A highly trusted source confirmed that the new Panasonic GH 4K camera has a NEW(!) 16 Megapixel sensor. But on a first test he made there seems to be no improvement on stills Image Quality. The sensor’s goal is to deliver a super video quality and all the circuitry around the sensor has been redone to optimize heat dissipation.
And it’s confirmed. Announcement at 5-6am London time on Friday February 7 (London timezone). As usual you can follow live the announcement on 43rumors!
—
For sources: Sources can send me anonymous info at 43rumors@gmail.com (create a fake gmail account) or via contact form you see on the right sidebar. Thanks!
For readers: Don’t miss any news. Join our group on facebook and follow our tweets.
Rumors classification explained (FT= FourThirds):
FT1=1-20% chance the rumor is correct
FT2=21-40% chance the rumor is correct
FT3=41-60% chance the rumor is correct
FT4=61-80% chance the rumor is correct
FT5=81-99% chance the rumor is correct
73 Responses
Hoping for super slow motion modes like the Sony FS700 has 😀
If the camera really isn’t even capable of 60p in 4K mode then it certainly isn’t going to be able to do anything notable in terms of slow motion.
All you ever talk about is slow motion…
It is overated.
@Sean Nelson
The GH4 has been a long time in development and I’m sure it will be the stand out Micro Four Thirds product of 2014.
As for it’s 4K and slow mo/high fps offerings I’m sure they will be better than anything your beloved Nikon eventually produces within the 2-3 years.
…pretending to be a camera. So much for photography progress.
In case you haven’t heard, cameras are expected to do both stills AND video these days. 😛
Some seem to be limited to stills only, while others, like the G, GX, GF and GH-series, are far more capable and flexible.
+1
The philosophy of the GH line has always been that of a true hybrid. Is that so difficult to comprehend?
You know how some companies JUST DON’T GET IT?
It’s been clear for some time that someone at Panasonic made a decision that Panasonic would NEVER EVER again be surprised by how good the video on its cameras is. After the good video from the GH2, Panasonic built an APC sized tank that takes even better video in the GH3, and now has decided that it will hide its future camcorders in the shape of Panasonic GH series cameras.
Not really a problem for me as I will be buying Olympus *cameras.”
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
How did you work that out????
High fps / slow motion will be just as welcome in HD as in ultra HD…..
That reply was for @sean nelson ^
The fact that the camera won’t be 60p capable in 4K mode has already been reported. If that’s true, that tells us the upper data rate that can be pulled off the sensor and processed by the imaging pipeline.
If it can do 4k/30p, then it can do 1080/120p at the same data rate. I think that’s what people are hoping for. And we know, pany engineers are thinking in those terms ’cause of the new w850 and v750 camcorders which can not only do it, but interpolate the rate to 240fps.
The image quality in GX7 is sufficient for stills, even GH3 picture quality is sufficient. A new sensor specialty developed for video is indeed a good news, it can mean global shutter, etc, etc. Bring it on Panasonic!
“Global shutter”, now your just being a tease!
The “4K” label should be the most obvious clue that this is going to be sold as a video camera, which is exactly what video production shooters like myself are looking for. I hope that the rumors of 4:2:2 color and 200 Mbps recording rates are true. ( which will likely mean using Panasonic Micro P2 memory cards, which is OK by me )
Why don’t they just use dual SD as a RAID. That would be so much cheaper.
… but extremely inconvenient… For performance, you’d need to use RAID-0 which would store halv the movie on one card, and the other half on another card. …..
You were joking, right?
Yeah because fiddling with small cards is so much more convenient than just plugging the camera…
I wonder if it’s possible to record to an external SSD drive with one of these. That would make the most sense.
Micro P2 Cards would be absolutely rock solid when it comes to performance, and they have built-in error-checking which would guarantee every recording.
Yes, they are going to be expensive, but I don’t see any other solution that would be absolutely fool-proof when it comes to high performance recording.
Yep thats the problem with M43….Look at all the other resent M43 camera’s (em1 and em10), . They all have the same not so good picture quality as the previous models from 3 years ago. I think if M43 wants to survive they need something new like a bigger sensor.
Your opinion and nothing is the same thing.
Image quality on MFT is currently on par with where the FF Nikon D3 is, only under higher ISO’s does it perform noticeably worse. Now, somehow, professional photographers have been managing to use the D3 to produce top notch images since it was released in 2005. If you believe there is a problem with that level of IQ I would suggest that you are incompetent at camera handling and no camera, MFT or not will be of any use to you.
@Viezevure – you just got a massive troll slap, how does it feels to be totally emasculated in public?
@Sarah ++1 Well played 🙂
Sorry the D3 was actually released in 2008, had the D2X on my mind. The D2X would actually have lower IQ than the E-M1 or GH-3 sensors 🙂
But hey, photographers somehow got by!
Basically I fully agree. I use a d610 parallel to a m43 EM1. Only under extreme conditions a difference is obvious (like extreme shallow DOF or high ISO). But what I don’t understand is this smaller is better mantra. For me the EM1 is the smallest body acceptable to work for longer stretches comfortably. Its almost too small for my hands (its perfect for my wife though). The D610 fits perfectly and is not too heavy with primes. The GH3 has a nice size, too.
What have you smoked? But go on, it’s funny.
I’d say that you need a bigger brain to say something smarter.. Still you survive: oh the Mistery of Universe!..
Tiresome troll. My schlong is bigger . . . . yada yada
If the rumor is true. 200mbps isn’t really high bitrate for 4K video. Cos 4K is 4 times bigger resolution as I know, then it means just 50mbps in 1080p video. But I’m still very interested how the 4K video performs. Cos I saw the new Sony AX100 sample video. The 4K video is amazing 🙂
The sony camera you refer to doesn’t even record close to 200 mbit. It’s about how smart the codec is, not just bitrate
200 Mbits actually IS a high recording rate when it comes to H.264 or H.265 data compression, and likely won’t be matched by any competitors without the use of specialized memory cards. ( yes it’s only 25 MB/sec, but this has to be the absolute minimum sustained performance, which nothing short of high performance memory cards or SSD drives can achieve )
I suspect this ‘new’ sensor is the GX7/GM1 one.
Probably it will be the one of the GX7/GM1 with some improvements on the circuitry.
With every new camera released the marketeers always says it has a “new” sensor, depends on how you interprete “new”.
will this gh4k (is it his official name?) have ibis like gx7 and usable in video mode?
Because ibis-5 is just fantastic in video on e5/em1/ep5
My wishes:
– 5-axis stabilizer
– 4:2:2 10-bit ProRes as option
Not so interested in 4K (it’s nice to have for stabilizing footage or framing on 2K timeline).
And a pro codec is a must as well. RAW is nice but overkill.
My wishes :
Slow motion (240fps in full HD burst mode)
IBIS
Prores option
I don’t think Panasonic or any other Manufacturers will ever do ProRes codec. Cos ProRes codec is for professional. There are still heaps of people don’t even know why people need a DSLR camera cos their “point and shoot” camera does everything. ProRes codec is just too small for the world market. So I think manufacturers will rather bring the H.265 codec instead of ProRes Codec. Cos H.265 really close to ProRes 4444 and it just 1% of the file size.
Check this out from EOSHD.com about the new H.265 codec
http://www.eoshd.com/content/11534/new-h-265-codec-test-prores-4444-quality-1-file-size
Good news for the video crowd, but I’m looking for m4/3 to move beyond 16 MP. It feels like it’s stuck again, the way it was at 12 MP for all those years after that Olympus guy said, “Twelve megapixels is enough.” Clearly it wasn’t.
I just bought a Samsung NX300 and 30mm f/2 on the cheap as a backup to my GX7. The resolution bump isn’t huge, but it is noticeable in the details of distant objects, text on signs, etc. It’s a surprisingly good camera in other ways, too. The point is, I want to record my life memories in as much detail as I can afford. I can’t afford to buy into a Sony A7R system (and not sure I’d want to if I could) so the Samsung has scratched the itch for better still image performance for the time being.
I hope m4/3 can reach something like 30+ MP while maintaining or improving on current image quality. It’s been my favorite system for the past five years, but I’ve starting cheating on it, I just hope we don’t wind up divorced.
More megapixels will not give you better image quality, sorry to tell you that.
I didn’t say that more megapixels will give better image quality. Read more carefully, it’s offensive to misquote people.
Maybe you were trying to point out that 20 MP won’t necessarily yield more resolution than 16 MP. True, depending on several factors, but my experience shooting the NX300 with the 30mm lens is that I’m getting a little more resolution than with my GX7 and Leica 25mm. By itself, this extra resolution doesn’t mean that the NX300 has better image quality.
The NX300 has better image quality because it has more dynamic range, less pink skin tones (I shoot in RAW and use Lightroom), richer color in general, and a bit less noise. The GX7 is far superior in video, customizability and overall shooting experience, but those are things that other companies can more easily close the gap on. Resolution and basic sensor performance need to be up to par.
You don’t have to defend your stance. Nobody can argue with personal experience.
Now to the point, if detail is what you are after then every additional pixel (coupled with efficient optics) makes sense. That said, I find it hard to believe that Samsung’s 30/2 is so much better than the PanaLeica 25. Perhaps the GX7 combo suffers from the dreaded “shutter shock”, in which case the electronic shutter might help squeeze a bit more resolution out of its sensor.
No, the 30/2 is definitely not better than the 25/1.4, especially when it comes to build quality. Performance is good, though, and the NX300 has a nice soft shutter. The GX7 files are a little sharper on edge detail but overall I’m seeing more resolution from the 20 MP files, as I expected.
But it was interesting when I first compared shots from the GX7 with and without electronic shutter. Shots using the mechanical shutter are very nearly as sharp as with e-shutter. Same with the 14-42 kit lens. I’ve also tried the new 14-140 and that was a disaster – every shot blurry with the mechanical shutter and sharp with e-shutter. I returned that lens, there was something wrong there. But I can’t find evidence that the GX7 body itself causes shutter shock at any shutter speed.
There are physical implications when increasing MP count. If 30+ MP is what you seek, m43 is not the system.
More pixel will make this system worse. The more pixel you have the more light diffraction comes into play(and already does so at f/8). What could help is a different sensor that is like this FOEVON things. Then we could go back to 12 megapixel and get away with better performance.
All this math used to compute 16 million full color pixel from 16 million single color pixel can not be good for image quality.
That’s my wish for a future OMD, Foveon sensor at 16MP.
You really have no clue do you? It’s so funny to read crap like this, presented as some gracious and wise lesson for the technically less competent.
Go on, don’t let me stop you.
What end-use are you shooting for that requires more than 16 megapixels in an image? The E-M1 produces 4608×3456 images — at 300 dpi, this will give you a 15.36″x11.52″ print.
Unless you’re regularly trying to make poster-sized prints (or bigger), you don’t need more pixels, although we’d all like better ones (greater dynamic range, lower noise, etc.).
The megapixel race seems over, thankfully.
I wonder if the sensor will be over sized like the GH1 and GH2.
These improvements might also be interesting for astro photographers, wouldn’t they?
If this camera is orientated primarily for video/film production, it would have been better if they went with an 8MP sensor, as opposed to 16MP sensor.
Hear hear, I’m kinda hoping for an 8 megapixel sensor too.
Not just great for video too, but some photographer’s might like its improved low light capabilities too.
Yes, I hope so… 8 Mpix max
‘Still’ always Pana’s limitation , very hard for them to invent a breakthough especially to cope with today’s competition . So I’m not surprise with this 4K camera with it’s still image below GX7 .
The GX7 is Lumix’s premier continuing the L1’s aspiration as Pana’s no 1 still camera , deserving all the best from Pana .
Why do you think still IQ will be lower than on GX7? GH3 was on par and it was released one year before it. This post tells that IQ will be about the same as current best Panasonic m43. There’s no reason to think otherwise (especially at that price point), even if it is made mostly for video.
I wonder if many mainly-stills photographers will be interested in this one. 4K video seems such an overkill to me. Actually, this camera might signal a departure of the GH series towards a separate route.
I’ve been shooting a lot more video on vacations and 1080p caused me to buy a new computer last year plus 6 TB external storage. Even with the upgrades, I couldn’t manage 4K right now.
4K will be great in a couple of years, but I agree that the average photographer is more interested in stills right now and It seems time for m4/3 to start moving forward again on that front.
I disagre completely. Stills already look amazing. I don’t know what more you people want. It’s video that is still suffering from a limited codec, moire/aliasing issues, less dynamic range and lack of global shutter.
There is more to be improved on the video side than the stills side at the moment.
You seem to forget that there’s a whole world of dedicated video cameras out there, cameras that videographers usually choose before something like a GX7 or E-M1 (BlackMagic, for example). The bulk of m4/3 camera sales are made on the basis of still image quality. This is much more important for m4/3 right now than video. Olympus knows this, which is why they put stills first. Panasonic puts both first, they’re unique in catering specifically to the hybrid customer with the GH series.
Yes, Olympus should improve video, and they’ve said they’re working on it. But get real – with the A7 twins, mirrorless is now at 36 MP and 14 stops of dynamic range. Anyone who thinks m4/3 image quality should stay the way it is might as well wish for the format to disappear.
B.S.
I hope they come back to multi-aspect ratio sensors.
Yes – another vote for the multi-aspect sensor and the ability to crop within the camera frame while video recording would be really excellent.
+1 on hoping for the return of a multi-aspect sensor – though would be surprised if actually happens…
Mmm yummy, I would donate my left nut for this, anamorphic recording at 4:3 anyone? I doubt it will happen though. Say, does magic lantern hack on mkiii do 4:3 recording on raw?
This is probably a Panasonic sensor rather than the Sony (?) one in the GH3. It may be a modified GX7 one.
Just wondering why your source won’t give exact camera specs and
in particular video specs ? Saying the cameras still image is about the same
is no real rumour. If you know details please give them, this is what a Rumor site is for !
Otherwise we may as well wait until the camera is announced on Friday.
Same still IQ as GH3 simply means the death of pro continue to use it for still project. An A7 which I believe most probably cheaper than this new 4k GH camera with similar size and weight can produce IQ with 2 stops more DR and 2 stops more color depth, that’s a huge IQ difference.
Next on, video. Yes, it may be sold to videographers who’d like to play with 4K footages. However, for serious filmmakers, probably not their choice since IQ will be much lower as compare to Blackmagic pocket camera which is possibly just half of its price and weight with 2 stops more DR. DR is probably the most essential part on IQ for film-look on modern sensors.
As we can see it very clearly now, GH3 did not get even a quarter of market attention where GH2 was getting. Why? Simply because the IQ didn’t improve that much. With a hack GH2, it’s getting very high bitrate that many claims IQ is even better than GH3. So you see, IQ is still the most important part.
Conclusion: I think Panasonic is slowly fading out with their GH line since they are just too slow to react to the market trend, the very same story we see from Nokia. God bless Panasonic.
It depends what you are naming ”serious filmmakers”. My freind is making money selling short promotional videos to samll buisnesses. He clearly don’t have the time to film raw since it will requered much more time to deal with (time=$). For people making commercial videos, having 4k is a nice long term investment. For people making videos for fun on youtube.. yeah I don’t think it’s a good buy for the moment.
Lets hope they fitted the appropriate optics in EVF this time, For my use that is the main problem with GH-3. Ipersonally have no need for better IQ.
I hope to see GH-4 being the evolution similar to one Olympus has done with EM-5 to EM-1 upgrade.
Excited about this camera! I think the GH3 was a bit of a rush job with a less than ideal sensor. Of course it was still a great camera but maybe a bit too big and poor viewfinder and hot shoe that fell off if you used it too much, leaving the screws rattling around inside. That’s not ideal for a magnesium weathersealed “pro level” camera.
4K images I have seen have been superb -prices have also been superb for the sellers.
I think 4k will take off this year though, unlike 3D and prices will fall. There is a huge amount of 4k products in the pipeline now -you can still of course just shoot in HD if you want with the GH4K. I hope to go 4k this year but not sure which cam for it yet! ..no monitor either ..yet.