The A77 will be replaced soon.
A known source told me that he got the info that four Sony APS-C camera will be released between now and Photokina. Three of them will be E-mount and one of them A-mount with SLT mirror.
I already told you that there will be a new High End E-mount and an A77 successor soon. The other two cameras are likely to be entry level E-mount cameras.
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0 Responses
A mount APS-C SLT is meaningless. We want full frame A mount mirrorless retro.
yeah… if you ask 1000 men 800 have a penis longer then 20cm. Everybody here want fullframe, 90% of them don’t need it. Are here really only professionels or only people with “small penis” ???
I dont think it is a need only thing at all; pleasure is part of the equation since for some people cameras are like toys and trying to take good pictures a hobby. I don’t need APS-C, I don’t need a full frame camera either. A good point and shoot like the Canon S90 could be enough. But I bought a NEX-5, a NEX-6 and now the A7r to which I’ll attach the two Zeiss primes. Not because I need them but just because I want to try taking pictures with these, purely for fun and see what I can get out from good equipment. Bad IQ with these and I have no one else than myself to blame.
the penis analogy is really true, since nobody “needs” FF but all of us think it’s pretty fun!
You do not speak for anybody but yourself so “we want” means “I want”. I do not want a 35mm picture size camera thank you. Neither do I want retro. If I did I would buy a film camera. BTW a “FF shooter” is one who shoots pictures using the entire sensor, so that could be FF MFT, FF APSC or FF medium format.
I get bored with the “only FF has a future” bollocks. All formats will develop and improve and in the future (I know what when) tiny sensors will outperform all of today’s cameras.
todays smaller sensors are indeed superior to the older bigger ones. but what you cannot do unless somebody comes up with new ways to bend light (apart from optics) is acconplish shallow DOF-look with a smaller sensor. If you shoot people this is a big deal. The kind of images that you can make with a full frame camera and a simple 35mm f2 lens just can’t be done with a smaller sensor (not to mention 35mm f1.4!). On MFT you’d need something like a 17mm f1 to do the same thing. The olympus 17mm f1.8 (kind of) equals 35mm f3.6 on FF. Of course it depends on your style of shooting, but I think a lot of people will appreciate FF in the future no matter what.
Back in the film days of limited iso nobody longed for shallow dof and bokeh
What was most cherrished and longed for was good depthcof field to keep more of the image in focus.
The camera industry basically brainwashed us into wanting shallow dof as the only wayto remain competitive with smal point and shoot cameras..and now cell phones.
I still want lots of dof to keep my entire subjet in focus an this is where the C format has advantages over ff.
Also..50lbs of camera gear on my back actually feels heavier than 100lb did 40 years ago.
So although I anxioslly await a high enough resolution ff to compensate for the shallower dof I could certainly use an improved A77 until it is ready.
+1
Interesting comment on the brainwashing,
I feel the same,
First it was sensor size, more pixels is better and when they started to max that out it was high iso is a must, then shallow dof, now shutter noise. I wonder what is next.
Meanwhile these new cameras are just only a tiny fraction better in image quality than an A900/850.
I am finally in the market for a new camera now too though, but I may be looking for two this time, an architectural camera (could be A7 to use tse lenses on) and a 36mp or higher for fine art landscapes (the two areas i work in)
We’ll see how these new A mount ff’s look….exciting!
They brain washed the amateur market with this fad which in the future will look so dated. The pro market has not been brain washed.
Barry, for many centuries, much great art has used sharp focus across an entire frame, and much has used dramatic shallow depth of field. Long before there were ANY cameras or camera manufacturers.
No sense in blaming propaganda by camera manufacturers for attempting to make both modes of photography to you with the same camera.I personally use both modes with pleasure, and many other photographers do. They have hugely different impacts.
As I said, it depends and has always depended on what you´re after. Some of them liked it already 50 years ago. Then again, it was harder to achieve before AF technology and modern optics.
“On MFT you’d need something like a 17mm f1 to do the same thing.”
Voigtlander Nokton 17,5mm/0.95 comes quite close 😉
This is one of the very rare cases where MFT actually manages to catch up in terms of DoF with FF, you also lose AF in the process.
Most of the MFT lens offerings don’t appeal at all, especially considering the pricing.
I think one of the reasons that people crave DoF today is that it distinguishes photos taken with a DSLR/ILC from those taken with an iPhone or P&S camera.
Whether that’s good or bad, I don’t know…
Good point
@osc: APS-C sensor cameras have enough bokeh (and I like bokeh for the situations that suit it). You just need the right lens. You talk about a 35mm f/1.4 for full frame. Well, an APS-C camera can take the same lens, and assuming we’re both at minimum focus distance and the object is small enough to fit in the cropped frame, there will be more apparent bokeh with the APS-C sensor camera. You can try it yourself. Take a picture with a full-frame camera with an object that doesn’t take up the whole frame. Then, simply crop your photo and zoom to the same size. There will appear to be more bokeh in the crop because everything will be blown up a bit. Or how about this? Get a 50mm f/1.4 lens for your APS-C camera. A longer focal length will yield more bokeh. You will have to stand farther back, but you’ll get that blurred background. I have a super-zoom camera with a 1/2.3 sensor and an 840mm equivalent zoom (the SX30is)…and I can get tons of bokeh with that (of relatively small objects such as flowers)! (And yes, there are times when you want everything in focus. APS-C is like a jack of all trades.) Basically, full frame is OK if you don’t mind spending more for everything, don’t mind more weight, and don’t mind (in many cases) lacking a pop-up flash that usually come standard with cheaper cameras. In fact, I’d get one if I had a lot of money to spare…although it might not be my main walk-around camera. But not everyone needs such a camera, and most people would be hard-pressed to look at a photo and be able to determine what sensor size captured it.
what you’re saying is “you can use another fov and get nice results too”. well, yes. but that will give me other images. if I want the same or close to the same images I have to change focal length between formats. and dof will suffer. of course nobody “needs” ff. but it’s nice to have especially with WA lenses. gives you freedom of choice when it comes to dof. I was lucky and got my a850 more than a year ago used for 600€. an a77 would have costed me a lot more.
I like that! Thanks. 🙂
roger48’s comment. 😉
Anyone who doesn’t want an A77 replacement is a fool.
Mr. T??
I pitty da fool who don’t want an A77 replacement! 🙂
(OK, so most people here aren’t old enough to know Mr. T)
Sony this is all you’ve got? You suck for a mount fans like myself. I should’ve gone Nikon.
go in peace,, leave us… the end
Yes. that D5300 is certainly a revolutionary piece of hardware. /sarcasm
There has never been a manufacturer that makes all their users simply froth with glee at every new release (the last 4 rebs are essentially the same camera. Who’s taking advantage of their market position, now? And where is Nikon’s REAL D300s replacement??). Sony, at least, has a story for the future that you can see and somewhat understand.
Yeah, I shot from the hip because my frustration with Sony boils over to the point of extreme exasperation but my point soars over everyone’s head. My complaint is a gripe many, many, many, many others have expressed ad nauseam (why I didn’t blabber on like I’m about to do).
Even if you’re right, the Nikon 5300 sucks worse than anything Sony produces – don’t know, not interested – Nikon is dedicated fully to DSLRs. They keep pumping out bodies and lenses. Sony? It is undeniable that they are putting almost the full weight of their development efforts in mirrorless e-mounts. My great frustration with this latest rumor – which I hope like so many of them is baloney – is here we go again with 3 e-mount bodies announced to a single a-mount. This is after Sony already came out with the FF e-mount a7/a7R.
So while Sony absolutely STAGNATES in DSLRs – it can’t be argued – the Canikon duopoly has long since leapfrogged them with very well reviewed bodies, both APS-C and FF. Sony’s response? Pretty much if you own an a-mount system go e-mount body, buy an adapter.
Sure, an a77 replacement is overdue. If I were in the market for another APS-C I’d consider it. However, I’ll stick with my a65 because it looks like all the rumor-mongering Sony’s CEO is going revolutionary releases over evolutionary releases is – surprise, surprise – baloney based upon (ironically) the latest rumors. I keep hoping for Sony to better compete with Canikon in DSLR FFs by replacing the nice try but mediocre a99 with a range of bodies – like the competition – but FF DSLRs obviously is a low priority with Sony, if it’s even on their radar scope.
My prediction based upon rumors and the history of their line-up is Sony will offer a very wide range of choices in e-mount bodies, both APS-C and FF. A-mounts I expect, at most, 2 APS-C bodies and an FF one. And to get that a-mount dribble – other than an a77 replacement – we’ll have to wait until they’re done pumping out a bunch of e-mount ones.
Am I going to switch to Nikon? Nope. I made my choice. I have a dozen lenses which would cost too much to replace. But it doesn’t look like they’ll be getting any money from me for a new body in 2014. The a7R is a nice try that fixes many of my a65 IQ complaints but Sony needs to perfect mirrorless AF and find a workable IBIS. When they do that, I may reluctantly buy into the e-mount system using an adapter to use my extensive a-mount lens collection.
and then you pre-ordered the A79/A88 like the rest of us suckers.
No Larry we don’t. Some of us shoot outdoors with large lenses and enjoy the extra reach of the A77. Some of us prefer our A77, SAL1650, and 24mm (over our Full Frame Zeiss/G-Series Solutions) when shooting in close proximity to our subjects or when we want to travel-lite, because we all use our kit (equipment) differently.
Another SLT camera? That’s really sad. Ok, it’s time for me to leave, my old friend Sony!
And the reason? When they leave out the SLT Mirror – what is different? You still have a electronic viewfinder but with worse AF. Is that what you want????
I don’t think he owns one. Most SLT owners really like them. Sure they have limitations, but what piece of equipment doesn’t? You just adapt, and overcome. The new mirror, and sensor will likely increase high ISO performance, and IQ substantially. I’m going to pre-order it.
+1. Except for pre order. 😀
Exactly. I have two SLT cameras (A77 & A99), and I see absolutely no limitations due to the translucent mirror. People like to groan about it based solely on reading specs (“this DxO article said I lose a 1/3-stop of light, and that’s horrible!”), but have probably never actually used one. Guess which camera does better in low light, my old A900 or my A99 with the translucent mirror? And in side-by-side tests, the Canon 5d3 only performed marginally better at high ISO (than the A99), so marginal that you probably wouldn’t even notice it in real-world practice. There are other things from Sony to groan about, but I don’t think the SLT is really one of them.
Bye bye then.
I dont know why people are saying this. If you just want to use wid angel lenses. Then the E-Mount system is ok. But if you want to use tele lenses. Then there is no way outside the SLT
“Then there is no way outside the SLT”
I am pretty sure that OVF’s do an excellent job with probably 99.9% of the worlds long tele-shooters using OVF cameras.Now don’t get me wrong even as a long term FF user who enjoys an OVF,I very much appreciate the advantages an EVF brings.However if long tele use is important to your photography I would not even consider an SLT model.
Any light loss with tele shooting is a major downside where shutter speed is often important { nature shooting, sports ,BIF etc}, though it allows for very good S-AF the C-AF and tracking currently lags behind the standard DSLR types from Canon/Nikon though this could be a weakness in Sony AF rather than a consequence of the SLT tech I am not familiar enough with SLT cameras to comment on this.
Though as I say I am a fan of EVF , I still feel that for fast moving dynamic subjects the EVF refresh rate etc . I am basing this on my E-M1 EVF which I believe is the same model as in the A7/R
The SLT tech is pretty much OK, especially the EVF in the A77 is really great. I was recently shooting with both my A700 and A77 and I can tell you that the A77 was much easier to shoot with than the A700. I do not experience any lag in my EVF nor have I had any other issues with it. For me the future is EVF only. The issue with the light loss through the SLT mirror is far less of an issue than the noise/heat induced by the constant reading of the sensor for the EVF.
Where I do agree is that Sony has signifficantly worse AF than Nikon or Canon counterparts. Predictive AF is virtually non existant, despite the fact that the AF sensor has constant view of the subject. Way too often its just hit and miss, especially with subjects which are moving towards you.
My problem with the EVF is with shooting BIF’s. In broad daylight the EVF becomes hard on the eyes to look at throught the viewfinder. Not sure why, but it’s an issue I don’t have with the A900. Also, the buffer clearing faster. I love this camera, but you hit a shot and miss two in this style of shooting. I’m getting more and more into this type of photography so maybe my dissapointment might grow. I’m hoping I don’t end up not liking the EVF for this reason all together. That will depend on the next round of EVF advancements.
I am afraid you are off the mark here on the EVF. There are not the same. Sony EVF is the OLED evf , same as A99 and NEX 7.
OMD EM-1 evf is the same as the VF4 , which I believe is designed by Epson.
“”I am afraid you are off the mark here on the EVF. There are not the same. Sony EVF is the OLED evf , same as A99 and NEX 7. “”
Ah sorry about that I am sure I read somewhere hat they were the same.
Bye bye!
you too go in peace and leave us alone, good bye!
why all the hate for slt cameras
the only reason i like the alpha series over canon and nikkon that i can use the lcd screen to focus rather than the viewfinder in normal light conditions
my only problem with my a65 is low light , cant go higher than iso 800 for good quality pics over iso 1600 and just look too noise
my next upgrade will be to a full fram camera the problem is i am not confident of buying new alpha glass i really want some thing preform like nikon d800e which is 2800$ in local stor
so ya i like A7r but not sure if i go mirrorless , i want imige stiblization and good AF sony
Agreed, DSLT cameras like A57,65,77 were great and SOny should have just worked on improving them. I don’t know why people were so against SLT. Any camera has to make use of available light and if it is imperfect, you will use a flash.
right! flip out screen and dpaf are underrated features.
3 E-mount and only 1 A-Mount?
Come on, Sony. Clearly mirorrless toys are bringing in funds right now, but you can’t forget about real cameras either.
Both A and E mount will have a new high end C camera.
Since A mount is intended more for pros/ serious hobbyists there is less market for entry level A mount.
I would like to see a major upgrade over the A77 (36mp) but expect. Only a few minor improvements to yhe sensot therefore will be surprised if I get what I want.
Although Sony wants everyone to buy into ff C sales far exceed ff sales.
36mp on a cropped sensor? NO THANKS! the noise is already quite bad as it is
Exmor r instead of exmor would allow much higher res without increased noise or decreased iso.
WTF!? _ No Firmware update for A77 since October 2012! Tsk Tsk Sony. Do they think I’ll buy a new A77 when mine is just fine? Would like a new FF but an updated A99 aint gonna do it for me. Looks like I’m waiting ’till 2015.
Do you need a new camera every year to take good photos? The A77 is a good camera, save up for a few years until there’s something substantially better/different to spend your money on!
That’s right.
I spoke to a Sony rep at a trade show – actually he was the Sony USA Marketing Director. He was baffled why I was even asking, as Sony believes ‘the camera is operating as designed and envisioned’ and there was nothing wrong with it and no reason to update firmware. He also claimed that he reviews a summary on all Sony complaints and suggestions for the Alpha line each month, and admitted that there were people asking for a firmware update but the percentage was ‘negligible’ and it indicated that the ‘vast majority of users are very happy with the product in it’s current iteration’. He said they have NO plans, zero, nadda, ziltch, to update any firmware for existing models.
So stop asking about a firmware update! It is not going to happen!
It’s a pity that you couldn’t firect him to Dyxum and show him the number of flash overexposure complaints.
Another one is that My A77+VG still gives errors about incompatible batteries and they ARE Sony batteries.
In five minutes any of us here could find numerous genuine faults with the A77 just by browsing a forum!
I did, he said that he frequents Dyxum and Dpreview, and that he’s never seen anything that suggested there were widespread problems. That it’s common for a handful of users to experience issues, but they always try to reach out to them and find a solution. Yeah right. At this point, I was getting a little irritated with the man. He asked if I ever had a problem with my gear, to which, over the course of 45 minutes or so, I shared the following with him (mostly terrible service from Laredo):
My A77 went to Laredo for warranty repair THREE times within 3 months. First, sound issue with the CG50 mic. Replaced main board. Then got it back, within 20 days the grip was loose. Back it went. Then they damaged it and wanted me to pay for it. I fought for the principal of the thing, and finally ended up talking to the Sony Customer Care team at their USA headquarters. They investigated, found out that Laredo DID damage it, and had it repaired and returned. When I got it back, the back LCD screen didnt work. I called Customer Care again and they had me send it back, again. It’s now working fine (so far) and looks and functions like new. But holy cow, what a terrible mess.
My A99 shutter died within 7 months of use (around 55,000 clicks). Went back to Laredo for repair under warranty. Came back severely backfocusing (to the point I could barely correct with microadjust). Went back to them to be repaired – and they sent me a brand new camera for some reason.
The old camera hit exposure perfectly with my flash units (one METZ, one F58, one F60M). Aside from the new camera randomly rebooting during a shoot, The brand new camera was so inconsistent with flash exposure (even if the scene didnt change!) that I just sold it for cheap on Ebay, and bought an old A900.
I also told him about the widespread complaints about A77/A99 interface lag time, soft very subpar video on the A99, poor smeary Jpg engine on the A77, lack of buffer size, overheating issues of the F60M (which is really bad, BTW), lack of tethering support for the A77, and a few other things I cant think of. His response?
He was just blown away as if these were the first times he’d ever heard of the issues and throughout the conversation he became somewhat skeptical of me and started treating me like I either didnt know what I was doing, or I was making things up. At one point he suggested I check the Sony forums for help ‘operating my camera’. I offered to pull up Dyxum on my tablet which I had with me, and SHOW him the long threads, but he suddenly didnt have time for me anymore…
Bottom line? Sony doesnt give a hoot about any of us. They just wanna make shinny things that people buy and make they money.
@NickBrusco
Thanks for the response. I think he was just blatantly lying in the first place and is only too well aware of the issues. 😉
Agreed. So sad. I felt like such a sucker when I walked away from the Sony area. But with all the Sony reps watching, I made a beeline for Nikon and started checking out the D7100 and D800E…didnt seem like it bothered them a bit.
It didn’t bother them because they are so used to disillusioned Sony users doing it. 😀
Wow that rep was a total a$$.
Of course he’s not going to tell anything about upcoming products including firmware upgrades cause he can loose his job, and in this economy he wouldn’t like get another in the consumer electronics industry. The Sony rep in my area also totes the party line too, but he accidentally blurts stuff out once in a while. Like the new 35mm lens.
If you want to pull information out of these guys send them an email via customers support. Ask a question like” when can you place a pre-order for the new APS-C camera”, and they’ll give you the launch date nine times out of ten. Do it sparingly cause they do catch on.
What about A-Mount FF Cameras? Or new E-Mount FF SLR Models?
@Admin
Will there be any FF bodies or lenses available until the end of february?
Thanks for your work and response.
Nobody
What about FF cameras?
Between now and Photokina ? thats in September !!! thats a long time from now !!and the true relaese date maybe even furder away ? I hope that this is not for the A77 successor, if so, thats way to long to wait.
Admin, I know this is APS-C-rumor but any hints of new FF lenses?
400mm f/4.0?
Other prime lenses?
24-105mm f/4.0?
From what I heard from a Sony source, the 400/4 was NEVER on the table for development. Just a rumor…
There is a 35mm Zeiss G-Series lens supposed launch with one of the cameras. That’s all I know I the Sony rep blurted it out accidentally when I was ordering the 70200G2.
I meant to say Zeiss or G-Series. There is normally a new Zeiss or G-Series launched with every semi-pro or better A-Mount.
f1.4 or f2? I hope for f2!
Great news – do you have any more info on possible specs of the e-mount cameras and their projected price point? Cheers.
3mirrorless will be successor or 3, 5 and 7 series.
While a mount will be a77 replacement. Nothing much to look forward for SAR reader.
The new a-mount… First the rumors were 2013… Then “very early 2014″… Then “spring”… Now “by September”
I suppose that it’s still possible we see it by early Spring. The a77 is certainly currently at clearance pricing.
But it’s starting to feel like the a-mount is slowly being killed by Sony.
I am starting to believe no one is steering the ship. They just throw darts at a board with words like “A-mount”, “E-mount”, “EVF”, “OVF”, “Retro”, “SLT”, “lenscamera” and see what sticks.
Then they put it all together, make it look cool, and send it to the stores priced at 4X cost.
Looking at previous SAR posts, its looking like the mirrorless sales have peaked, and I suspect this is because the typical mirrorless user has less need to update their camera, and there is thus a small replacement market in that sector.
Traditional cameras have a much more consistent replacement market, but *only if they are significantly better than the previous verison*, something I thought Sony had taken on board by cancelling previous plans for incremental a77/a99 replacements (new CEO statements last year)…. but the release rumours so far point to incremental changes. What is the new killer feature in the replacements, because I still can’t see it!
You are right, there seems to be no major technical wonders what so ever so far aheat, again marketing strategy, promis big but give little ?
Do you think that in a dwindling camera sales market these large multinationals will remain idle as usual and wait for things to dry whilst only pushing marketing hype ? The market dictates who survives and at this time I think that Sony will push further innovations in the vein of the NEX-6, A7 and A7r for both E and A mounts. Their survival in this segment depends on it. I expect to be surprised.
The rumors on this a77 replacement indicate a few small improvement….10% better light usage and a new jpg engine..
This alone will not generate huge sales.
A 36mp C size will generate a lot more interest and sales.
I would not upgrade my A77 just for the minor improvements already mentioned but would for 36mp and a good price.
I think a good price is pretty much a certainty because cameras cannot sell for too much with the new sensor technology just around the corner.
If they include better video quality and audio (meters, at the very least.) I’ll be picking one up, most likely.
“Looking at previous SAR posts, its looking like the mirrorless sales have peaked” –
Looking at the CIPA global sales statistics – mirrorless sales have went down significantly this year.
And I thrust CIPA much more than SAR pro-mirrorless bias.
That is pretty much what “sales have peaked” means. Btw, CIPA provides shipment numbers, not sales.
Don’t ask too much from Admin? He is not Harry Potter.
I hope not – Harry potter doesn’t know dick about cameras…
He’d do well at Sony then!
Last autumn: 2014 will be the year of the A-Mount
Yesterday: At least 2 A-Mount-cameras this year
Today: 1 A-Mount-camera till September
Tomorrow: A-Mount is dead. RIP!!
Thats one A mount C camera..AND…one high end A mount FF probably comparable to the a7R
Why dont you wait Christmas 2014 ? I feel that the A7 and A7r are a strong signal from Sony wrt innovations as well as their agressivity to capture market share. They can only do that with sales so I’d believe that they’ll try to satisfy demands.
Agressivity?
@Christopher – Agressivity? Sure, why not. It’s within the ‘normalcy’ of American English. 😉
By the way, I just looked at your site – I was particularly impressed with some of your architectural/interior shots and some of your fashion images.
Well, I’ll bite. I guess it is pretty rare (vs. aggression or aggressiveness) but not incorrect! Glad you liked my photos, thanks.
Please excuse my flawed English. I am French trying myself at some English writing… I meant aggressive stance with the object to capture more market share but I imagine you got that.
Actually, aggressivity (with two “G”s) is a real word. (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/aggressivity) So PJP is correct. Maybe some native English speakers need to improve their own English before questioning others (who are nearly perfectly bilingual). I realize that “aggressiveness” is more common, but still, you should consult a dictionary before making really good second-language speakers feel stupid for no reason.
Actually, aggressivity (with two “G”s) is a real word. So PJP is correct. Maybe some native English speakers need to improve their own English before questioning others (who are nearly perfectly bilingual). I realize that “aggressiveness” is more common, but still, you should consult a dictionary before making really good second-language speakers feel stupid for no reason.
I’m very interested in the A77 successor.
A new E-mount APS-C is good news. I love the A77 (despite Sony’s stupid idiot firmware).
shamb makes very good points… SLR buyers/users are far better trained by the camera companies to be dissatisfied with their cameras, and needing the next meaningless upgrade for them to be dissatisfied with.
Mirrorless users are less obedient.
APS-C future with Canon or Nikon ? That’s the year2014 question for me.
There exists an adapter to mount Sony lenses onto Nikon body, is there any solution for Canon body ? 70D or D7100 or even D5300 ? 6D or D610 ? What do you say ? Whom has best OVF an best AF tracking ?
That’s great news. The A77 has been an excellent camera and any improvements will be welcomed by A77 users. Hopefully the price will be reasonable.
Assuming that it is indeed an A77 successor, would it make more sense for an upgrade from my A57 to the existing A77, which I hope would come down slightly price-wise? I can do with a built-in GPS, weather sealing and a 24MP sensor.
Or is the current A77 firmware so bad that it probably isn’t worth the upgrade?
The firmware’s absolutely fine for me – nice and snappy with most of the flash issues fixed. The first production firmware was a nightmare, but that’s another story.
The A77 is an excellent camera. It’s on sale at Henry’s for $799.99 CDN which is a lot of camera for the price. I’m guessing the replacement is going to cost initially $1299.99.
It would make sense to upgrade. The weather sealing is decent especially when paired with the 1650, 70200g2, or 50mm Zeiss which are all sealed lenses. The firmware v1.07 is great, and it improved performance. There might be one last firmware upgrade when the new batch of lenses arrives in the spring.
I don’t do JPEGs from camera so mushy JPEGs isn’t a big deal. Have you personally used the camera? Is the high ISO performance any worse than A57/A65/A58? If not, then I might as well wait for the successor to be announced and then take advantage of a price drop on A77 (if any). If not, there’s also this deal: http://www.dealsrunner.com/deals/sony-slta77vm-a77-18-135mm-zoom-lens-bundle-deal-accessories-and-visa-gift-card
I own the own the A77. I have used both the A65, and A57. The A65, and A77 performance is identical, but the A65 isn’t weather-sealed and it’s build is not very robust. The A77 outperforms the A57 in poor lighting conditions (High ISO), but only marginally in real world conditions. I’m considering buying a second A77 to upgrade my wife’s A350 while the price is $799.99.
A77 is an excellent camera, and the current firmware (1.07) is great. The standard A77 kit lens is fantastic, and it beats any other APS-C and kit lens combo available.
Issues are:
– high ISO. About the same as earlier APS-C cameras, but if you pixel peep at per pixel size, you will see more noise. That occurs because the pixels are smaller though. However, if there is too much noise in an A77 shot, the same shot with any similar APS-C (such as the 7D) will not be a keeper either, there’s not as much in it if you do a hands-on rather than listen to the internet arguments over the issue. I currently shoot RAW and use DX0 9 prime for my NR (and have the wonderful Minolta 50mm f1.4), and with those, noise is no longer an issue in any case. You also get ISO50 on the A77… if you are in conditions that can make use of it, your shots beat any other APS-C for noise.
– JPEG quality. To much NR/softness for most people’s liking. If you shoot RAW, then its a non issue.
– Soft video caused (intentionally) by the camera blurring the video to avoid artifacts caused by lack of pixel binning. Also occurs in similar CaNikons, so not as much of an issue as the web seems to imply. However, if video is your thing, the A77 has a lot to offer… see my post here http://howgreenisyourgarden.wordpress.com/2013/11/16/sony-alpha-video-part-2-avchd/ and look at the section ‘Advantages of the a77 over the GH2/LX7, and every other DSLR’).
I own an A77, A500, A200, and Pany GH2 and LX7. I tried Canon before sticking with the A77, don’t know about Nikon as I’ve never used one. If I want sharper video than the A77 can provide, then I use my GH2 with Alpha lenses, otherwise its A77 with LX7 as my ‘DSLR replacement’ (it does better video than the RX100 IMO).
Thanks for the link. Very helpful to a video noob
HAPPY NEW YEAR, ANDREA!!
Highend APS-C E-Mount sounds most interesting to me.
What about A-Mount FF? Skipped? Or did I miss something?
Regards
Dirk
I’m leaning towards the a77 replacement too, provided iso 800+ isn’t any worse than it currently is. I’d be all over an entry level ff but I wouldn’t pay the a99 launch price (as price gets silly when I factor in upgrading my 70/2.8 and 16-50). Andrea – any if there’s 1 on the cards? I probably set yet for an a99 with a hefty discount, to be honest…
I bet you’ll be able to pick up an A99 for second hand for $1000.00 a year from now. A lot of people are going to upgrade their A99s, and flood the second hand market. I bought my A850 from someone last year who was upgrading for $1000.00.
My prediction is it goes for 1500 by June on the used market. A99 prices, if cheap entry full frame under 2k available, will take a beating the world has never seen before.
I’m really waiting for an APS-C E-mount camera in the same (or similar) body to the A7/A7r. Hopefully that will come, as that would really be perfect for me. Until then I’ll very happily keep using my a77, which while it is bigger than I’d like, does everything I need it to do very well.
yep one will be the A5000 and one will be the A6x-7x 65 and 77 replacement and since sony made the 58 more liek a A37 and less liek the A57 my $ is on the cheapened A77 (im ok with that since thts what i want )
if the A5000 is speced ok tho i might look at it. im just not sure if mirrorless AF is ready yet
Aw come on, wasnt there a FF A mount coming as well?
I pray that this be a rumor and nothing more, or else I’m stuck with the AA filter, plastic and no upgrade in resolution or bad compatibility, slow read/write and the arguably most noisy shutter on a FF digital camera.
Quite a dilemma.
…Wait, the admin mentioned ” four Sony APS-C camera will be released between now and Photokina”…so no mention on FF cameras at all!
At least this is better than to say “only 4 APS-Cs up next, no FFs anytime soon”.
between now and September? really? i can guess this without “A known source”. come on! 😉
no offense ! i just want my nex 7 successor with tethering NOW ! 🙂
Now I am a total n00b compared to some heavyweights on these forums, so I do not profess to know much about anything. Which is why I have a basic question – given what the A77 has today, why would an upgrade with better high ISO performance and a couple of decent new lenses be a worse thing compared to, say, drastically new sensor tech or a 54MP FF sensor or whatever it is that people want changed with SLT? I mostly shoot candids, macros and landscapes and, for the latter, I don’t seem to require too much help from the AF points. Candids are always in manual, so 19 versus 190 versus a bazillion straight or cross type sensor points don’t seem to be a major attraction for me at least.
I don’t understand all the tech as well as some of you do, but I do know that low light performance is probably the only area where canikon seem to have an upper hand. If there are questions around the longevity of a particular mount or of Sony’s camera business altogether, how hard can it be to improve low light performance and give people a reason to choose Sony?
For manual focus candids the a7 / a7r series is pretty great. It is much more discreet, good low-light performance and has MF magnification (plus focus peaking).
As for your question – the new sensor tech is expected sometime from 2015 to 2016. Some users of the a77 have been hoping for firmware improvements to their camera but that’s not going to happen so a successor is the only short-term solution. Given that the a77 still has the minolta hot shoe and Sony is only making multiport accessories at this point it really does need to put out an update anyway. It is unfair to users for Sony to be selling this with a defunct hot shoe.
While antagonizing any segment of the user population isn’t a good thing, was the A77 such a good camera that there is a substantial user base that is suffering because of the lack of update? I seem to recall right around when the camera was released that DPReview dinged it pretty bad for its high ISO performance as well as JPEGs from the camera. That’s why I decided to go for the A57 and wait until an upgrade came out – given that it’s been about 2 years since I’ve owned the camera, I think I can justify the upgrade if it comes along.
Why do you consider it to be antagonization by Sony if they release a new model? It was announced August of 2011 so it will be due for a follow-up this year.
I wonder if the 100 to 200 hardcore SAR readers on here would be willing to pool a hundred bucks on kickstarter to fund and pay a few programmers / developers to write an alternative firmware (magic lantern style) and a way to install it.
Another plastic lens mount APS-C Alpha with lower LCD resolution and no flash system.
Excellent Smithers. Release the hounds (dogs).
i’m sorry… it’s a sony!
Does this mean no 36+mp a99 (style) until AFTER September?
any news about the FE lens roadmap? when can we have a FE wide angle zoom?!??? I can’t use the A7 like this. waiting for it so I can buy it.
The last lens roadmap I saw was that the FE wide angle zoom would be this summer. I sure hope so, because that is the one lens that I’m waiting for also.
Okay, a 36 megapixel cheap $500 nex 3 successor will do, I don’t ask for much! : )
Hey, the 3’s don’t even shoot RAW, to me that means that they’re useless, don’t know about you though…
I have seen NEX 3, C3, F3, 3N and A3000 RAW files. I guess those were all fake.
This is surprising, I saw the specs on a authorized dealer’s site and it said that the 3N doesn’t shoot RAW, I checked immediately with sales reps and the answer was that the 3N didn’t shoot RAW.
I just checked on sony.jp and it said that 3N did…why would they make a mistake on the specs and lie about it? Or did the sales guy really lack basic knowledge of his product?
Anyway, I was only looking for second-hand model for somebody else so recommended 5N to him at once, old like-new 5Ns are much cheaper than like-new 3Ns, worth it if you ask me.
They all shoot RAW, including the 3N, see for example the Imaging Resource review which also provides RAW samples. Only the A3000 is limited to Jpeg or RAW+jpeg (meaning you always get the jpeg along…) for reasons unknown to me.
You could always download the manuals for the cameras before buying them. Additionally, specs published in sites such as dpreview actually say that the NEX-3N (and 3 models before the 3N) support JPEG+RAW. It is unfortunate that you were given incorrect information.
Well, what will these three E-Mount-APS-C be? Of course, the NEX-7 successor, which is overdue and probably might get named α700 or α7000, since the name NEX is given up, so the other two cameras should be simply two out of α300, α500, α600, α5000 or α6000. That’s not very spectacular, unfortunately, since I’d prefer to get this α5 here: http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/the-super-compact-e-mount-full-frame-camera-patent/
I’m thinking that only one of the 5 or 6 would be updated, and then the 3.
Yes, most likely. But since the NEX-6 is simply a NEX-5R in a different body with EVF there’s also a chance the NEX-6 might be given up and replaced by the NEX-7 successor. So beside this NEX-7 successor there’s a risk the current cameras might only get renamed like this α5000 shown here: http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/next-ilce-5000-registration-not-sure-if-its-the-nex-5r
Not sure whether I understand Admin correctly, this post is about all the APS-C cameras (both E & A Mount) to be released from now to Photokina, it is not talking about FF at all. FF will be in other post I guess.
I’ve had my A77 for about two years at this point. Use it very often and sometimes every day- zero issues. I think the A77 is such a bargain right now new for most photographers. I just hope the redesign can keep the buzz I think the A77 had going for it.
You are either very lucky or don’t use the A77 in the same way I do. 😀
Bounced flash exposure with the F58 is all over the place. This is a very well documented problem.
I use a Nissin flash.
It is the body not the flash.
It works great with the HVL-F42AM. Isn’t the HVL-F58AM is really meant for the A850/900?
No
I have two ’58s and a ’43. The 43 is the controller (usually on the camera hotshoe, but off to the side with a lead) and the 58s are Sony optical wireless or running electrical wireless (with Phottix Strato 2’s) and fitted with Flashbender modifiers (so they are both effectively bounced all the time). Any issues disappeared on the A77 1.07 update. Even when the exposure is wrong its now consistently wrong, so its easy to compensate it in my experience.
Bounced flash is still over the place for many people. The last update improved DIRECT flash not bounced.
I might not need it, but I want cheap FF A-mount. All my lenses is FF.
Any serious suprise upgrades I don’t think will be rumored until right before release. I don’t see Sony giving away anything unexpected these cameras might ofer to it’s competitors before it hits market. What we are hearing is mostly assumed upgrades we could have figured out ourselves. Wait patiently, I think they’ll be more suprises.
Where are the next E mount flagship specs ?? The camera is supposed to be announced within weeks and nothing has filtered yet ??
It seems as if the Japanese camera makers are helping each other stay alive, allowing each maker to have a niche and not produce one killer product that will dominate. Obviously it makes us anticipate and buy new cameras, and in the end we’ll never be totally satisfied with the latest, greatest camera release. They’re quite clever, like drug dealers stringing along the photo enthusiasts’ addiction
+1
A C size crop camera with a long telephoto lens will give superior results to use of a teleconverter and a ff camera.
Teleconverers cannot inprove the quality of the native lens and always degrade tje image to varying degrees.
This is a very big reason why a higher resolution C camera in A mount would be very desirable.
I am specifically looking at the specs of the new Tamron 150-600.
The mtf charts show this lens to be extremely sharp at 600mm and in the center of the image. The image portion on the edges of th ff is less sharp.
This lens seems extremely well suited for a high resolution C size camera…as does the Tamron 60mm f2 macro.
Such a camera would be worthwile even if it were only used for lenses like those as many people such as myself carry more than one camera.
There are of course many other lenses that would be better suited for ff cameras, but carrying more than one camera allows the best of both worlds.
It would not surprise me if Sony releases a replacement for the A77 that had fewer dedicated buttons and a plastic chassis.
Who here actually uses the “?” button on their A77? They remove the useful “C” button from the A700 and put a useless “?” button on the A77, Sony think their flagship APS-C users are dumb and need a dedicated help button.
What they should have done is given us MORE “C” buttons, not removed it! Instead they allow us to customise some buttons on the A77, but they are the useful buttons so you can’t!
Maybe someone else above has already said it, but:
Predictions:
The two “entry-level” E-mount units will be something like (a) an A5000 and (b) an A3; the first being a higher spec’ed mirrorless in a DSLR/Bridge-body like the A3000, but with improved specs – namely a better LCD and better viewfinder; and the latter being an entry-level compact mirrorless, i.e., a successor to the NEX-3N.
The third E-mount will be the long-awaited NEX-7 successor, which I expect will also replace the NEX-6, and essentially have most of the features of an A7 but with a 24MP APS-C sensor instead… an A6 anybody?
A NEX-6 in a A3000 form factor, with the improved EVF and articulating high res LCD would probably be released. According to studies, a LOT of people like bulky SLRs. It seems that people equate weight with quality (or something akin to that).
Question
Why have Sony changed and now choose to go with mirrors again?
In this question hides also what else can they change from what is said?
“Any customer can have a car painted any colour that he wants so long as it is black.”
Henry Ford, 1920.
“Any customer can have a SLT full frame that he wants, long as it is the A99.”
Sony, 2014
I want my new cameras and lenses painted GREEN …..I like green and its a good color for long lenses and macro lenses
“Any customer can have a car painted any colour that he wants so long as it is black.”
Henry Ford, 1920.
“Any customer can have a camera, so long it is a huge DSLR.”
The industry, 2000-2008.
Is that huge AND green?… ({:<{))
“‘Any customer can have a car painted any colour that he wants so long as it is black.’
Henry Ford, 1920.
‘Any customer can have a SLT full frame that he wants, long as it is the A99.”
Sony, 2014′”
As long as stocks of the (rumored) out of production a99 last.
Difference being Henry Ford made a fortune selling many low-cost cars and kept the costs down by trimming features. Sony is losing money in digital cameras and isn’t setting the world on fire with a99 sales nor is it particularly cheap.
To me its a clear indication sony wants to pull out a-mount from the entry range and keep the higher end cameras like a77 and a99 in production. The entry level market will be e-mount and then a-mount aps-c on the top, followed by e-mount ff and a-mount ff on the top.
Maybe later they will put another a-mount in between depending on the mood of the market.
The A77 replacement will be the last time Sony put an APS-C sensor into a native A-mount body.
Whatever A77 replacement comes this year:
It will be hideously expensive.
It will not be advertised.
It will not be tested by PHOTOGRAPHERS.
It will be dumbed down with less buttons and/or have useful features removed.
It will have more scene modes because the jpeg engine is, er, fantastic.
It will trip up on some basic but significant feature and get average reviews.
It will receive poor high ISO scores.
It will of course fail to sell in significant numbers.
What bugs me about Sony is that they have the resources and technical expertise to dominate stills and video. They just don’t listen and get the basics wrong EVERY time, it’s like they concentrate on the whizzy stuff and forget the very basic stuff that turns a mediocre camera into a great camera.
So you will test it?