This is how the GX7 is likely going to look (Courtesy Dicahub).
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It’s not a secret anymore that in late August Panasonic will announce the new GX7 with 18MP sensors, built-in titlable viewfinder and on sensor stabilization. And many here on 43rumors are excited to see the new cameras. But the camera will not be cheap. A trusted sources informed me that the price will be a little bit above $1,000 (or 1000 Euro). And that for the body only! There will be also a kit version with the zoom lens or with the new 20mm pancake.
The question is….
[poll id=”201″]
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Rumors classification explained (FT= FourThirds):
FT1=1-20% chance the rumor is correct
FT2=21-40% chance the rumor is correct
FT3=41-60% chance the rumor is correct
FT4=61-80% chance the rumor is correct
FT5=81-99% chance the rumor is correct
215 Responses
I will wait for the price to drop (I will also wait for the new Olympus offerings! :-)).
We can wait until 2015 and then it will be priced at 300 Euros 😉
299 Euros!
In 2015 it will be $199. 🙂
What a sense of humour!
199$
was just about to write that 🙂
what is wrong with people? M43 is supposed to be affordable, i might as well buy a cheap canon with money to spare, which is what 80+ percent of people are gonna do. is this camera a Panasonic or sony? because i cant see the difference anymore!
M43 was not created as an “affordable” option. You have always had to pay a premium for it. Now that the system is more mature there are some good deals on older cameras though. That is what I do, buy the good lenses and wait until the body is half price.
Well, Olympus said it was to be the successor to 43 and .. well – nota bene: 43 always was: affordable.
4/3 was both affordable and not; the E-x series was hardly a consumer camera. The GX series never was, either, and now it’s moving upmarket. You can always get the GF.
Current state of play @ B&H (body only)………
Nex6 is $650.
EOS M is $349 (includes 18-55mm)
XE1 is $799.
E-P5 + VF4 is $1273.
GH3 is $1049.
E-M5 is $999.
Micro Four Thirds – Less is More.
Strawman much?
The NEX6 is not the top of the NEX line and you compare it to the GH3 which is the top of the Panasonic line. If we move one down the currently available Panasonic food chain we are at the G6 with kit lens for $749.
The NEX6 with kit lens is $798 not the $650 you quote (which is body only).
No strawmen here.
We are talking body only prices (where possible) as that is what Admin mentioned above – GX7 body only price of around $1000. Also, one can argue that all these cams are more or less equally capable of some great photography so the differences between them become arguments more about specs and charts and 1 stop of extra DR or ISO. So the differences between higher spec and lower spec are a bit blurred, eg NEX6 vs NEX7.
Problem is G6 and GH3 are not RF styled/sized bodies. So those looking at the EX1 or NEX or Pens may not be interested in the G and GH ranges. Enter the GX range.
So add these to the list if you like….
NEX7 – $1098
X-PRO1 – $1199
G6 – $749 with lens).
EPL5 – $549 – (but no VF, so add $249).
GF6 – $599 kit but no option for EVF so not part of this group IMO.
Doesn’t change much really, it is still clear that M43 (overall) is priced too high compared to the others. (exception of the G6).
Price is everything. Look at what happened since the EOS M was reduced to almost nothing ($350 kit).
M43 have to not only compete with other mirrorless gear, but with larger sensor FUD and DSLR’s too. Uphill all the way. They just make it harder for themselves when they jack up their prices from the get go and then look equally ridiculous when in 6 months the prices fall to half of their original value – thereby trashing the value of their brand – “why by it now? just wait a year….”
It seems that M43 gear is only for the camera geeks. No one else bothers with it.
Your argumentation is totally arbitrary, and fails to make sense. There is much more to a camera then the theoretical IQ it is capable of, which becomes totally obvious from your own statements already.
Why did you insist on having to add an EVF to the E-PL5 if all that counts is IQ? Because you arbitrarily determined this feature to be mandatory? Why is this specific feature mandatory while others are not? And do you think that this argument applies to everyone, or is at least general enough to use for a general purpose comparison? Why?
I’d suggest comparing apples to apples and oranges to oranges instead of the rather arbitrary mix you make.
Yeah..if you want a bargain buy a GX1(last years model)…if you want the latest options on the newest camera…you are going to pay.
What happens when you go to the car dealer?
The problem with that scenario is that you can get a lot more for your money in other systems if image quality is more important than size.The E-P5 with its EVF a vital accessory in my opinion [ why I shoot with a GH3/GH2] is around £1100 , Nikon UK has a £150 off the D600 summer offer putting its price [£1255] within £155 of the E-P5.
The E-P5 + EVF at £1100 makes me wonder just what they will charge for the OMD pro
So.. you are comparing the price for a camera that has been around for quite some time now, and is having a special action price for a short time to the list price of a just released camera?
Maybe you’ll rather want to wait 2 months and the story will look a bit different.
Then there is the question why the D600 lost 25% of its selling price already, against the barely 10% of the longer available E-M5.
I’m thinking you are picking very specific examples to make a point, but those examples don’t really hold up to scrutiny.
As a nice addition to your comparison (since you consider an EVF mandatory), how about comparing an E-PM2 + VF3 to a D600 instead? Same IQ as that E-P5, but a fraction of the price. Or if you want to compare a premium model like the E-P5, how about comparing it to a premium model Nikon like a D800 or D4? Or would that be bad for your point…
Just i think and do by M43, good lens and old camera so E-P1 and E-P2 but maybe i go for E-P5 to next year. 😉
I see people making this stupid comparison with the OM-D, but then fail to point out which Canon will give me the same IQ with weather sealing and IBIS…still waiting
And making the comparison with the Rebel or whatever at this stage is pointless – we don’t even know any details about this camera other than the pretty pictures and some suggestion it will have an 18mpx sensor
Don’t do that. There’s only room for one moose here, and that’s me.
…wtf
Ya’ll are the worst.
-1
It’s not expected to be cheap, but there are quite many affordable options. This body is high end with superb build and latest tech, how you can expect it to be cheap? Lets see which sensor they put inside first, if it’s no worse than in e-p5, gx7 looks like actually better deal for people, who need evf. Especially if 20mm pancake kit will be cheap enough. Superb lens, unlike questionable 17mm f1.8
There are affordable m4/3 cameras: GF3 is 170 euros body only, while E-PM1 is 215 euros with kit lens. No Canon ILC can match those prices.
That’s my point. If you want the latest and the greatest then you’ll have to pay premium, or just wait half a year o so. I doubt everyone really *needs* all the features that are in these top models (GX7,EP5) especially when there are so many bargains on the older models.
GX1, G5, G3, GF3, EPM2, etc. are less than $500 each with lens. Some are cheaper and some has more features. E.g. the G5 has an articulated touchscreen and a large viewfinder with 100% coverage. Which Canon has both and how much does it cost?
Over 1000? why not just get a NEX6 then
And what about lenses?
Where did you get the idea that M43 is a budget option? If you want a cheap Canon then fine, go ahead and buy one. If you want a GX7 and can afford it, then buy that. What’s the problem?
I won’t be criticizing the price until I see how the camera performs. If it’s ahead of the competition in all aspects, then it’s worth a 1000 dollars. I would consider to buy it, but not based on patent drawings and rumored specs…
Comparing to the Oly P5 this new Pana offers more (tilt EVF). However it must have an image quality at least on par with the P5 to be worth the money.
M43 high end cameras are expnsive. Cost much more than a similar spec DSLR. Mirrorless cameras have fewer components than conventional DSLR. You pay for smallishness. Had manufacturers cosen a mor aggressive pricing (downwards), market shares would have been higher. Another mistake is production for the shelf ledang to having to sell earlier iterations cameras at an extremely low price. This canibalises on sales of the latest iterationcamera.
Poor old Panasonic, they just can’t win –
Forum users: “The GX1 sucks! It’s useless without a built-in EVF and in-body stabilisation”.
Panasonic: “We’ve listened to your feedback and added all the requested features”
Forum users: “The GX7 sucks! It’s too expensive!”
i think it’s pricey because of new sensor.
EM-5 have ibis stab, evf, tiltable screen, etc… and is cheaper than gx7.
The launch price of the E-M5 was the same ($1000), also the EM5 is a little bigger I think (with the viewfinder hump, but can’t be sure until the GX7 is unveiled) and doesn’t include a built-in flash.
$1000 ≠ More than $1000
You forget that the E-M5 is protected from the weather and has a magnesium body. In general, these two models is complete parity. GX7 I would take because of the lower price and 1/8000, but now is profitable to buy E-P5.
$1000 ≠ More than $1000
Yes dear, so is a false precision.
lol
Lol. All-purpose post, Andy C.
The initial street/online shop price will be $999 body only then.
This will be a fair price only if it brings (in addition to what we already know) most of the following:
– all-metal body
– high-res, high-refresh, true color viewfinder
– sensor as good as the GH3 one
– WiFi and GPS
– external mic input
– very good video codec (maybe not as good as the GH3)
– wireless integrated flash commander
– electronic shutter
If you add the All-metal-body, you will generate a perfect faraday’s cage and hence Wifi and GPS will not work anymore… Personally I do not really care that much about GPS if all the other features are there, also metal body has it’s drawbacks. Just let it be comparable to GF1/GX1 in robustness and quality.
My 6D is Magnesium, except the top is a Composite plastic to get the signal out. Works very well.
Not true. The antennas can be behind/around the LCD screen or other exposed body elements.
How do you think the HTC One smartphone which does not have an external antenna works?
I personally don’t believe this idea. I have a WiFI SD card and it works fine in my all metal bodied eP2, and my metal skinned G3? Both have metal bodies of different composition and the SD card is embedded deep inside them. It works without issue?
admin any more info about that weird looking mount?
asked the source about that. No answer yet.
Perhaps the pictures just don’t show the camera fully assembled with a mount. It looks like that’s just the camera chassis and the actual mounting plate with the lens bayonet will be screwed on top.
i checked the base for the mount on my OMD, its very thin.Looking at this drawing and assuming the mount ring is not assembled yet, then its base is much ticker compared with the OMD.
It
It’s because it will be able to use both m43 and old four thirds lenses.
i would like to believe that, but since Panasonic has not much history in FT, its unlikely they will put effort in that direction. But still, the longer I look at that mount, its like it can pop out and change its diameter….maybe i drunk too much soda i dont know.
I think the is an new mount, there we need use adaper for M43,….. but also for Sony E-mount, NX, Fuji, Canon M-mount and cinema lens…….. 😉
But if the drawing is to be believed, exchangeable mounts would have to be screwed on and off every time you want to use a different lens with a different mount? Doesn’t seem very practical.
The price of this is exactly why M43 is going to fail. If they’re asking that much for this thing, it better leave the NEX6 in the dust (which can be had for nearly half the price), and match the NEX7…doubt it though…(and I own both the GH3 and NEX5n – the NEX5n bests my GH3 in ISO and dynamic-range, and it cost me half as much as the GH3…).
Exactly. The problem is…
The next person wanting to upgrade from a point and shoot will look at the GX7 vs the NEX-6 and will find that the Sony sells for $798 including a lens, while the Panasonic sells for over $1,000 and no lens. What features will sway the average consumer to pay up to ~$300-$400 more for a similarly designed body and a smaller sensor? I am guessing it will be a very hard sell for this market.
I am a fan of Micro Four Thirds, and I love the design of this camera, even over the NEX-6. But, without any rumors of a professional, weather-sealed body, the price is just too damn high.
There are many other camera’s they can buy from Panasonic, your comparison is ridiculous and assumes that the nex-6 and gx7 have the same features and performance.
From a “new user” point of view, the comparison with Nex 6 makes sense. OK, GX7 isn’t out yet, but from what has been shown here, it’s similar to Nex 6.
Form factor is about the same, + tilting EVF on GX7. We don’t know about weather sealing. Of course, that would explain a higher price for the GX7.
Sensor performance should come close, if we expect IQ like GH3 (again, we are not sure about that).
2 axis IBIS vs bigger sensor on Nex 6 = same value to me (ultimately would depend on IBIS performance).
Both have WIFI.
A new user won’t care that Nex 6 is one year old if performance/specs are alike. Perhaps he won’t notice or care that m43 still has better lens choice. If GX7 price is 300$ more than Nex 6, it will be a hard sell.
About other panasonic EVF equipped cameras? GH3 is expensive too and too big to be a direct competitor to Nex 6. G6 is good value, but IQ is not on par and it is still bigger.
BTW, I understand that 800-1000$ rangefinder with EVF in corner isn’t the only worthy market for mirrorless cameras. m43 is still leading in SLR and range finder without EVF form factors.
Quite interesting that you cannot consider touchscreen, touch shutter, virtual touchpad etc. as a great added value.
“Quite interesting that you cannot consider touchscreen, touch shutter, virtual touchpad etc. as a great added value.”
Hahaha, really?
Nice feature indeed. I use it mostly to choose focus point on my GH2. Not too fond of touch shutter, though. OK, I forgot this in my post.
So we know for sure GX7 will have three things over Nex 6: better and smaller lenses, tilting EVF, touch screen. My conclusion stays the same: price difference shouldn’t be too big if Panasonic want to sell.
(GX7 will have IBIS too, but I maintain that this is a non-issue for Nex as its bigger sensor can compensate that shortcoming.)
No, a bigger sensor doesn’t make up for lack of is, that idea is based on a very limited understanding of the use of is.
Whenever you want (due to for example the desire of showing motion blur in the background of a panning shot, eanting to smooth out the water of a waterfall or such) and when available light leaves you no choice but using a slow shutter, forms of is are useful. Note that the first reason has absolutely zero to do with light levels and a larger sensor won’t magically solve that. Additionally, the 1 stop approx advantage of an aps-c sensor is more then compensated for by the 2-3 stops you can gain from is in low light conditions, so even thete that larger sensor doesn’t make up for lack of is.
The relevant question is how often you encounter this, and how important those cases are to you, so its quite possible that for you personally the larger sensor is much more important, but from a technical point of view what you say is just wrong.
It depends on what your “new user” is.
If they are upgrading from a P&S, then your basic assumption is off base: A P&S user is accustomed to shooting without a viewfinder and would therefore be expected to not care about / want a builtin EVF because it adds cost and bulk. Thus, they would probably avoid both the NEX6 and GX7 and instead look for something from the GF or E-PL series.
Someone looking for an EVF is probably coming from an SLR of some sort. In that case they’d almost certainly notice and appreciate the better lens line up m43 has to offer.
That raises a good question. Who exactly is buying “high end” (~800-1300$) mirrorless cameras right now?
Upgraders from phone and point and shoot?
Upgraders from entry level mirroless?
DSLR users moving to mirrorless?
DSLR users getting a mirrorless as a second body?
I’d like to know the answer. Your assumption that most are current or ex-DSLR users is probably correct.
Depends if they stick a usable VF inside.
Recently tested some EVFs in the local store but man… the lower priced cameras EVFs were really horrible. I’ve yet to test a GH3 so I don’t know how VFs differ on the Panasonic range but the EVF on the G5 was totally ridiculous. If light sources moved (or I moved the camera), I’d see rainbow trails behind them. I mean, wtf.
Rainbows? Place the Oly’s VF2 against a strong light and you will see mini ponies!
Many lens choices….Sony doesn’t have them.
No lenses for NEX – only 38 on B&H’s web site. How many lenses do you need?
38 useless lenses.
Weres a 50 1.4 , fast zooms, wide prime, fast portrait, long macro, 600mm lenses? I could go on.
And sony gets clean images by smearing the crap out of everything, thats why mft out chart them in every test. Popphoto got a resolution score so low from the 5n that they re tested just in case. And they pointed out that the 12mp sensor in the pens out resolve the 16mp sensors from sony. Theyre that bad. But if you like smearing you can always turn noise reduction all the way up in lightroom and smoke a 5d mk3.
Delusional Daewoo failboy.
That’s complete rubbish. Sony NEX has plenty of good lenses. And M43 DOES NOT “smoke” NEX. Are you serious? I have GH3 and NEX5n, and I see myself grabbing my NEX5n much more than my GH3. If it wasn’t for the great video quality coming out of my GH3, I would have got rid of it a long time ago. I’m telling you, the GX7 has to be far ahead of the NEX6 to command this kind of price (the NEX6 can be had for nearly have the price of the GX7). Sony’s on the verge of announcing a full-frame NEX to succeed the NEX7 – God help Panasonic if it doesn’t cost much more than the GX7.
About full frame NEX, price is reported to be >3000$. It is no competition for GX7, price wise.
@ True Homer
“”38 useless lenses.
Weres a 50 1.4 , fast zooms, wide prime, fast portrait, long macro, 600mm lenses? I could go on.
And sony gets clean images by smearing the crap out of everything, thats why mft out chart them in every test. Popphoto got a resolution score so low from the 5n that they re tested just in case. And they pointed out that the 12mp sensor in the pens out resolve the 16mp sensors from Sony. They’re that bad. But if you like smearing””
Where to start firstly resolution
lets just ignore popphoto for rather obvious reasons
Dpreview
5N Resolution comment
“”The NEX-5N’s JPEG engine is capable of pulling genuine detail out of the chart up to around 2800 lp/ph, which puts it on almost exactly the same level as the Panasonic Lumix DMC-G3 which has a very similar number of vertical pixels. .””
E-P3 one of the dozen with the same 12mp sensor
The E-P3 produces results in our resolution test that are to all intents and purposes the same as the E-PL2. Its relatively light anti-aliasing filter allows it to render the lines on the chart with good separation to at least 2300 LPH, and the image processing removes moire very effectively.
As for lenses you are partly right they are short of native lenses though the Nex mount has as many adapters as mFT giving them a very wide choice of high quality options for those who do not mind MF.There are a number of very decent options though some are quite pricey.
The older 5N sensor outperforms even the best current mFT options in every area
http://www.dxomark.com/index.php/Cameras/Compare-Camera-Sensors/Compare-cameras-side-by-side/%28appareil1%29/793|0/%28brand%29/Olympus/%28appareil2%29/737|0/%28brand2%29/Sony
As for smearing detail by high NR the Olympus models including the E-M5 have amongst the highest default NR of any system not surprising really , have you ever looked at a low light high ISO shot from the E-M5 with all NR turned off including the defaults in ACR etc not a pretty site
Why are we ignoring popphoto? Because you dont like what they say?theyve been doind tests for much more years than dpreview, which test dynamic range using jpegs and reeolution after sharpening the files. The 5n is a smear monster after iso 800, good for the point and shoot crowd but not for me.
Go to a a good resolution test site like lenstip and see m43s lenses outresolve the crwp out of apsc. Then go and look at the comparison roger cicala did of the 12-35 vs 24-70 and tell me the pany doesnt smoke it. Imaging resource always end up comparing m43s to apsc and they always conclude it holds on to more detail.
Theres nothing sadder than having proof right in front of you and not wanting to see it.
I agree. Success means selling to the masses. But, at this point in photographic history. I have to wonder,is it possible to sell to the masses and make money when the iphone has taken over as the modern day polaroid? At $1,000 that’s a bit steep for the average person where i live. I’m not saying it’s not a great camera but it’s going to be hard to sell tons of these when the last generation camera is currently good enough. Nothing ground breaking is going on here.
I agree. Success means selling to the masses. But, at this point in photographic history. I have to wonder,is it possible to sell to the masses and make money when the iphone has taken over as the modern day polaroid? At $1,000 that’s a bit steep for the average person where i live. I’m not saying it’s not a great camera but it’s going to be hard to sell tons of these when the last generation camera is currently good enough. Nothing ground breaking is going on here.
I agree. Success means selling to the masses. But, at this point in photographic history. I have to wonder,is it possible to sell to the masses and make money when the iphone has taken over as the modern day polaroid? At $1,000 that’s a bit steep for the average person where i live. I’m not saying it’s not a great camera but it’s going to be hard to sell tons of these when the last generation camera is currently good enough. Nothing ground breaking is going on here.
m4/3 cameras are built to be – expensive 🙂
I dont understand current m4/3 price policy: a very high initial price vs steal price when clearing the stock. I would prefer constant, affordable $750 which makes good value for every buyer. And attracts more potential customers. With high prices m4/3 lake will never become a dominating system.
Why do people complain about the price as if this is the ONLY m43 camera available? Just like DSLRs, there’s a range of prices for m43 cameras. When Canon released the 1DX, did people complain about the $6800 price tag and that you can get a Nikon D3200 for $390???
The deal there is that there is an obvious chain advantages as you move through the range of eg Nikon , better build quality, weather sealing, AF modules , sensor size, performance and so on.Apart from the new IS what does the E-P5 give me over the E-PL5 weather sealing nope, better image quality nope , better AF nope , empty wallet yup.
I personally do not see why anyone would consider an E-P5 over an E-M5 especially now that the E-M5 is dropping in price it is currently £230 less than it launched at or around £90 less than the E-P5 without an EVF.they weigh within 5g of each other the E-P5 is a little heavier with the EVF
I will reserve judgement until the full specs and reviews are in including the street price of the camera. Most probably it will be competitively priced.
called it … kind of. Since a little over 1000 means probably 1200€. In which case I’ll probably wait for the inevitable price fall a few months later. Seriously, if these camera become cheaper so fast, why make the inital price so high? Doesn’t make sense. If you have a good price from the beginning, people will order like crazy, which looks good in sales charts etc.
If you start with a “good” price since the beginning you leave early adopters’ money on the table, pretty much like Olympus did with the EM-5. It might sound weird to you but many managers regretted the (relatively low) introductory price. Probably an error they won’t repeat any time soon.
Considering that the GH3 sells for $1300, $1100 with current discount, and considering that, on paper, the GX7’s features are better, $1000-1100 seems quite reasonable to me. I’m willing to trade E-P5’s 5-axis for the tiltable EVF, too, since the EVF will allow at least 1-stop stability. And, GX7’s sensor has the potential to be better, so it’s great that it will be only slightly more expensive.
Debating whether to preorder or wait out the initial price. Hopefully there will be rumors about IQ soon. My E-PM1 is at the repair shop and the wait is driving me nuts.
On the other hand, refurbished E-PM1 is $130 at Cameta. 🙂
Correction: I’m pretty nuts to start with. The wait is making me more nuts than I already am. 🙂
in germany the price fall of the gxq took a while, nearly a year…
Just wait until the price drops to 299, like GX1
Will be mine in 2015. For the moment, very happy with GX1.
by the time the price is down to 299
There will be NEX FF and people will be moving from DSLR/m43 to Full Frame Nex with Zeiss glasses
Yeah and pigs will fly
…and New Zealand will be touching Anartica!
🙂
As if everyone needs ff. Or has the money for it, since it will always be a substantially higher investment, especially for lenses. Finally, the size advantage of m43 will be even more pronounced between m43 and sony ney ff. Although I have to admit that the minituriazation results of Sony are almost witchcraft.
The current state-of-the-rumor is that the NEX-FF will be $3000.
i would rather buy Sony RX1-R just to have A FULL FRAME CAMERA rather than to have another FF ILC Mirrorless System, since i already have M43 as well as XF Fuji system and Nikon FF for a work,.could not afford another system to invest in the future.
People that are waiting for a nex full frame are idiots. They have a nex ff camcorder and it shoots in crop mode because in ff mode it vignettes like theres no tomorrow. And if after yeeeeeears they still dont have a decent lens line up for nex aps c, how much you think its gonna take them to get a ff line going? How big do you think those lenses are gonna be? And what do you thinknthe price of the camera plus lens will be? Are you dreaming of 1500$? 2000$? Keep on dreaming. When and IF the nex ff happens itll be ridiculously expensive and none of you will get it
I agreed. Those who think that smaller means cheaper will be wrong. (Judging on 6D pricing vs nex FF)
And if $1000 is too ex for a gx7, nex FF will be far from reach.
You Sony guys make us look sane lol FF users are by far the most entrenched in a system as they typically have a good selection of lenses.No doubt the NEX FF body will be much smaller and lighter than a FF DSLR but decent quality interchangeable lenses are never going to be small regardless the system meaning you are back to square one, add in the Sony issues and prices of their decent glass and its bye bye.
I vote for
I would consider to buy it.
Depend on sensor that feature in GX7 .
Pricing not a issue to me as long as it deliver what I want . An on par with EM5 sensor is not sufficient enough for me to trigger the purchase . A significant / clear improvement in RAW image quality over my current GX1 is a must .
Maybe the jump from the number 1 to 7 indicates the improvement in IQ 🙂
” An on par with EM5 sensor is not sufficient enough for me to trigger the purchase . A significant / clear improvement in RAW image quality over my current GX1 is a must ”
I would say that a on par with EM5 sensor is a clear improvement in RAW image quality over my current GX1…
But I agree that I’m waiting for something better than E-M5 (even if it is a great cam, i have 2, it’s time for technology improvement !!)
14 stops of dr and 2 more stops of noise control over omd is what you said right? Oh yun…you ridiculous person you…
At that price i would rather get the E-P5 with add-on EVF. So it sticks out whatever, if it hangs on your chest that bump is not bothering anyone. In fact with this one pointing out of the back, it’ll poke in your chest. Anwyay, it’s likely that the magnification of this will be smaller, and maybe even the resolution .. like the G6. Plus i’d prefer the 5-axis IS, obviously. 🙂
The EVF tilts so technically you can have it at 90 degrees. I wonder is it also retractable? 😉
If it is magnesium alloy and the sensor is on par or better than EM5 it will be worth it. Hopefully buying a full kit (with quality lens) will offset the cost, say at 1500
admin, by “kit with the zoom lens”, do you mean the 14-42 MkII / Powerzoom, or a new, as yet unknown zoom (12-50 2.8 – 3.5 hint hint nudge nudge. Whatever happened to that lens, anyway? I think two years ago it was FT4 that it would come.)
@admin what is the kit zoom? Will it be wider or faster than most bundled zooms?
Will there be an aperture ring?
Funny after mention of the price interest dropped suddenly. Well that is notice to Pana.
The other factor is all the other releases from Sony, Oly, Canon, Fuji, and maybe more… All competing in the same space.
Hmmm, the picture indicates a mode dial and a rec button. I believe it will be a shutter speed dial and an on/off button
If the sensor is equal or even better than the GH3, EM5 & EP5 the price seems to be very competitive. Yes, 5-axle and weather-sealing would be nice but still the GX7 looks to be a very good camera for a good price. A new pancake zoom would be nice something like a 12-50 f2.8-4.0.
Dave
I did this incredible. For over 3 yers people here have been clamoring (bitching) for an RF styled m43 cam with built in vf. Now it’s here, for just a little more than the much praised (why?) e-p5, and people still have complaints. It’s no wonder they ignored your cries for so long.
Only worth the price if it has a metal body and WEATHER SEALING! Otherwise, should be priced no higher than a NEX-6.
For $1000 I would have preferred weather sealed. Sealed for $1000 is a good deal!
It makes a difference if it is 1000 dollars or 1000 euros. Hopefully it will be the lower one. Lets see the whole picture. We really don’t know much about the camera yet.
And lets hope that Panasonic’s Canadian prices are more or less at par with American ones, like the dollar. If Olympus can do it, why can’t Panasonic?
I wonder if they will do the usual treat for us in the UK where we get the pleasure of being charged £1000 ( $1500 ) .it is no wonder that the American market gets the slowest availability , more profitable to sell in UK/EU plus there is higher demand. Even our different taxation system should mean at most a 20% difference in price , it should really be less as far more mFT cameras are sold in Europe than in the USA
Did anyone here really expect a lower price? It is perfectly in line with the latest “high end” MFT offerings of Panasonic and Olympus.
I bought the GX1 when it dropped to a reasonable price level and perhaps I will do the same with the GX7 … in 2015 or so. If you want it now, pay the premium price or stop whining.
And they still want to figure out why DSLR stil sells more and more and mirrorless sales are falling
At 1k, I will probably go for it depending on the reviews of the chip performance.
I shoot GX1, one lens only, with a Voigtlander finder, so the new finder means nothing to me, it is all about how the sensor performs in low light. The Sony RX1r would have taken me away from Panasonic if it had been priced at 2k, not 2.7k.
So you would have traded an interchangable camera system with a smaller sensor for a fixed sensor ff camera? Interesting.
It makes sense Narretz, he says he uses a single lens. Consider also that Sony RX1 has two crop modes to “simulate” two other lens lenghts. You’ll loose pixels, being crops, but it packs 24mp.
he mentioned that he uses only one lens with his GX1
I will not consider any future M4/3 after my OM-D unless it has focuspeaking.
If the next OM form Olympus does not have it, I will go for a NEX
bye bye !!
If Panasonic puts everything they have into this price-point, it would be a sweet deal!
Although I don’t agree on the form-factor, I would buy this cam for the swivel evf.
Not good. Need to price $999 or lower or else fail
This price upon release is to be expected for a camera of this specification whether we like it or not.
Those who want one and can’t afford it can wait a little longer and in a few months prices start dropping everywhere to something most would consider a more reasonable price.
I voted no for many reasons and price has nothing to do with it because if the ep5 had a built in VF it would be worth it’s asking price.
I shoot jpeg + raw, always.
When I don’t have time to edit or touch up hundreds of images after a holiday a great jpeg engine comes in very handy until I go to work on what I consider my favorites.
Am I stating that Panasonics jpegs are inferior? No not all, just that their jpegs are good but different to my liking and from point & shoots I’ve owned of theirs after repeatedly attempting to tweak to my liking I couldn’t get the look I wanted. Ultimately this may be a subjective thing but I love Oly and fuji jpegs.
I paid $1500 aud for an x-e1 + 18-55 and $2000 aud for an e-5, I’d have no problem paying $1000 for this body if it had an excellent jpeg engine, that 5-axis is(I’ve read amazing things about), a great sensor, some level of weather sealing and reasonabke video.
After the OMD and GH3 came out I thought I won’t compromise on what is my next camera after my current ep3.
I watch with curiosity regarding this Gx and I applaud Panasonic for being the first to even make such a camera for the m4/3 format, albiet a very over due one.
9 out 10 times I’m an Oly user but Panasonic deserves some respect for bringing a type of camera that simply didn’t exist and Oly just wouldn’t give us.
A camera I meant that simply didn’t exist in the m4/3 world while almost every other format out there did and the irony is this format is the father of them all!
People seem to forget that these cameras are built and sold primarily for the fastest growing Asian market not necessarily the smaller US or European mirrorless markets. To put this into perspective price wise the current best selling mirrorless model in Japan is the GF6 2 lens at $1066 (#10 when including all DSLRs) and you won’t find a DSLR kit less than $950. The recent EP5 with 17mm and added EVF cost $1974 and it shot high up the sales rankings for several weeks for first buyers only to fall sharply to #42 in Japan. I think the GX7 will be $999 for body in US and 999 Euros in Europe because of higher taxes. Don’t forget Pany is rumored to be coming with a smaller model sans EVF early next year but with similar high specs and that model likely to be $200 cheaper?
Because the yen is valued so high and the dollar and euro lower these manufacturers will produce and sell to the Japanese market first and then supply in volume only later to US and Europe for newer models.
To think this camera was going to be under $1000.00. I mean, really? Under a grand for a tiltable VF, IS, 18mpx and WiFi?
Panasonic listened to us, to an extent, and now you all don’t want it.
Yet, if this was a Olympus camera, you all would jump for joy at that price.
Pathetic.
Thing is that the E-P5 is widely seen as overpriced, and the price were okay if it had an internal evf. And now the GX7 is even more expensive, if just a little. So it’s actually no surprise.
The ep5 was seen as over priced everywhere but here. Go read the comment section when the price was announced. Lists and lists as to why it was a good price.
Lets see what the sensor is capable of.
If it can match the OMD / E-P5 camera, then it might be worth the price.
If the IW will be less, similar to the current GX1, then the camera will be way overpriced.
This trend of charging over $1000 for a camera body is getting ridiculous. At what point did we send the message to the camera manufacturers that the majority of us have thousands of dollars to blow on camera bodies, as well as the will and the means to repeat the behavior every year?
$1000? …c’mon.
If Panasonic uses its new partnership with Fuji for an Xtrans type sensor in the GX7, that pars or outperforms the OM-D, then YES it’s worth it !
The sensor in the GH3 already matches the E-m5 , I think that no matter what tech is used a larger sensor with that tech will always do better. The E-m5 is not even on par with the last gen Sony 16 mp APS in the Pentax k5 and Nikon d5100 etc .It is getting a little amusing to see all the posts around here looking for miracle sensors when if you are all as genuinely worried about image quality as the posts suggest.There are numerous better options from Nikon ,Canon,Sony ,Fuji and Pentax and worse still much of it is cheaper! This pricing is beyond a joke now , don’t get me wrong i love my mFT kit and I use it a lot more than my K5 set up , but seriously.
The K5II costs around £670 ,for a camera with an excellent sensor better than my E-pl5 excellent build quality fully weather sealed with built in IS , very good bright 100% view finder, with a larger sensor so how come the E-P5 with no EVF , no weather sealing and a lower sensor score costs £860 . I would love an E-p5 with EVF but no way am I paying £1150 for it when three are so many others options big mistake mFT is not Leica ,even though their pricing may make you think otherwise lol
So it seems it does not innovate on value either. Unless something miraculous secret is revealed later, like getting 1500+ on DxOMark’s high ISO score, or having global electronic shutter for ANY shutter speed (and ultra-low ISO emulation, reliability, quietness etc), or great AF-C tracking.
I bet you have an EM5 and think you are protecting your investment by insisting that the GX7 has to have the features that you want. Just a guess. We don’t know whether the GX7 has an electronic shutter at all shutter speeds yet, but it will be better for some people than the EM5 even if it has none of the features you want.
DOA.
Fine, that the price will be high! I hate to buy a camera if everyone is able to afford it.
Lately Italian trolls are particularly pathetic in their decadent ways… Perhaps they regret Bunga Bunga and their former goverments of apes…
Said the worst troll ever seen. U’re an ignorant racist , pathetic and hypocrite.. Seeing your face on blogs is like seeing $ h i t in a beautiful place bwahahahaha
Impressive, if it had been APS-C sized sensor the pixel count would’ve been 31-32Mpix (!!)
Thom.An – the Fuji XTrans is merely a trusty Sony 16Mpix sensor with a non-bayer colour array and without the AA filter. I don’t think you would want a sensor many RAW converters have problems converting.
That is why I said xTrans *type* 🙂
Could they utilize the Fuji non-bayer color array on a modified and improved GH3 sensor ?
Wouldn’t it be worth its price if it outperforms GH3 ? (Though, I doubt they would allow a GX series to outperform a GH series … and with this thought, I answered my own question and shouldn’t have too high expectations for this new 18Mp sensor)
Some people specialize in negativity. Not healthy.
The poll shows that we have a majority of anonymous wimps who clamour in favour of Panny until crunch time comes – $$$.
They’ll probably while away another year of waiting – 2015 – whining about how Olys are overpriced.
Whatever their disguise, Oly and Panny are trying to sell us 1/3 of additional value for 50% more.
That’s their way of keeping profits stable, either in the face of declining demand for cameras and/or depreciations of the Yen.
Now for us Europeans it becomes even more critical to know if 1099 $ means 1099 EU or 1430 EU!
I personally don’t think that ANY non pro camera is worth that, not even a NEX 7 24 Mpx camera, which has no better resolution that a 16 Mpx one.
So as always we’ll hear a gnashing of teeth and lots of trollish vaporware 🙂
“Now for us Europeans it becomes even more critical to know if 1099 $ means 1099 EU or 1430 EU!”
Wait … what ? 🙂
$1000 is 768.58Euro
so for Europeans the question becomes a range between 768Euro and 1000Euro
Right, but it will never happen.
Think that Phe E-P5 with EVF and lens is some 1400 EU, so I am not far from the mark, unfortunately – Unless panny has a different exchange rate policy from Oly.
bye bye!
Whine whine whine … That’s all you guys do around here.
I remember I bought a 3MP Sony f505V for $1,000 back in the days. It was horribly slow, with a small LCD.
Back in the days other equally spec cameras were probably the same amount. In a hundred years in the future they could product something like this for peanuts too. What’s your point? My Playstation 3 outperforms my Playstation 1 and was cheaper, does that mean I got a good deal on it?
Ridiculous pricing for the Panasonic. Would rather get a cheaper NEX-6 for half the price and same features with the benefit of a bigger APS-C sensor. To be honest, this is what the GF2 (back in the day) or GX1 should of been. Not to mention we’re now seeing the onset of FF mirrorless, Panasonic is YEARS too late with this.
I fully realize that comparing a DSLR to MFT is apples to oranges, but…..
Nikon D7100 is priced at $1200.00 body only.
The EM-5 was $999.00 Body only.
The GX1 with the optional VF was around the same price when it debuted.
Now the fanboys are in a furor when this camera with added functionality and larger sensor cost more.. HAHAHAHA!
Wow.. The stupidity that goes on here.. Amazing!
But hey, either you’re going to buy it, or not. majority of people here weren’t going to buy it in the first place, simply because it’s a Panasonic, which is sad really.. One company likes screwing and overcharging for it’s products, and another simply gives what is asked for, only to be hated upon.
Larger sensor? Are you nut or something?
Agreed. I think the ‘m43 is overpriced’ is a fad that started with the E-P5 which, without an EVF, rather is. (Granted, if you don’t want an EVF the P5 is arguably a better deal, but you’re comparing apples to oranges at that point.)
Oddly, the E-M5, presently considered a good deal at $900, doesn’t pick up the same criticism. By all indications, though, the GX7 will be better to the point that if it’s $1100 it should also be a “good deal”. Or is the thought that the 5-axis stabilization and weather sealing (which the GX7 could have) are worth that much?
Anyways, what really raises this all to the point of ridiculous is that we know almost _nothing_ about the GX7. It may well be weather sealed. The IBIS may be quite good. The sensor may be quite a lot better than the E-M5’s. At this point we simply cannot say. Without knowing the actual feature set / performance and price it could be a steal or overpriced.
M/43 is dead , just s witch to fuji is just way better selling my gh3 now 🙂
Nuts! just sold my xe1 for a new gh3: if I had known, I’d have grabbed yours! 🙂
Yes ? You will fell very bad when used in low light images fall apart
Nope. It does fine in low light. The half a stop I get from the fuji is only visible at 100% crops and iso 12k. And lightroom has noise reduction, did you know? Is there a watercolor effect reduction slider in lightroom? Cause I cant find it. Is there a “good af mode” in the fuji? Cause the gh3 will af in -3 ev and the fuji has trouble in daylight. Af with the fuji after sundown? Forget about it.
And btw, I got almost half of what I paid for my xpro less than a year out.
Body only over $1k?
1.5 years ago, Olympus E-M5 was introduced at body only $1k and sells really well. It sells so well even now that the price dropped only $100 to $900.
Can Panasonic do the same? Kind of unlikely if judged solely on the information leaked.
E-M5 has ground-breaking sensor IQ (comparing to other m43 offerings) and new 5-axis IBIS at the time of release. What is new or even ground breaking about this GX-7? Built-in tiltable viewfinder is about the only thing new.
Most people don’t consider the center hump viewfinder of E-M5 ugly or inconvenient. Unless GX-7 has better sensor IQ, it won’t be stealing many customers from E-M5. Worse, the OMD-Pro is releasing soon. Not optimistic for this GX-7.
This is going to be a great camera but I think panny is missing an opportunity with its pricing. The gx7 could have destroyed the overpriced e-p5 but instead it looks like their 20mm kit will be close to the price of oly’s 18mm kit. Some people might view the 5-axis ibis and removable evf (because it could be sold separately or carried over to a future body) as being the better purchase.
If the rumors are true (im skeptical) that the 20mm AF speed has not been improved, reviews of the gx7 may also be critical of its AF when compared to its closest competition. It’s almost like panny is trying not to upstage the e-p5??? Is there some sort of deeper level of partnership going on?
I don´t intend to sound too pessimistic but I don´t think that this new sensor will be any better than that one in the current Oly models, worse I don´t believe this GX7 is going to have any weather sealing and even worst the evf might not be as good as the Oly VF 4. But as a whole package the GX7 could be more complete and pleasing to use (no fiddling with the add on evf, better grip, cool form factor) than the e-P5 or OMD-EM 5. So in the end, it might be worth it´s price after all.
As for the price I think we shouldn´t mourn about a few hundred bucks more or less. Sooner or later it will go down. Instead of body prices I worry about lens prices much more because lenses seem to be stable or even getting pricier.
On the other hand, the argument for high camera prices has been (back in the day) that the bigger the sensor the more expansive the camera, because big sensors are very expensive in production (that´s what I´ve been told). So the rational should be that smaller sensors lead to less expensive cameras. In mft that does not happen in comparison to APS-C or even FF.
A Nikon D600 or Canon 6d is much more reasonably priced than their mft counterparts, if you think about production cost.
I always thought that the reason for a small sensor dominated camera future would be their lower production cost (and lower prices for bodies and lenses) and technological progress that closes the gap in image quality to the point of being good enough for most people (that´s where we are right now). But the price requirement doesn´t seem to be fulfilled. Sorry for off topic.
GX7 – interesting camera – let´s see what it got…
Either you are into money laundering or dentistry, so whatever price doesn’t affect you.
Even, perhaps you prefer to be among the happy few and despise us mere mortals.
However I think that the common perception is that m4/3 small size advantage shouldn’t be paid more than 200 5 be it an entry level, of a mid tier dSLR.
We know instead that mirrorless prices are between 30% to 50% more, which is outrageous, since we see their real price two years later.
The reason is very simple:mall Mirrorless makers sell 10% less than C or N, so they have to offset their R&D by hiking prices.
However a rational customer will compare sensor technology and not pay attention to much else.
I am very wary of mirrorless becoming luxury items, that is why I have high hopes for Kodak and the Chinese market. If they can catch that with low prices, mirrorless will never be the same.
amalric, didn´t I write exactly the same thing as you? Mft is overpriced in comparison to APS-C and FF, it should be much cheaper. But as the sensors in mft cameras are all the same (at least in Oly products) they become unimportant as factors of price differentiation. You didn´t buy the OMD for it´s sensor alone, did you? You could have bought the e-pm 2 instead with the same iq for half the price. ;o)
Well no, perhaps I am old hat, but I thought that the new sensor deserved good ergonomics. For snaps my E-PM1 is plenty enough.
Now this is the big question about the new Panny: better ergonomics, but is there a matching sensor?
My doubts are that we are approaching the density limit for cropped sensors: NEX 7’s 24 Mpx were nototiously too much. Is that because of the diffraction limit? Or noise? However resolution is not in proportion.
AA filters have been withdrawn but I am wondering if we are not reaching a limit, above which it’s only wasted money.
It happened to me with film: I didn’t need to buy further – the limit became having better concepts. So if the GX 7 is up to the E-M5 I would be more than happy. But it might suffer image degradation too, because pixel density is not managed well enough.
Everything is in the execution with high density sensors.
“”My doubts are that we are approaching the density limit for cropped sensors: NEX 7′s 24 Mpx were notoriously too much. Is that because of the diffraction limit? Or noise? However resolution is not in proportion.””
Firstly diffraction effects all sensors at the exact same DOF regardless of MP count,the newest 24mp sensor in the D5200/D7100 is the best sensor ever put in an APS body and easily outperforms the best mFT has to offer in every area DR, colour,high ISO.The downsides of higher MP count are outweighed by the advantages
As for the nex7 try downloading equally exposed RAW files from it and the NEX7 and the E-M5 you will see that the Nex has better resolution, better DR ,better colour and even a tad better high ISO.One of the advantages of high MP counts is the added flexibility that extra detail gives you
It seems that most people are finding the price to be too high, but for me it’s a good sign that this camera will be a high-end product. I’m hoping for something that does video as well as the GH3, and the price seems to suggest that it might.
I don’t buy cameras that often, but when I do I’m willing to pay a premium price for an excellent product.
Sean Nelson: This makes sense, especially when it comes with an excellent kit lens.
Then buy a fuji
I won’t give serious consideration to Fuji until they take video seriously.
I wont seriously consider a Fuji camera until Fuji itself takes video seriously.
Not enough external control dials.
wait, what about GX2-6?
GX7 is Pana’s way of showing how much of an improvement the new camera is. Also GF6 + GX1 = 7. Forget about the missing GF4, it’s no biggie. Still would have preferred a different name, why not GL1?
7 would make it better than 5 as in E-M5. Yes, no doubt about it.
Interesting how the poll results got inverted in a few days, from Yes to No 🙂
I’m hoping the high priced is hinting this will be a sick hybrid camera. If this offers manual video controls and high bitrate codecs on a similar to or better sensor than the 16mpx one’s we’ve seen then I think $1000 sounds about right. My challenge as a M43 shooter is I want to merge my OMD and GH2 into a GX1 body. Sounds like this may do it. Crossing fingers. Picture quality is already more than good enough for me and most of us for the newer gen sensors. To me the video will set this apart. IBIS + OIS (google panasonic’s camcorders on hybrid ois), touch focus in video, gh3 / hacked gh2 like codecs with the existing lens selection would be butter.
Of course I won’t buy it until it’s 299 haha =p.
The initial cost argument is boring, any price too high is too much … big news.
What is bugging me about this body the most is that EVF . . . in 2006 an EVF poking out that far was a technology issue, but in 2013? What are they cheaping out on here? The same complaint to the EVFs on the PENs, why is there so much depth to them? They use Epson thin film LCD tech, and then position the eye so far from it? Why not shrink that distance with some optics, because they are being too cheap is probably the answer.
I look at the SONY NEX EVF depth and it’s much shallower. So, it’s not impossible. It’s nice to see that Panasonic came out with an RF styled body, but the resulting EVF application seems way out of date for both PAN and PEN. Maybe Olympus can share some of the SONY EVF tech, because it seems to be the biggest crutch of mFT is EVF advancement. They can achieve the pixels count, but they can’t shorten the distance to the eye?
If the EVF really does flip then at least you’ll be able to trade depth for height by flipping it up when you put it into your pocket or camera bag.
This may come as a little too late for Pana. Across the pond on SAR, it appears Sony is again going to make waves with their new releases; new sensor, new jpg engines, new lenses…
Pana needs a foothold by offering a competitive sensor and bundle an exceptional lense. Camera bodies come and go but a good lense is an investment for the future and will justify a premium price.
Let me state it again “A good kit lense is essential for consumers to buy-in to a premium product”
I’d agree that a good kit lens (not “lense” BTW) is a blessing, but Panasonic has poor experience with that – they had one of the finest kit-zoom lenses on the market, supplied with the L1; it was one of several reasons the package was too expensive and sold very modestly. The 14-45 kit lens for the G1/GF1 is still regarded as the best quality M43 zoom short of the recent fast and high-priced 12-35, but Panasonic found that they had to produce the inferior and cheaper 14-42 to keep price under control.
You can see the general reaction here. Everyone is excited about the G7, but get cold feet when it comes to shelling out money for a relatively premium product. A very high quality kit-lens bundle sounds good to me also, but would only exacerbate the negativity over price.
I’ll paste in an edit of a comment I made several weeks ago, that I believe is a good idea (I mention Panasonic but the idea applies to Olympus, Fuji etc. just as well):
Panasonic should consider a pricing structure that gives a standard good discount for (say up to two) separately-boxed lenses when purchased along with the latest-model body. This would give incentive for early adopters to buy at a profitable price for Panasonic, and likewise reduce the penalty of purchasing the latest body while a previous version is heavily discounted. It would also encourage customers to build their lens system methodically while enjoying upgraded bodies. One wouldn’t have to buy a low-end kit lens if one didn’t need it; in particular no one need be stuck with multiple copies of a standard kit lens. Finally, it would simplify the inventory and sales-channel management. All bodies boxed and inventoried consistently as body-only, to be matched with lenses or sold separately as each customer desires.
JHCCAZ, what a great idea 🙂
“a pricing structure that gives a standard good discount for (say up to two) separately-boxed lenses when purchased along with the latest-model body”
I would say any body so long as it is not discontinued stock.
In any case, my thought came from the $1000+ price body only. Pana could offer a good lens at say 30-40% discount to sweeten the deal, but this being a premium product the lens will also need to be premium. There is no point offering a basic kit zoom with a premium product.
And when the next latest and greatest comes along consumers will jump ship, but if they already owe great lenses, it may be incentive to stick around.
GH3 started 300 higher at $1299. GX7 will likely have higher photo quality. Those arguing this would cut into GH3: so what, GH3 is video optimized, GX7 won’t have high bit rate codecs for video. Is $1000 too high? Well, the ep-5 is the same price with no evf.
I’m noticing the Olympus fans are very quiet about this camera.
“I’m noticing the Olympus fans are very quiet about this camera.”
Oly fans are mostly fair players, very much unlike Panny fans. If Oly fans don’t find good things to say, they shut up.
The only thing new with GX=7 here is an integrated evf that is tiltable. Not too many are excited about that. The rest has yet to be seen.
This carries fandom to a new level. Not only do Olympus owners have better cameras but they are better people, fair and restrained.
Olympus and Panasonic both make good cameras, and their respective owners are equally fine folk and good citizens. The EM5 is a good camera. The GX7 is very likely to be a good one too.
Can we dispense with the ad hominum stuff?
You are probably the only Anonymous having fair play. The schizophrenic ADHD typical troll here if the frustrated Panny owner, long deprived of a credible camera, and up to date sensor.
He is usually followed by jealous Fujiite, who forked a fortune for his wares, only to be electrocuted randomly by Fuji’s haphazard firmware.
NEX henchmen used to be as agressive, but they toned back their attacks since they were thrown a few Sigmas and had to save a fortune for their only Zeiss lens 🙂
There are trends, not only thos watched by Thom in mirrorless, but also in mirrorless trolls. One must be an accomplished troll whisperer to tell them apart.
By comparison we Oly owners are true gentlemen, and never insist on others’ sorrows 🙂
Quite on the contrary. I commented several posts ago that this seems to be the camera that Oly would not make despite all the requests. So they will have to put up with defectors. It’s nearer to what we have been telling Oly we want than they are producing. They won’t listen that’s their problem. I may even get one myself.
Delighted to hear it. 🙂
Reply was to Almaric
“Oly fans are mostly fair players”
I had similar arguments, claiming that Mercedes drivers are better than BMW drivers. This was when I was six years old.
It is funny that simple minds categorize people according to the products they buy. Must have something to do with marketing.
Facts could very often be observed. It is quite obvious that Oly fans seldom deny shortcomings of Oly gears. Panny fans on the other hand will very often do whatever they can to deny and ridicule. Make one really wonders if those are really fans or employees.
Well I have G1, GH2 and EPl5. So where does that put me? No need to think some kind of people buy Oly and some other kind of people, unfair ones, tend to prefer Panny. Seems a bit illogical to me.
who give a fu*k!
Not to get into fan wars, I just found it interesting how every time Panasonic announced a new camera, dozens of commenters would say “no IBIS no sale” or some variation.
And… the next lumix camera is rumored to have ibis.
Its no different from how people have been commenting on all the olympus lenses because they want them in black, and finally we have black lenses from them.
The silly part is the insane arguments about how ibis is an irrelevant feature, lessee if those same people will still be saying this when the gx7 is released.
I went for “I would consider to buy it”.
The reason is that I thought it is going to be like MSRP $999 for body. Consider all these type of cameras – NEX-6 $750, NEX-7 $1100, X-E1 $800 (and even x-pro1 at $1200), the question for me is how “little” it will be above a grand. I’m fine with $100 more if they include some useful feature like MAR.
I love the totally new, tiltable, integrated EVF!
What’s the difference between options 1 and 2?
I’d definitely consider buying this camera, but only if it could match the performance of the ep-5 and had the benefit of a built in viewfinder.
If it used the IBIS system from the e-p5, same or better sensor, similar AF performance, 1M+ dot screen, 2M+ dot evf etc. I’d buy it for sure.
Well, it’s pretty obvious that it has a built-in viewfinder so that’s half your checklist ticked lol
I will, half years later, don’t mind to keep my GF1 for another half year, or one, or two…
Mmmm..
Unless it has the same sensor as the E-M5 or a better one, I’m not interested. An E-P5 with integrated VF4 would be very tempting..
Yes the sensor is still the wild card. It is claimed to be a “new” one but don’t know what that means.
I seem to remember one of the highlighted advantages of M4/3 when it was first announced was the reduced manufacturing costs vs DSLRs, precisely because of the lack of mirror, prism and AF sensor, and don’t give me the ¨economies of scale¨ bs argument, Oly I can understand to an extent but Panasonic is as much a manufacturing giant as Sony. This much marketed advantage applied to lenses as well, less glass element = cheaper lenses at comparable quality. M4/3 paid its R&D cost a LOOONG time ago so where those this premium prices come from ? You’re gonna give me the ¨you pay for the price¨ BS, right ? So why does Sony or other manufacturers compared to Pany and Oly afford to price their system so competitively ? Now you’re gonna give me a list of lens and body prices that compare favorably to other systems, right ? then how could they manufacture a lens such as the 20mm 1.7 for such a price in the beginning and not now ? (I’m not talking about software correction and lens design, this is pure marketing)
Let’s be honest, little by little PanOly have been increasing the MSRP of their m4/3 products, some may be justified, others -a lot- are not, they began the mirrorless crusade all by themselves in a humble manner but got greedy from the years without competition. When Sony first entered the market people were relieved that competition would bring lower prices to consumers but that has hardly been the case, as portrayed by the E-P5 and this GX7 Pany and Oly don’t give a FCUK about competition, it’s like the Nex 6 and the Fuji aren’t even there.
I know this sounds like a rant by some cheap bstard but trust me, I’m way more worried about this system isolating itself out of the market into an even smaller niche and disappearing (like legacy 4/3) than I’m about my wallet. I can cope with current prices (if the products are worth it) but when you see equivalent systems being sold for less and m4/3 going for almost double with no apparent reason then it gets me worried big time. It’s like Oly and Sony new partnership included some prearrangement to set their market shares beforehand, as in, Sony only agreed to save Oly if they agreed to renounce part of the market and recluse themselves into a safe 15% or so market share from now on. It’s sounds paranoid, and it is, but the way they’re pricing their stuff lately (12mm, 17mm, 12-50, E-P5,OMD, etc) that’s the road they’re paving. If they really wanted to fight Sony and Fuji for this market they would go full force with marketing internationally and price their stuff competitively or at least comparably (to DSLRs). I know, that costs LOADS of money and the market is down, well OF COURSE it’s down ! because NO ONE knows the advantages of mirrorless, and m4/3 even less…It doesn’t matter how much marketing cost, of they can capture any % of DSLR market back then it’s worth it.
Marketing, marketing, marketing…that’s the only way into mirrorless dominance and profits, no matter how much it costs.
TLDR:
If M4/3 doesn’t reduce it’s prices and start eroding more of that DSLR market this system will become irrelevant in a few years. M4/3 needs to become a mass market system, THE mirrorless system of the masses, like 135mm film became the standard decades ago. It needs to offer options for both casual amateurs and pro/semipro photographers. Going up is a good thing, it’s what we asked for years but they need to conquer that mass market first. Sony, Canon and Nikon are eating away those sales and M4/3 reacts by increasing their MSRP ? seriously, wth.
addendum:
.where those *these premium prices come from ?
.Also, I meant ¨you pay for the size¨ not price
3 options in the vote, but aren’t 2 of them the same? You are asking would we consider buying, yes or no.
Make the whole camera stealth black, none of this black with chrome trim business…
Panasonic has 5-axis IBIS for some compact cameras.Why Panasonic does not give us 5-axis OIS for mFT cameras too?
http://panasonic.net/avc/lumix/compact/zs30_tz40/video.html#hybrid-ois
As a professional Nikon user I look to my GX1 as a consumer carry around camera. If they are going to offer the new GX7 at 1000 euros it needs to be a professional camera – which it isn’t. If I am going to spend that sort of money I would probably spend a bit extra and get a Nikon body.
Sorry Panasonic, but I don’t the GX7 as a professional camera, so please don’t give a professional price
@paul
There are a lot of more affordable m4/3 bodies available to pick from, so if one model is outside your preferred price bracket, there is a very good chance on other models being inside it still. GFx models come to mind, as do the G6 and a host of Olympus PENs (only the E-P5 doesn’t qualify here with its $1000 body only price). The GFx models don’t have the features you need but the GX7 will? Thats why one is actually a consumer grade camera, and the other is a clear step above that level.
Not to mention, I find your argument rather silly. A PRO Nikon body for $1000 isn’t. The best you’ll get is what is often referred to as an ‘advanced amateur’ level camera, such as the D7100. The D600 isn’t anywhere a ‘pro’ grade body either eventho the best street prices still put it at 50% higher, and that is the general picture you’ll get when looking at the high-end market. Hence, demanding a ‘pro’ grade body for $1000 from anyone, Panasonic included, seems rather silly. A body with some pro-grade features, but overall still an ‘advanced amateur’ level camera such as the E-M5 or D7100 for that price is however quite the norm.