It’s a real surprise Sony didn’t make a big advertising on one of the Sony A7s biggest new features. According to Amazon US (Click here and read the “Additional Features” section) the A7s has full electronic shutter! It means you can shoot in full silence and with no vibration usually caused by the mechanical shutter! Quite a huge news nobody wrote about it! I hope this isn’t a mistake. This is Amazon’s description:
Silent shutter mode is ideal when discretionary shooting is required; like capturing a recital or wildlife. Activating the silent shutter eliminates the use of the mechanical shutter and therefore shutter noise by utilizing an electronic shutter in its place.
Also the well-known German Fotomagazin claims the Sony A7s is capable of shooting in full electronic shutter mode! The magazine also writes “Sony could not answer our question if the function (pure electronic shutter) could be updated in other Sony-A7-cameras.” (I don’t know if it’s technically possible).
Also Digitalversus writes:
“The other reason we’re dying to get our hands on the Alpha 7s is that it has an electronic shutter mode, which means it can snap photos in complete silence—a more-than-welcome surprise that puts it in competition with the Panasonic GX7.”
There is not detailed info yet about how exactly the silent electronic mode works on the A7s. Hope Sony will disclose more details about it soon!
—
A7s and RX100M3 Preorders:
Sony A7s preorder in USA/CA at Amazon (Click here), Adorama (Click here), BHphoto (Click here), Sony (Click here), Sony Canada.
RX100M3 preorders in USA at Amazon (Click here), Adorama (Click here), BHphoto (Click here), Sony (Click here).
RX100M3 preorders in Eu at Sony DE, UK, ES, FR, IT, NL, BE, AT, CH, SE, NO, FI, PT.
RX100M3 in Asia at Amazon Japan.
Sony A7s EU pages (no preorder yet): Sony DE, UK, ES, FR, IT, NL, SE, FI, PL.
A77II Preorders:
Sony A77II body in USA at Amazon (Click here), Adorama (Click here), Sony Store (Click here) and BHphoto (Click here).
Sony A77II with 16-50mm lens at Amazon (Click here), Adorama (Click here), Sony Store (Click here) and BHphoto (Click here).
Sony A77II body in Europe at Sony Germany, Sony UK, Sony France, Sony IT, ES, NL, BE, AT, CH, PT, NO, SE, FI.
SonyAlphaRumors support note: If you use these store links to preorder the camera I will earn a small commission that will help me to cover the cots and if preorders are high also reward me a bit for the daily work I do on SAR. Thanks for your help guys!!!!
0 Responses
It would be the perfect timelapse camera if true.
Are we talking global shutter here for the A7S?
What shutter does the A7R have then?
A7R: Focal plane mechanical curtain shutter. No electronic first curtain.
A7: Focal plane mechanical curtain shutter. Optional electronic first curtain shutter
A7S: ???
Not “global” shutter -it is a rolling shutter- but “Full Electronic Shutter”, which makes sense since it’s a video oriented camera and the shutter is electronic -there is no physical curtain- in video mode.
Old news.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00JIWXTXG/
See product description:
“Additional FeaturesSilent shutter mode for discreet shooting Silent shutter mode is ideal when discretionary shooting is required;…”
From the Amazon.com page: (http://www.amazon.com/Sony-Compact-Interchangeable-Digital-Camera/dp/B00JIWXTXG/)
“Silent shutter mode for discreet shooting
Silent shutter mode is ideal when discretionary shooting is required; like capturing a recital or wildlife. Activating the silent shutter eliminates the use of the mechanical shutter and therefore shutter noise by utilizing an electronic shutter in its place.”
Amazing!
Sounds promising but there must be some disadvantage otherwise they could have done away with the mechanics.
Check ricksastro’s post above (Panasonic G5/6..GH3/4..)
A rolling shutter would be a wee bit disappointing
Battery life is the obvious for stills
does this give us better sync speed?
i concern this too, does it cap at 1/250 sync speed….
I think I saw 1/250th
Non-global electronic shutter shouln’t be so hard to implement I guess. A nice option to have, especially when the mechanical shutter is as loud as the one of the A7(R).
Here it says “Electronically controlled, vertical traverse, focal plane type”
http://www.sonycenter.lu/upload/pdf/ILCE-7S.pdf
Electronically controlled shutter is not the same as electronic shutter
Yeah, I assumed from that it was the same as the A7.
If this is true…Sony PR department should be replaced with capable ones. Great news and now this camera, despite the 12MP sensor becomes more useful! 🙂
[I sincerely hope this is not like one of the bogus price claim stunts. Also, I would like a FW update for A7 to have this.]
Simply cannot be true–remember the IBIS reported on E-mount cameras on their website? Sony has already made the selling points of the A7s clear, there won’t be any surprises. EFC is the most it will have.
Well considering it was ‘pre announced’ anything’s possible.
Why should it not be true?
remeber it’s still a rolling shutter, so it’s not that big of a news. why wouldn’t it be possible if full sensor readout is possible in video?
If this is really true, I’m gratified and excited about an A7 model for the first time. I wouldn’t touch an A7 or A7r due to the clatter.
Still it seems incredible to me that such a fantastic feature would be negected in all previously released information about the A7s, and not mentioned by those photographers who were privileged to use an advanced copy. Perhaps the chip was capable, but the firmware was not yet in place to exploit it.
Some features are remnents of the film era and would not otherwise be on or current digital cameras.
The mirror is one
Optical viewfinder is another and
Anything but an electronic shutter is another.
Another really top, super intelligent comment from you. Well done!
He has to increase his post count somehow.
Isnt it nice to have a cast of familiar characters here though? Now barry is expected to play his role.
seriously people stop the bullying. if you don’t like people on the internet, just ignore them.
Car crashes are difficult to ignore.
Barry is a nice guy apart from the stacked sensor thing.
I do wish he’d stop listening to what “Sony” say to him though, he needs to realise that Sony employees haven’t a clue about their own products and you can’t simply accept what they say as fact!
Consider yourself ignored….
….only joking, I love you really…
This is correct. It’s all because of the history. [I am not sure why you got two negative comments.]
Reaping what has sowed in the past 🙂
Yes I really do deserve to be bullied.
My commenents dont live up to your high standards so I deserve to be bullied.
Or I dont speak right so I deserve to be bullied.
Or I dont look right or wear the wrong clothes or walk funny so I really do deserve to be bullied every day.
Funny thing is if I were to give up and go away you would find someone else just as deserving as me.
It could be anyone out there…mayby your next?
One who can see his own mistakes and correct them will be successful in life.
I would hope some of these individuals will realize that what they are doing is wrong and hurtfull and change thier behavior.
Unfortunately some may not because this type of behavior really is in thier nature.
No doubt because he was being Captain Obvious as usual.
Barry thinks he is a man of insight and importance. Narcissists are like that.
Or because others feel more important by bashing him. It gets kind of boring that whatever Barry post, somebody has to reply something meaningless. A while back I agree that he posted to much about 50 megapixel sensors, but now there are plenty of more noisy people.
Bullies ALWAYS think their behavior is ok because their victem deserves it.
They also ALWAYS think thier behavior is more ok if they can get more bullies to help gang up against thier victem.
This is hatefull and deplorable.
I will never back down to people like this.
I think many people feel this way about bullies but are afraid if they speak up they will be the next victim.
If others want to join me in speaking out against bullies you are welcome..otherwise I will continue to speak out myself.
Perhaps this cyberbullieng is not important enough.
Mayby when you kid comes home crying because of the bullies in school it will be important enough.
Or mayby when a teenager takes thier own life because they cant stand it anymore it will be important enough.
Bullies are bullies whatever rock they happen to crawl out from .
Go son! Don’t fret the petty haters, thier actions add nothing of value and only work to degrade the community on this website.
I too don’t understand why Barry is being picked upon. He succinctly picks up on three legacies of the film camera era which are gradually being phased out in the electronic eras. It might be considered common knowledge, but I still think that many aren’t aware of the rethink that’s required in digital photography as so many of the concepts of the film era are deeply ingrained. For instance, we still talk about ISO speeds, when really all that happens with digital cameras is the application of analogue and/or digital gain.
In the meantime, if you have criticism of Barry’s conclusions, fair enough, but ad hominem attacks are unworthy.
There are people here who will make negetive comments no matter what I say.
They usually claim to want me to stop posting comments but anyone with any common sense realizes that many more people read my posts because of the negative comments.
A nice ugly internet battle *is* hard to ignore. 🙂
People do seem to enjoy whatching a pack of cowardly cyberbullies at work
This is where Sony can and does lead the way. Even sit hinge a flapping mirror in a dslr was a huge move forwards.
Oh snap Barry! You’re the top commenter on SAR right now. 700+ comments. Pshewww.
How do you know how many comments I have made? Is there a list somewhere or is that number a quess?
http://disqus.com/animalsbybarry/
Then 715 are just my recent comments..since admin switched to discuss..
I have made many more comments prior to that.
Like photography, it’s quality not quantity that matters.
Thank you.
Thank you? Seriously?
I counted each one. XD
Just kidding. At the top of the comments section, I noticed that it said “Sony Alpha Rumors” (right next to the comment count i.e. “90 Comments Sony Alpha Rumors”. Click on that to see the numbers.
Sounds like it has what the GH3&4 have had for a while…an electronic rolling (not global) shutter. Doesn’t help sync speed, limited top shutter speed and not good for action (due to the jello). But great for relatively static scenes or when you want to be super discrete
sound logical. rolling shutter has been confirmed, so it seems probable in silent mode too
On the Sony site they refer to something termed silent shooting – Possible translation error by the German magazine?
OTOH, if the camera has a full electronic shutter, I wonder what the drawbacks are and how insanely short the exposure times might be.
If the speculation that the electronic shutter is a rolling shutter is accurate, then very short exposure times, i.e. for quickly moving subjects, won’t work well… Oh well, back to waiting for a “real” electronic shutter.
Considering the A7S does full sensor readout in video it is entirely ‘capable’ of electronic shutter mode. Haven’t seen anything official about the capability, but is possible for sure.
Sony confirmed about full electronic shutter when they announced A7s in Japan. http://www.sony.jp/CorporateCruise/Press/201405/14-0516B/ At the big photo show, I tested A7s and yes, the silent shutter works really quietly. Also, I tested RX100M3 and 5 axis motion stabilizer works really well while shooting the video. Sony Global doesn’t advertise about the silent shutter of A7s and 5 axis motion stabilizer for RX100M3. They really need to know how to advertise their good product…
If Sony’s marketing department had so much as 1/10 the ability to execute as their engineering and manufacturing, Sony would be in a much better position.
Sony confirmed about full electronic shutter when they announced A7s in Japan. Find the word “サイレント” and translate it. http://www.sony.jp/CorporateCruise/Press/201405/14-0516B/ At the big photo show, I tested A7s and yes, the silent shutter works really quietly. Also, I tested RX100M3 and 5 axis motion stabilizer works really well while shooting the video. Sony Global doesn’t advertise about the silent shutter of A7s and 5 axis motion stabilizer for RX100M3. They really need to know how to advertise their good product…
what a failure marketing team; fire them all and replace me 🙂 I promise market shake up and a clear victory! LoL…
Dang. You weren’t first this time… 😛
haha
A google translate of your link:
Silent shooting function to mute the shutter sound newly ※ 10 It is equipped with. In order to use the electronic shutter automatically, shutter sound is muted, silent shooting while setting is also ideal for shooting wildlife. Also available as a scene that require a quiet and lectures concerts.
※ 10: Silent shooting capabilities, your attention, please use at your own risk enough to portrait rights and privacy of the subject.
WHAT? The pic duplicated after I done editing. Delate it, Admin, please…
great. now we have 3 A7 with things I want. Make a FrankensteinA7 by mix them, put it in a bigger body and it will be mine.
🙂
I’m going to assume that Andrea’s response indicates that all of this will be offered in the upcoming Alpha flagship body.
Amount mirrorless camera w ibis and internal 4k video?
this is a rumor I ams till working on…
Good to know. 😉
a88 or a99M2? 😀
I can’t wait…
What do you know about it so far?
Logically it would be the a99II:
36MP sensor from a7R + great AF (hopefully not from a7 but fits the scenario) + 4k video from a7S.
Exciting if my speculation is correct and it would be a monster seller for the a-mount but, alas, not sure I could justify the $2,800-$3,000 price tag. Tempting though.
You forgot bout Barry’s orgasmic sensor.
you shouldn’t believe what Amazon says. amazon.es still says the a6000 has touch screen and in body stabilization ¬¬
I understand they can’t implement this feature on the other A7 models because they don’t do a full sensor readout. I’m pleased by this announcement and I’m also surprised it wasn’t better publicized. It won’t increase sync speeds as it is a rolling shutter so you’ll still get those ugly flash bands. Usefulness for fast moving subjects may also be limited but I think it will still be a very useful and unique feature.
They can do it on other A7 models, they can do a full sensor readout, albeit at slower fps.
Can somebody explain to my why a mechanical shutter is still needed?
I never understood this..
I read about that chinese kinefinity movie camera that full sensor simultaneous readout adds noise to the image, in addition to being costly to implement ans requiring faster ellectronics etc. I guess its just a cost benefit balance.
Oh, man! You’re one of today’s lucky 10,000. 🙂 http://xkcd.com/1053/
As you may have noticed, most point and shoot cameras don’t have a mechanical shutter. This is because they have electronics on the sensor chip which store the charge when light hits each pixel on the array. This can lead to more compactness, but negatively impacts image quality (part of the sensor space which would otherwise be a light collecting area must be dedicated to the electronics). Sony’s Exmor R sensor tech (and other back-side illuminated sensors) combat this problem by placing the electronics behind the image capture elements; this drives up the cost though.
Digital cameras that need a mechanical shutter don’t have electronics on the sensor to store the charge, therefore if they used an electronic shutter, the charge would “bleed off”. The image capture elements also stay on while the shutter is closed, so an electronic shutter would result in a continued capture of light while the image was being transferred to the buffer (storage area in camera used to store image data before writing to storage i.e. Compact Flash/SD card).
If there is someone more knowledgeable reading, please call me out if I accidentally posted some BS in there.
Red herrings… Most of compact cameras have mechanical in-lens leaf shutter.
Actually leaf shutter is better for most of uses than focal plane shutter (which is more of film relic)
I didn’t know that most compact cameras had leaf shutters..?
Not trying to be rude, but which ones?
Don’t know about ‘most’, but it appears the FujiFilm XF1 does, as i can still hear it very faintly (with shutter-sound turned off in the menu). Also it has the leaf shutter characteristic of the maximum shutter speed being limited to 1/1000 at full aperture, but 1/2000 when stopped down a bit.
Every compact camera I have used had leaf shutter, except the cheapest PS I bought for $60.
look for popular compact cameras on dpreview — all of them have, except canon g1x (1 st version) which has focal plane shutter
I was strictly talking about about point and shoot cameras though…
What do you mean by ‘point and shoot’ camera? It’s more of a snarl word than a technical one.
Is Kodak C182 P&S camera?
Is Canon A1100 P&S camera?
Most people agree they are. And they have in-lens leaf shutters.
If you don’t know what is meant by ‘point and shoot’ then your an idiot.
@Validator: https://twitter.com/alyankovic/status/276009238583705600
Rx100 1, 2 and 3. Rx1 and rx10 all have leaf shutter
I knew the RX1 had a leaf shutter. The rest..? Man, how did I miss that?
what most P&S cameras don’t have is full-fledged diagragm, unlike serious cameras where is can be adjusted by 1/3 of stop, most P&S have only 1 or 2 settings
Leaf shutters have been in use in film cameras for over a century, how is it less of a relic that a focal plane shutter?
In film cameras focal plane shutter also protects film when lens is removed (obviously of little use for digital cameras, where sensor can be reset). After switching to digital, most systems already had lots of glass which people still needed to use.
There’s a lot of advantages of leaf shutter: less noise, less vibration, cheaper, more reliable, and for digital — there is no need to develop that messy Electronic First Curtain tech: it’s a lot easier to reset entire sensor at once than row-by-row.
The old Sony R1 fired shutter only once per shot in 2005, yet many today’s mirrorless cameras still need to fire shutter twice per shot.
That’s why virtually all fixed lens cameras use leaf shutters.
It is not needed, actually.
But typical CMOS sensors don’t have electronic global shutter and require too much time for full readout (e.g. about 1/5 to 1/20 of second). Simple reading will produce time parallax (rolling shutter) which isn’t good if subject is moving. If A7S can do readout of 8M pixels for video, it can do so too, for photo.
Has RX100 iii got full pixel readout in video mode?
Yes!
Does it have a Global shutter?
No!
Yes and no,, what? Can somene explain electric shutter, global and so on?
Doesn’t every camera that does video have a full electronic shutter? Obviously, this isn’t global, or this would have made a much bigger splash and we would have heard about this at launch. I would think that this could be a feature with other cameras with a firmware update, but sensor readout is certainly slower with the other two A7 models.
Yes and no. Most cameras can’t do full sensor read out with an electronic shutter, so in video and live view they line skip. Most Sony’s has done this this far, there are only a few exceptions and all have been smaller sensors, such as the Nikon 1’s and some Panasonic m43’s. The RX10 and RX100 sensor can as well, but they use a very quiet leaf shutter so no real advantage of electronic shutter (which has its own problems). The A7S sensor is designed to do full sensor read out electronically, this has advantages for focussing, for video and for silent electronic shutter.
But people will always believe these things are just a firmware update away…
Are we saying the same thing? Is line skipping a function of the processing after the sensor is read? If so, line skipping electronic shutters could read every line, but would be slow.
If this is true it portends well for the other A7 series models as possible version 2 models. I will definitely reconsider the a7r if this shutter issue is resolved as I returned the current version as unsuitable for my purpose. Now if only they would provide an option for uncompressed non lossy raw files, the other reason for my return, while they’re at it. Finally, I want to see sony’s commitment to building a complete system both in hardware and firmware.
The real reason he returned the A7r is because his wife saw the bill on the credit card, slapped him around and forced him to return it. The nonsense about the raw files and shutter issue is just an excuse to save face.
Thanks to Lloyd Chambers, he is the one who discovered A7R shutter vibration issue, finally Sony listened
Errr they have been EFCS for ages, A7R is the one exception because the sensor doesn’t support it, really as simple as that.
Had it since at least the a77.
An electronic shutter would be a game changer. Flash sync at ALL speeds 🙂
Other cameras already do and don’t have improved sync speed because they are not a global shutter, just an electronic one.
That’s what I meant. Thanks for clarifying.
I’ve been waiting for a global shutter in any aps-c or full frame since day 1 for that exact reason. In this day and age of computer processors you’d think they could build one fast enough and small enough to handle a global shutter. Get with the program Sony and you’ll put Canikon on there respective butts.
After A7/A7R/A7S .. I’m waiting for the A-mount FF that will take all those inside it.
I am waiting mature Emount FF. DSLR body+flash+lens are just too heavy and bulky to me.
Thank god I’m not a camera manufacturer :/
everybody want something to fit their needs
LoL…
What you’re waiting for is a dose of reality, because you are living in a fantasy land. Get a life!
Virus X more insane than me, so greed wanted mixed of good stuff from A7/A7R/A7S. That will be Power Ranger a like story 😛
at least I’m dreaming of something worth it.. A-mount FF with Bionz X , silent shutter , 36MP without AA filter , fast AF like a77II
your dream is available .. just buy the A7 it’s the mature E-mount FF ;p
let the guy dream.. I’m still dreaming of a car that can drive me home while I’m playing with my ipad on the back seat
that is a pleasent surprise ….tho it makes perfect sense considering this camera is targetting the video market and user will mostly be using it for video
minipixels.net | Automotive Photography + Design
Any idea what this means for the max flash sync speed?
According to the spec list I posted earlier it is 1/250.
Admin please also mention the 15.3 stops of dynamic range that Sony claims this sensor has as well 😀
Where do they claim that?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00JIWXTXG/
Scroll down to info from manufacturer…
this Feature is on the sony Website for the a7s days ago
This is fantastic and it fits perfectly to the low light capabilities. Makes it the perfect camera for photographing classic concerts. I was unsure about it but now it’s a clear buy for me if it comes at an affordable price in Europe. Sony is really thinking about what photographers need for what purpose. I’m impressed.
New sensor + large pixels: I bet this sensor will set a new record on DXOmark in all respects.
No it does not. There is a major drawback to full a electronic shutter when the subject is moving. More useful to have electronic first curtain.
Sony Website!!!!! weeks ago
Silent Shooting
To eliminate shutter noise, simply activate the newly incorporated Silent Shooting function, which employs an electronic shutter in place of the mechanical shutter. This silent operation is ideal for serious wildlife photography, allowing you to capture more natural poses from closer up. It is also extremely convenient for shooting recitals and other performances without disruption.
Is this setting also doable on: A7? A6000?
Is it a function of the Sony menuing system across their cameras?
Where to find this setting in their menu structure?
Thanks.
This is a first for Sony, but some question its usefulness.
Yes, as it’s been pointed out in the comments below it’s a good feature to have, but it’s nothing really new. It’s the kind of shutter used by video on all cameras (several Panasonic cameras have this feature).
Some tests show its shortcommings and limitations, but still good to have it.
It’s new for full frame.
Here is a review of this feature on the Panasonic G5:
http://m43photo.blogspot.com/2012/12/gh3-electronic-shutter.html
“The electronic shutter feature is very interesting. But it’s usefulness
is limited, since it requires that both the target and the camera are
very still. You must keep the camera still for 1/10s, which is pretty
much impossible. However, when photographing organic objects like nature
or people, small wobbly effects will probably not be noticed.
Photographing geometric objects using the electronic shutter can be a
problem, though.”
Electronic shuter is any great achievement, I’m even surprised Sony hasn’t used before, but I guess this is a way to deal with the fact that the shutter from A7 cameras are pretty loud.
I am amused at the idea of discretionary shooting. Why not use the plain old adjective “discreet”. Discretionary means something in else. And there are enough threats to Plain English from its native users without our needing help from Sony’s marketing department
It is not from Sony but Amxon US who fix words and prices at their discretion. 😉
Well, this “discretionary” is no doubt the kind of reason Oscar Wilde said that we and the Americans were two peoples divided by a common language
“Translucent.”
http://info.xitek.com/slide/201405/16-152543_9.html
Says silent shutter setting in the slide for a7s.
Best guess is that when using entirely electronic shutter, you won’t get a full 12mp image… Likely reduced resolution — in effect, a 4k video screen capture. Just my guess.
No, I think it’s able to use a full electronic shutter specifically because it only has 12MP, vs the 24/36MP of the A7/A7R. Far fewer pixels to move = far less data to move = faster readout.
So yeah, I kinda like the mighty shutter sound of my A7. But sometimes it would be really great to have a silent option!
If this also means high sync speed. Shut up and take my cash Sony!
quite obviously not. as the full matrix readout is done in about 1/30 sec.
LOL if they can do video (8M) at 60 fps, the pessimistic estimate for 12 MP is 1/40 sec. Probably even faster.
They do 8M video only up to 30 fps, Dmitry. 60 fps (available only in 1080p) is line skipping for sure.
“as the full matrix readout is done in about 1/30 sec.”
They spend 1/30 sec to readout 8 mpix out of 12. 1/20s to readout all 12 (obvious math). But video readout is at 10 bit/pixel. At 14 bits, it is much slower than that – even if they support 14 bits in electronic mode.
The sensor does not look new tech, even Aptina in the old Nikon V1 does much better.
it’s a remake of the sensor of the D700 from Nikon. So, you know how old the sensor design is in reality. Then do not wonder about some specs that are disappointing in it. The rest is not magick, high ISO ability, large pixels, ridiculous low resolution. This is a video camera, for stills it is hilarious.
I agree with you Shamael. Saying that they would do a completely new 12 mpix sensor is wishful thinking from people who don’t know how business works. With probability of 99% it is the same old sensor, maybe with minor changes to allow compatibility with the new faster processor able to readout 8 mpix 30 times per second (like 10 and/or 8 bit modes added to ADCs – not a big deal if they already have 14 bit ADCs).
Sad face…
Why not put a similar functinality in A7r at lower shutter speeds and at single shot mode. 1/250 and up doesn’t have any issue anyway. Are you listening Sony?
The whole electronic circuitry and also the sensor itself must support that and I doubt that the “old” sensor from the D800/A7r does that… It’s an awful lot of data that has to be read in an awful short time… The sensor of the A7s is much younger and has only a third of the data …
Wow. I’m really leaning towards getting this just for video, though. But I might wait to see if they’ll make a version that is somewhat like the VG900 that can do 4k Internal, maybe not RAW, but can hook up an extended recorder to it like this can. Blackmagic camera is NOT better than this.
Let me guess – flash X-sync something like 1/20s or lower (flash will be disabled of course), artifacts (for moving subjects or in artificial light) are HUGE – 3 black lines across the frame.
And even with 1/20s, DR/color depth will be reduced to something like 10 bits, basically to phone camera quality.
Without global shutter it is all BS. GIVE US GLOBAL SHUTTER F*CKERS!
Wot ??
So because you are offered to set the camera to use silent shutter mode, it now sux? and flash sync speed changes? An DR ???
Please elaborate on your logic, because I can’t follow it.
OK, I will elaborate. Flash X-sync speed is determined by the physical shutter speed, because for flash to work, the whole sensor has to be exposed at once. A slit moving top to bottom (as in most mechanical focal plane shutters) or “slit” of active pixels between initialization and readout (as in electronic rolling shutters) will expose for flash only this slit, creating bright line across your frame when the rest of the frame is dark. For that reason flash x-sync speed is limited by mechanical speed (between 1/180 and 1/320s) of mechanical shutter or readout speed of the sensor (between 1/10s in the most and 1/60s in Nikon 1s with Aptina). The latter speeds are just too low for any practical use (not just moving subjects but even handholding), so camera makers often simply disable flash with electronic shutter.
But, it only has a “Silent Mode” option. That doesn’t exclude the existence of a real shutter, does it?
Otherwise how does the camera work when you turn ‘Silent Mode’ off ?
Want to see some RAW file samples for download. Anyone know where I can find these?
Guys, read the Sony specs before you post and panic …
X-Sync is 1/250 sec
And this is a high ISO camera for available light video or photography anyway. If you want to use flash you´re better served with other brands or models …
Do you know of any CMOS sensor camera with significantly higher X-synch than 1/250th? Only (some) CCD cameras had really high X-synch numbers, and they don’t make those anymore. If you need to use flash to overwhelm ambient light at wide apertures, that’s what HSS is for, which will work fine with this camera as well.
“Do you know of any CMOS sensor camera with significantly higher X-synch than 1/250th?”
Recent Olympus and Panasonic m43 cameras have 1/320s, if you are talking ILCs. For cameras with fixed lenses and leaf shutters X-sync goes as far as 1/2000s. But it is with mechanical shutter of course. Electronic rolling shutter is usually so slow flash does not work at all.
Sure: Ricoh GXR and some compacts have CMOS and very high flash sync speed. HSS is a crutch and it loses 2 – 3 stops. I really hope those electronic shutters come out (and work :)).
Really? Which model and module? What I was seeing on the A12 modules, for instance, was 1/180th. I can’t find max synch for the P10, and the S10 has a CCD sensor.
Nothing’s perfect, but I wouldn’t call a tool a crutch. If you want full speed synch with a single flash on a large, modern sensor, your options are pretty limited. As peevee pointed out, a leaf shutter is an option, but then you’re generally limited to a fixed lens, and slower max shutter speeds (1/2000th for the RX-1).
“Guys, read the Sony specs before you post and panic …
X-Sync is 1/250 sec”
Not with electronic shutter, no.
WHHHAAATTTT?!?!??
THIS IS GROUND BREAKING NEWS.
And no, I am not being sarcastic. Usually to get electronic shutter you would have to settle for a smaller sensor format like a few of the m43 bodies (GX7, G5, G6, GM1) and the 1″ formats and smaller (Nikon 1, Samsung NX Mini, Pentax Q). But to see a silent shutter mode on a full frame MILC….. I am gobsmacked. I didn’t think this would be possible for at least a few more years.
The Ricoh GXR (APS-C) also has a noiseless e-shutter.
Annnd it has 15.3 STOPS OF DYNAMIC RANGE!!! That’s HUGE news! The Arri Alexa, king of pro cameras, only has 14stops!
that is not difficult if you take a sensor that has the resolution of a 6 mpix APSC camera. We come thus in image quality back to 1995, with more dynamic range and FF. Simply said we have remade a new D700 in a mirrorless body, or better said, Sony has made the camera that Nikon should have by now. But anyway, I will not buy it, 12 mpix is a ridiculous resolution, even if it allows to shoot 12500 ISO more or less clean. What I await now is to see a remodeling of the other two A7 to silent shutter, that will be a reason to get one f the price is ok. But please, not with 4 k video and beyond 2000$.
A FF camera with less than 20mpix is useless in resolution, maybe they will make an 8 mpix soon and shoot 1million ISO.
Well, for video more mega pixels is a bad thing, and dynamic range is everything. I almost exclusively in dark environments and when taking stills they only go on the web so don’t need more for that either. This camera is the one I’ve been dreaming of. Well, unless they put that sensor in a proper video camera body…
Video DR on the a7r is crap, I’ve tried and you couldn’t even pull one extra stop with Final Cut Pro.
That is due to the low data rate output and compression of the codec and not the dynamic range of the sensor.
Pray tell, what application do you have which makes a 12 mega pickles sensor useless for *you*?
Do you print larger than 11″x17″ at 300dpi?
Do you find yourself doing significant cropping?
Do you not need high ISO performance?
Is $2500 too much to swallow?
->Then the A7S is definitely not for you.
It isn’t useless, it just has a range of applications. Like all cameras, you have to choose the model which suits your needs and budget.
I need at least a baker’s dozen of mega pickles.
Mmmm. 13 mega pickles. Think of all the sandwiches you could pair with those huge pickles!
I’m thinking a couple properly made subs for starters (veggie with pepper jack, toasted, everything except onions and pickles; you already have pickles, duh; mustard, brown mustard, and Sriracha sauce). Get that meal deal with some salt & vinegar lay’s, you’re set!
Would that be Vlasic mega pickles, or Allen’s Barrel Cured mega pickles?
LMAO!
Where did you get that information?
Is it really possible with 14 bit files to have such a large DR without risks of posterization ?
That should be DR for still. Video usually has significantly lower DR than still.
If it has just 13 stop DR for video like Blackmagic, it will be revolution.
Yes, silent shutter is real.
One of our Sony user visited Sony Plaza in Tokyo, and discussed with Sony adviser.
They discussed with silent shutter of A7s, and concluded it will help capturing photo at music concert and various plays of amature groups. The back display had better be coverrd with something to keep concert environment.
We are glad to hear it.
You mean you are glad NOT to hear it 😉
I know why they don’t want to piss off the people with the cameras that go KRANCUSHUCHATHUNKACANCHUNK! when you take a picture for $2300 bagholder MF’s like myself. Thanks sony the A7s will have it plagues too. Go Go Gadget Holders!!!
im surprised that many are now claming WOW
its really no surprise to anyone who knows a little about sensors
i know it since sony said they will release a 12mp FF sensor
to all claiming electronic shutter is useless, i had been using an electronic shutter with my J1 (it had not a mechanical one) and its very good, not having really any of the bad effects everyone else talk about here
if i had to bet, i will say you will get the same picture with electonic that you get with mechanical
since sony cross license aptina tech a few years ago, they keep incorporating the good tech from the aptina J1 sensor, as in A6000 and now A7s
did i mention my J1 can shot at 1/16000 and picture is as good as any mechanical dslr
as for the high dinamyc range, i actually thougth sony could get a higher number, more like 18, that combined with their better than everyonelse HDR should get the magic 24EV human like DR
im really not surprised by sony path, it was the natural evolution of tech, sony knows it strike gold with the A7r and A7s, not a surprise that the new A mount cameras will be A99r and A99s, im sure both will be a sure hit this christmas
“haha u guyz r so dumb i am smarter than u i saw it coming hurr durr”
Welcome to the nation of reee tard eh shuuunn…
Electronic shutter is not so special. You can add electronic shutter to Canon DSLR with Magic Lantern custom firmware, and as others noted, GX7 has this too. It doesn’t allow high speend x-sync.
In sum total benefits against whatnot… This seems just for the show of it and not development of photographic technology. Or else?
It seems Sony has been breaking wind lately, without consideration or consent. ASK YOUR CUSTOMERS FIRST!
For the ladies with their fancy purses perhaps, does it come in pink? No? A step too far in the puddle and no dry socks in sight. We expected more from a mighty company.
Try to construct first.
Sense. Try making some you should.