Panasonic will have a press conference on April 13 right at the NAB show in Las Vegas. Trusted sources already told us back in October the new AG-AF100 successor is due with completely new sensor and 4K recording. I am particularly interested in that new MFT sensor as it should bring some incredibly advanced new performance:
Source 1:
I had a conversation with a Panasonic Rep here in Japan.He told me in the near future there will be an upgrade of the AF 101 camera announced. Newly designed sensor will have an immense dynamic range of up to 15 stops and 4K. Sensor will be a big surprise in unexpected ways. Not shure about the price tag though.
Source 2 via Photorumors.
- 4K video
- 18MP photo
- 16+ stops of dynamic range
- Improved lowlight capabilities
- Improved skintones
- Improved highlight rendition
- Useable ISO (almost no grain) up to 12,800
- The new camera will basically have one of the best stills and videos images/color rendition/dynamic range compared to the competition
- Price tag is expected to be high – similar to the AF101: around $3k-$4k
59 Responses
Well this definitely got my interest.
Sounds promising though I would not expect to see it in lower priced products before the GH5 and that must be a way off still. I was thinking of selling my M43 lenses; but going to wait now!
16 stops of dynamic range sounds too good to be true though.
Upgrade to AF? what is this? Super Maga Hyper DFD or finally PDAF?
It says “an upgrade of the AF101”, which is a video camera, and does not mean auto-focus.
Doh! i see now
16+ stops of dynamic range!!
WOWEE!! Is that possible?
Red Dragon sensor has 16+ DR stops of DR (this is how red advertise it), some think it has less, others more, depending on the enthusiasm :). So yes, basically, it may be possible if Panasonic uses Tower Jazz (who made the RED Dragon) sensors. If I remember correctly Tower Jazz bought Panasonic sensor division.
I’ll personally be very satisfied with 16 DR stops on paper and 14,5 in real life situations :).
Don’t forget that these 16 stops DR don’t translate 1:1 to stills.
Can you write in clearer English? What you say does not provide ebough information… i.e. explain FULLY.
Well said. The few that know(all) this info assume everybody knows…….zzzzzzz
I’m not forgetting, and didn’t imply the DR figures where pixel per pixel examined. 🙂
I remember in my previous post insisting m4/3 sensor should achieved 18 MP & 15++ ELV DR if the 88 dbs sensor is not ready yet & got negative feedbacks from readers here .
Now the truth is reveal by admin .
This might be my beloved GX7 successor sensor .
If the rumors may come true, first the sensor will see the daylight in Oly OMD E1II (with crappy video), then in Gh5 with similar video quality (less pro functions compared to the pro model) and only then in GX…line etc.
Why would Panasonic give their sensor to Olympus first? The GH5 and GX7 are both flagship cameras for Panasonic so I think there is an equal chance for them rolling it out for either one first. GX is the flagship compact and GH has been the flagship really for video but also the larger size. Note that the GX had image stabilization while the GH4 had none so it’s not like the GX is always a beaten down version of the GH.
I’m just speculating…In the past Panasonic provided Oly with sensors before they used them (like in the case EM1). I personally don’t care which camera get’s the sensor first, I only wish Gh5 to have those specs and be available to purchase at the end of this year or early next year.
I presume Panasonic wants several months in advance to sell this high end video camera before they release the sensor in something cheaper.
You are definitely wrong on this one .
GX will have that sensor first regardless is 4K .
Follow by GH & EM series .
We shall wait and see…although speculating is fun. 🙂
How does admin reveal the truth … the specs are stlll rumors at this point, and 15 stops DR is easier to do with video than with stills, anyway.
Well, no, it’s not. On the contrary, it’s much harder to get usable HDR with video than with stills.
Sounds like a wish list, not reality.
This sensor makes the decision of m43′ future. If this sensor is that good, FF would become the new medium format and m43 the new standard. Just hard to wait until it will be available in an E-M1x
No . That is not m4/3 future sensor .
Is still CMOS at it’s highest kind .
The 88 dbs Organic Sensor is m4/3 future sensor .
Upcoming gear will serve me better. Right now the existing gear is serving me well. I prefer to keep shooting with what I have now, rather not shooting while waiting for “the next big thing”.
Mr Marco , don’t mind to tell what you mean by “the next big thing” ?
I mean: whatever the future will bring, right now I can already make good use of what I have. Taking photos right now is better than not taking photo while waiting for an improved camera.
No need to use titles Yun! Marco is ok! 🙂
18 Mpix vs 16 Mpix is no big deal. Less than 300 pixels more on the horizontal axis and a bit more than 200 pixels more on the vertical axis (like adding 280 and 210 on todays 16 Mpix sensors would do the trick and conserve the 4/3 sensor ratio).
Good idea by Panasonic to use the new technology in the most expensive camera and than later roll it out to GH5, GX10 (assuming GX8 will be announced soon), OM-D E-M1 MarkII etc.
if they also add 1080p 120 fps (or even 240), if necessary in burst like on the fs700, i’m in!
I don’t know why everyone assumes these 16 stops DR will translate !:1 to stills … video cameras have had higher DR for a while now (RED, Blackmagic just to name two). I’m not even sure this 18Mp sensor will make it into a Lumix. Traditionally, Panasonic’s dedicated video cameras have had different sensors from their Lumix cameras. Now it makes sense to converge both world’s (and Panasonic has been working on that), but it’s not 100% sure the time has already come. Although 18MP make it probable, because you don’t need that many pixels for 4k.
In conclusion, people who are setting themselves up for 16 stops DR in stills are gping to be disappointed.
For stills the key thing that interests me is that 12800 ISO with almost no noise. That is insane and I would buy a GX8 with that sensor in it just for that. The rest of the specs is just a bonus. Even if for stills it somehow only translated into 6400 ISO being like how the current 3200 ISO is I’d still be a buyer. It would be extremely useful in low light with m43
no grain, even if its true, can just mean a lot of noise reduction.
I have to admit that would be a bit hilarious if they just increased the blur to get rid of grain. lol. My guess is that 12800 is a pipe dream, I’d love it if it were true but I’m not getting my hopes up, there has to be some gimmick there because its too large of a leap. If they got 6400 ISO to what my GM1 can do at 3200 ISO I’d be willing to upgrade for that.
But that’s for video. If they can do full sensor readout, then downscaling 18 Mpx to 2 Mpx (FullHD) will give you pretty clean image at high ISOs. You can try it yourself, take a shot at 12800 and scale it down to 1920×1080. With noise reduction carefully fine-tuned for video use, you can probably get very nice results. For 4K, that’s not going to be as effective, but will still improve things.
Another thing, is that for a video camera, they can replace Bayer CFA with those color splitters they’ve been boasting about some time ago. That’s easy for video, as you just need to output the final result. But for stills, that is rather impractical, as it requires totally different algorithms for decoding RAW files. You can ask Sigma shooters how happy they are that they can only process their RAW files with software provided by Sigma. Unless of course Panasonic decides to add option to save Linear DNG files for RAWs.
So all those claims might be true for video, but not necessarily translate to stills.
Keep in mind that in a AG AF-101 form factor juggernaut, it’s easier to stack a huge battery, a chip set that means business and zero compromises on the circuitry.
I believe that given the same sensor, its very possible to pull some extra on the AG AF that you won’t get on a GX8.
(edit) let’s just wait for the GX-8 and see how it turns out, regardless of what sensor…
the true ,we don’t know the name of new GX called GX8,
we don’t know specs ,design about new AG/AF ,
we don’t know new sensor and specs 18mp on AG/AF successor and may use on EM1 successor
Maybe they broaden the sensor to get rid off too much crop in 4k.
Ooops, is that possible to already have this sensor in GX8?
not sure,this new about camcorder or hybrid ,it’s not mean RF top model(GX)
No chance in hell. The sensor would cost more than the camera.
I was thinking of moving from GH4 over to A7s, but this makes me wait.
If this is as good as they say, MFT future secured.
I’m getting it if it offers 4k 50p and dual recording for backup. I won’t move to 4k until it reaches 50p. Let’s hope it’s there!
So will this thing shoot jpeg and raw and have a flash for $4k??
a flash on a video camera?
Flash video yeah pallywood.
I hope it records 10-bit 4:2:2 in HD onto an SD card similar to BMPCC and the same quality in 4K to an external format, in addition to 4K 8-bit on an SD card.
That sure sounds like the fabled Panasonic/Fuji “organic” sensor we’ve been hearing about for years now. Here’s hoping… Maybe a bigger body solves the rumored heat displacement issues.
4K 60p , 240fps slow-mo,Global shutter, ND filter , choices of codec h.264 & h.265. 10 bits RAW , internal dual recording 4K SSD & SDXC, around $3,000, my new dream camera.
Hard to believe that a MFT sensor will be able to do “Useable ISO (almost no grain) up to 12,800”
Also why 18MP for photos it’s supposed to be a god damn video camera, 12MP is already plenty enough for 4k video plus you’d get better low light capabilities with 12MP.
I’m thinking of switching to m43 from Nikon. At this moment I’m using a d800 ( a superb stills camera) but I’m not happy with the video it produces. Will this AG-AF100 succesor be able to shot stills, let’s say in a studio environment with studioflashes? I understand if it’s hard to answer right now. 🙂 I am doing more video work at this moment and this seems like the dream Camera for me. But it would be nice if it could be used as a hybrid, being able to shot fine stills with as well. Otherwise I can wait until GH5 launches.
This new camera in the rumours is said to cost 3-4K. So it’s a semi pro camera. It’s way more expensive than a D800/ GH4 /GH4/ 5DM3.
I own a production company and we use a current AF100 with all Nikkor lenses and a D810 (D800 previously). You will really like the way an AF100 (or the new rumored cam) and your Nikon glass work together. Our AF100 with a Metabones Speedbooster and our Nikon lenses inter-cut fine with Canon C100 and C300 footage (I actually am not a fan of the ‘look’ of the Canon cams in general and prefer the Panny/Speedbooster/Nikon mojo). We do it all the time with great results. I doubt you’ll get much use of this new cam with studio strobe set-ups though, keep your D8000 for that kind of work.
What do people keep talking about the FUJI/PAnasonic organic sensor ?? That is Research and is years away, in any case that will probably be an APS-C sized sensor not m43. m4/3 sensors have a small market only Panasonic/Olympus use them so it makes no sense for a sensor division to make 4/3 because the market is small.
My bet is the next GX camera will just have the GH4 technology in the GX& package. i.e. Have 4k 30p, dfd, new screen (probably like gh4) and a bigger evf and the same GH4/EM1 Sensor.
Panasonic will just go with the “Wow look it can record 4K” 8MP image grabs which not many photographers really care about. It’s going to be another stop gap camera like the EM5 M2 and will cost $1000+. When the EM1 M2 the GX8 will be overshadowed again. Panasonic don’t seem to learn their lessons.
M43 was a great system in 2012. But 3 years of expensive “PRO” cameras and “PRO” lenses have ruined that. It’s funny considering hardly any pro use m43.
Here in the UK
Olympus OMD-EM1 + 12-40mm lens = £1500
but for this you could get
Fuji XT1 + 18-55 F2.8-F4 + XF 35mm 1.4 = £1504
Seriously M43 cameras are extremely overpriced now.
Interesting. But I’m betting Oly is going to get sensor scraps for a few iterations. Maybe the gx8 will be same ol’, and maybe the em1ii will out perform it by a negligible margin, as did the mk1 over the gx7. But the next real upgrade in sensor tech will very likely be in a panny (Gh5).
And, come on …the fuji is nice but has flaws abound. Certainly more than the slight IQ improvement from the aps sensor.
Exactly. Some people seem to think that m43 should automatically be cheaper because it’s got a smaller sensor.
But there’s been this sensor obsession for many years now completely ignoring everything else about a camera.
And the irony is that all the high end cameras have sensors that are good enough for 95% of us and nobody is going to notice the difference in our photos.
And the other things that make a camera good will have far more impact.
1) I think m43 should be cheaper because in low light Fuji has a stop advantage over m43.
2)The original rationale for m43 was to use smaller sensor for shorter focal lengths, why? So that they could make smaller, sharper, wide aperature lenses at a good price. This seemed to be going well with the 20mm 1.7, 45mm 1.8 which were as good as more expensive “pro” Canon and Nikon glass.
In 2012 m43 users were getting compact lightweight system with bang for the buck in terms of quality. You lost a stop or two of IQ and dynamic range due to lower quality sensors and image compression due to shorter focal lengths. Overall it was a good compromise.
Now in 2015, m43 cameras are more expensive than DSLRs. You can get a Nikon D800 for the cost of the EM1. Also, m43 cameras like the EM1 are no smaller than their APS-C variants. Sony has a new FF system, its APS-C system is growing all the time. Fuji has developed an entire range of these quality cameras and lenses and these cost less than their m43 equivalents.
It’s not about fanboyism, it’s about asking what are you getting for your money and are there better tools available. I sold my m43 system in December due to the stagnation.
IMO m43 is caught in a death spiral. Products are too expensive compared to competitors so they can’t gain market share. This means that no image sensor company wants to invest to make better 4/3 sensor as volumes will be uneconomical. This leaves Panasonic (who is the only game in town for 4/3 sensor development) who are dragging their heels because they know that developing a new sensor is very expensive for a system that night be dead in 2 years, that’s why there is a bottleneck.
A quick look at Amazon shows the EM1 body running $1300 vs $3000 for an 800/810, so I’m not sure how they’re the same cost.
As for size, below are a couple comparisons. I own a D5100 and a few M43’s and I always grab one of the M43’s going out the door. There’s just no comparison for travel and portability.
You mention that better tools are available. There are shots (which stress portability and stabilization) I get with the M10 that I would never get with the 5100. In those cases M43 is the better tool. If you’re a pro shooting sports or in the studio, go DSLR FF. In those cases, it’s the better tool.
The combination of portability, cost (don’t buy when the equipment first comes out), lens selection and ease of adapting cheap vintage lenses (coupled with focus peaking) was the reason I made the move.
I agree that M43 has a tall order competing with the canikon juggernauts. So does Fuji and Pentax. But that has more to do with very large established customer bases and huge marketing machines.
When canikon finally bites bullet and comes out with serious APSC and FF mirrorless systems that could be the end for a number of competing systems, M43 included.
But in the meantime, have fun. I’m glad you made the move to another system better suited to your needs. I moved from Nikon to M43 for the same reason.
Mark Marko just has lens envy.
Interesting comments,, but I strongly disagree with many of your points.
First, anyone who claims MFT is “in a death spiral” and seeks to be perceived as objective has a steep mountain to climb. You have an agenda, and that is fine. We all do.
Regardless, to your first point – Fuji has a stop over MFT. You need that stop above all else, buy a Fuji. I’d argue that depending on focal length, MFT has a LENS that can get you that stop back and more, and cost you less. You’re AF also suffers with the Fuji. And perhaps the OS is too slow. And perhaps the camera just feels like s**t in your hands. Perhaps the jpg color is flat (imo it is), perhaps the Fuji mount lens selection doesn’t do it for you. etc etc etc. But if you need that stop above all else, buy the Fuji.
On to full frame. FF is great. I love the images that come from today’s FF cameras. FF rips MFT in low light. No argument there. The thing about full frame is this: The lenses are freaking huge. And there’s no way around it. Sony A7x is as small a the E-M1, but only so with no lens attached. Mount some real glass and you have an SLR sized camera in your hands. Might as well buy that D800 or 7di because there’s a much better lens selection from Canon and Nikon. Unless you resign to every owning 2 lenses (and one is not a tele…$$$$), the Sony a mount is not for most.
Your other point purporting to have some exclusive handle on markets and the general camera business are just going to be rejected if you dont mind, since after all you’re just a dude on the web. But while the use of APS sensor size is common, the lens mount standards are widely fragmented. Same for FF.
MFT has one of the best, if not THE best lens line up of any camera system. Their bodies have some of the most advanced tech available in consumer cameras. And for the purposes of 99% of the photos most people take, the current sensors produce enough ISO and DR performance to yield stellar photos on par with FF.
Guys, I have a really bad feeling.
Is it 100% sure that the sensor itself really has 16+ DR stops? Just think about it, e.g. dubling the time rate in a trivial way (e.g. 120 fps instead of 60) would make possible a software-based HDR recording.
What about slow motion? I hope the AF101 successor be able to record 120fps with sound in 1080p. Being able to punch while recording to check focus is crucial & needs to be implemented into the system. It was a major oversight in the GH series of cameras.