Something ia about to change at Sony!
The last six months I got a huge amount of rumors and hints about cameras. The NEX-FF, NEX-7 successor, A-mount mirrorless, A79 specs, Firmware update info. A lot of info and single pieces of information I often didn’t know how to order. I had questions like…what’s coming first? What tech will be used by what camera? It’s an incredibly hard job to get rumors and it’s even harder when Sony keeps changing roadmap and hiding things.
But the latest 24 hours were exciting(!!!) on the rumor work front. I got an 80% perfectly exactly clue about what’s going to happen the next 6 months. And I even got “evidence”…or better “pictures” that allowed me a breakthrough on the rumor front. Some questions are still left but I will sort them out in time. I will promise you an STORM of rumors on SonyAlphaRumors right after the QX camera announcement on Tuesday. The next 3-4 days I will work with all my sources to clear out all the questions that are left. Here are some hints about what’s coming. All SR5 guys!
1) There will me many new APS-C E-mount cameras and lenses in September. One of these cameras has a unique feature, and that camera will make you happy (if the price isn’t too high). And also Canon and Nikon owners will be motivated to switch and they can perfectly use all their lenses on it! Question left to answer: pricing and some specs. Lens availability (don’t know if lenses will be available yet or if these is just a roadmap announcement).
2) The NEX-FF is confirmed(!). It is a pure NEX shape with more ergonomic grip. It is probably the most close guarded secret right now as so much development has gone into it. A source told me that it is some different from what you might expect. The project was near cancel several time and revived! Question left to answer: Announcement and specs (end 2013 or very early 2014?).
3) A-mount future: It’s moving more towards the PRO market and mirrorless tech. And Early 2014 is the most likely date to see the new generation APS-C and FF A-mount cameras. Questions left: Specs and final announcement date. New lenses coming too (at leats four within the next six months).
4) Firmware updates and NEX-7 successor: The NEX-7 successor suffered from delays because the NEX team priority shifted towards the cameras that I described on point 1. This is also the same reason why major firmware upgrade for the A77, NEX-7 and A99 and so on have been delayed (this week firmware update was just a small update). Sony engineers worked hard for the ASP-C A-mount cameras and NEX-FF. I have been told that its very likely the after the announcement storm in September they will finalize the firmware update work. Questions left: NEX-7 successor specs and release date.
5) You remember the mistake made by one of my sources saying the A3000 has in Body IS and another source saying it has a higher resolution EVF? They read wrong data in the Sony menu-manual. Even that was actually not a mistake…these are the data from another camera that Sony put by mistake on menu 😉
If sources are reading this and can help me to get some answer contact me anonymously by using the contact form you see on the very right of your browser. You can also contact me directly at sonyalpharumors@gmail.com.
I will post pictures soon!!!
And that time I can prove what I am writing here. I got two pics confirming that the info I am sharing to you is correct. Sony did change the roadmap more than I thought and there are more surprises than expected. And suddenly everything makes a lot of sense (all the NEX-7 successor confusion, the firmware delay, the NEX-FF rumors, the A–mount mirrorless…. I really had one of the best days ever on SAR 🙂
I will share these pics with sources to discuss the details. Give me 3-4 days only to sort out some of the questions left. I will definitely post what I got after the QX camera announcement on Tuesday. And what you will see…I bet there will be more than 1,000 comments 🙂 Tomorrow I will give you a hint about one of the cameras that not only Sony but also Canon, Nikon and Pentax lens owners will be veeery happy to own (and still use their lenses!).
Stay tuned on SAR. It’s going to be a hell of a time!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Subscribe the RSS feed (Click here) and Twitter (Click here) stream and the Facebook fan page (Click here) in order to not miss that news!
Greetings,
Andrea
—
Reminder (SR = Sonyrumor):
SR1=probably fake rumor
SR2=rumor from unknown sources
SR3=50% chance it is correct
SR4=rumor from known sources
SR5=almost certainly correct!
263 Responses
Andrea, you really know how to keep you audience interested. Really excited what you will tell us in the near future.
And this time it’s great that I can soon share pictures. So that excitement gets cementified 🙂
P.S.: Correction…some “AWESOME” pics 🙂
Cool man. Thanks for the hard work.
Andrea –
To avoid having 1000 comments on one page, can you please break up these stories into separate news items when they come ?
Looking forward to next week. Have fun.
+1 too much opportunity for de-centering
+1
Wow a sony camera that can mount canikon lenses?? That’s about as good as it gets… Awesome wide angle + tilt shift!
you need an adapter. But there is one amazing feature. You will see it soon!
AF by moving the sensor
Isn’t there is a problem with “AF by moving the sensor”? Some lenses have elements which move for correcting focusing at close range (maybe for other focal ranges too), if you are focusing by moving the sensor these don’t move, so won’t function properly.
Numbers 1 and 2 are the same thing, it will be kitted with adapters for Nikon and Canon. It will come in around a month
5 axis IBIS ?
Speed-booster tech built right in?
Now THAT would be a cool feature.
why not FF?
FF is better at high iso for lower noise
FF has the DoF that you’d get from using a speed booster
I wouldn’t be so sure if any of the serious Canon, Nikon or Pentax users would really want to use their lenses through the ADAPTORS.
Very cool news, Andrea.
Awesome! Thanks for all the hard work. 🙂
Thank you guys! I like it when things work out fine. It’ was a terrible job the last 6 months. Even trusted soruces got confused by all these changes and misleading info (send out by Sony). Now…finally now I know. And finally I can show some pics so that I cna shut down all critics I got lately 🙂
Just post the pictures and let us in! This is a rumor site so just give us what you got, NOW! 🙂
Oh shit, I’m sooooo excited 🙂
Hope I can sell my D800E an get a small 30 MP FF-Nex with body stabilisation.
Sell it now, keep the lenses 😉
NEX camera with unique feature … 4K filming? … A/E hybrid mount? … makes a cup of coffee as well? … fills out my tax forms? … I’m excited!
The only thing it can’t do is making a Capuccino while shooting pics. I know it’s big let down 🙁
NO CAPUCCINO, NO BUY!!!! 😀
As long as it makes small espresso shots we can add a Nespresso milk steamer through the accessory mount
I have to propose this to Sony engeneers…
That should be Nexpresso of course.
LOL 🙂
I can’t wait. I can’t think of what would be happening if canikon users can use their lenses unless Sony has some new adapters coming.
About the adapters I have no info. About the special feature yes. Wait until I got a clear explanation of how this technique works. Amazing what Sony does. THey really try to do a lot of new things. Obviously we have to see if these new stuff really works fine. The devil is in the detail as usual.
Sensor shift AF? 😀
Feddo Freddo Freddo!!!!!!! 🙂
OMG OMG OMG!!!!!!!!!
Really?! <3 These news are so exciting!
Would Sensorshift-AF also give autofocus to legacy lenses? 😉
The idea of a sensorshift AF is old and simple, but getting it work reliable is the big thing.
The 5-axis IBIS of Olympus is great, but not without flaws. Sometimes a moving sensor causes blurred images under otherwise fine circumstances. A sensor with IBIS and sensorshift could be a highly error-prone thing.
That would be a killer feature.
That would tie into the “hybrid mount” rumor last year
wow,Andrea!!you are the best!!! thanks for all the hard work!
I think your site is going to go into melt-down today.
Not today. But when I post the picture yes. Server will crash. I am going to work on that before I post the image.
Make sure you post to FB too, to handle the excess traffic.
Exciting times Andrea. Eagerly waiting for the news.
I still wait to get some NEX-FF info. It’s really a super secret. I hope it comes in 2013. Otherwise it will coem in early 2014. Anyway, I would love to buy it within 2013 🙂
Same here! Remember you said something a while back that it may be announced in Q3 and released within this year. I was thinking, YES, in time for my vacation!!!
regarding your first point, as a canon (and minolta) owner I’d say that whatever they’re up to, it needs to be extraordinary to make canon and nikon owners switch over. At least if we’re speaking of owners who have invested a bit deeper than just the basic rebel/d3200 + kit lens. It would have to eclipse the canon X0D series. Or at least offer something everyone wants but which neither canon or nikon has on offer at this time. Or complete compatibility (i.e. lens compatibility as well as hot-shoe compatibility, allowing users to mix stuff from all systems) Will be interesting to see. Keeping my fingers crossed.
On paper it sounds amazing. My concerns are about the real use of all these new tech. I mean…does it really work? is it reliable? Usually there is where Sony sometimes disappointed us.
Well, when you think about it, Sony generally disappoints with support, their gear tends to work pretty well. So this is exciting!
Like they added built in HDR, which is brilliant, but then crippled it by not letting it work with the remote control.
The trick is to not propose a switch. Instead say “here is a chance to add a body with unique features that allows you to use most of your already made investment.”
That pill is much easier to swallow….
E-mount already provides that
Not full compatibility.
no, not really.
I hope they not allow Canon and Nikon users to use their lenses on Sony camera. That would pollute the Sony brand – Nikon and Canon users stay where you are, you are not welcome over to Sony side.
We dont need Canikon users over to Sony, go away
That’s the most ignorant comment I have seen on this site. Being a fanboy is one thing but this takes the cake. Get your head out of your ass! We are all photographers here. More people using Sony means that they can invest that much more into development due to a larger customer base. This is nothing but good news.
sony move the sensor to autofous other lens. nex-ff may not come September? so sad
david david david!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
gotcha… 😉
Admin: I hate you for making me keep your site up all the time while I’m at work, waiting for info…
lol 🙂
+1
that sounds really exciting, im gonna bet on a moving sensor to focus and has IBIS too 😛 maybe its possible, it’d let all those lenses focus without the AF protocol
Pb Pb Pb!!!!! 🙂
sounds really interesting! i like this new direction of Sony, but i will still hold out for FF NEX though, i’m waiting for the day that I can use the voigtlander 21mm f1.8 on it but I think i will keep my RX1 because its a really neat camera too.
sadly this news comes out just as im nearly done selling all my canon lenses 🙁
Makes sense! Removing the mirror allows that empty space in A-mount cameras to be used for such a mechanism. If it’s coming for E-mount cameras too I’m interested =)
One bayonet that fits A, E, CaNikon & Pentax lenses… and a moving focal plane. No adapters needed 🙂
If they actually made that thing, it won’t be moving 2cm for sure. So, I think you will still need adapters.
agree with vlad, you’d get the adapter to get the correct flange distance then sensor can move to AF the rest
Wow, you make it all very exciting Andrea.
You do a great job and very difficult also, i want to buy a new A-mout camera but with the rumors of you i will wait for it now.
The next 3 weeks i am on holiday, but when possible i will keep in touch with you site 😉
Cancel your holiday 🙂
LOL, if i could i would do it… very exciting about the A79 😉
Andrea, thank you!
Thansk you! A note: I am off for 2 hours for a very important meeting. Sorry if comment approval will be slow. In 2h I am back and will try to answer all your questions ok?
Not OK 🙂
No Andrea, you can’t leave now. Tell your client/boss/co-workers that you have more important things to do 🙂
All our questions? You shouldn’t have said that!
moving sensor to focus doesn’t strike me as a brilliant idea. not only would you need some very high precision mechanics to move the sensor without it getting misaligned, you would still need something to line up the contacts of the lenses with those of the body (to control aperture at least). And then what happens if the lens is set to MF and the body to AF and you start moving the focus ring? No, I think we’re going to see adapters for this.
For those of us that use the NEX as a digital back (and there are quite a few of us), most of what you mention is of no importance. And have you ever heard of Contax AX? A camera that had to shift the whole film plane, rolls and motor, and that was almost twenty years ago…
not only that, it shifted pentaprism and viewfinder too.
“you need some very high precision mechanics to move the sensor”
You need precision mechanics to move the lens elements too.
… And IBIS for a 20+ MP sensor …
Freddo: the point is that a moving sensor adds complexity (which adds cost) and might introduce some handling issues. and at least in the case of canon lenses that would just be unnecessary since the EF lenses, like the e-mount lenses, use electrical connections between the lens and body to control AF and aperture anyway.
Vlad: You forget that the lens will already have the mechanism.
I’m not saying it’s not possible, just that I don’t see it as a probable solution to using canikon lenses on a sony body and retain AF.
True, but there are plenty of MF lenses out there and only based on that, sensor shift is already a great idea.
possible. if they can solve how to control aperture on all these old lenses as well that’s great.
Most manual focus lenses have aperture ring. And Meatabones makes Canon to Nex adapter will full electronic aperture control from the camera.
As someone already mentioned, the Contax AX film camera auto focused on manual lenses by moving the film plane back and forth. 30 years later, Sony can probably do the same, but even better.
So, no NEX FF this year and NEX 7 successor delayed because of these new projects, or, perhaps, even cancelled. No RF flashes (where Sony could leapfrog Nikon if it chose), no pro support, and AF still inferior to DSLR, as john has pointed out above.
Sony now proposes to focus other manufacturers lenses in the same mediocre fashion because it can’t produce the lenses it needs due to manufacturing constraints? OSPDAF still a question mark with no discernible advantage in the real world, and certainly not faster than a D3200.
I have invested a lot in NEX over the last 18 months. This sounds like a suicide note from the camera division.
Sony tried to push PS4, NEX FF, NEX 7 successor, Honami, and camera/lens expresso/latte into stores this X-mas and perhaps they bit off more than they can chew? It looks like the only high end compact photo offering this fall is RX1R, something I have zero interest in.
Are you all RX1 users or something? Just curious.
@Taran
It’s funny how we percieve things differently. I have also invested a lot in my NEX gear during the past years. I now have four NEX cameras (5, 2x5N and 7), EVF, LA-EA, lenses, WA and fisheye converters for the two 16mm lenses I have. And 50+ legacy lenses with a crapload of adapters, cheap and expensive. Recently, I’ve been thinking if Fuji might be the better choice for me, and I have been thinking about a platform swap. And it is stuff like this (if it turns out to be true) that makes me want to stick with Sony and NEX.
TaranNew is a joker. Probably a M4/3 troll
it would allow using in-lens motor for slow and coarse movements and fine and fast movement of sensor , mitigating problem that older lenses are not situable for CDAF.
VERY EXCITED!!! THANKS MATE!
Really exciting Andrea. I have one question though. I don’t know the Sony system very well, except for googling it a lot. I have just sold my OMD and lenses and both my body and credit card are ready for the next big announcement. I will also sell my 5DM3 along my lenses to have enough money for that FF NEX.
My question is: Which lenses will be mounted on that FF NEX? E-Mount?
Thanks for all your hard work and time! 🙂
Yannick
E-mount yes. There will be FF E-mount lenses from Zeiss. But you can also use your Canon lenses! With AF!
Does this mean, that all manual lenses will work with AF? If yes, Sony wins, really wins. There is nothing from other systems to suggest
“But you can also use your Canon lenses! With AF!”
Ok, what? On the FF NEX? So, not only on the APS-C E-mount cameras?
check the metabones website and u will found a new adapter that support full frame nex for canon full frame lens.
AF with canon lenses? That is a huge rumor that deserves its own proper post.
um, does this probably indicate that Metabones somehow negotiated with Sony?
You just put my decision on buying a Fuji X on hold. Hope the waiting is worth it 🙂
I knwo new FUji X cameras are comng too (Patrick from Fujirumors told me that). So you have a double reason to wait.
Andrea, most of my shooting is in extremely low light concerts. My a77 is a fine camera but really struggles at this. The highest that I can push this camera and have useable shots is ISO 2500. What I need is accurate tracking in very low light and very clean ISO, preferably above 6400. I’ve used Minolta and then Sony cameras since 1983. If Sony cannot deliver I’m seriously considering a switch to Nikon. Are any of the new A mount bodies going to satisfy me?
I have no detailed info on AF. But I have been told it’s suepr fast.
You should be using a full frame Nikon.
D3S is amazing on that front yes. But resolution is very low
Get the A99, this will solve your problem.
Man, the system has a great set of lenses. I am just waiting for APS-C + IBIS to buy in.
Andrea we bow to you!!
keep on getting great rumors!!
cheers, J
How much money will this awesome tech cost me? I’m super interested in the a3000, e3000 in Australa, because of the form factor. That 18mm flange has made me a photographer. And I’m really to upgrade from the 5N right now
7-axis IBIS !
LOL! One that moves front and back so you don’t miss focus.
Added bonus, you can AF MF and other lenses on the camera!
I wish…
Was thinking about this the other day though, since it was mentioned that 5 axis refers to degrees of freedom.
Interesting times.
OK; SO FF NEX WILL AUTOFOCUS VM, ZM AND LEICA LENSES OMGOMGOMG
omg! that would be exciting actually!! didn’t think of that!
Sensor that moves the focal plane inward and outward dependent upon the mounting of all current lenses??
Or
Singular mount that moves all current lenses at differing distances from the sensor plane?
Sensor-Shift-AF?
Woo hoo… So glad I put money in the bank for the next goodies to come !!
As did I. I’ve practically alredy bought a new Sony camera without even knowing what it actually does and looks like. 😀
Let me guess #1: they are using the space left by removing the mirror to let the sensor go back and forth so it can AF with any lens, even old manual and mechanical lenses. Right? The AX is back! 🙂
Could be an universal mount socket and you get a set of mount adapters with it.
The necessary sensor shift could be done with very accurate linear motor.
@Andrea, I never got more excited reading an article from SAR than this one.
Thank you so much for this contagious enthusiasm. 🙂
Hope the design of this new E-Mount cameras will change a bit from that bulky DSLR shape.
So, in summary, entry to mid level A-Mount cameras will be replaced by e-Mount cameras. hmmm, maybe a bit sad for a-Mount lenses owners if true.
Wait a minute, does that meen it will AF my Zeiss/Leica lenses?
Well, if it is a sensor shift AF, yes.
Shi#t, if that really works, it’s a killer feature…
Well that’s an understatement. 🙂
The expression “game changer” just got a gigantic definition boost.
One should probably go on ebay and buy some decent MF legacy glass from Oly, Contax and the likes. Prices will soon go up!
@xspider That is for sure.
Choose focus after taking the shot? That just might be the special feature. Me im more hopeful towards better glass, sony should really step their game up in that field because Fuji are kicking their but.
I genuinely struggling to believe that sensor shift focus (at the current time) would be fast or accurate enough to lure people away from their trustly DSLRs. I’m guessing something more obscure, perhaps a Lytro style sensor that can focus after the shot is taken?
well, if used by skilled people, 5-axis is accurate enough to hold a piece of sensor in place for more than a second. The question of speed remains though. Does someone know how the weight of a sensor compares to the weight of lens elements that the AF motors have to move usually?
I am pretty confident a sensor would be significantly lighter.
FW updates for A67/65 users?
Moving towards “Pro market” is that just talk for “expensive”?
I’d count quality and reliability there as well… but as our friend “e” likes to say, Sony needs to open up the Multi shoe interface so we can have better 3rd party support for e.g. flashes… that’s what at least I would count into “pro”.
Maybe this feature is something that will allow Sony to build smaller FF NEX lenses.
Not only no IS in lenses but no motors at all and all the lenses in the world to use on it! Release one body, and system more than usable.
A killer feature if true!
Or you could use the space to add better/more elements.
Even with moving sensor, tele/close up/macro lenses would still need focusing groups. But your point is correct.
I was really hoping the NEX-FF was going to be the one they were announcing next month, but it sounds like it’ll be some of the APS-C ones. :'(
Assuming the special feature that will let you use Nikon & Canon lenses perfectly is a built in SpeedBooster. Yawn.
If really the sensor gets moved for AF, wouldn’t that allow AF also for manual legacy lenses?
Hmmm, that really would be something….
hmm a telephoto lense can have a shift of some cm. i have a problem to imagine a sensor shift over such a distance. And the body has to be thicker equal to the maximum shift distance….
And macro lenses shift even more.
I would prefer a camera with its sensor rigidly and accurately located at the correct distance behind the lens mount. I am not convinced that any kind of moving sensor would give reliable infinity focus.
They can put all the tricks they want in the adapters.
+1 too much chance of decentering
you get the lens to be approximately focused and sensor will adjust smaller amounts to achieve focus?
Sensor shift is not a general focus mechanism because some lenses need a lot of movement to focus and some lenses use internal movements to focus. Moving the focal plane might be able to focus these lenses but may not be optimal.
It could be used to adjust registration distance, in the case of an A-mount, the sensor could be moved forward to allow a short Canon mount, Nikon mount etc. to be used without needing a correcting lens. As suggested above the movement could also be used for final focus, the sensor not only moves for image stabilization but can also move to pinpoint the focus.
That is the way my Contax AX that used focus shift AF worked.
Most lenses did not require it but some did require a “prefocus” to get the lens in approximately the position then AF worked. It was very fluid and worked well….
Anybody has got a web resource explaining how a shift sensor AF is supposed to work ?
This is all new, so I doubt you will find a lot of info in this matter. But first have a look att a cut through of Contax AX: http://www.ixbt.com/digimage/m39/contaxax.jpg
That camera had to move the whole film plane, shutter, pentaprism, film rolls and winder motor to be able to focus. New digital sensors with OSPDAF will only have to move the sensor.
What about shutter? Does it have to be moved, or could it be that these cameras don’t have a mechanical shutter at all?
Nobody outside Sony can say for sure, but if they solved the digital second curtain (the first is already digital), there’s no need for a mechanical shutter. But it is an interresting question. Soon we will find out!
If sensor is to be moved by a 2-4 mm only, it is possible to leave shutter fixed.
For those who are about that, focusing by moving “sensor” is absolutely not new…
This incredible film (!!!!) camera was made by Contax…
Just read this :
http://photo.net/equipment/contax/ax
You can find many picture of the Contax AX, google is your friend.
Contax Zeiss autofocus lenses exist before the G system 😉
Apparently, it is, because that is a film camera. You mean the concept is not new, but then who cares?
If the topic is of no interest to you why waste time with a rude response.Film camera or not the Contax AX demonstrates proof of concept namely you can focus a lens throughout its range from minimum focus distance to infinity by moving the film/sensor plane back and forward.
If this can be done with a 35mm film mechanism in 1996 it does not seem beyond reason to imagine it could be done in 2013 with an APS sized sensor.If I recall the maximum movement was just under 10mm.I would be delighted with the possibility of proper AF with all types of lenses.
Get over yourself. It is hardly that rude to ask who cares. You also entirely missed my point with the rest of your comment.
Forget about focusing Canikon lenses Sony need to NAIL auto focus with all Sony lenses.
Really hope their OSPDAF works better that anything they have put out so far as their AF system lags behind Canikon.
Then fix their flash system.
Then add support and Sony will finally arrive.
Not sure how the A77 lags behind Canikon.
He’s talking about autofocus performance
Me too.
Speed is one thing tracking and accuracy is quite another and face detect doesn’t help much for birds.
😉
OH and 12 frames a second means nothing when the buffer is so small you only get 13 shots off. I know that’s not the AF systems fault but the 2 work together to make or break a camera.
Sony have the tech and ability to make the best cameras out there and always promote their latest must have feature but fail to deliver on simple things.
All sizzle no steak.
Sony are very innovative and lead Canikon in areas but also lag in others.
Autofocus
Available lenses
Flash system
Customer support
Fix those 4 and they become a threat.
I really don’t think they will do it with this latest flood of cameras.
As always cautiously optimistic but I am hungry for meat not the sound of it cooking.
🙂
So the A77 is not accurate? Give me break. Tracking being the only real issue, I don’t see how it can be said that the AF system lags (overall). It lags for one thing, it is better for another.
I have to agree with you John. To nail the Pro market you have to have the basics of what makes a pro camera great rock solid….
The autofocus on the SLT is much better then the Canikon, what are you talking about?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVmZKGnzqv0
That’s just speed in low light not tracking
A low light speed test.
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/41119919
Canon lost there.
There is no better AF system in SLR / SLT / still cameras than the one developed for the Canon 1D-X. The AF system is unbelievably fast & accurate. The AF system in the 5D3 is based on the 1D-X AF system and is nearly as good. When I compare the 1D-x AF to the a99 AF system…it’s like comparing a new Ferrari to a used VW bug. It is lacking in speed, precision and the AF is clustered in the center (and the “side” points are less accurate than the central point).
To be fair, the 1D-X to a99 comparison is uneven. The 1D-X costs 2.5 times the a99, however the 5d3 was 25% more expensive than the a99 when each camera was released and were seemingly positioned against one another.
All of the innovative features that Sony is developing are fantastic, but it should not be at the expense of the fundamentals – AF system, flash system and lens choices.
And how is that AF working in Live View? I’ve seen how the 5d3 performs and it is not “a new Ferrari to a used VW bug”, when compared to the A99. I have seen so much bashing of the Sony AF, one would think people would be better to use manual focus (which, btw, is outstanding on Sony cameras). Same goes for the lens range.
Bizarre why you’d announce pictures but not release them and risk getting scooped. Most “leaks” happen when they’re “ready” to be leaked so delaying usually means they go to someone else.
If they leak the admin can just link to them and then this site won’t crash.
If AF is possible by moving the sensor, why not tilt-shift in body as well? instead of tilt/shift the lens, you could have tilt-shift with all lenses!!
Finally someone more than me who wish for that! Give me now!
Tilt/shift requires a larger image circle to move around in. This idea will not work with ff. On the other hand a FF lens would be capable of this on an aps-c sensor but never on a FF
Hey Andrea, not only the glasses can move.
Me finding a job just got more intense. One things for sure though, I know what my next camera will be. 🙂
Sensor shift auto focus sounds like a perfect world and would surly sell a ton of bodies but not necessarily Sony lenses.
A statement from Sony earlier this year said the expected to increase lens sales by 50%.
Whats up with that?
Kit lenses ?
LOL wasn’t thinking about that.
From this point forward you will not be allowed to by any camera body only.
E-bay will be flooded with cheap kit lenses.
Well… alot of words about nothing for sure, but that is rumors.
Time will tell.
So, tilt-shift sensors anybody?
It would be nice!
The big Q is now will the FF-Nex also have sensor shift AF or only the APS-C Nex?
Now I have to PRAY TO GOD that this game changing cam comes in RF form factor, and NOT in the atrocious DSLR shape 🙁
+1
+1
Probably Andrea can say something about that as he has pictures already? Pretty Please!
+1!
it’s a matter of taste and personal preference, there is no absolute better form factor. it’s nice that sony realize that and started to make RF and DSLR like E-mount camera
for me I prefer the dslr shape ,and I hope Sony make the ILCE-5000 very soon ( I want nex 5T on DSLR body with EVF and better battery )
+1
And they don’t need all the bells and whistles. Just release the damn fullframe camera!
The camera body needs to be bigger if it’s going to AF by shifting sensor inside the body!
really very very excited (I even turned on tweet mobile notification for your twitter account 🙂 )
although I’m excited I’m kind of afraid that I will lose control of my wallet 🙂
P.S /thanks a lot 🙂 you don’t only write rumors , you make entertainment out of it (and I love it 🙂
Andrea,
Will any of the cameras that you mentioned for 2013 / early 2014 feature the hybrid a-e mount or is that not on the roadmap?
Thx,
C.
I guess the hybrid a/e Mount is the Sensor Shift AF + an adapter…
“I will definitely post what I got after the QX camera announcement on Tuesday.”
Why delay and all the drama? Just post the pictures. Or somebody else will do it first. If you want to say they have adapters with electronics for DSLR lenses, say that.
About Sensor-Shift-AF. Some time ago I was also kind of fun of it. I even proposed it to Sony 🙂
http://community.sony.com/t5/Alpha-SLT-DSLR-Cameras/Active-Contrast-AF-idea-proposal/td-p/128813
But success of Canon’s Dual Pixel AF system proved that on-sensor PDAF can work fast and reliable. So now I am sure Sony will use nothing more than improved on-sensor PDAF for autofocus. And with simple adapters PDAF will work also with Canikon AF lens.
And I suggested the Contax AX approach here at SAR a couple of years ago in a whole different discussion. I could never imagine they were actually already working on it, because surely, they were experimenting/contemplating this solution for several years before they deemed the technology mature enough for production. 🙂
Maybe the sensor can be made to tilt up and down and left to right.
Fore some cool effects.
11 axis IBIS!
LOL.
Whatever it is I hope they make this in FF nex and not in APSC first. Although maintaining the IQ and coverage on the FF would be more difficult
VERY interesting if all manual lenses suddenly AF on the new Sony tech. that may use sensor shift.
However, Iris/Aperture control will still be a problem when it comes to Canon/Nikon/Pentax lenses not having aperture control, unless Sony has worked out electronic adapters only taking care of aperture control for newer “Canikontax” lenses.
the reason I switched back to Nikkor D lenses from G.
better built and an aperture ring
Yes, and the prices for old prime lenses with aperture control will go through the roof!
DirkW, I have a drawer full such of old wonderful Konica lens that I bought for pennies on the dollar on eBay. This would be a dream come true for me!
Spaceman, it’s not a show stopping problem. One can switch to Aperture priority. You simply select the aperture you want to use on your lens and let the camera decide th proper shutter speed.
I’m not saying it’s a show stopper, and I do use fully mechanical legacy lenses with my NEX cameras so that is not the worry here.
If the aperture only can be changed electronically like on newer lenses, then there has to be an adapter allowing electronic communication between the NEX camera and the Canikontax lens to change the aperture.
Oh, now I understand what you were getting at. I didn’t think about totally electronic lenses. Thanks for clearing that up.
agree, not a show stopper, however, the aperture ring just gives you full manual control, love it esp when shooting with the FS100 or FS700
If the sensor moves for AF, would this lead to a new family of lenses without any need for focus related lens elements? Would this lead to smaller/cheaper/lighter lenses?
I’m not sure I “get” how this whole idea would work. For instance, my Tamron 90 extends a fair bit when it focuses to MFD. would the sensor have to move that far?
Yes.
I don’t think the idea is practical, except for a very limited range of lenses with short focal length and no macro.
Hi Andrea,
I only say thanks to u, from bottom of my heart for your hard work & keeping excitement till the product launch. As a true SONY fan i am loving ths site.
I had visited 3-4 years back when i was searching some sony cam and After purchasing A57 i am visiting twice or thrice in a day or sometimes more than that.
Sony’s quality, technology & innovations & and your hard work keeping me excited.
Best regards,
How about lenses with Floating Elements like my Summilux? Seems like that could be an issue….
+ Agree. There’s more to focusing than just moving the sensor from the rear exit pupil. FLE demonstrates that pretty clearly.
Maybe I will be able to put my 30 years old manual super prime glass (CANON FD500,300,85) on such a camera, prefocus manually and then then sensor does the rest and brings the af right on the spot… that would be incredibly awesome!
That’s how the Contax AX was used. For long tele lenses or macro lenses the whole film contraption would have to be moved a lot, and sometimes there were not enough motion for the AX. So seasoned AX shooters made a quick and rough prefocus and let the camera do the fine tuning. I’d guess the rumored camera from Sony, whatever it will be called, will work best used in similar way.
Another great feature with the AX was that it could take macro shots with non macro lenses. You only needed to move closer to the object than the minimum focus distance the lens was designed for originally. The camera would then move the film backwards for correct focus, creating the same effect that a small macro ring would have done.
These rumors are so exciting, I have a hard time accepting it!
The celestron c5 telescope would make a great entry lens if it would auto focus.
It is f/10 an a f6.3 focal redicer is available.focal length is 1250mm high quality and under $450.
Also thinking of c6 or c8.
Andrea will manual focus lenses autofocus and will anything be available with high resolution?
I keep telling the same thing, every single time. A-mount us dead, dead, dead. Sony is transitioning to an E-mount Alpha line. They are going to flood the market with E-mount equevelant lens and cameras and transition products. Why keep doubting me. Everything I have ever posted has been absolutely correct. Dead, dead, dead! Where do you think I get this info?
Dan
You can go on regurgitating it, no one gives a damn.
That is why the new ILC line is so thick, just to house a moving sensor for sensor-shift AF.
I guess in a slim Nex the sensor could not travel far enough…
i was asking sony to replace the slt mirror with a built in speed boster, so we had ff dof and faster lenses for new Alphas…
but that sensor walking front and back sound interesting…
with body taking all the AF job, thats mean zero SAM, SSM, retrofocus, iner focus, etc… sony basically can throw all that of the window, well, out of lenses.
lenses with fewer parts, maybe fewer elements, maybe even new designs with better image quality and cheaper will be made… maybe that rumor of expected 50% increase in A lenses is real stuff.
many say “bodies as for chritsmas lenses are for life” but lenses dont last forever.
there was an era where lenses were full manual, then lenses reinveted to autofocus, image stabilisation, electronic control, new built in motors, better glasess and coating, programable chips, etc
maybe sony just outdated all lenses in market and will start a new generation, indeed could be a truly game changer… for the first time, its time to sell ALL stuff, bodies and LENSES
what for? Sony obviously wants you to buy expensive FF camera instead of cheaper speed booster.
Sensor-Shift AF that uses the IBIS technology can only shift the sensor a some millimeters forward and some millimeters backward. That’s not enough to focus any lens from close to infinity except perhaps ultra-wide-angle lenses. That means the feature will not be a “real” AF, the photographer will at the very least need to manually pre-focus the lens to the approximate shooting distance, and the pre-focusing will have to be the more exact the longer the lens’ focal length is.
If that’s what it is, the bad news is, it won’t be able to substitute a real AF. So it’s probably better to not yet sell one’s EOS 70D or Nikon D7100.
The good news is, it would work even with manual focus lenses, and there’d be no need to buy new dedicated AF adapters for every mount.
If will work well with 30mm lenses: if sensor movement is 4 mm, closest distance you can focus is (30*30)/4 = 22.5 cm, quite acceptable. Longer lenses will just have you combine both focus mechanism, so nothing is lost.
Sounds plausible. Ok, so lenses up to something like the “standard lens” focal length for APS-C might actually become fully AF-enabled! There’s one other disadvantage, though; if I let the sensor-shift AF take care of everything, I lose potential corrections for close-focus if a lens has an internal focusing/floating elements design.
Yes… but symmetric lens designs work well without CRC.
I remember when Konica used this concept (moving the film plan to archive focus) on one of their SLR film cameras. A friend of mine owned one. Konica abandoned the idea shortly after it was introduced.
If you dig deep enough you can find Konica technology in Sony roots.
My optometrist tells me that the human eye works by changing the geometry of both the lens and the shape of the eye ball, a similar way of doing things.
it’s pretty obvious that variable focal distance can not do autofocusing for manual lens. consider 200mm lens and its focal distance for example. but if the sensor is on a movable worm-gear or sth, it quite can help to focus, i.e. to “postfocus” after you do the manual focusing. but it would be too tender – any sand/dust inside and.. :). i hardly believe this to come true from the very beginning, although in theory, why not. first more logical step would be several positions for various bayonets + configurable positions. that would make sense, if the bayonet would be universal.
Sai, What you are saying my well be true but I’m not sure. Yes, long lenses require considerable change in geometry to achieve focus. I’m not sure it hold true if the focusing is accomplished by moving the focusing plane. I simply do not know. Is anyone expert enough in optics theory to comment?
Andrea thank you very much for a great news! Been visiting this site every day for new rumors and was not disappointed! If the Sensor Shift AF is true, then imagine using it with Sony AF lens. Focus speed will be much faster if both work at the same time, don’t you think? A really smart idea from Sony.
P/s:I hope that 85mm lens is not Zeiss, looking forward for a cheaper Sony version. At least it won’t break my bank.
Wow, looks great! Andrea, I got very solid info (including pricing and release date) of a E-Mount Zeiss lens that will be released this year (and I’m not talking about the 16-70). I’ll double check and send it to you next week, so you’ll have one piece more in the puzzle. 😉
PS: If the 85mm Zeiss launches this year too I won’t have money for the NEX-7 successor anymore, so in this case, you don’t need to make pressure on Sony to release it this year. 🙂
Thank you Andrea for all the very good job !!!
Very awesome ! and i’m happy to see that a serious firmware is coming for the nex-7. I was really disapointed by the firmware 1.03..
Now just impatient to hear what are the big news and can’t wait tuesday announcement !! 🙂
I hope they write the software so sensor shift is useable the way we all think it should be…
Will they call it 6-axis now? Maybe 6 DOF?
If you can control rear tilt movements with software, add a TS lens and you have a true view camera.
Andrea, before receiving more than 1000 comments, check that your backups are OK. It will be a pity to suffer again a data lost in the best SAR moment! 🙂
yeah, I do backups on a daily basis anyway!
NEX 7 FIRMWARE UPDATE !!!!!!!
YEAHHHHHHHHHHHH :-)))))
Hope big improvements !!
I’m intrigued by this rumour of a camera that would also take Canon and Nikon lenses. I seriously considered moving to Sony the other year, but it was the lack of lenses of interest to me in the system that stopped me. Sony cannot easily catch up with the lens ranges of CaNikon. However, if they introduce a universal mount, this will be disruptive technology, which could entirely change the game. Proprietary mounts have advantages and disadvantages to the manufacturers.
Since the CaNikon lens ranges have grown so much bigger than everyone elses, it really hasn’t been in the interest of the other manufacturers to have proprietary mounts. Whilst in theory they are locking people into their lens range, they are not. People buy independent lenses like Sigma and Tamron, and others vote with their feet and buy into CaNikon because their system ranges are not so limited.
The NEX cameras have ALWAYS been able to use Canon and Nikon lenses. Since Sony itself has referred to the A3000 as the first of its “hybrid” cameras I think it is most likely that the “hybrid” system will be an e-mount with custom A-mount adapters.
Also, this “new” technology that will bring Canikon user to NEX is probably super-fast OSPDAF that, like the physical E-mount standard, is open to 3rd party developers so suddenly all lenses can use phase-detection. The achilles heel of adapted lenses (for most people) has been the slow/no autofocus. Sony has been on the cusp of changing that for a while they may have finally solved the technical issues. If the Sony side of things is open and public than adapter makers only need to have reverse engineered Canikon auto focus routines which are fairly well known at this point.
Amazing. A rumor that there are to be rumors.
Actually, is a teaser of a rumor.
A rumor of a rumor would be:
“Someone told me there is going to be a rumor next week. Confirming it”
What the hell are you doing here if you are not interested in rumors ??
A rumor saying new E_mount cameras will be announced in September is no rumor for you? Did you read that info somewhere else? Please go at Dpreview or any other serious site if you wnat news and not rumors. DOn’t know why people still comes here complaining. Are soemone forcing you to visit SAR?
Andrea don’t waste your time with dumbs 🙂
I really appreciate, as many, all the job done ! Thank u
This is really Sony time ! all amazing new product coming make me appreciate my Nex 7 more and more. I was waiting for so long for new lenses and I think here we are, the e-mount lineup is maturing !
bite the bullet for the 16-70 or save it for the FF NEX?? tough decision.
sell a kidney, buy FF NEX 😛
Thanks Andrea! Very exciting. Appreciate all you do.
Admin, can you please confirm if the new mechanism would also allow AF with MF lenses?
Maybe I’m just dreaming but either they are 1)super secretive about new e-mount ff lenses for the NEX ff or instead of a ff nex,2)they are gonna release aps-c camera that has some kind of Metabones speedbooster tech built in which effectively makes it ff. Kinda makes sense if you think about it with all these new e mounts and no word on any ff e mount lenses.
Here’s my reasoning:
1) The 16-70CZ and 18-105 both are f4. With speedbooster type tech, they would effectively be f2.8 without the need to make these lenses huge.
2) Yes you still would need an adapter for Canikon owners, but that would give them the ability to keep all their aps-c lenses and step up to full frame with af.
I not sure how the af will work though unless Sony makes adapters for the Canikons with built in af.
Your understanding of Speedbooster is excactly backwards. It doesn’t turn lenses designed for an APS-C image circle and make them work a stop faster on a FF sensor… it takes lenses made for a *FF* image circle and makes them work a stop faster on APS-C lenses!
Simple physics: you have X amount of light, meant to be concentrated on an FF sensor-sized area… now you concentrate that same light onto an area about half the size (APS-C sensor), and it’s twice as bright! The new F4 lenses, therefore, would act as F5.6 on a FF sensor.
Grrr… edit functionality would be great. Should read:
“It doesn’t turn lenses designed for an APS-C image circle and make them work a stop faster on a FF sensor… it takes lenses made for a *FF* image circle and makes them work a stop faster on APS-C *SENSORS*!”
To complete the thought, in order for a Speedbooster to make an f4 APS-C lens work like an f2.8 lens you’d need to focus its light onto a sensor half the size of APS-C, i.e. about 20% smaller than an m43 sensor.
Thanks for the clarification. I’m still new to photography and learning lots. just a couple months ago I didn’t even know what aps-c was or full frame, etc. was.
Sure wish you were right, though!
Ridiculous!!! I love how they leave us on the backburner. This firmware update for the a99 is a joke. It’s unbelievable that that don’t fix basic issues that shouldn’t even be there in the first place… like their crappy bracketing options.
ko: adapters giving AF shouldn’t be a huge problem with EF lenses, should it? I mean, it’s basically that they need to figure out which pin does what on the EF lenses and connect each pin to the corresponding E-mount pin. Possibly with a circuit to translate the signals.
Love it how someone mentioned “shift-sensor AF” and suddenly everyone is thinking that’s what’s coming.
What if it’s a return of eye-controlled focus that’s the big thing?
We really have no indication of what Sony are up to yet, for all we know it might as well be a transformer 😀
different companies can have different voltage levels to control the lens, though i think 5 volt is quite common, but the communication protocol between the lenses are different too and its all serial communication (pretty much), so unless a company releases all that information (which most of them don’t besides m43 with some agreement) then people are left to reverse engineer all that, which takes time and resources
True. But sigma and tamron, among others, managed to figure it out so it’s quite doable. Voltages and protocol would require the chip/circuit I mentioned.
Wouldn’t surprise me if sony examined the nikon, canon and m43 mounts as they developed the e-mount
yeah, but sigma and tamron has been making lenses in those mounts for quite a while, plus they’re large companies by now and i wouldn’t be surprised if there was an agreement made to share the com protocol with the companies.
there is always iteration processes as well, like how older sigma lenses which were reverse engineered for canon mount can be used on the film cameras but not the digital cameras. right now metabones is in the process of reverse engineering protocols too and have made a (slow) AF module which can be used on a NEX to shoot a Canon EF lens with a chip in adapter
its not strange for a third party to do it, but you’d very rarely hear of a native camera company letting other people use AF on another mount.
My understanding is that the big issue with the slow AF is that the Canon/Nikon lenses (just like Alpha lenses on the LAE1 adapter) are designed for phase detection AF not contrast AF. The LA-E2 is so much faster because it adds a phase detection module. Theoretically if 3rd parties could update NEX firmware to support such an adapter they could release something similar to the LAE2 but for Canon or Nikon mount.
Now, NEX cameras starting with the 5R and 6 have had Phase detection on the sensor but for some reason it requires special firmware compatible lenses. If Sony has figured out how to “open up” so to speak, those protocols without having specific firmware support for every lens that wants to use them, then 3rd party E-mount lenses and E-mount adapters could make use of them. Thereby dramatically speeding up focusing times for adapted AF lenses.
To answer an earlier comment. There WILL NOT be AF support for MF lenses because there is no way to turn the focusing helix. Deotech created a Frankeinleica that had AF but they did that by mating it to Contax G lens so that the helix could be turned by their adapters motor.
Thank you Admin!
I think “sensor shift” is being misunderstood here. You just move the sensor around to find out which way to move the lens focus, not to actually move the sensor into the focal plane.
You could do both by moving the sensor orthogonal to the focal plane:
1. Looking for contast improvements to speed up a contrast AF system,
2. Stop at the perfect position without a need to refocus the lens.
It might not be full AF over the full range just with such sensor shift, but it should be enough to only require rough approximate focusing of the lens supported by fine focusing via sensor shift.
Most current SLR lenses, except of those that were already explicitly designed for contrast AF cameras like Canon’s latest STM versions, will not work well with contrast AF systems because their focusing motors do not give position feedback and/or cannot handle high-frequency focus jittering. Such a sensor shift focus approach would also fix that and allow fast contrast AF focusing with about all legacy AF lenses. And limited fine auto focusing with MF lenses.
Side note: I have no idea how helpful sensor shift AF would be for the latest mirrorless camera AF systems that include phase AF pixels on the sensor. But considering that Canon is currently introducing sensor phase AF _and_ STM stepper motor lenses in parallel, I feel that sensor shift AF could also help mirrorless cameras with combined contrast and sensor phase AF.
And in a perfect world, [dreaming mode on] one could even add sensor tilting, to get some (limited) tilt&shift effect with standard lenses [dreaming mode off].
BeeJee
And – apart from the not current SLR af lenses – think about all the MANUAL lenses!! Concerning the on sensor PDAF: for the sensor shift it should perfectly work also with on sensor PDAF and would probably enable the sensor to an even quicker af movement, because the direction of he movement would be clear. A combination of on sensor PDAF for speed with CDAF for precision, and fast sensor shift technology – would RULE the camera world!!!!
I hope there are some news on the RX10 (APS-C Compact)!
Is the NEX FF going to be compatible with existing E mount lenses (either in cropped mode or somehow made to cover the FF sensor)?
If in cropped mode are we going to get a bunch of new e mount lenses that are FF – and will those work on APS-C sensor NEX models?
So, there will be Nex aps-c, nex dslr shaped aps-c, nex ff, alpha aps-c, alpha ff,
nex aps-c lenses, nex ff lenses, alpha aps-c lenses, alpha ff lenses.
I know the camera market and i`m confused. Tell that to a “normal” costumer.
Think they are making a mess. I like sony for their forward thinking, but I´m not sure they will succeed. Maybe in 2-3 years their strategy will become clear ;-I
I’m all to excited about the FF NEX camera. It will certainly be a Leica M competitor. Fuji would then follow suit and Leica M will have some serious competition. Well, I also wish that the NEX FF has an OVF / EVF like the Fuji X-PRO-1.
1) There will me many new APS-C E-mount cameras and lenses in September
It’s already September now, where’s my new camera! xD
I currently have a Nex-c3 and was planning to upgrade to an Alpha DSLR by the end of the year or beginning of 2014, but there’s going to be so many new releases from Sony….it will be a hard wait followed by a hard choice xD
And also Canon and Nikon owners will be motivated to switch and they can perfectly use all their lenses on it!
日本語訳：そして、キヤノンとニコンのユーザーも切り替える気になるだろう。彼らは全てのレンズを、このカメラで完璧に使うことができる！
アホか、このライターは。散々、故障に悩まされたから言えるが、レンズが交換出来る一眼（レフ）システムというのは、信頼性が無ければ使えないのだ……。「なぜ、ニコンかキヤノンか？」っていうと、故障はしないうえに、フリーズすることもなく、レンズも豊富だからだ。ソニーαなんて、写真を仕事としている人間にとっては選択の対象外、
>And also Canon and Nikon owners will be motivated to switch and they can perfectly use all their lenses on it!
日本語訳：そして、キヤノンとニコンのユーザーも切り替える気になるだろう。彼らは全てのレンズを、このカメラで完璧に使うことができる！
アホか、このライターは。散々、故障に悩まされたから言えるが、レンズが交換出来る一眼（レフ）システムというのは、信頼性が無ければ使えないのだ……。「なぜ、ニコンかキヤノンか？」っていうと、故障はしないうえに、フリーズすることもなく、レンズも豊富だからだ。これらの要件をすべて満たしていないソニーαなんて、写真を仕事としている人間にとっては信頼に足らないもので、選択の対象外ですわ（苦笑）
11-12-13 and no update :-<