The recently published Panasonic United States Patent 8749893 discloses a lens design description for a f/1.8 prime lens series. The mentioned lenses are:
12mm f/1.8
16mm f/1.8
26mm f/1.8
30mm f/1.8
50mm f/1.8
All have a similar kind of design and inner focusing. As usual with patent it’s hard to say if these lenses will ever become real products.
85 Responses
The 12 would be welcome. The O12 is looking kind of old and overpriced now since the 2.8 zooms are sharper and render just as well.
exactly the existing 12mm is way way too expensive
we need an affordable 12mm f/1.8 lens (under $500 USD)
We need all of them in the realm of 300$. Don’t forget those lenses are much easier to produce than APSC or FF lenses. If Panasonic wants to sell a lot of them and the m43 system to grow it must consider this price tag of 300-400$ for each lens.
Are they? And why? Just because there is less glass needed?
I would say it is the opposite. On a smaller sensor the lens has to resolve better to have an equally sharp result as on a bigger sensor. That means there is less tolerance in production, which is far more expensive.
You’re exactly right. It’s far easier to make a larger format lens for the reasons you stated.
It’s also easier to produce a good design when your design parameters allow for a heavier lens. You can add extra elements to correct aberrations which you may be restricted from doing when the target is small and light.
Or you may have to use exotic (read expensive) glass to achieve the same effect.
And the production tolerances have to be much stricter as any misalignments have a disproportionate effect .
Samyang 12mm F2… no AF but at 12mm it almost doesn’t matter.
how is the 12mm old?
OFF
Dear colleagues, please forgive me about this little (though
smart) hack which closely resembles to spamming, flooding, trolling, etc. but
you should consider that I do it for that noble intention to make the idea of
square-shaped multi orientation and multi aspect ratio sensor
as popular as it’s possible.
And to make real our knowledge for both the people and the manufacturers
that this would be a killer feature for our Micro Four
Thirds system!
A square multi orientation multi aspect ratio
sensor makes the so-called portrait grip (and the body camera
rotating) absolutely useless: you can always hold the camera in its natural (‘landscape’)
position and change the orientation just by pressing a dedicated button, switch
etc. even if you want to shot in portrait mode. Don’t
confuse this with classical square-sensor systems: unlike e.g. some medium-format
cameras, in our case the square multi aspect and orientation sensor should
cover not just the image circle for 1:1 (square) format but also for 4:3
portrait, 4:3 landscape, 16:9 portrait and 16:9 landscape modes respectively,
see the illustration below (omitted the 4:3 modes for simplicity). Somewhat similar
to ‘conventional’ multi aspect ratio sensors – and as opposite to classical
square formats – in our case there is no mode where all the pixels from the
whole sensor would be used simultaneously.
For DSLRs this would be a real challenge as the mirror assembly
should be increased to house the bigger multi orientation mirror/pentaprism, but
for mirrorless systems there are no major technology issues to use a square-shaped
sensor. Moreover, a simple tilting screen/viewfinder would be enough for all
situations, no need for swivelling. Worth to note that all current lenses are
already compatible with this new approach.
Considering the major importance I will post this illustration
in every upcoming threads here, in 43rumors, from now on. Hope both
our admin and you, guys will forgive me for this kind of ‘harassment’ but this
is a small price paid for trying to make this killer feature as standard for
future M43 bodies.
The idea is good but it may be to expensive to implement!
Don’t think so, just the sensor should be a bit bigger. Though may be a little problem with the shutter but I hope mechanical shutters will became anyway history in a short time.
Not just the Sensor, the EVF too. And the lenses might be also not usable for the to directions, because they are sometimes constructed for the landscape picture.
As far as I know all the lenses – at least MFT ones – are symmetrical. On the other hand – at least on cheaper models – the EVF doesn‘t necessarily need to be square as well, the black area on the margin can be used for showing exposure parameters, histogram, etc.
Are you sure that m43 lenses are axis-symmetrical?
I thought that lenses in general (and m43 ones too) were optimised for the sensor they were being used on – meaning chaning the size/shape of the sensor meant moving into bad optical “real estate”.
I’m only an occasional photographer so wouldn’t really know. I just posted because I’m interested
I had the chance to see a disassembled (legacy) lens and there were no physical limiters to prevent the individual lens or group being assembled in the ‘wrong’ direction. Everything in the interior was perfectly round.
The only thing should count is that all relevant part of the sensor should be inside the image circle.
The only issue would be with lens hoods. By the way, wasn’t it the GH2 that had a multi-aspect sensor?
Normal and medium tele lenses always have simmetrical (rounded) hoods. There may be a problem on wide/ultrawide lenses but usually these lenses are seldom used in portrait mode anyway.
The PL 25mm has a rectangular hood. The Olympus 12-40 has an asymmetrical pedal hood. And those are just the ones I own personally.
I also own the Bower 7.5mm fisheye which has an integrated asymmetric pedal hood. Come to think of it, 3/5 lenses I currently own have asymmetric hoods. The other two are telephoto lenses.
Fortunately these hoods (except for ultra-wide angle where portrait modes are not really used anyway) are removable, so you can use either the ‘new’ or third party simmetrical hoods in the unlikely case if my idea was implemented.
why don’t they make circular sensors then? Then you could crop to whatever format you wanted or have a native circular image that took full advantage of the lens’ image circle
That becomes challenging from a manufacturing and performance standpoint because then you have to deal with the fact that some lines on the sensor are much shorter than others. It’s easier to make a larger sensor and simply ignore defects in the corners. Then you get a slightly larger yield, offsetting the cost of the larger sensor.
This is just one thing. The other is that – as shown in the image – the appropriate square sensor has no larger surface at all.
Yeah, you wouldn’t be saving much by going round.
I’ve been neglecting my blog, but here is my longer discourse on this topic.
http://leicaapostate.com/index.php?file=20130928__CCP_1(46)1_Aspect_Ratio
I’m going for 0.8×0.8, rather than the 0.87×0.87 proposed here. 33% larger, as compared to 58% larger, than the 4:3 sensor.
Actually, Panasonic makes all of their sensors except for the GH3s, and they make the EM1 sensor for Olympus
Oh god, why why? No ultra wide angle prime, no affordable 1.4 primes, no fast tele primes. Go home, Panasonic!
I hope they won’t became real product. What this system do need desperately is a F1.4 series.
Exactly !!
I think the f/1,8 series will have an acceptable price, and the pro series will have f/1,2
Why desperately? Nice to have option,but sure not desperate. Quite big choice of high quality glass in this range. But telephoto range sure needs some help, so far nothing but slow and not really good lenses.
Yep. I almost think the f/1.8 aren’t worth the bother unless they’re all super compact pancakes. Where the interest lies is with f/1.4 and faster primes. The PL 25mm f/1.4 is really the only prime on MFT I’m completely happy with. I find the system needs that extra speed, especially if it’s targeting professionals.
Bring them on Panasonic, we need them.
Interesting, perhaps Panasonic is planning on “prime primes”, similar to Sigma Art series.
Maybe it’s even sigma producing them.
A 12/1.8 and a 16/1.8, if their IQ was really good, would be just what quite some people including myself still find to be missing in Micro Four Thirds. While I perhaps wouldn’t go and buy the 12mm lens straight away, since I’ll probably rather be covering the wider angles with a zoom like I’m still doing with the FT DSLR, I’d very much like to have that 16mm lens as a compact and fast walk-around option, just what the M.Zuiko 17/1.8 should have been but didn’t quite become because of IQ issues.
If the M.Zuiko 1,8/17 doesn’t quite do it, maybe the PL15 does. In any events that FoV at that speed is pretty much covered, both by Panasonic and Olympus, I don’t think the 1.8/16 is going to happen.
You may be right. And meanwhile, the PL 15mm is indeed on my list of lenses to have a closer look at, when my transition from FT to MFT will finally come.
Can we have a 10mm, please!
+1.
After oly introduces the 300/4, an ultra wide prime will be the only big gap left. The 7-14/2.8 will be heavy and $$$.
Except 400m 5.6, unless a 1.4x converter is launched also
Well, more options. Don’t see a real must have here for me though. Not that I really need anything, but an 18mm 1.2 might be nice to have. Not to mention an ultra wide.
Hmm. Maybe the consortium is splitting their resources — Olympus to do the budget f1,8 lenses, and Panasonic to do the Pro >f1.4 range? Would make sense. Hopefully they start giving us _weathersealed_ primes this year.
Weathersealed primes. I’m talking about _weathersealed_ primes. I have no idea why people keep not seeing the part where I mention _weathersealed_ and tell me about lenses I already know about.
Don’t worry dude, you are the target of their strategy. Soon you will receive some hot info.
you mean f/3.6
🙂
STFU
You’re right, though. That’s why I expect these to be affordable budget lenses, maybe even pancakes.
Zzzzz… Zzzzzz……
Make it happen , please .
Especially the 50mm looks good replacement for M.ZuikoDigital 45mm F1.8 if Pana really can build to live up to the legendary Zuiko optic .
No Leica certified please cause this should be an affordable lens for everyone .
Nobody wants to make a native UWA prime, what a pity…
Here is a short write up on the Kowa Super Wide 8.5mm F2.8. It’s not a fisheye lens and has a threaded barrel for filters. http://mellenbogen.com/kowa-super-wide-micro-four-thirds-lenses/
That Kowa sounds sweet! We’ll have to wait for price and IQ tests, but a super wide will be very useful
Hello,
Thanks for your link. I saw Kowa lens in rumors43 fews monthes ago, and still waiting for.the 8.5mm/2.8. Is there some pictures taken with in internet?.
It would be great to see a full line of consistently designed, small, fast, weather sealed, aperture ring fitted primes with the Leica aesthetic but not the full Leica tax. And please add an ultra wide, non fisheye please!
Here is a short write up on the Kowa Super Wide 8.5mm F2.8 that I saw at Cine Gear 2014. It’s not a fisheye lens and has a threaded barrel for filters. http://mellenbogen.com/kowa-super-wide-micro-four-thirds-lenses/
The Kowa Prominar 8.5mm looks VERY promising!
Hopefully the pricing will be reasonable.
I have gotten a bit spoiled by the 7mm end of the 7-14mm, but an ultra-wide, non-fisheye prime will be a good addition to the native M4/3 stable of lenses!
I wish they would up the PRO status of these lenses and offer them at least at f/1.4. Olympus already does f/1.8 for their primes and this would be more of the same. At a minimum, these lenses NEED to be weather sealed!
Imagine yourself out there in wind and rain, changing primes… unless you go for a very specific bad weather shot – which is a fairly limited use case – weather sealed zooms make more sense.
It’s more a case of I’m hiking lightly on a day excursion, carrying just a 14mm on my EM5, when suddenly there’s either a dust storm or rain. That was how I lost a Ricoh GRD to an unexpected shower in the middle of a forest. Or I fall into a stream, which has happened a couple of times before.
Yawn. 1.4 or better or bust. I Echo the weather sealed piece. Would be nice if they had OIS too since Panasonic hasn’t figured out how stabilize the sensor in it’s flagship GH series (heat).
Releasing these primes will satisfy just about no one. Only if they were really cheap. Say sub 250.
A 1.8 12mm for $500 will steal every O12 sale. Some of those focal lengths are really not needed, but the O12 isn’t as sharp as the pro zooms and doesn’t really render any better (maybe better bokeh than the 12-40). The only advantage is a bit of speed and smaller size. All for about the same price as the pro zooms. A reasonably priced, quality 12mm would be fantastic (and reasonable is near $500, not slow Sigma sub $250 pricing)
Qhy are Pana and Oly afraid of primes wider than 12mm? 1.8 is probably a little bright for that, but anyway …
I agree I’d like some wider primes but I think the reason they hesitate is because the short flange distance makes wide lenses tricky. But +1 for more wides, even if expensive.
Unstabilised F1.8 = stabilised 2.8 zoom (OK don’t get too serious) If they are trying to compete on image quality they should be aiming for F1.4. Maybe this is Pana who have never done a 1.8 ever aiming to patent block Oly’s everthing is F1.8 strategy but not actually make any of them?
So, when you’re shooting sports, before taking a picture you scream out “CAN YOU ALL MOVE A LITTLE SLOWER, I’M USING A STABILIZED LENS HERE” or what, how does it work?
that’s funny!
Who said these are for micro 4/3rds?
Looks like aps-c numbers.
12/1.8 for APS-C???
Why not? Thats 18mm for Full Frame.
Which would be hard to do with those few elements.
Time for Oly and Panny to man up and give us the 1.4’s.
Still waiting on a 12mm f/1.4, 17.5 f/1.4, 25 f/1.4, 42.5 f/1.4, all sealed, with metal mount, metal build, fast focus, and sharpness from wide open.
We need something between Nocticron quality and PanaLeica 25/f1.4 quality.
In black.
Not silver or glossy grey.
ADMIN, PUBLIC DEMANDS VOTING!!! 🙂
Where are the 6/7 and 9/10 mm primes? Do we really need a prime lens for every mm in the 14-17 mm range before we get a rectilinear super-wide prime lens?
The Japanese optics companies by and large have transferred responsibility for UW primes to Samyang. Which is fine, as the latter makes excellent lenses and manual focus is ok for UWs. The problem is, they make nearly nothing for m43, except for that one fisheye.
+10000000000000
The system is grossly overpriced, some primes with a sensible aperture (ie not too fast) might get sensible prices instead. This would be a refreshing novelty, and good for survival. Nobody buys the “pro” crap for that tiny sensor.
Could these be for a Panasonic APS-C Lens group?
Tune In…
If it is not to expensive, then the 12mm would be very interresting.
Zzz. Sorry but almost evry focal length here is close to covered… and not at an unreasonable cost on most cases.
I am really hoping for a 100mm f4 macro. Small sharp wide open and fast focussing… could e the same size as thr 60mm macro.
But more primes, I mean cmon… people ain about the 12 from oly because of the price performance issue, yet most users seem vry happy, the 14mm seems a solid lens with easy to fix ca, the 15mm seems a very solid lens, the 17mm f1.8 is a solid lens, the 19mm sigma is a solid lens, the 20mm pana is a solid lens,the 25mm pana and oly are solid lenses, the 30mm sigma is a solid lens… anyway,I could go on.
Point is a 100mm macro at f4 would be great for a lot of hobbiests size would be reasonable, price would be reasonable and it would probably find its way into many bags… it is a gaping hole… while the UWA primes are light on the ground, the zooms exist as do primes… but we have 2 macros, a 45, and a 60… lets get that 100 done.
Still good to see them iterating, the lack of these lenses in the Apsc marketis probably what they are gunning for.
In addition to weather sealing, please give us all metal construction along with distance scales and aperture rings. Agree it should not come with Leica branding so should not be at a huge premium.
Would be good to see a set of primes that are fast like these that don’t break the bank like the ones we currently can choose from. Even the EOS M has a great fast prime lens for like $120 new (even if the camera is only meh).
Gimme! 16mm, because there is a gaping hole between 14, 15mm and all the 17mm choices available.
then the 12mm would be very interresting.
http://ict3.com/
Which would be hard to do with those few elements
http://ict3.com/canteral-telephone
Here is a short write up on the Kowa Super Wide 8.5mm F2.8 that I saw at Cine Gear 2014. It’s not a fisheye lens and has a threaded barrel for filters.http://mellenbogen.com/kowa-su.
http://epanasonic.net/
Please Panasonic bring 12/1.8 prime!!!!!!!!!!!