The E-P5 is here but a rumor site is always hungry and we collected two info about the next Olympus MFT camera. As you it’s coming in Spetember and it will be the new OMD model (E-M6?). Two rumors came right out of the E-P5 presentation:
1) Our friend Pekka Potka wrote: “Quite obvious to everyone seeing E-P5 should be that the next OM-D series model goes well above E-M5 in features. Incorporating VF-4 should be just one of them. And that is all I can say now…”
2) Olympus employees at the PEN Collection 2013 Fair said that next OMD will have phase detection AF (Source: biglobe).
It’s not the first time we get this rumors and and both features are very likely to make into the new OMD model. What are you hoping to get with the new OMD?
—–
E-M5 body
Price checks at [shopcountry 29074]
E-M5 Case:
There is the official [shoplink 31898 ebay]CS-36FBC Olympus case[/shoplink]. A [shoplink 31899 ebay]leather half case from Hong Kong[/shoplink]. A full [shoplink 31900 ebay]leather case with strap from Cina[/shoplink]. Than we have half cases from two well known producers, [shoplink 31901 ebay]Zelenpol[/shoplink], [shoplink 31906 ebay]Kaza[/shoplink] and [shoplink 31902 ebay]Gariz[/shoplink].
E-M5 Batteries, and other things:
The [shoplink 31905 ebay]Olympus GS-4 strap[/shoplink] and the [shoplink 31903 ebay]DSTE E-M5 batteries[/shoplink] you have to use with an extra charger. There is an [shoplink 31903 ebay]E-M5 car charger[/shoplink] a [shoplink 31908 ebay]new E-M5 LCD screen[/shoplink] and a [shoplink 31909 ebay]Front Cover+ Top Panel[/shoplink].
218 Responses
I’m not so sure that Olympus will follow the ‘Phase-detection-on-sensor’-hype. Just don’t forget that almost all but the currently highest speed AF mirrorless camera (G6) uses phase detection on sensor. 😀
It’s not a matter of speed. Current AF is more than fast enough. It’s a matter of:
– Subject tracking ability
– Good AF with 4/3 lenses (designed for phase detect, and not contrast detect AF)
I’m also not sure if Olympus will use the on-sensor phase detect technique or some other (they stated they don’t like the on-sensor one because of the loss of IQ), but they must do something to provide those two features mentioned above.
really (g6), personally i think correction(CA,Distortion ) in camera can develop by their team,
but AF must developer by 2 company,join team,because auto focus that different by TYPE make
their camera is low performance , and make M43 protocol is unstable.
PDAF will be essential to stay competitive. Then they can start bringing out some fast long glass, at last.
Better VF? Not a biggy, personally. But progress will keep progressing….
I’m hoping for a reasonable price, but after seeing the E-P5 price, I know it’s just wishful thinking. =P
+1
ha! +1
I agree….but whatever it costs, it will be a great camera (that half the people on this site will whinge about), AND hold its value. No doubt.
Bob .b
“(that half the people on this site will whinge about)”
If we make concerted effort we may get to 100% by the time it comes out.
True. With the E-P5 body being $1000 might give Olympus a reason to increase the E-M6 body only price even though the E-M5 came out at $1000. I surely hope not.
What am I hoping to get with the new OMD? Exactly what the two rumours you posted say: A new bigger viewfinder, and phase detect AF! I’m holding onto my pro Olympus lenses just for this kind of news… and here I was thinking just yesterday that maybe I should just sell my 14-35 and 35-100 Olympus lenses for the inferior Panasonic lenses, nice as they are.
What am I hoping to get with the new OMD? Exactly what the two rumours you posted say: A new bigger viewfinder, and phase detect AF! I’m holding onto my pro Olympus lenses just for this kind of news… and here I was thinking just yesterday that maybe I should just sell my 14-35 and 35-100 Olympus lenses for the inferior Panasonic lenses, nice as they are.
What am I hoping to get with the new OMD? Exactly what the two rumours you posted say: A new bigger viewfinder, and phase detect AF! I’m holding onto my pro Olympus lenses just for this kind of news… and here I was thinking just yesterday that maybe I should just sell my 14-35 and 35-100 Olympus lenses for the inferior Panasonic lenses, nice as they are.
You seem to be quite excited 🙂
Never mind: So am I.
Max just maxed-out! :-O
Along with the better viewfinder and PDAF;
* Better videomode – 25fps, a better codec, Audiolevels.
* Timelapse mode.
* FocusPeaking.
* wifi
I guess all those will come. I’d add also:
– Better ergonomics out of the box (meaning not to be forced to buy an additional grip to have them). It probably should be slightly bigger, better buttons, bigger grip.
– Better battery life
I agree – can afford to be a little bigger – OMD sacrificed ergonomics for size just a little too much.
It wouldn’t look as good in advertisements though, and if consumers are genuinely irritated by the size of the grip, they will pay for the larger grip. Consumers are less likely to pay for a smaller replacement grip if it feels like they are forking out extra cash to subtract from the camera.
Agree! It should be bigger. The reason I didn’t buy the OMD was the size. To small in my hand. Big disapointment to me this. The PEN actually fits better. The OMD shouldnt be smaller than the PEN.
Is it because Asians have smaller hands?
I have relatively big hands, I am not Asian, and I think it will be a mistake to make the base OM-D much bigger. A little bit to get better layout of buttons, etc, and perhaps to get better battery life. I have the extra grips for the OM-D, but have never used them — not even with the mFT 75-300 lens.. Don’t forget that a key reason for buying into mFT is the small size. Not only for lenses, but also for the body. I realize that some of the high quality FT lenses may necessitate a bigger grip, but a solution as for the E-M5 may be a good compromise.
Anyway, most likely the new EVF will make a hump larger than on the E-M5.
To use F/T lens on OM-D will anyway be a compromise.
The i hope is if Olympus come by 6-axis IS, there camera give focus on sensor by move sensor, and maybe will give focus on old OM lens also. 😉
Umm…actually one of the whole ideas is to make these cameras small. There are loads of them out there that are bigger!
You could add a battery holder to make it bigger, or a leather case.
Give the next PEN a viewfinder for those who like super duper small, and then scale the OMD slightly to get a decent grip. It would still be a small camera, but now its too small to hold properly with one hand without grip (I dont like grip. Cant even change the battery without detaching)… The PENs actually got a better one hand grip (wierd).
For me the PEN is the entusiast level, whilst the OMD is more like a semi-pro-ish. Hence it does not matter if its a tad bit bigger than the PEN, s only natural and makes it better to work with because you can actually hold it and control it with one hand. It would still be insanly much smaller than any FF or APS.
Size and concept are about right. If you want bigger there are many many fine brands and cameras to choose from. As Americans would say, your welcome to go elsewhere if here is not to your liking.
All my 4/3 glass is fine on the e-m5 with the exception of af speed. Even without the extera grip which I do use depending on what I am doing.
Any one noticed that regulars and users tend to call it E-m5 and drifters call it OMD. That’s a ‘tend to’ not an ‘all do’.
As a pro or semi-pro product, I hope they will replace the IAuto, SCN and Art positions for a C1, C2 and C3 presets like in any serious camera.
+1!
+100
Very good comment. That would also alleviate the need for a lot of extra buttons. 3 custom settings on dial and 5 programmable buttons/dials would allow for a wide range of ‘at finger tip’ control. I would prefer an additional custom setting (4 total that is) to additional buttons.
Image quality is already great on the OMD.
Hopefully we will see better video features with that.
there is not much doubts about the key features of next OMD …and I dare to say the price body only will be 1499$
It will have to be if the E-P5 is to have a chance at selling.
By October or November or whenever this thing releases the EP5 will be 700
What am I hoping for in the new OMD? A suitable replacement for 4/3 E5! So I can use the excellent 4/3 lenses I am lucky to have. Body needs to ergonomically support the larger 4/3 lens size (= a slightly larger OM body). I use both E5 and OMD and both have their niche places; but a combination system would be nice.
My guess:
E-M6 will be annouced next year.
i.e.
2011 E-P3
2012 E-M5
2013 E-P5
2014 E-M6
….
Every rumor stated that it would arrive in September.
I think they mentioned OMD pro in september…or do you think there is only 1 OMD model at a time …?
Better video & audio recording quality and capability.
Better ergonomics including streamlined manual controls & the return of the thumbwheel on the back (as per EP3)
Yes Please,
Better Audio recording similar to Nokia HDR tech and better video AVCHD v2.0 with Full Manual Control over the video.
ISO 100, and ideally something all the way down to ISO 25 – not for better quality, but so I can stop carrying an ND when I’m shooting with fast glass in the daytime. Wifi remote for tethered shooting. HDMI live out when shooting video, and longer record times.
Olympus, please less cameras and more lens… (12 60, 35 100).
+100
I also hope for faster, well built and dedicated lenses! IMHO the e-m5 is more than sufficient for most situations. That’s where I wanna spend my money on. Not on another cam! IQ depends a lot on quality glass. So oly, where are the fast zooms! No more mediocre glass or lens updates!
Yes! I still want a 25mm f1.8. A basic, absolutely standard lens that was the #1 purchase of millions in SLR days. (50mm equivalent).
20mm 1.7 or 25m 1.4 out of your financial reach?
Better video and audio recording quality and capabilities.
Better ergonomics including manual controls and thumbwheel at the back (as per the Fuji X1.)
Well this is a surprise. I knew eventually m43 would get a hybrid auto focusing system, just didn’t think it would come this year. With these improvements, the OM-D should easily stand out as the flagship camera in the system. I fully expect all the evolutionary upgrades in the E-P5 should be coming to the E-M6 as well (Wi-fi, focus peaking, 1/8000 shutter, etc). However, here are the a few requests, all quite possible, that I hope we’ll also see, but am not so sure will happen:
1) Improved build quality – The build of the E-M5 should be refined to eliminate the breakage problems certain users experienced.
2) Improved video features – It would be an utter waste of the incredible 5-Axis IBIS to not add any upgrades to video. 1080p/60, and improved bit rates at a minimum.
3) Improved ergonomics – Yes, there is an additional grip option. But the camera as is should be more comfortable to hold out of the box. This may require a slight size increase.
I am guessing the sensor technology will be primarily the same, but with PDAF added. This is truly a surprise to come out in the current year. Is it possible Olympus will be able to boost the E-M6’s image quality as well?
Just when the GAS was starting to build for the E-P5.
E-M5 was almost perfect, with passable continuous AF it will be perfect if:
– It has slightly better ergonomics (hard to reach fn1 was the reason I didn’t buy e-m5)
– is of same size & weight.
Hard to reach Fn1 was the reason you didn’t buy the EM5? There are three other customizable buttons, why not just use Fn1 for the least used function? I agree that that button is the hardest to use, but I hardly see it as a deal breaker. Personally, I use Fn1 as the manual/auto focus switch and then the Fn2 button for AEL/spot auto focus when in manual mode, then magnifying mapped to the button next to it. I even forgot what I mapped the Rec button on yo, that’s how many buttons you get on the EM5. 🙂
I was hoping for an OM-D PRO with better ergononics, more battery power, less classic design, better pro-support ..
.. not a state of the art E-M5 update.
There is a whole world of alternatives for you to choose from. Just go to a camera shop and try some out. I am sure you will find something you like without the need to change a whole well established popular product line.
I think they will go Phase detection on sensor because they can they use that sensor in their 43 and m43 cameras and make it play nice on 43 lenses.
For the E-M6 I hope little over the E-P5 features except for a newer sensor.
If it will only be a 1/2 stop tweak I will wait out for a another generation.
Wi-Fi, ISO 100, 1/8000s, Better EVF are all good features that I would want in a future camera. BUT 1stop better sensor in high ISO is a must for me. I like small and versatile/portable kit for evening shootings.
I also think that by then they will make a new HG f2.8 standard zoom and offer it as an expensive kit, along side the current weather sealed 12-50mm kit.
Like they did with E-P5 and 17mm f1.8
My guess is it will be $1650 as kit.
Better video.
+1
Condidering the extremely HQ 75mm lens I wonder if Oly has a higher resolution sensor in development. – Matching the 75mm (and the 4/3 super HQ’s). The upcoming sensor technologies has the potential for a 24 mpix m43 sensor “all else equal” quality. OK, I don’t know exacly, but in that direction….
The current sensor is great, bu technology evolves. Photographers always asked for resolution and this is a natural development. Like the Nikon D800 is not for everyone, a 24 mpix m43 would be for those who has the craftmanship and know why they want more resolution.
My wishes for the EM6 would be slightly better ergonomics, most importantly that they would switch the left/right positions for the front and back control wheels so the one closest to your nose was more to the right. As it is with the EM5, I have to use my index finger on the front of the camera even for the supposed-to-be backside wheel.
Other than that, the VF4 built in (preferably with a less pronounced hump compared to the EM5) and all other software features from the EP5, and then some more. 😉
I have the same problem with the back wheel, maybe because I use my good eye (the left :-)) for composing: I have to use my right hand pointing finger also for the back wheel. I suspect that the wheel layout is better on the E-P5 thanon he E-M5. Also: why not copy Nikon and put the on-off button below the wheel on the release button? Would free some space for Fn buttons as compared to the E-P5…
1. A slightly larger body, something along the OM-1 (should be comfy with heavier lenses).
2. Off-center spot metering, coupled with the selected AF area.
3. A small built-in flash for triggering remote units.
4. E-P5 build quality.
I would also make the grip slightly deeper. Even with the lens cap toy lens, the lens protrudes more than the grip on the EM5 so there’s clearly an opportunity there to improve handling without sacrificing any portability.
It’s funny, I don’t think I’ve ever shot without the HLD-6 on the camera, and the ergonomics are pretty good. And that grip is deep enough to let me use the Panny 14/2.5 as a body cap without taking any extra space in the bag.
I see them doing two models: one to replace the E-M5 and another to replace the E-5.
The OM-series camera bodies were never good with huge lenses, so they really wouldn’t try to do that, if they’re being sensible. They could go with something the size of the E-1 or Panasonic GH3, though.
If they don’t go with two bodies, they’ll alienate someone.
Yeah, don’t want to alienate the 100 or so people still shooting 4/3 worldwide. 😉
One not two.
Remove the hump, put the view finder on the left, put a small fill flash centre left.
Or soften the hump, like the g6.
Bigger built in grip. You’re going to stick a lens on the front, so might as well have a decent inbuilt grip.
Better battery, thanks to bigger grip.
Stronger buttons, hinges etc.
Bigger buttons, better ergonomics. They squashed too much into the last one.
Much better video specs. Mic in. Headphone out.
Inbuilt gps, HDR, panaroma.
Side card slot, x2.
1/8000 shutter.
Electronic shutter.
Bundle with a m43 SHG 15-35mm f/2.0.
I don’t need inbuilt wifi if it means you have to lose the decent grip.
This is a very good list! And it is all perfectly possible, just hope that Oly listens.
Few things I would add:
– Custom functions on the mode dial
– In-camera removal of CA in jpgs
– articulated screen
– 18Mp ?
And finally: A 300/4 lens, please
18, just 18! Why not 60mpx, if you want something to brag about go big!
There is a Nokia phone which has a 41 megapixel sensor, can you just go buy that so you can brag and just leave camera’s to people who want to take photo’s with good image quality, not brag about how many megapixels it has.
OMD already being a great camera its hard to see what would be really needed (except maybe for the video section)but the VF4 is surely in the new one. if its goin to be a proclass, i am very curious to its build quality. The AF section, really wondering about their solution, as Olympus mostly does things different. i dont think they will make the body bigger, maybe an updated HLD6 with more real estate.prob lots of minor changes too.
I have discussed the following some times (and am not sure it will work in practice…):
* What is the reason FT lenses do not give fast AF on mFT cameras/CDAF?
— CDAF is based on “jogging” the focus ring rapidly back and forth and thus experimentally building up information about the correct focus direction from changes in the image contrast
— FT lenses have too slow servo motors to enable this
— FT lenses have too low bandwidth in connectors, and it is not possible to transfer the necessary information fast enough between lens and body
* some 20-30 years ago (?), Contax made cameras where the focusing was done by moving the *film plane* instead of the lens elements in the lens.
* the “Contax principle” can be easily implemented as a sixth direction in the IBIS — theoretically speaking.
— by instead moving the sensor back and forth, the AF will be completely independent of the lens servo motor, and it will be completely independent of the bandwidth of the lens connectors.
— OK: it may be difficult to build a sixth direction in the IBIS, it may be difficult to give it the necessary travel distance (don’t know how much movement of the film plane was allowed in the Contax, but in the proposed solution less travel is needed — only sufficient to detect changes in contrast), and it may demand too much energy/power for realistic battery capacity
— don’t know how good AF tracking can be achieved, though: the principle is basically enabling fast CDAF for FT lenses…
without trying to guess about the tecnical tour de force achieving the Contax Way, it sounds like a very interesting one, since it would prob turn all manual focus lenses into AF versions.
If I remember correctly the Contax G allowed for about 1cm of movement, which was enough to focus a 90mm lens between approximately 1 meter and infinity. I think that a m4/3 camera would be much more limited because of the strict constraints in terms of light ray angles.
I envision an extending mechanical “arm” that can bridge between the camera and any lens and physically rotate the focus ring to obtain accurate focus, but that’s only science fiction.
sneye@ i think maybe Ulli mean Contax AX, there film plan move out or in for to give focus.
yes lmqø ..the AX, specifically designed as answer on stubborn Zeiss engineers’s claim that AF could not be implemented with their lenses
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjgV34PzKTA
This is a great fine tune method. The sensor does not have to move through the entire focus range. The lens motor takes it to a reasonable focus and the sensor then fine tunes. Or software drives the lens motor to one of 4 (maybe only 2, 3quarters and 1 quarter) set positions and then the sensor takes over.
Similarly a very thin 4/3 m43 adapter could be made and the sensor takes up the difference in the same way. Which is something I mentioned some months ago regarding 4/3 lens compatibility with m43 allowing a drop down, or slide across mirror paddle to be used for focus.
The Contax AX was huge with its moving film plane ! Much bigger than other DSLRs. I think that there was even a digital version, the Contax N.
the first 24×36 DSLR yes, but without the moving part. Very nice camera. bit ahead of its time.
“What are you hoping to get with the new OMD?”
E-P5 upgrades + these rumored features + decent integrated grip + built in flash.
A camera of class above E-M5 was rumored and Pekka Potka also says “next OMD,” not “E-M5’s successor.”
I think Oly would milk the E-M5 till the end, while also releasing even higher-end body: larger EVF? swivel LCD? dual card slot? 1/8000 shutter? higher flash sync speed? other perks?
And now again, the rumor is that it might have on-sensor PDAF, meaning that potentially the new body is fully compatible with the 43 lenses. The ultimate perk for the higher-end m43 body.
WTB LNIB ZD 12-60mm
Why? That lens is out of place on anything smaller than the E-x line. Too big and too heavy for small camera bodies with no grip.
Bodywise nothing will be changed I guess to save on retooling.
OM-D body will probably stay the same for at least 2 maybe 3 itterations.
Perhaps just some other materials under the mushy butons and reengineering of the LCD.
The hump was “big” to fit the VF-4 they knew was coming. So no redesign of the body needed.
Would love to see some PAL support.
The 12-60 was perfectly at home on my E-520, I don’t buy that it’s an E-X only lens. But then, I’ll use a Samyang 100-500mm on my E-M5 (but it does work better w a monopod)
Remember last year when during an interview an Olympus official stated that OMD was a camera series with a camera above and below the E-M5 coming. Also Pekka Pokta statement seems to indicate that it is the camera above the E-M5 is coming. The E-M5 is more likely to come early next year. Still I like the rumored features.
Dave
Everyone above thread that says bigger or more grip … The OMD system comes with both of these, you simply screw them on? More battery, more body, more balance.
I’d like to see the e-P5 button layout moved over to the e-M5, it looks like almost all of the new setup is an ergonomic improvement and the FN assignment idea is also useful. It makes sense to incorporate that, as well as the V4 EVF tech. The improved IBIS and shutter, all these features should show up. NO internal flash! That’s consumer gizmo junk. It would be great to see the OMD EVF with a 90D hinge, (When I saw the original e-M5 I thought they’d done that back then.)
I’d like to see usable, lower ISO choices, 100, 64, 25 would be a nice retro feature.
Lastly, a ZUIKO made Lens Boost adapter for OM lenses, [and a similar variation for 4:3.] If I am going to pay for a lens priced Speed Boost option. Give it to me in a Zuiko branding and optical quality …
Spoke to an Olympus rep who admits to knowing nothing officially, but best guesses include:
new 18MB sensor
fully articulating screen (the most requested feature)
Keeping up with the EP-5’s features is a no-brainer, so add those as well.
Personally, a mic input for third-party products would please me.
The larger issue for Olympus is lenses- they’ve addressed the fixed-lens-availability issue, now we need some quality zooms that can reach 2.8.
What I’d want in the next E-M6 ?
1) a white one !
2) a white one and
3) a white one 🙂
Then :
4) the same VF-4 as in the E-P5
5) a better placement of the main dial and buttons
6) the smaller AF box
7) the better implementation of the Mysets
8) the better HDR bracketing
8) the switch allowing you to change the behaviour of the two dials
9) wifi
10) GPS
11) longer battery life
12) horizontal grip available without the vertical one and allowing access to the inbody battery
13) please, neither bigger, nor heavier !
I don’t care for AF on the sensor and wouldn’t want it at the expense of IQ. I don’t care for AF tracking, what we have now in the E-M5 entirely fulfills my need already.
Only you don’t care about AF,
and for all Phase Detect for What?
if oly use phase detect we have M.Zuiko support only.
because Pany do not support this AF(see old rumors).
How many lens will use? and where F2.8 M.Zuiko lens.(wait for along time)
may good Lumix G 12-35mm/35-100mm is useless ,please sell i want it .555
What makes you think adding phase detect will remove contrast detect?
No sir,i mean if Pany do not support PD then lumix G lens was useless for PDAF but still work on CDAF
@rrr_hhh
Most of us do shoot moving objects need faster AF trekking and hence need PDAF sensor. Did you see any dead pixels (PDAF in Sensor) in any of the pictures taken on the Nikon V1, J1, V2 or Sony NEX-6? Let assume that the 1000 PDAF sensors replace the 1000 active sensors on a 16mp sensors – that only 0.006% of the total sensors. I doubt any pixel piper can notice it.
Yepp one White by tan leather. 🙂
I don’t have any HG 43 lens, and I wonder if there will be a kit for those who want to test Olympus/Zuiko 43 glass.
I’m not interested at all in video so if it was for me, I would remove it from the camara options.
VF-4 is useful but not necessary to me, compared to the existing one. I welcome it though.
I think it will have the same but tweaked sensor for better image quality.
Over all better construction.
I wish it had SCN and iAUTO options on the upper wheel removed, and have a C1 and C2 options e for 2 full custom modes.
I wish that the custom buttons (f1, REC) would be FULLY customizable.
It will be more expensive than Em-5 at its day 1.
I’m very happy with my E-M5, and I probably shouldn’t be buying an upgrade so soon (a year) after. Here’s a list of things that would make me realistically consider it:
– Better magnification in the VF (seems possible, from the rumour)
– ISO 100 (or equivalent)
– 1/8000
– Focus peaking
– And better movie options. I wouldn’t expect it to beat the GH series in that department, but I’d want it to be at least competitive enough to make us pause and consider. Better codec, line-in, an effort to minimize rolling shutter distortion, shutter speed per frame..
Unless it has all of this, I’m lost likely going to stick with the E-M5 for another couple years.
I really wait for tethered shooting. A must for reproductions, stilllife and much more. Or a wifi conection to my powerbook – not iphone only.
Using the M5 until half a year now, I don´t want to buy a new camera again.
I´m waiting for a firmware update enabling my M5 to make hdr aeb, focus peaking etc. I know that´s not realistic. But I don´t understand that. In the pc sector it is normal that a once bought device gets updates for better functionality. The M5 is not a discontinued model. It´s the current flagship and thus should have at least all the functions the pl5 has. It has to compete not only against other Oly models but against the models of all other manufacturers. And if Oly is getting too arrogant, I´m switching to Pany or Sony.
Panny is worst. Older sensor and there is no firmware update too ( no focus peaking for the GH3 for ex).
never mind EM6, how about firmware so we can assign exposure mode positions to specific “mysets” as per the EP5,
built in flash, fully articulated lcd, new sensor to differentiate from the pen line…
Speaking of Panny, when will we have the next GX rumor?
Ask to @admin
Yes, I’m far more interested in GX2.
A built-in flash. I will upgrade just to get that feature.
The only thing I dislike about the current OM-D is the clip-on flash.
I use my camera in two ways:
a) Kitchen Sink – I take my camera bag with a bunch of lenses, grip, flash, batteries, etc.
b) Light – I take the camera with one small lens attached and no accessories.
The clip-on flash adds bulk, and looks ugly as hell.
Don’t be silly, everybody — what you’re going to get will be the latest E-P feature set repackaged into the E-M line’s form factor. In other words, an E-P 5 except with a built-in viewfinder and an external flash, instead of the other way around. That way Olympus can share chips, firmware, etc. between the two lines, which is the only sensible way to do it.
That’s not bad — the E-P 5/VF-4’s improved EVF display, mechanical shutter, focus peaking, and WiFi all would be useful additions to an E-M model. More to the point, it would be hard to justify buying an E-M model if it lagged behind the E-P model’s features. And it would be silly for Olympus to keep making (and stocking parts for) a lower-spec and a higher-spec model.
The PDAF-on-sensor chatter sounds more like just another “Rep at trade show told me” rumor, which tend to be less likely. Even if it appears, the real question will be whether it’s actually useful. So far, PDAF-on-sensor implementations seem to be a mixed bag: Some are good (Nikon J/V) and some are lame (Canon EOS-M.)
PDAF on chip like NEX6,and what about lens?
FW update for existed M4/3 lens and new lens,
Pany do not want PDAF and they have no lens FW update,
if you had Lumix G lens for PDAF is useless.
…”hybrid AF Lao Tzu”…
Yes! Please bring it Oly! 🙂
This makes the E-P5 look like such a bargain!
My E-M6 Most Wanted Features:
1) A true ISO 50 and ISO 100 (More photons “full bucket”),
2) More Dynamic Range,
3) 1/8000 sec Shutter,
4) Electronic Global Shutter,
5) Pro-quality 100-300mm f/4 lens,
6) Higher EVF refresh rate
ISO 50 would be fantastic! As a film shooter, I’m often shooting that low. Great for when you want to shoot wide open in sunlight without the hassle of using ND filters.
Maybe ISO 25 also. :green:
For the video folks, I think panasonic’s or nex feature set is pretty compelling and while it’s nice to have similar capabilities I rather Olympus focus on photographic features like improve CAF tracking, introduce Silent/Electronic shutter, In body ND filters, fast, clear and accurate EVF. Metering coupled to focus points 1/8000s able to switch on or off illuminated buttons like E620 including power or access light. Better battery life. Auto bracketing like pentax, better support for their ZD line although it’ll never reach the speed of nikons or canons lenses. MORE quality lenses.
OMD wishlist:
-sturdier buttons that don’t feel like plastic mush (more like GX1 buttons)
-CA removal with RAW files and Panasonic lenses
-more responsive viewfinder eye detect
-better built-in grip, more like the add-on part.
To me, being able to add/remove the grip is one of the big advantages of the E-M5. Can remove grip, put the 14/2.5 on it, and its really really small. Can add grip when you need it. Making the ‘regular’ grip bigger reduces this advantage.
Not to mention.. never noticed all the whining about the GH3 and even G6 being ‘too big’ ?
I expect all the upgrades and refinements of the E-P5, plus a few new goodies. And it will be enough of an upgrade (in price) that the E-M5 will be around another year w/o taking a bit hit on price.
bigger VF will fill in that hump.
I think they could build in the landscape grip and leave the portrait/battery grip as an add on, but should they?
Swivel display? it’s about time
If it comes with better and BIGGER viewfinder, I will buy it on the spot. The small viewfinder on E-M5 is the only thing that holds me back.
Not much is needed to perfect the EM-5
Only one thing is missing:
GPS!
I expect an on three axes tilting screen (as on the E5)
when the external flash is connected, another similar port schould be available for other accessories
The add-on grip system of OMD is a well thought idea, making the camera small when needed, and with a good grip usable, when it is needed. So, keep that!
The body can be a bit larger than EM5 for my needs, but the same size is fine too. Buttons that can be used with gloves anyway!
ISO 50 (or even 25) – I like to shoot with long exposure times. But also the high ISOs! Both needed. A built in ND-filter?
And the extra:
How about program-able, lens-dependent focus limiter, let’s say with 3 or 4 steps like (for 75-300) 1: all 2. 3m-infinity, 3. 0,9m-4m, 4. -;
for 17mm 1.all 2. infinity, 3. 2m-inf. 4. 1m
or anything you need.
Think about that with 50mm macro in low light portrait shoot or 50-200mm lens for BIF’s. Would make the focus faster in itself. Could also be coupled with focusing areas so, that only subjects within the limits would get focused, and even so, that when something is in focus area, the camera will fire ( a focus trap).
A built in flash would be nice, and a rotating LCD like the E3/E5/EM5 has.
And of course all the whistles and bells there now are in the EP5.
Very excited that there is a possibility to use my 14-54 on a new pen.
The perfect kit: large zooms like 14-54, 70-300 and small primes like the 20mm panansonic, 45mm olympus. This is the perfect photography kit.
Also by doing this Olympus will triple their lens catalog.
There are a lot of good hints, however I am still not convinced by the main one, PDAF on sensor. Not that I don’t want one, but I don’t see Sony designing a chip only for Olympus!
OTH there are new of up to 40% improvement of 4/3 lenses with the E-P5 AF speed:
http://torontowide.blogspot.com.au/2013/05/olympus-e-p5-pen-camera-first.html
So perhaps hybrid is not needed but brutal processing speed. In the words of Torontowide: ‘we are almost there’. By the same token Predictive AF and fast tracking might be achieved by ultrafast processing. So hybrid might be just a lazy rumor, indicating how tight lipped Oly is about the jewel of the crown.
But it might be a much simpler thing unless Sony is ready to mess at the foundry level, which seems unlikely.
Also, if there will be an E-7 the Pro OMD might have more time to adapt ALL 4/3 lenses. Some are more easier than others, that have even older motors.
sadly I have read claims about faster AF of FT glass from several sources in the past model releases , with no such gain in reality.Doug is a more trusted source and I hope that he is right , but I will wait tilli have tried it myself. We heard the same types of claim from the Olympus shills like Wong regarding the E-M5 and I can catagorically state that between my E-P3 and E-M5 the difference if any was tiny despite the claims I still have the 50-200SWD , 50mmF2 and 150mm F2 ( my fav lens ever ) and it would be nice to see some move forward though the E-P5 has little interest for me
Geo
Mind you he doesn’t mention improvement on non-CDAF compatible 4/3 lenses. My 40-150 is definitely more zippy on the E-M5, and marginally so the old 9-18, which was never a speed demon. Fact is that it is difficult to measure below 1 sec. speed if you don’t have tools.
OTH I am pretty well convinced that processing power is of the essence. There might even be some mechanism associated with IBIS, as mentioned above, the sensor helping the lens. The less likely is PDAF on sensor, because Oly has no control over its sensors.
From what I understand, starting with the E-M5, camera processing power is no longer the limiting factor in AF speed of PDAF-only 4/3 lenses on MFT cameras.
The limitation is the speed of the PDAF motor for the back-and-forth movements required to get a CDAF lock.
AFAIK it’s just not possible for the E-P5 to focus the (for example) 12-60 faster than the E-M5.
Do you have any 4/3 lenses? Or even non internal focussing m4/3 ones? In fact if the processing power is fast enough, the motors will do the AF dance in a way you can’t tell the direction. But the camera of course can.
In native lenses m4/3 predictive focus can be achieved by sheer calculation power. So I am expecting this.
I had the 12-60 on my E-M5 for several months. I could see the DOF scale rotate with the movement of the motor; whereas on a PDAF camera the motor makes one smooth movement to the phase target, on CDAF the motor racks back and forth until the camera finds the best CDAF match.
Since a PDAF motor is optimized for the former (single smooth movement to target), it doesn’t need to be anywhere near as fast as a CDAF motor, which is designed to be racked back and forth at very high speed until the camera detects the “most” contrast.
A CDAF camera can’t predict focus for effective C-AF. It’s only possible to make a rudimentary guess about the direction of movement (i.e. closer or further away) and testing its guess by moving the AF motor–which is exactly where CDAF C-AF focus hunting comes from.
Without phase sensors, there’s not enough information to predict accurate focus movement; we’ve reached the limit of what extra processing power can give us.
interesting remark about goin for pure processing power for increasing the AF with FT lenses untill its “there”, resulting in a more elegant solution.
sorry ,and where M4/3 lens ,Pdaf support M4/3 lens?
someone kept 4/3 lens but someone begin at M4/3 (body/lens)
Come on Olympus.
North America models: 24p, 30p, 60i/p
Euro models: 24p, 25p, 50i/p
Or even easier, give all options on all models.
It’s not that fricken difficult.
+1000!
Onboard flash and articulate screen and it would be as close as possible to the perfect camera for me. If they manage to maintain around the same size as the current OM-D.
ISO 100 (or lower…)
1/8000s
C positions on the dial instead of the I auto etc.
An LCD that can be flipped and hidden away
Tighter AF select area
VF-4 EVF built in
GPS (without needing to connect to my phone)
Ambivalent:
Focus peaking
HDR bracketing
Not wanted!
Built in pop flash
1) Simple, intuitive, full-featured tethering.
2) Shutter button with mechanical remote socket.
3) PC connector that can handle high-voltage antique flashes.
4) Tethering. Not EyeFi with scripts. Real tethering.
5) Built-in wireless flash trigger.
6) Full-frame sensor. (kidding!)
7) Tethering.
Makes me laugh weeping lemmings imploring Oly marketing about their wet dreams, as if they were listening.
Did undignified consumerism come down to that?
Not that said lemmings are so clever to ask for new features a day before introduction of a new model 🙂
Oh, I thought we were have a group orgy. 🙂
Olympus is welcome to join us if they want to, although then it might quickly become BDSM-like. They are totally missing out!
And, hey, I used to implore Leica. I know the limits of my influence. 🙂
Seems to be in keeping with the information I was given at Focus on Imaging in March, as a point of interest it was not a company rep than my information came from, certainly not a rep.
Am quite surprised how few seem to want Four Thirds lens support. All I want in C-AF to work consistently and quickly with SHG FT lenses that I own.
The last three words of your post explain why most of us don’t care about four thirds lenses.
In truth I do not think beyond those who already own the FT lenses there is much demand for compatibility between them and mFT. Though some of them are amazing lenses , many are also large and heavy ( FF heavy) Which to most mFT users is the absolute antithesis of what attracted them to mFT in the first instance . It is my belief that Olympus made a mistake with FT when the strongest point should have been size and weight, they instead wasted a number of years and a lot of resources trying in vain to compete with FF which the SHG glass is the most obvious example .
The central reason for improving AF in mFT should be dedicated to delivering far better C-AF for mFT bodies. There is no doubt that the FT lenses have some real gems but the difference in size and weight is very significant ,look at the Panasonic 7-14 which delivers 95% + of the performance of the OLympus 7-14 .Yet the Olympus costs 50% more , weighs 2.5 x times as much and is 50% longer .
Going to the expense and trouble of making a DSLR would be poor business practice for a company who have an imaging division in financial decline. The FT market has atrophied to a tiny fraction of what it once was , on the other hand making a high end Pen where the advances in its AF system benefit both mFT lens users and FT lens users would be a far wiser stratagem
P
Four thirds lens support will i not have from OM-D, but E-x. 😉
I don’t think there will be anything that will warrant a complete upgrade. Of course I am intrigued by the ep-5 feature slate being integrated into the em-5 aesthetic. I will wait on a new sensor generation.
However…
Please allow me to assign different functions to the primary wheel on the HLD-6 and the one on the body.
Let the HLD-6 shutter release activate a different drive mode from the integrated one. e.g. AE BKT for one and single release for the other.
First of all: As several people already said, it’s probably the higher or lower classified OM-D, not the successor of the E-M5 we are talking about, here.
But no matter what camera it will be, I don’t see on-sensor PDAF in any Oly mFT camera.
To keep on improving the already very usable C-AF of the E-M5, it ‘just’ needs more calculating power and the enhancement of the face detection to silhouette detection. Should they achieve this, the AF system could predict the moving subject’s direction and speed just by assessing if and how much the size of the moving subject decreases or increases. Don’t forget that the E-M5 (and possibly the GH3/G6 – don’t know about them) already have the best C-AF on the mirrorless market that outclasses the ones of all their competitor despite having ‘only’ CDAF. While most of the cameras with on-sensor PDAF, such as the NEXes and the EOS M, don’t even feature a satisfying S-AF.
And at the same time – as Amalric already mentioned – the E-P5 apparently demonstrates that Oly are on a good way to also accelerating the AF performance of the FT lenses on their µFT cameras.
All in all, improved C-AF, small AF field and metering coupled with AF field are the only things that I would really ask for, for the next OM-D model in addition to the innovations introduced with the E-P5.
And a fully articulated screen would be nice but please don’t return to the swivel screen but use the technology of the Sonys A77/A99. I don’t weant that swivel screen that always gets in the way of my left hand if I want to use the cam as quasi waist-lever-viewfinder camera.
Hello Don, I am a nature photographer and have seen no such usable C-AF in any of my mFT bodies that comes anywhere near my DSLR kit. Now and again I see folk posting soft blurred shots of birds with no detail or shots that are really landscapes with a bird in them.Or shots of pets moving in predictable and repeatable manners. The challenge of photographing true wild animals /birds is a very different challenge. Obviously we are not helped by the poor performance and slow apertures of our longer telephoto lenses. Frankly , at the moment I would not consider using my mFT gear for my paid work. Which is most unfortunate as I would very much like to carry my E-M5,s into the wilderness on days long treks , I fear it will be a long time till mFT compets with what DSLR bodies already have
P
Hi Peer,
may I draw your attention to these pics:
http://www.systemkamera-forum.de/micro-four-thirds-fourthirds-kamera-technik/33556-olympus-om-d-bilder-265.html
or these:
http://www.systemkamera-forum.de/419755-post2640.html
Hope you don’t have to register to view the pics.
Anyway, there are far more of this shots shot by two or three blokes in this forum.
While i even shot sighzhpounds at the racetrack, with the E-M5 combines with the m.Zuiko 75-300.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/63427925@N00/sets/72157630172691350/
Yes I know, they are not perfect but many of the mid-class DSLRs also wouldn’t have done better.
So, I think it’s just one more small step – and some fast tele zooms or primes – and µFT will be there. Also for your wildlife work.
Love the Afgans racing.
Custom Functions On-the-Dial. C1, C2 and C3 would allow you to set two Color Profiles and one B&W, or whatever. This is better than doing it with menus.
it gets real tedious when shills like Wong , Mein, and Potka get used as references for “testing ” new Olympus equipment when the absolute truth is that they are simply advertisements with no criticism of the many faults that we as consumers get the pleasure of discovering.Compound this with all the amazing claims that have been made in the past from them like the E-5 ( lightly warmed over E-3 with E-620 sensor) had soul every single Olympus mFT model has been preceded by claims about faster AF faster AF of FT glass , faster C-AF all BS .
A consumer is one who uses up, consumes something, like eat it. Its a camera you are talking about. You do not consume cameras you use them. You are a user. American marketing is nuts.
Huh. Consumer indeed.
If they are going to improve video it’s got to be to blackmagic levels so personally I think it might be better to concentrate on stills. I’m rather unexcited by the EP5 and, especially with the finder, it doesn’t seem much different to the EM5. So I think mainly what I am hoping for from the EM6 is that it pushes the price of the EM5 down.
PDAF capability would be nice not only because of the 43 lenses, this would give a possibility for a MF legacy lens (or any other lens) adapter with focus confirmation chip inside. I love my old Pentax lenses and I ordered a few more recently. This could give them a new life 🙂
Slightly bigger body, EM5 was too small too handle without ext grip. Felt like a toy camera..
25fps.
Range finder / EVF combo. If Fuji can make it…why not Oly ?
Agreed! The em5 far to small to get a good grip. No need for the OMD to be as small as the PEN.
PEN smaller, OMD larger. Superb!
Get a GH or go back to your DSLR then, M4/3 is all about having the camera with you, portability, if you people keep demanding bigger and bigger cameras (GH3,G6,etc…) soon we’ll be back to legacy 4/3 days where the size of the cameras was unjustifiably large for the sensor size and we know how that ended.
This stupid reasoning is getting out of hand, why would you want a mirrorless camera if you’re not ok with the size reduction that removing the mirror means ? if you need a better grip for your gorilla hands either get the optional grips or get a DSLR,period.
Nope.
M4/3 is all about having no mirror. This means there’s no necessity for “bad usability” in mirrorless systems. OVF’s are dying right now. Nota bene!
Go Olympus, make the OM-D 5-8% bigger in width and height (not in depth).
Problem is if you changed the grip on the camera, or changed the size of the camera, the HLD-6 wouldn’t be able to attach anymore…did you think of that? Keep the grip as-is, and those who want a bulkier grip can get the HLD-6!
The OM-D needs a built-in finger-grip, sorta like a Sony NEX. 1080p 24 (25) and 1080p 60 would also be good.
No need to GO-BIG like a Panasonic GH3. The GH3 is almost a large as a Nikon DSLR http://camerasize.com/compare/#440,381
The E-M5 with added grip weighs 72 grams more than the GH3.
The GH3 weighs 38% more than an E-M5 http://camerasize.com/compare/#381,289
Why would you spend $300.00 for an Olympus HLD-6 ??
Oh, maybe because of the second battery, being able to swap batteries while the camera is running, and because of the portrait grip?
Why do people insist on publicly demonstrating their ignorance?
I wonder myself too sometimes. I see some prefer to use the “proudly made in USA” 3rd party grips “because it allows to switch batteries without taking the grip off” and glady pay 150-200 USD for what basicly is just a piece of machined metal. But paying 300 USD for the HLD which give so much more extras, lots of people dont want.
@anomymous, I’ve been making money with a camera for 40+ years. When shooting with a Pro Body (built-in grip) I never move my hands, I grap the side grip and keep it in the same place while rotating the camera between Landscape and Portrait. You would be amazed at how many Pros do this.
If you don’t Spray ‘n Pray you don’t need extra battery capacity 😎
Really Right Stuff make a combo Grip and Arca Swiss L-bracket with Battery Access http://reallyrightstuff.com/ProductDesc.aspx?code=BOEM5-Set&type=3&eq=&desc=BOEM5-Set%3a-Base-%2b-L-Plate-%2b-Grip-(black) for $180.00
You don’t use a portrait grip, totally fine, but many people do, and many people also appreciate the portrait grip in landscape mode, try it sometime, its really nice.
With regards to extra battery, ever considered that a complete wedding coverage in many parts of the world means 10+ hours of photography? Ever done event photography for a day?
That your photography is limited enough to not have any need for those things is fine, but regardless of your 40+ years of photography, that doesn’t at all change the usefulness of those things in general.
Arguing that since you don’t need it noone does is just silly, asking why others make different choices, actually trying to understand their arguments, and then deciding they do or don’t apply to your situation is not silly at all, but you will never get to that point when dismissing alternative choices out of hand.
Please don’t ask for a bigger OM-D. I love the small size/weight of the EM-5. Just improve the grip a bit. The grip on my Panasonic GX-1 is not very big but it provides a great handle on the camera. Just do something like that.
Thats crazy talk ; ) If you want super small house get one of the 3 PENs. The OMD is more of a worktool and should offer a decent grip. Or else just make the PEN weathersealed and skip the whole shebang!
I don’t get it: the E-M5 is a ‘I am three cameras’ device. Why ist so difficult to accept that this is a huge adavantage. If I want it,it’s as small as a PEN, if I want it, it’s slightly bigger but with a far better ergobomy and and if I want it, it’s bigger than an E-620 without battery grip. As I see it, it couldn’t come any better.
No please the E-M5 size is perfect. Keep it so, in bigger camera please. Just offer the horizontal grip separately with a hole allowing access to the battery door. Then we can choose the size depending on the situation. That is three in one !
Sorry the spell checker is playing havoc again; I meant to say : “no bigger camera” , not in bigger camera.
Well: it should be a little bit bigger, not too much.
Nuts. I don’t want the omd bigger so it ain’t gona be. Got that?
I agree. Size is fine. Just a bit more grip like the NEX-6/7 and it be great. Also, if Olympus made the button/dial layout on the E-M6 similar to the E-P5, they might be able to shove in a popup flash. That would be killer.
If the next OM-D has (1) higher resolution LCD, (2) higher resolution VF, (3) focus peaking, (4) spot focus, and (5) phase detection, then it will be one killer camera. I love my E-M5 and those features address the main weak points for me. I would upgrade in an instant!
Same basic size with slightly larger built-in grip and thus battery, higher resolution EFV and LCD, focus peaking, phase detection, spot focus and custom naming for Mysets. Also would love exchange iAuto and Scene mode dial positions for a C1 and C2.
25 fps
– Pro video codec -> 50 Mbit 4:2:2 25p/30p, – 100 Mbit 4:2:2 50p/60p,
– Modern style body, like GH3 (not retro body)
– mic input / headphone outputs
– lanc -> start/stop, aperture/iso, focus.
– Max resolution -> 8-12 megapixels
– ISO 50, 100
Sounds like you want a GH3. Leave the Em5 as it is, if 5 Axis is all you are after get a stabilizer or a tripod, by the time you have to lug around a camera the size of the GH3 for serious video you’ll need a tripod anyway, so don’t ask for a bigger unwieldy EM5, the EM5 is meant for portability, photography on the move, not Pro videography and rigs and whatnot. For that money you could get the Blackmagic pocket anyway, far better investment if video is a priority.
Olympus has no pro video division and can make camera without compromises like Panasonic did… An yes, 5 Axis IS is the key.
I agree, better video. Much higher bitrate !
EP5 +
– Built in VF4 viewfinder ON THE LEFT (not centered) = much more ergonomic!
– WiFi: (a) full remote control (b) remote screen (c) image transfer
– New 12-60mm fast zoom OR PDAF support.
– 60fps 1080p, 120fps 720p
First, the view finder is never going to the corner so just stop it.
And how does moving the evf make it more ergonomic?
yeah u doubt they’ll modify the SLR body for the OMD line, that’ll probably stay as is. On the other hand it’s possible they’ll save the left-corner EVF for the next E-P7, why ? because once a Pro EM6 is out the gap in features with the top PEN flagship (E-P5) will be enough that an EVF won’t mean a threat like it does with the E-P5 and E-M5 (if there actually is any, which i doubt).
In fact it has two Pekka Potka, which is awesome.
Didn’t you know that Finland is the world center for photography? 🙂
The is a Pekka for every lake in Finland. :innosent:
Please don’t make OMD bigger. Obviously people who go into micro 4/3rds, and then complain about size/handling aren’t the target market.
Yeah, I think that the optional battery grip of the OM-D is a brilliant solution that should be continued going forward. 50% of the time I use the side grip one, 30% of the time, I keep it as small as possible with no extra grip, and 20% of the time I use the battery/portrait grip.
Why not just build the side grip as part of the E-M5. Then you wouldn’t need to remove it to get to the battery.
Well, because then the people who want the smaller form don’t have the option? I’m willing to unscrew and screw in something for the option, it takes like 10 seconds.
Keep up the great comments, keep the oversizers and up sizers at MacDonalds.
You can have small size and great handling. g5-g6 are far superior in handling. Nex 6 is also really comfortable to hold, em-5 has great functionality, but the design of body from ergonomic point of view is crap.
Much prefer the same size of EM5, and preferably lighter… (slightly, FL600R is too heavy to balance anyway)
If it handles better than the E-M5 or competing Panasonic models and is good value, I might consider getting one. Lets see what happens in the meantime. I am awaiting G6 tests and a GX1 successor.
GPS. Why is this not a standard feature by now? Coordinates are some of the MOST BASIC kind of meta data, just as important as as Time captured! Every other el cheapo camera + all phones have it so WTF is going on? If you don’t want it, turn it off. But give us who do the OPTION. And no, a “smart” phone can not replace an inbuilt GPS just like they can’t replace the camera itself.
don’t make it larger…the best part is its portability compared to SLRs…isn’t the whole point of 43 is its size factor.
the main fault of the OMD is the video…that codec needs to be improved…then Canon/Sony/Nikon will have no chance.
Panasonic has truly excellent video quality and the GH3 has better ergonomics than the E-m5 with identical image quality. Can’t say that I have seen the collapse of any of the big companies its the reverse in fact with Olympus and Panasonic imaging being deep in the red .
Plus the DSLR crowd are delivering better video than before the D5200 has excellent video performance and a sensor better than any in mFT and is at least $300 cheaper .For me the real problem with the E-M5 is its dreadful ergonomics and interface. I
Agreed! The OMD should be 2 cm wider, 1 cm taller and 0,5 cm thicker. It would still be a small camera. Want smaller? Buy a PEN!
Want bigger? buy a fucking dslr then! Leave the em-5 alone. It’s the perfect size!
Panasonic has truly excellent video quality and the GH3 has better ergonomics than the E-m5 with identical image quality. Can’t say that I have seen the collapse of any of the big companies its the reverse in fact with Olympus and Panasonic imaging being deep in the red .
Plus the DSLR crowd are delivering better video than before the D5200 has excellent video performance and a sensor better than any in mFT and is at least $300 cheaper .For me the real problem with the E-M5 is its dreadful ergonomics and interface. I
Get a video cam.
The problem with some is that deep inside they cannot accept that a small camera can be as good or better than a bigger camera.
That only explains why mirrorless penetration is so slow in certain cultures. Thankfully, although very verbal, they don’t dominate sales anymore.
But mirrorless are WORSE at everything, except smaller size:
Focus
Speed
Usability (except maybe OM-D)
Image quality
Price
Viewfinders
So this will be yet one more gadget, at a suckers’ price.
Yeah, right. How are mirrorless worse at IQ? How is EVF worse than OVF – they both have their strengths. Usability depends on the user – for some, smaller cameras are better.
Try a proper camera and you will see. You have to try yourself tho, not check the net for other people’s “opinions”. And I assume you are a decent photog, otherwise the M43 waste would be even greater.
That was quite condescending. I’ve tried many cameras (D80, D7000, Rebels, K-x, K-7, 7D, 5D, A900, OM-D, NEX, just to name a few). What would be the IQ difference between a NEX and pretty much any other APS-C DSLR? There won’t be any.
I own a NEX-7 currently and had used an OM-D with the grip for some time. No issue with usability whatsoever for me.
OVF – seen enough crappy APS-C ones and largely prefer the one in my NEX.
So, that is my opinion and it is based on my own usage.
Inbuilt gps and flash and I’ll be more than happy
And…DO NOT make it bigger
I think the E-M6 will have to be bigger. The E-M5 is too f***ing small and actually smaller than the PEN (sic!), and cant be use onehanded like a real camera. I think Admin supports me on this. And probably the Olympus CEO. Time will show!
I’m not talking GH3 size, just enough for a normal grown man to hold it with one hand. Remeber not all of us have those tiny fairy pixies girly small hands ; )
Check this link to see how small it really is: http://camerasize.com/compare/#289,243
Yeah, and then check it side by side with an om-1 or a nikon fm, from the film days: same size, same weight. And when you are done, check it also against the first Leica. Do you think the earth was inhabited by girly fairy pixies back then? For goodness sake, full format dslr cameras would make even a Graflex SpeedGraphic look small (certainly thinner, when closed!), lightweight and agile, by comparison. A small camera (like pre-war leicas) will not turn you into a RC-B. But a digital behemoth will not turn you into an Ansel Adams either. If you shoot crap, you will still shoot crap, just less of it, because you will carry your camera with you less often.
To LeFrog: keep up the good comments!
Does it matter what we wish, when there is no chance that we will get it?
Personally, I wish Olympus went for retro ergonomics, in a tiny body, rather than for retro looks in a bigger one. Let me elaborate, because there is both a fundamental disagreement, and, I fear, a fundamental misunderstanding, on this matter: Most, in fact probably all, complaints about “big hands” and “tiny controls” are really complaints about “tiny buttons close together”. Well, in the old days we had dedicated rings and dials for each shooting parameter (iso, or rather asa, speed, aperture, exposure compensation, focus, and, depending on the lens, zoom). And there was plenty of room for all of them, all of them good sized, even on a rollei 35 body. A few more controls had to be added in the 80ies, to choose metering method, autofocus method, and program mode. But these were all dedicated controls – although, cameras that did not offer speed-priority could actually fit the automatic and the program mode on the speed dial, and that was a simple, elegant, and perfectly adequate arrangement. The basic arrangement, however, which normally allowed for the simultaneous manipulation of 3-4 shooting parameters, did not change. An ergonomic optimum had been achieved.
Nowadays we need more controls (we also need to set white balance and colour scheme and the program modes have become infinitely richer), but we actually have fewer of them at our disposal. We have to use various combinations of dials, buttons, button-cum-dial combinations, and button-cum-dial-cum menu, sub-menu, and sub-sub-menu, combinations, to achieve, sequentially, half of what we could do simultaneously. And we have to relearn the position and function of each control and the structure of the menus, every time we change camera. Small wonder Fuji’s semi-retro controls are so hugely praised.
So, Oly has already, managed to create an excellent camera, in terms of iq, and I am sure the new one will be even better. We can safely guess what will be carried over from OM-5 (weather sealing) and perhaps even what will be added (new evf, focus peaking, flash – perhaps also phase detection through a porro prism allowing for a side placement of the focusing sensor?).
Is it too much to ask to get rid of the hump, place the evf on the left corner, keep the body as tiny and lightweight as possible (preferably the size and weight of a pl-5 or a nex), and endow the new camera with retro dedicated ring and dial controls, which I am sure will make even the biggest and clumsiest hands happy? And, while it is at it, can it please also built a high grade pancake zoom, to go with the new camera, and, maybe, a few high grade pancake primes (say, 11/2.5, 19/1.6, to rival panny’s 20/1.7, 42,5/2, 90/3.5 macro – yes it should be doable, rember leika has already built a 90/4 macro for full frame cameras)?
Earlier comments on using the mode dial to store 3 or 4 custom settings would allow the current programmable buttons to cover a wider range of functions without increasing size. For example I use a lot of m and other manual focus lenses. I have magnification and other functions set up for the buttons I would like to have that on the dial as c2. when using oly native lenses I would use a c1 set very similar to default. c3 for higher iso range when moving in and out of dark buildings and c4 set up for HDR shots. I think I would have no need to make changes from the LCD with that setup. And the potential for setting or resetting a custom setup is avoided.
The hump has to stay for the OMD range. That’s why its an OMD.
Put the EVF into the left rear of the ep5 and leave the epl as the smaller limited function camera with good ‘auto’ settings for beginners.
You are not talking to an idiot, JimD, just to someone who happens to disagree with you. As far as I am concerned, a limited number of multifunction/programmable buttons/dials is part of the problem, not part of the solution.
Have you ever tried to use a manual film slr? You can manipulate simultaneously focus and aperture with the thumb and index of the left hand, speed and photometer activation with the thumb and index of the right hand (with the rest of your two hands you are hugging the camera and pressing it against your face, to keep it steady). I have never used an autofocus film camera, but I guess it worked the same way: you activated the photometer and the autofocus mechanism by half depressing the trigger. The only thing that you could not set simultaneously was ASA – which was not possible in the film days, and therefore was not needed, anyway; but I bet that if it was something that could be done, the ISO dial would have been moved, probably somewhere to the right, precisely to facilitate simultaneous manipulation.
Well, none of that is possible if you have only two rotary dials, at best (I am not counting the pasm dial, because, as far as I am concerned, it does not count and it is not needed, all you should need is an auto position on the focus, aperture, speed, and ISO dials; fuji, for example, does perfectly well without a pasm dial – unfortunately it still does not have an ISO dial, it only has a dedicated exposure compensation dial).
So, you see, film cameras did have achieved an ergonomic optimum. That’s why – unlike modern digital cameras – they all had the same tried and tested setting. And that’s why I wish the camera makers of today did bother to learn a bit from the past, and so should you.
As for your comment that small cameras are for beginners only, who prefer to point and shoot and are scared by manual controls, I will pass (although the advantages of a small, lightweight, pocketable pro body should have been obvious to anyone and I bet pros would gladly give, if not their right hand, certainly their little finger to have one). I hope the purpose of the comment section is not to insult each other, right? So, I will assume that you wrote what you wrote, but did not mean it.
“You are not talking to an idiot”
I am not so sure after your little tirade to a comment that supported your comment. The only difference being I want the OMD line to stay as the OMD line. The pl stay and remain as the baby of the set. In other words maintain the current line. The only addition being an EVF on the top PEN line. In case you don’t know the original PEN range had viewfinders. They were also portrait mode.
You also make a fool of yourself in relating me into your comments on film cameras. Just for your information my first SLR was a Minolta SR7 and followed by the wonderful SRT 101, I still use a PEN FT and a Bronica GS with a set of 3 lenses and many options. I have been using digital since 2001. I also spent over 40 years in IT services and management after 10 years at sea with P&O.
So don’t come on like an idiot if you don’t want to look like one. But if you do you now have some information.
Uh, I have a ‘small’ collection of film cameras, and unlike what you suggest, there isn’t an optimal layout that they ended up with, there actually isn’t a uniform layout.
I have SLRs with a shutter speed dial at the front right of the camera.
I have SLRs with a shutter speed dial at the top of the camera
I have SLRs with a shutter speed dial around the lens mount
I have SLRs with a right-hand thumb wheel for aperture
I have SLRs with a ring around the lens for aperture
I have SLRs with buttons to the left of the lens for aperture
I have SLRs with buttons next to the shutter release for aperture
I have SLRs with a button+right-hand dial for exposure compensation
I have SLRs with a left-side dial for exposure compensation
I have SLRs with 2 buttons at the back for exposure compensation
I could go on, but I guess the point is clear, the past is by far not as glorious as you remember it, and most definitely not as uniform as you claim it to be.
There would be no point in providing the E-M6 with PDAF capability unless Olympus plans to make the chassis strong enough to handle 4:3 lenses. if Oly ZD comes through with the rumored 14-40/2.8 (or 12-40/2.8) and 40-150/2.8 zooms—making them as sharp or even sharper than the 14/35/2 and 35=100/2 duo, then the only 4:3 lens I really desire is the 150/2.
I just wish the next OM-D has a better quality construction compared to E-M5… With so many body flaws like main dial coming off, crack at the bottom of the LCD panel, Loose eye cup, Rubber grip peeling off the HLD-6 battery grip, etc. the body works of the OM-D has a long way to go to be a truly great camera…
Just stuffing great features into a lousy body is simply not a good way to win a losing market!
+10000.
Body paint of my omd comes off easily to reveal ugly white or pale plastic under. The eye cup came off within the first few months of normal usage (came off just slipping it in and out of a camera pouch). So I hope the em6 will have great features but also a much better quality body and construction than the em5.
Putting the oar in ehh.
I never had any problems with mine. I think that all problems have been resolved. So no need to bring it up. Or are you like the climate change deniers just find one thing and keep regurgitating it over and over and over, even after its disproven. But, it’s on the net it must be true, is that not so?
Buy a new rolok.
For those that never used one, its sailor talk for row lock.
I have had a Lumix G1 for 4 years, but I would like to get an Olympus to have IBIS and the best m4/3 image quality.
What I really need is a side mounted fully articulated screen so I can comfortably use it low and off to the side. An alternative would be a wifi remote with live view if it worked well and was cheap enough. I have Android, but I would prefer a dedicated remote so it doesn’t eat my phone battery and there’s less chance of my losing my phone in the woods or dropping it in a creek.
Also I would like to see exposure bracketing for HDR become easy to access and execute like it is on the Sony A77. You select it from the drive menu along with the number of shots and spacing, then one click takes the HDR series.
Someone mentioned spot focus. I use the G1 spot focus that you can put most anywhere on the screen a lot for nature photography. On the G5, you can literally put it anywhere on the screen, which is great.
This is hot hot hot ! Evf will be big and comfortable, em-6 and 12-60 will be a killer combo if pdaf works well…though no new camera for me for 2 years…
I empathize other people size requests ,but I must admit that I tried OM-D (unfortunately it is unfordable for me at this time :<) and it fits perfectly (without grip).
Actual form factor is perfect for women and mens with smaller hands… I had quite petite hand for a man, so larger DSLR's require a bit finger stretching :P.
Anyway, more compact (non-battery and cheaper :P) horizontal grip would be great addition for OM-D cameras.