video and the upcoming 1dx II and 5D mark IV as well…..so they could already advertise 4K….lets pay sony….;)
There are pretty much two camera choices for World Cup photographers – canon 1d-x or Nikon d4. Sony does not have a rugged, super fast sports camera. SLT processing speed has been too slow and battery life too short.
This could change. A super fast, large body, sealed camera with full frame AF coverage (not Aps-c coverage), at least a77-2 speed and the a7s sensor could be successful in this space, although it is a small market.
Generally pros aren’t the adventurous type so they’ll need more convincing even if the lenses and bodies were there and the logic made sense.
There’s nothing stopping someone from recording 4K video with a A7s+SLT adapter and extracting frames either.
The video shutter speed would stop any experienced sports / action photographer from considering that.
What’s the max shutter speed in video then?
I don’t know what the max is for the a7 series cameras.
If you want useable video though to go with the stills, the shutter speed should be double the frame rate (29.97fps = 1/60). Even if you shoot 60p, then you would use only 1/125th – slow for action stills.
Pretty sure more than 1/125 is possible in video on a a7s. There’s quite a bit that can be done in non-high speed situations with 1/125 too… especially if 30 fps can help.
Possibly, in the past the screen grabs from Sony alpha cameras were often mushy. Since this has the full pixel readout hopefully the new codec does a better job at preserving details. I heard it can work out pretty well with RED cameras but they shoot raw video.
I don’t see video grabs being a good substitute for action situations though…yet.
Things don’t go mushy with line skipping or binning. Binning is actually sharper than demosaicing. compression is usually the culprit.
How is this exactly a marketing fail??????????
They got a Canon photographer to advertise a Sony camera at the biggest sporting event of the year. That’s a marketing WIN.
Nice spin! That is what the Sony market division probably tells their execs! LOL!
there are no silly news the site has to be kept updated…
Why the hell should anyone be impressed by the cameras a sports photographer uses? I am not interested in shooting 15 fps of a football player. Why should anyone else be? The only people who want to see Sony offer a pro-sports camera are the kind of people who use a Canon 1DX to take snaps of the kids at Disneyword – weird, status obsessed, insecure wannabees.
Is there any statistics showing:
1) How much of the total revenue is made by selling pro lenses 300mm +
2) Same for pro bodies like 1dx, 4dx ….
3) Money made/spent for service
Or is there a general statistics showing the distribution of sold bodies and lenses? Maybe Thom Hogan has statistics here as companies don’t disclose that.
For those interested: I predict strong further reduction in revenue for camera companies here in Germany. I already told it elsewhere: I teach at a university and the last couple of years asked my students every new semester whether they bought (last three years) or will buy a camera the next couple of years, out of curiosity. Over the last 6 semesters (600 students on average, 4th semester): 17, 12, 14, 8, 5, 2. If they use one, they use their parents DSLR (Canikon, because that’s what they know) the one’s who bought a new one bought Sony NEX models (I was surprised by that, but they say theses cameras are more smartphone-like) and Canikon (those who got a kid and wanted to capture precious moments (entry level)). They didn’t know what FF is, nor did the majority ever hear about mirror-less cameras. The majority thinks smartphones to be good enough and updates every 1.5 years on average. The debate here, I fear, is that of enthusiasts like me always lusting for the next best gear but the future (and here I have to agree with Thom Hogan) is in software.
This is an interesting poll! What course where those students taking? I would guess it makes a difference if it’s thermodynamics for engineers or history of architecture (though I wouldn’t know which way, but I presume engineers are gear heads).
Fluid Mechanics. All engineering students!
You said it. Sony is a sponsor, so they may have to wear that vest regardless of what they shoot with. That’s just the way sponsorship works. Hyundai is another sponsor, but I bet the teams move in volvo buses.
Are you trying to make sense? What is wrong with you?
He is stating the fact. Sony buys to be visible by supplying the official vests. They can not force photogs to shoot with Alphas. If they have done that there will be very little world cup coverage.
I was agreeing with him 🙂
Indeed.
I thought I was but look at how long this thread has got.
Sports photographers have work to do. They don’t suffer from GAS.
I don’t get how this is a marketing fail. If you’re working with a company and you have sponsors, you either wear what they want you to wear or get fired. Are they supposed to be wearing Canon or Nikon vests? Seriously, only a hardcore Sony fanboy could get angry over this. Please stick to posting Sony rumours.
I didn’t read admin’s post to be angry in any way. It’s not posted in “rumors”, but “news”, so we can filter it out easily. The Canon dominance in this market does open a few interesting questions, though.
But anyway, it’s pretty lousy marketing. It’s like putting the sponsor’s “Mercedes” on the bonnet of each car in the race that is won by 10 Audis. People who are interested in buying cars will certainly buy the machine they saw winning. I think Sony should have given the vest only to those shooting with Sony gear. Otherwise, this is embarrassment.
but then they wouldn’t have given out ANY vests… 🙂
Agreed, the basic marketing message is not particularly amazing.
Hehe – exactly my point. No one would ever notice photographers except people who care about photography. For them, however, Alpha logo on Canon shooter would be ridiculous… Huge Sony logo over whole arena, however, would be appropriate, because it’s for masses.
they are marketing 4k VIDEO
the photographers shoot photos.
ERGO
its like promoting “the best electric car for the city” in a car race.
both are cars, but have completely different purposes.
I only see “Sony α” on their vests. I see neither “4k”, nor “Panasonic” there 🙂
I love the 1dx…..its a weapon like a machine gun clack, clack, clack 14 frames p. second love it….;) and the jog dial in order to go through your shots as fast as possible are the most reasons to use the 1dx instead of the d4(s)……
Absolutely agree sony will never be used from sports pro……pro customer services is missing as well as the (super) telephoto primes……200 f2 up to 800 5.6…..!!
But sony dont have to do this…they should concentrate on other fields of photography/segments….innovations/special cams, videographers 4k, action cams, enthusiast mirrorless, high premium compacts etc…
where is the problem ?….some cam producers work together having cooperation…..nikon has to grant sony for getting their best sensor two years ago….without this sensor nikon wouldnt be so successful….with the d800 and 800e….”MF results in a small package”…so every nikon shooter has to say thank you sony…..;) which company would give away their best developed sensor to another competitor for one of their flagships instead of using it themselves?
Nikon: Could we have your new developed sensor? The one with 36 MP, nearly MF performing…??
Sony: For sure. We do not want to have the best sensor in our flagship Sony A99…
Nikon: Totally surprised. We were kiddin….you mean that serious?
Sony: Yeah. Why not?
Nikon: Thank you so much Sony! We would like to be longterm friends, we give you one additional dollar note for your accomodation and convenience….you could never have enough good friends….(not mentioning but thinking…..esp. those who dont care about themself. jsut focus on helping others!!!hehe)
Sony what else…..hope they learnt……
brilliant….amused…..
Help!
Invasion of Nikon fanboysz! get out of here! Men down, Men down….I need some backup…!
Are we in war…..???
Oh the war starts…..
You simply played too much ego shooters and war games…..i guess call of duty…you got sick man……not a video game it was the reality of our grand-grandfathers i hope they resting in peace….;)
They learnt for sure. They got plenty of money thanks to Nikon’s name.
.”MF results in a small package”.
It’s only people who’ve never used a real DMF who say that.
Sony is bigger than Alpha division.
The same thing happened during 2010 World Cup in South Africa. Nothing new here. I’ll check 206 cup in Germany, suppose the same.
Not a fail. People see the professional lenses and cameras and associate them with Sony. Win!
CORRECT, AND THE MAJOR MEDIA THE FILMEKERS OF FIFA IS SONY 4K.
No… people that dumb dont matter. plus they’ll check and find out sony has nothing serious.
Next year’s sponsor is Preparation H.
http://www.hemorrhoidinformationcenter.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/preparation-information-H.I.C.jpg
At least the togs will know something about THIS product, after taking it hard up the yayhoo from Sony this year.
Idiot campaign.
I too will put Minolta straps on all my Sony cams now, out of protest.
The idea of being forced to wear something that has NOTHING to do with my job for my client providing free publicity for the event. Something wrong here folks.
Horrible! Here’s something else to hate on:
http://sportswol.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/formula+one.jpg
Every one of those togs must DESPISE Sony for forcing this upon them.
Great PR idiots.
It’s no different than when names like Kodak or Fuji adorned the vests, no matter what film the individual photographer used.
It could also be names like Canon or Nikon. Users of the “opposite” and other brands must really have hated it.
Incidentally, it’s not Sony forcing anything on anyone, but FIFA maximising their profits by selling advertising space to the highest bidder.
It’s like the rich kid who dresses up with the pro team, but never gets to play.
So freaking sad.
Pastor Maldonado comes to mind!
This sort of thing happens all the time, it’s no big deal.
I was at the golf open at St Andrews 14 years ago and the Canon shooters were forced to put yellow Nikon tape around their big lenses.
4K video cameras are by Sony, 80% of broadcast technology is by Sony. 100% of photo cameras are by Nikon and Canon. I don’t understand why Sony has to own the pro-photo world too.
Because Nikon and Canon are holding back, and raising prices of their top end cameras. Because Sony is actually innovative unlike the other two, because Sony will push the technology along so much faster before they decide the market is dead and they bail out, but leaving the market better off for it.
Not even Close to 100%. Plus let me remind you that Nikon actually uses Sony sensors ;)… Canon and Nikon are in 2008 Technology-wise. And it is time that somebody Shows them that time moves on… Canon/Nikon just continue to milk the customers with basically the same technics they sold years ago.
Until Sony gets the colors right, no serious photographer would venture to do his work with one. They have great cameras with great features, but it is all negated by the bad looking pictures.
LOL. Right.
and uncompressed raw files…not those shittys of the sony a7, 7r and 7s……nice t be innovative but you should do your genereal homework as well….!!!
I was not agreeing with him.
“Bad Looking Pictures…” – sounds like you people have been drinking the Canikon punch too long. Sony’s color rendition, dynamic range, and as of recently – high ISO noise performance – are all class leading.
I’ve shot with Canon cameras…in fact I used to exlusively for several years. And they make a solid product. But the images they produce are uninspired, flat and dull.
I guess myself and the thousands of other professional video and still Sony shooters are “not serious photographers”.
That’s why I said LOL. The arguments the “Sony is sub-par” people make are truly pathetic and often out right lies.
I sold 2 Sony cameras (a NEX-5n and an RX100) because I couldn’t get one good looking picture out of them no matter what Lightroom raw fixes I tried. I then got a Canon 5 year old T2i by mistake and the pictures looked amazing from the first shot, not even requiring adjustments. Just my experience.
Well I can respect your opinion on that, but I don’t understand it. I have an RX100 and I love the image quality.
He’s obvious a SHILLING for the other team or is suffering from some severe neurological condition (called I don’t know how to use a camera), because the NEX-5N, and RX100 are excellent cameras that produce stunning results.
You remind me one of those “coke sucks, I drink only pepsi” people.
Cameras don’t produce images that are uninspired, flat and dull. Bad photographers do. Lots of great photographers are producing gorgeous images with Canon cameras, just as they do with Nikon, Sony, Pentax, Olympus, Panasonic, Fujifilm, Leica, Hasselblad and Phase One cameras.
If you say the raw files from the a7r are bad you’re ignorant. It’s not compression like JPEG you know. It perfectly preserves the smoothest transitions.
Uhm, why should the Sony RAW files be compressed!?
Canon and Nikon have plenty of camera body and lenses available for lending by the World Cup photographers. Sony have none. You shoot with your personal equipment or you will have to go with Canon or Nikon, even if you are a convicted Sony user. Everything the Sony representatives in Brazil want is to sell equipment, for absurd prices, nothing else.
Just having a sports oriented full frame body won’t do a thing and you will see no more Sony users than you do now at events like this which is zero. It’s an entire infrastructure that’s needed. In addition to cameras you need lenses. Sony doesn’t have a 400/2.8 – bread and butter Sports Photog lens. Sony doesn’t have a 600 f/4. But even more than that, Sony doesn’t have professional support – on site professional services that can fix problems, hand out loaners, make firmware changes if something goes wrong. On site repair services, etc. etc. etc. A camera body is a drop in the bucket of what is needed for Sony to have even a tiny presence at an event like this among still photographers.
EJ, had no idea you visited this site, but guess it’s not a surprise, particularly given your role (or one of them) at NatureScapes. 🙂 Of course, your comments are 100% correct. I would also note that as long as Sony’s DSLR/SLT cameras have the EVF slide-show effect when shooting in high-speed continuous advance (rather than showing live action), the cameras will never be adopted by pro sports shooters (or wildlife photographers), even if the lenses and support system were there. Sports photography requires the ability to track (as accurately as possible) a moving subject while photographing it, and the slide-show effect makes that impossible.
I’m pretty sure the A77II and newer cameras don’t have this.
Sorry, but everything I have seen about the A77 II indicates the slide-show effect remains in continuous high-speed shooting. Also, no matter how good and flexibile the new AF system may be, if you can’t keep the subject in the “viewfinder.” let alone within the AF sensors, all the AF improvements are worthless. And that is the problem the slide-show effect creates. When I photograph birds in flight, for example, while the bird is in the frame for the first 2-3 shots, it is increasingly out of position because I can’t actually follow it once I start shooting, and after those first 2-3 frames part of the bird is inevitably cut-off by the edge of the frame, and eventually is totally out of the frame. This occurs when I’m photographing with my long telephoto lenses (e.g., 70-400, 300/2.8, 500/4, 600/4) and subjects such as bald eagles, ospreys, and albatross. I encountered the same problem recently photographing a youth soccer game. Because of the slide-show effect, what you see in the EVF when you start shooting is what you just shot, not where the subject is, and the faster the subject is moving, the faster it will move out of the frame because you don’t know where it is while you are shooting. The A77 II does not fix this problem from what early users have reported. If someone knows for sure that the slide-show effect no longer exists when shooting in high speed continuous advance, I would love to know it.
The EVF on the A77II does not have EVF lag what so ever, Sony has corrected this. This was one of Sony’s stated goals with the new cameras design.
Every A77II review to date has stated this in each of its opening paragraphs. I’ve used this camera and this does not occur.
I used it (A77II) last week and took pictures of cars screaming down the highway with the 70200G2 and didn’t notice a problem.
If it can handle 120kph cars I’m pretty sure the problem is corrected. One of the members of Dyxum posted info on his A77II regarding this topic.
http://www.dyxum.com/dforum/tried-the-tracking-of-the-a77ii_topic107309.html
I have read previously the discussion you linked to at dyxum. The last post in that thread notes that the slide-show effect remains in the A77 II, though the focus tracking is (obviously) improved. At the start of the Gary Fong video, which I also have seen previously, the soccer player (football for those of you not in the U.S.) is moving increasingly to the left of the frame as the shooting sequence continues and, at least from my perspective, those shots become far less usable (or unusable) from a composition perspective. Had the sequence continued, the player would essentially have run out of the frame (or maybe he did and Gary simply cut out that part of the sequence for purposes of the video). It’s not just a question of whether the camera can accurately focus track, but also if the photographer can maintain the subject in the desired composition within the frame. The new AF system in the A77 II can help with the better focus tracking, but the slide-show effect means it can’t help with the composition, or the ability to maintain the subject at a certain position within the frame.
Actually Gary is shooting all the pictures from the hip, and not attempting to compose any of the photos in order to drive his point home. The hardware hand shaking between focus point to focus point is quite amazing for a $1099.99 camera.
I am not talking about EVF lag, I’m talking about the camera showing you in the viewfinder what you just shot rather than returning to a live action image when shooting in high-speed continuous advance. I have not read any review of the camera that addresses this matter. If you know of one please direct us to it.
Also, EVF lag still remains in low light situations, though from what I have read it is better than the A77 in this regard (not as sure about how it compares to the A99). I don’t have an issue with EVF lag in good light, which as I said is not to be confused with the slide-show effect.
4k advertisement is about video, not photo
But the Alpha logo on the vests is about Imaging.
The vast majority of the world doesnt know what a L lense looks like. So when the tv pans across the sideline most people just see the photogs wearing Sony vests. I think that’s all Sony is really looking for. If you can quickly determine brand by looking at the lenses, you’re probably not going to be strongly influenced by what people are using over specs etc. so that’s not really the group this type of ad is going after.
Exactly. This is not a marketing fail for SONY. It’s brand building, and 99% of the audience won’t have a clue of what camera the photogs are using – they will see the nice orange vest with SONY and the logo.
Disagree. People who are that ignorant know two things: “big cameras at sports events” and “small cameras”. The first type also includes 100x zoom TV cameras. Regular people are impressed the most by those.
Also if they ever go to buy a camera to a shop they’d see a whole line up of massive white canon L lenses or black Nikon lenses and soon find out that Sony doesn’t have anything like that. When they ask which bodies pros use again the answer they get won’t be Sony… unless they went to a Sony store lol
So the people who think they’re all Sony don’t matter. I don’t see why it’s wrong for Sony to advertise wherever they can but can’t say this is any more effective. If anything it’ll make people ask and find out that Sony has nothing serious to offer in this regard.
These are nice safety vests by the way
YOUR ARE WRONG!
THE MAIN MEDIA IS SONY 4K OF FIFA / WORD CUP AND GIVE THE LINK FOR TV: GLOBO, BAND IS SONY.
Only because they paid FIFA off.
Yes, the goverment pay bilions too….. and fifa dont will pay the tax, fifa gone win a lot of bilions real.
Fifa is like a criminal gang, 2 years i go i try do some job/video for fifa/gettyimagens…. is a shame to work with these criminals.
fais is a photographer, the sony 4k can frame the perfect frame over many footage.
I was in charge of 12 Chinese press from China when they made a stop to the US before the World Cup. They wanted to shop so I asked what they want to buy. They told me electronics. So cool, I can get you guys a 25% discount at Sony store I said. They took their cameras out of the luggage and said we like Canon. Good I said, let’s go to the Canon Irvine center and get those cleaned before you leave for the World Cup.
It’s very hard to get Pros to switch to Sony.
I am a pro now… i started with sony about 6 years ago when i lived in Australia… now for me sony is the best for video
Which Sony are you using for video?
I have no experience with video. I think Sony has the best cameras but they don’t have the lenses and services for the pros.
I think even nikon has problems in order to get pros switching to nikon instead of canon!!!!!!
CANON IS THE MOST USED AND COMPETITOR TO BEAT!!!
So SONY ….it’s up to you!!
Chevrolets are the most driven cars in North America, and it doesn’t make them any better than the rest.
Technology like “Lock on AF Expandable Flexible Spot” will drive people to Sony, after it fills out its G-Series line with a new 400mm f/2.8 (or f/4.0), and 600mm f/4.0
Please show me the link to that info!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0PC-_FJZvk&feature=share
“Lock on Expandable Flexible Spot” sounds like something you put in the dishwasher.
Even if the lenses were all there, no one will pick a a77 II when there are cameras like the 1D X and D4/s. If they want a cheaper option they go for a 1D IV or a D3s…
“Full Frame Sports camera that will convince some of them to switch over to Sony!”
Yeah, because all pros like to use EVFs in stadium lighting situations.
Sony should make a proper DSLR, they already make great sensors, just add mirror to it and bring back the OVF.
Why would anyone take a huge step backwards. I’d rather use the A77II its faster cheaper, and I can afford enough of them to put one on our 300mm, 400mm, and 600mm, and probably get better results.
And for the money we save I’d be able to save up for the 400mm G-Series lens that Sony is rumoured to be working on.
What good is an OVF and a flappy mirror in a stadium lighting situation 😮 ?
Sure noisy evf in dim light is way better 🙂 and for the mirror of course nobody likes it, but so far it’s the best way that helps the autofocus in tracking action.
I don’t get it. Why is a Little noise a Problem in tracking? You see it with more light, that is an Advantage. Plus you do not have the delay of the mirror flip-up.
Yeah you didn’t get it. Mirror is what helps tracking not the lack of viewfinder noise.
It’s not so much about the camera. It’s a total lack of glass that will hold Sony back on the sports side of things. I’m a former SI shooter and the sort of bare minimum for me to shoot sports with is a 200mm f/2, 400mm f/2.8, and 600mm f/4. the 200-400mm f/4 zooms are also nice. Soccer requires a 28-800mm f/2.8 zoom to cover properly, not that anyone could carry one or work off a mono-pod with that kind of heft and bulk. But What I would need to shoot American football is a 600mm f/4 and a 400mm f/2.8. Sony has made a big inroad to light sensitive chips which is fine, but photogs need serious optics to blow annoying backgrounds out of focus from a distance. Their 300/500 lineup is lacking. I love the Sony gear… up to 55mm which is the current limit of their prime fast glass. After that, it’s the D4s and Nikon glass. I want very badly to unload all my Nikon gear but not until Sony starts speeding on their “roadmap.”
We’re still using Minolta era glass for this reason. Our 600mm f/4, 400mm f/4.5, and 300mm f/2.8 are all upto 20 years old now. All of them are outstanding lenses but servicing them is getting harder every year.
Sony needs to take the Minolta designs they’re sitting on, and produce a new 600mm f/4, and a 400mm f/4.5.
up to 55mm? What about the great 85 F1.4 Zeiss or the 135 F1.8 Zeiss? Or the 300 F2.8 G lens or the 500 F4? 🙂 Yeah, there are holes… but it does not stop at 55 at all :).
What a jab to all of Alpha’s Sony imaging division, as they don’t put Canikon away yet. They should be embarrassed, sure, but I think the point of this advertising is their VG (Videographer) cameras, and to see some of them in these pictures I think it’s OK.
Haha – actually I think its a quite nice coup they did: Having “pro” Canon/Nikon-Shooters running around dressed as Sony Alpha-Guys. From the distance nobody can tell the difference. The people will just see all those professional sports photographers wearing black vests with big “SONY Alpha” logos 😉
That’s funny and it may happen someday. The A77II can easily handle Sports Photography it’s new Lock on AF expandable flexible spots is incredible, and only possible with a EFV, you really need to watch the Gary Fong video on you tube to believe.
It literally locks on to the subject even if the subject is running at full speed.
How many Sony cameras were there? 100? or less than 0?
It’s different when it’s your non-potty trained 6 year old running at full speed and the players in the world cup doing the same.
WTF are you talking about? Did you even watch the video? Watch the video , and read the Dyxum post before you make another dumb statement!!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0PC-_FJZvk&feature=share
http://www.dyxum.com/dforum/tried-the-tracking-of-the-a77ii_topic107309.html
ROFL did I hurt your feelings by joking about the new aps-c camera you day dream about? aww there there.
>Let’s hope Sony will mae a real Alpha Full Frame Sports camera
Yes, and no more than 12Mp please, just take the amazing A7S sensor.
This is not a marketing fail for Sony. People will see the logo from a distance and not have a clue about the camera they are using.
However, knowing Sony, they probably offered all of those photographers the option of using a Sony Alpha camera to go along with the vest. It says something that not a single one took them up on it.
If Sony manages to get off its butt, and launch the rumoured 400mm G-Series lens they’ll probably see more “Alpha Pros” at Sporting Events.
Sony just don’t seem to understand that the high-end “HALO” products give the entire product line the credibility/recognition it needs to drive sales.
Sony is missing these key “HALO” lenses 400mm f/4.0, 400mm f/2.8, 600mm f/4.0, and without these lenses cameras like the A77II, A88, A99II (rumored), and A1 (rumored) will be useless at sporting events.
Most of us are using High Speed Minolta 300mm, 400mm, and 600mm lenses that are well past their prime. Parts are scarce, and hard to acquire these days.
All Sony need to do is relaunch these lenses, update their electronics and slap a Sony logo on them. I’d be nice if they’d paint them the 70400G silver (which I really liked) just to stand out from the crowd.
However the A77II seems to be quite useful for the Sporting Events. The new flexible expandable auto-focus seems to be very useful for outdoor sporting events,
Its sad to think there isn’t many useful Sony Sport lenses to take advantage of its new capabilities.
A88? A1?
I dont belive for one second that Sony offered them cameras. No way no how.
They have simply sponsored the event and have their logo on all personel.
Sony doesn’t give away squat, especially cameras. Most reviewer copies of Sony cameras a lent for a very specific period of time, and then returned. They gave them $50.00 vests.
I´m sorry admin but this is a dumb post.
It´s obs the vests are only publicity.
with sony camera, you wont need photoshop and lightroom.. thats for sure..
I agree with most comments that this isn’t really a marketing fail, it gives at least a lot of exposure to sony alpha (no pun intended) for sure, but Sony could at least sponsor a few good photographers and let them shoot with Sony alongside all the Canon/Nikon guys.
As Rafael said, you can’t rent / borrow Sony products anywhere (maybe in the US, but that I don’t know) so you have to buy the ridiculously expensive lenses yourself. Why is that?
And of course, Sony 4K is being promoted as well, as it has been the latest buzz in professional video world the 3 years and starting to reach consumers. But I think they’re not promoting any of the sony camera’s, they are promoting 4K itself and trying to convince the consumer to buy a sony 4K TV from their money losing TV division. The cinealta and F55 camera’s have already taken the professional film & broadcast market, so there is less need to promote these.
But Sony should start to look at PR of other brands, that are getting far more exposure and are convincing photographers to switch from their beloved Canon & Nikon. A friend of mine who is a jazz/stage photographer, wanted to switch from Nikon to another brand, and Olympus offered him everything he wanted on trial for a month with an option to buy with a very interesting discount. Same with another friend who wants to try out Fuji XT, he has an option to try it for free for 2 months, just by calling Fuji. When I tried to rent/borrow a A99 before I bought one, there was not even an option to try it in the store, as almost none of the camerastores in NL sell anything more than the A58 or the cybershot range.
That’s true, the problem is that those photographers earn money with their pictures rather than the sponsor. So, if they have always used a brand, feel confident with it and it does the job, I don’t think they will switch so easily if it means possible degradation in the quality of their work.
Besides, even if I think A99 is still pretty good, it’s not a speed monster compared to the D4 or even the latest 1D. Less megapixels is not a problem for journal printing or web publishing, so Sony lacks a faster full frame camera even if with less pixels. A77II maybe able to do the job but it’s still not as complete and the high iso performance comprensibly not on par with the full frame alternatives.
But the most important thing is the lesser choice of lenses in the very long range, the 400 F4 would be a nice addition but simply not enough, they should step up the focal length and go beyond 400, 500 and more 🙂
What does 4K video and TV have to do with shooting still images with a camera?
Sony are convinced that most of the snaps will be displayed using a 4K TV. During the introduction of A7/7r they had emphasized this belief to the dealers. Only they forgot the small detail that Samsung is the top seller of any TV nowadays.
oh, dude, sony might not be the top TV seller these days, but most 4k content u see comes from a sony video camera, and every 4k live u can receive this worldcup come from sony too
Nothing, mate, nothing. I don’t understand this post. Sony is a sponsor so they can plaster their logo wherever FIFA allows it. 4K is the official source material and transmission of the tournament that is sponsored by Sony (if you have a 4K TV, good for you…you can watch the whole world cup in 4K)
The vests mean nothing but the fact that Sony has coughed up to have their logo on them.
Other people splashing dough are:
Yingli Solar
Hyundai
Adidas
Nike (It looks like they got almost all the monopoly of the boots)
Liberty Insurance
Powerade
Castrol
Continental
etc…
etc…
Wow a Nikon strap looks GREAT on my Sony camera!
Best part is that Nikon didn’t FORCE me to do it.
I do this in protest against Sony marketing idiots.
Genius more like it, now the ignorant masses think all pro sporting events use alpha cameras. Two thumbs up for Sony’s marketing/deception team.
That’s true. Nikon didn’t force you…your newspaper/employeer may have done because thats the gear you get. I wouldn’t know how many of those photographers there actually own the gear they are shooting with.
Kind of interesting to see most replies below ignore the fact that the vast majority of photographers there are not self funded freelancers that talked their way into the matches.
well…
i was shoting along a bunch of other phothographers
mostly they had nikons and canons, i was the only one with an alpha
when the speed was needed i switch my alpha to continuos shoting
i start feeling the bad looks when keep firing the shutter
some go and ask me to show how the photos i was taking look
i was getting good pictures so i think, lets get real speed and turn the telezoom continuos (or whatever that function with the 12 square is called)
soon, my alpha was like a machine gun, it was as fast as loud, lol
then the real funny start
– one come to me and say me “you are gonna to kill it”
– i listen how 2 others were talking “thats cheating” “yeah, a real pothographer only needs one shot”
– but the one that make my day, was the one with a nikon 800e, he keep asking how he can get more fps, he looked menu after menu until i aprouch and told him, “thats it” you only had 4fps, if you want a real machine gun like mine, go and get an alpha
needles to say, i get a lot of photos, thousands, most were average or useless, but along with that i also get the best photos of all the bunch
No..My question is to all those Nikon and Canon shooters with the Sony Alpha Jackets on…WHY? Where is your own back bone of saying NO! A Massive Fail on Sony and all those YSSUP Photographers!
What are you talking about? They’re there to do their job, which is to shoot photos, not to act as testimonials, and of course will wear the official vests! Besides, I don’t see the big problem and I would not have any problem wearing a Canon/Nikon vest to be able to be there shooting with my Sony camera 😀
Less fanatism is better for everyone 🙂
thing is Alpha not much in super tele lens for sport and advance camera like A99 a77m2… so what you expert people will use alpha which they might missed some good shot…
Admin has there been any info on the 400mm f/4.0 that was supposed to be released this year??
Attached below are the articles, and the last one was over 8 months ago.
http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/sr4-the-400mm-f4-0-lens-will-be-the-first-designed-with-olympus/
http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/sr5-70-200mm-f2-8-ii-and-400mm-f4-0-coming-and-a-82mm-filter-size-lens-mistery/
http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/its-official-olympus-will-develop-lenses-for-sony/
Why? 400mm? You will spend 4000 and you can work with 70-400 or 70-200 in aps…. now wity good iso you can do the pictures… the quality isn’t bad.
Or use a 18-270 on APS-C… *sarcasm* …
Honestly, it’s not the same.
For web, newspaper and magazine… YES, I meet some photographers… they carry 300mm 2.8, 400mm 2.8… and sell photos for $50 or $100… sometimes in games just sell one picture.
Sorry, my english is not good….
If Sony wanted to it could have bought the exclusive rights to photograph the games. They could have simply hired their own Alpha Savvy Photographers, and simply sold photos to all of the media outlets, who would have paid top dollar.
Its a heck of a lot cheaper to buy photos than to send a photographer half way around the world, and pay his travel expenses for the entire World Cup.
Sony could have used this opportunity to fully exploit the new A77II, semi-new A99, and the updated G-Series lenses. That picture could have been filled with Sony Pros using A77IIs, and A99s attached to the 70-200mm, 70-400mm, 300mm f/2.8, and 500mm f/4.0.
How many Pro,s use Sony. I was a Sony Alpha Ambassador in Australia until May this year when they stop the program to solely focus on the 7’s marketing. I have not seen another sony user in any of my travels in Australia.I just dont think Sony wants to compete with Canon and Nikon in the sports /action arena.
http://www.sony.com.au/microsite/alphaambassadors/daviddavies.html
Sony’s has zero chance of competing in Sports photography now, but should Sony decide to plug the holes (400mm f/2.8, 400mm f/4.5, and 600mm f/4.0) in their G-Series line-up in the near future they’d have a fair shot at getting a toe hold.
The A77II was their first step in the right direction. Hopefully the A99II will also come equipped with a 12fps second burst rate, and the new AF system, enlarged to cover the Full Frame sensor of course. If the A99II builds upon the A77II success it will be the first time they’ll have something decent for Sport photographers.
I wouldn’t hold my breath for it.
All true, including the fact that Sony doesn’t seem eager to fill the gap in the system to make Alpha cameras more interesting for pro sport photographers.
12fps? You should buy a 4k camera and take the frame.
Friends, i commented above: the sport market is strategical for one reason: these cameras and photographers have a great TV exposition of trademarks at these events. While Sony put the Sony logo on leds display and photogs jackets around the arena, people see the professionals using Canikon systems. This fact matters to consumers.
These images are showed at slowmotion on replays. So the market see Canon and Nikon like Pro’s choices, no matter the event. Nikon and Canon fights for F1 and Olympic photogs, borrowing lenses and cameras to them make their jobs, giving free assistance at these events with big trucks. If Sony wants to be a bigger market player, they have to improve sports equipment and assistance on great sports events. Sorry for my poor english.
And for the incoherent advice to Sony
Sony is official sponsor of the event but mainly for the video cameras (and TVs :D) , the photographers are there for themselves or for the media that employ them so they use their own equipment, which is clearly not bound by the sponsor. So I don’t see the big fail here, we knew that most of the pros use canon nikon and, especially for sport events, there are basically only those two brands. And it will certainly stay like this, IF sony doesn’t come out with some more cameras and lenses suited for the task AND does not promote its name.
So, nothing wrong here, as much as I see it 🙂
I would call this common sense on the account of the sports photographers. What counts for them more than the qualities of the camera is the availability of pro-grade telephoto lenses with IS and fast autofocus. The offerings of Sony in this segment are inferior in terms of price and performance.
Friends, the sport market is strategical for one reason: these cameras and photographers have a great TV exposition of trademarks at these events. While Sony put the Sony logo on leds display and photogs jackets around the arena, people see the professionals using Canikon systems. This fact matters to consumers.
These images are showed at slowmotion on replays. So the market see Canon and Nikon like Pro’s choices, no matter the event. Nikon and Canon fights for F1 and Olympic photogs, borrowing lenses and cameras to them make their jobs, giving free assistance at these events with big trucks. If Sony wants to be a bigger market player, they have to improve sports equipment and assistance on great sports events. Sorry for my poor english.